Sony hate thread

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ZMOT said:
pcs these days are highly homogenized, everyone is running w10 with either a intel or amd cpu (makes no difference really), gpu is either nvidia or amd, and the latter already runs in the xbox and playstation. all that differs is performance, but most pc games have graphic options and resolution selection for a reason.
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And yet, Cyberpunks stability varied wildly depending on what components your PC had just last year. Many games still run better depending on if you are using NVidia or AMD GPU's or AMD or Intel CPU's so the idea that the Cell Processor is suddenly such a non issue when multiple game dev's had said the opposite over the past 15 years seems unlikely to me.
 
X Pac Heat said:
And yet, Cyberpunks stability varied wildly depending on what components your PC had just last year. Many games still run better depending on if you are using NVidia or AMD GPU's or AMD or Intel CPU's.
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There's a reason why the word slave is derived from the word Slav.

Because if these people were not kept in check, the world would be thrown into chaos.
 
X Pac Heat said:
And yet, Cyberpunks stability varied wildly depending on what components your PC had just last year. Many games still run better depending on if you are using NVidia or AMD GPU's or AMD or Intel CPU's so the idea that the Cell Processor is suddenly such a non issue when multiple game dev's had said the opposite over the past 15 years seems unlikely to me.
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modern cpus use literally the same instructions, if you got a recent one the only difference is performance.
gpu depends how much cock they sucked off each vendor/how much "help" they accepted during development (no shit nvidia optimized shaders for MUH FPS will run better on nvidia hardware), but outside the typical issues of shit/faulty hardware and rotten software (WHY DOES THIS GAME CRASH ON A DRIVER FROM 2017!!!!11") it's a non-issue for the vast majority of players too, and I can probably count games that released in the state of cp2077 the last few years on one hand.

shit devs produce shit games, simple as that. don't think I have to remind you cp2077 crashed on console too, so take that as you will.

>cell processor
X Pac Heat said:
I'd assume that porting Cell Processor jank isn't that hard when you have a stable set of components in a single system to port to, but is probably a nightmare when you try to account for the myriad of component combinations for PC.
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you are talking about porting FROM cell TO pc, you are aware this is something completely different than devs talking about developing FOR cell 15 years ago, right?
 
More patents are shown to exist to help with backwards compatibility including setting up streaming for PS5 so whenever the next playstation rolls around so the network won't shit itself

www.dualshockers.com

PS5 Games on PS Now May Soon Be a Reality

A recently published Sony patent gives us a glimpse at upgrades being done to provide PS5 games on PS Now that might even be future-proofed enough for PS6. It’s coming up on a year since the PlayStation 5 launched, and much to fans’ disappointment, PS5 games on PS Now are nowhere to be seen...
www.dualshockers.com www.dualshockers.com

But it's been 10 months since the PS3 patents came up with adding support for future consoles and there's been no movement on that end. The UI for the PS5 kind of feels like it's still missing stuff. There's no dedicated suspend button like the PS4 had since they have the PS Button pulling double duty, so if you want suspend to come up you can't hold the button down. Important icons look too small while other less important ones take too much prominence.

I think it still took the PS4 a year to get major features added to it.
 
So let me get this straight.

Modern technology makes porting over stuff designed for a unique CPU from 15 years ago onto modern PC configurations a complete non issue. That's not even getting into how PS3 emulation has been a complete chore on PC.

But it was impossible to import mocap data for Peter Parker from PS4 Spider-Man into PS5 Spider-Man?

Yeah, makes sense lol
 
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X Pac Heat said:
So let me get this straight.

Modern technology makes porting over stuff designed for a unique CPU from 15 years ago onto modern PC configurations a complete non issue. That's not even getting into how PS3 emulation has been a complete chore on PC.
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the straight fact is you're clueless dumbass conflating different things.

yes, making your own code run on the platform which has been around for decades with documentation everywhere and plenty of people around is a non issue compared to releasing a somewhat new architecture that is already more difficult to develop for (protip: there's a reason both sony and microsoft switched to x86), not to mention that in the beginning apparently documentation was only available in japanese. with a remaster you don't even have to worry about performance that much either.
meanwhile an emulator tries emulate said platform (it's in the fucking name), except this time blind with hardly any documentation or sources, and the people with the expertise to do so usually don't do it for free. compare that to back compatibility on xbone when microsoft spends money on it.

and least of all those are technical reasons, which is moot if rockstar decides it's much more lucrative to just keep fleecing 12yo with shark cards instead of spending money on a remaster. that's 9 out of 10 times the reason shit doesn't happen, not because smoothbrains think "it's difficult". same reason your only choice for BC on playstation is ps now.

X Pac Heat said:
But it was impossible to import mocap data for Peter Parker from PS4 Spider-Man into PS5 Spider-Man?

Yeah, makes sense lol
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you're right, that has absolutely nothing to do with them replacing the actor because sony wanted a tom holland lookalike for the remaster...
 
ZMOT said:
the straight fact is you're clueless dumbass conflating different things.

yes, making your own code run on the platform which has been around for decades with documentation everywhere and plenty of people around is a non issue compared to releasing a somewhat new architecture that is already more difficult to develop for (protip: there's a reason both sony and microsoft switched to x86), not to mention that in the beginning apparently documentation was only available in japanese. with a remaster you don't even have to worry about performance that much either.
meanwhile an emulator tries emulate said platform (it's in the fucking name), except this time blind with hardly any documentation or sources, and the people with the expertise to do so usually don't do it for free. compare that to back compatibility on xbone when microsoft spends money on it.

and least of all those are technical reasons, which is moot if rockstar decides it's much more lucrative to just keep fleecing 12yo with shark cards instead of spending money on a remaster. that's 9 out of 10 times the reason shit doesn't happen, not because smoothbrains think "it's difficult". same reason your only choice for BC on playstation is ps now.
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Dude, what the fuck are you talking about? I'm not talking about coding fresh I'm talking about porting. If it was difficult for people to port DOS games over to future OS's and CPU's what makes you think a Cell based game would be easier? So why would everyone have been lying 15 years ago when they were saying it would be impossible to port 3rd party games like MGS4 designed with Cell in mind to the 360?

And why are you even bringing up Grand Theft Auto? We were talking about porting Uncharted 1-3 to PC. Calm down and stay focused.

And it's funny you say it had nothing to do with it when every Sony fanboy has been claiming up and down the mo cap data just "didn't work" and it had absolutely nothing to do with getting a Tom Holland look alike.
 
Cell Processor Jank probably is a bitch to deal with bit not impossible. Just not worth it.

Sony is only interested in putting their low sellers and junk on PC. If it requires much work than they are not going to do it.
 
The Last Stand said:
Was the Cell Processor actually powerful even back then? Or was it just marketing?
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I mean, I think so. I just don't think many too advantage of it. The only game I really recall wowing me cause of the Cell was MGS4, but I got a PS3 late so I could have missed a lot of games.

I've always read it was more trouble than it was worth, and more often than not made porting games to the PS3 a pain in the ass for 3rd party devs.

Hell, I remember some games like Mafia 2 actually ran worse on PS3 and it was claimed it was cause of the Cell.

DMX DA GOAT said:
Cell Processor Jank probably is a bitch to deal with bit not impossible. Just not worth it.

Sony is only interested in putting their low sellers and junk on PC. If it requires much work than they are not going to do it.
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I mean, that's pretty much what my main point has been. I'm not saying it'd be impossible to port, but if it's a pain in the ass why would they bother? That's probably the best explanation in my mind for porting Uncharted 4 but not the Nathan Drake collection. The idea they only put their junk on PC doesn't work for Nathan Drake Collection as Uncharted 4 surely sold better than it and the collection would have to be as equally "worthless" to keep exclusive at this point.
 
X Pac Heat said:
I mean, I think so. I just don't think many too advantage of it. The only game I really recall wowing me cause of the Cell was MGS4, but I got a PS3 late so I could have missed a lot of games.

I've always read it was more trouble than it was worth, and more often than not made porting games to the PS3 a pain in the ass for 3rd party devs.

Hell, I remember some games like Mafia 2 actually ran worse on PS3 and it was claimed it was cause of the Cell.



I mean, that's pretty much what my main point has been. I'm not saying it'd be impossible to port, but if it's a pain in the ass why would they bother? That's probably the best explanation in my mind for porting Uncharted 4 but not the Nathan Drake collection. The idea they only put their junk on PC doesn't work for Nathan Drake Collection as Uncharted 4 surely sold better than it and the collection would have to be as equally "worthless" to keep exclusive at this point.
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I remember it being because the CPU and GPU were molded together. Two cores were for one component.
 
The Last Stand said:
Was the Cell Processor actually powerful even back then? Or was it just marketing?
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Cell was powerful for scientific computing because the architecture allowed for simpler calculations to get done faster with the SPEs but beyond compiler support, it didn’t have any libraries or APIs to make it easier for computing developers. IBM’s chief engineer for the project said in an interview if OpenCL came out a year sooner, it would of saved Cell. By 2008, the writing was on the wall and there wasn’t many customers for the Cell rack servers.

Now for games… no, Cell didn’t offer any realistic advantages. There is an interesting podcast where an interesting developer mentions his experience with Cell. The jist of that segment was Jonathan Blow worked on a tech demo and he was programming a destructible physics game. He really disliked programming Cell and thought that Cell wasn’t going to be good for games.
 
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The Last Stand said:
Was the Cell Processor actually powerful even back then? Or was it just marketing?
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It was pretty powerful in a special way but that was then counteracted by the GPU not being the best, it still used different execution units for pixel and vertex shaders and some corners seem to have been cut there. Naughty Dog and other have talked about how they offloaded the GPU by sending vertex shader work to CELL(along with other graphics tasks when appropriate). There are both blog posts and Siggraph presentations/papers about this, it's pretty interesting for people that find this interesting, it is absolute torture to everyone else.

Some early games only ran on the PPC CPU because CELL was a tricky beast to figure out. On tricky thing was that CELL itself couldn't read or write to system RAM, iirc, so the PPC CPU had to feed it data from either the XDR or GDDR3 memory pools, then collect it when done and write it back to wherever it is supposed to be. Each CELL SPE had 256KB to work with and that's not a lot, it needed constant attention from the general purpose CPU to get the most out of it. The people at Naughty Dog could run that shit like clockwork while other developers struggled.
 
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