Marvel Cinematic Universe

[StarkRavingMad]

Giving myself a reminder that I must check out Marvel Rivals ... I have heard nothing but good things.

Also, this might be an unpopular opinion, but here it goes:

When you really think about it, it doesn't make much sense for the X-Men and the other Marvel characters like the Avengers or the Fantastic Four to exist in the same universe. Makes no sense for the Mutants to be a "marginalized group" while the public unanimously praises other heroes. That's always bothered me in the comics, and it would for sure bother me in a shared cinematic universe where everything is half-baked at best these days.

After all that has happened in the MCU (and the fact that Marvel refuses to take a long break and then do a reboot), it really doesn't make sense for the X-Men to start showing up, especially if the MCU wants to accurately adapt them with the world being prejudiced against mutants.

The X-Men could easily stand on its own as a film franchise. I don't think anybody would be missing the Avengers being shoehorned in whatsoever if the X-Men were adapted faithfully on the big screen.

 

[Fatsuit Shinji]

Mutants have been the "marginalized group" due to randomness and possible destructiveness of their powers. Coupled with them being an evolutionary successor to humanity. While the most mutants have minimal to no powers and frankly are mostly harmless. It the extreme other end of the power scale is what terrifies humanity and other mutants. As their powers are capable of mass scale death and destruction to outright extinction of the human species.

 

[Doctor of Autism]

Alright guys, box office predictions for this year?

I feel like Fantastic Four could be a hit since out of the three MCU movies this year, it is the only one that has any hype around it given the Fantastic Four never had a good film adaptation before so this looks promise. If it's a decent film, then it could make more than its money back.

I wonder if Giancarlo Esposito gets tired of playing Gus Fring

I think he does, but he is really doing it for the bag since I remember an anecdote where he said that he would've arranged himself to die so his family could benefit from his life insurance, so if he has to play Gus Fring to keep himself afloat, I can see him do that. Though he along with Pedro Pascal suffer the most from being typecast, and should be in sillier roles since I think both actually have good comedic potential that isn't used.

The problem is who could they have cast, plus the optics would be rough, especially in a post Floyd era with the only big recasts being two black dudes and ed Norton.

I mean the entirety of "Black Twitter" is more pissed that T'Challa didn't get recast, and felt snubbed especially as other comic characters are recast all the time. The MCU and a lot of movies in general seem afraid of just recasting in general since I guess the actor's face is used as part of the character's brand. Like that's also how Star Wars kept using effects to keep making actors resemble older or dead film stars most of the time.

 

[UnKillFill]

Mutants have been the "marginalized group" due to randomness and possible destructiveness of their powers. Coupled with them being an evolutionary successor to humanity. While the most mutants have minimal to no powers and frankly are mostly harmless. It the extreme other end of the power scale is what terrifies humanity and other mutants. As their powers are capable of mass scale death and destruction to outright extinction of the human species.

Yeah, but like... Thor is, for all intents and purposes, a literal god. He could really fuck shit up on the level of many of the strongest mutants if he wanted to, but he doesn't get any of the hate or fear the mutants do. Even though there are members of his race who are not good guys. (I don't think it's common knowledge that Loki is actually a frost giant).

 

[Fatsuit Shinji]

Yeah, but like... Thor is, for all intents and purposes, a literal god. He could really fuck shit up on the level of many of the strongest mutants if he wanted to, but he doesn't get any of the hate or fear the mutants do. Even though there are members of his race who are not good guys. (I don't think it's common knowledge that Loki is actually a frost giant).

My knowledge of the "in universe" reasoning is limited to Earth's humans and mutants as of the 1990ies comic crash. As this have been a topic that just give me migraines; beyond knowing it is the result of in real life authorial and/or editorial fiat saying nonmutant superheroes are okay and the mutants superheroes not okay. Coupled with permanent "Status Quo is God" mindset.

 

[dick brain]

Giving myself a reminder that I must check out Marvel Rivals ... I have heard nothing but good things.

Also, this might be an unpopular opinion, but here it goes:

When you really think about it, it doesn't make much sense for the X-Men and the other Marvel characters like the Avengers or the Fantastic Four to exist in the same universe. Makes no sense for the Mutants to be a "marginalized group" while the public unanimously praises other heroes. That's always bothered me in the comics, and it would for sure bother me in a shared cinematic universe where everything is half-baked at best these days.

After all that has happened in the MCU (and the fact that Marvel refuses to take a long break and then do a reboot), it really doesn't make sense for the X-Men to start showing up, especially if the MCU wants to accurately adapt them with the world being prejudiced against mutants.

The X-Men could easily stand on its own as a film franchise. I don't think anybody would be missing the Avengers being shoehorned in whatsoever if the X-Men were adapted faithfully on the big screen.

I think there's a few approaches they could take to make it make sense in a vacuum but not really in the current state of the MCU.

One angle would be something similar to Civil War where some big bullshit mass casualty event happens that makes the public hate metahumans, except for the ones they already like. But that's a big fucking ask after Endgame where metahumans saved half of all life on Earth. But I wouldn't put it past Marvel since it's a blatant allegory for heckin' wholesome minorities being discriminated against for being Born This Way, and the willingness of the left to portray their political enemies as dumb and irrational knows no bounds.

Another angle would be having it be a multiverse incursion thing, where they already exist in their own universe and one way or another end up in ours, in which case it would be a heckin' wholesome immigration/refugee allegory where muties are discriminated against for entering our universe uninvited and being different than us.

Another angle would be an AvX thing, where they're initially positioned as enemies of the metahumans that everybody loves so they hate them by default. Then it can be a heckin' wholesome globohomo anti-war can't-we-all-just-hit-a-bong story. I think this is probably the most feasible in the current state of the MCU.

I'm expecting some shitty combination of the three.

Probably the most elegant solution would be to introduce them in essentially a crossover event, a temporary incursion thing where they team up with the Avengers (like, say, Secret Wars) and then have them fuck off back to their own universe and have their stories take place there. But I really don't expect that to happen since the only way to up the stakes from a multiverse-level threat is to collapse the multiverse so "this universe is the only one we've got!" or whatever, and because they fucking need the X-Men to breathe new life into the MCU universe at this point.

Regarding multiverse fuckery, I will say what I said in the leadup to Days Of Future Past, which is: this is the perfect opportunity to retcon all of the shit people hated and fix any continuity issues and cherry pick the best of all their intellectual properties, and while I have somehow even less confidence in Marvel's ability to do that without fucking up than I did in 20th Century Fox, I'm willing to give them the chance since it costs me nothing at all.

 

[wtfNeedSignUp]

When you really think about it, it doesn't make much sense for the X-Men and the other Marvel characters like the Avengers or the Fantastic Four to exist in the same universe. Makes no sense for the Mutants to be a "marginalized group" while the public unanimously praises other heroes. That's always bothered me in the comics, and it would for sure bother me in a shared cinematic universe where everything is half-baked at best these days.

I think the issue with X-Men is the opposite, in a real world almost everyone would hate them and want them as far away from their families as possible. They would be sympathetic to their issues, but it's enough that one 10 year old throws fireballs to kill everyone in his elementary school without meaning to.

A conflict like this would be more interesting than comparison to IRL faggots. But would have the majority of readers against the mutants.

 

[Salt_Merchant]

I always bring it back to that scene from one of the xmen comics

Where a teenagers super power triggers and his power is he just leaks radiation and kills 250 odd people

Wolverine finds him and kills him because if it got out that that could happen. That a random teenager could just wake up one day and wipe a town out by accident then that's it for mutants it's camps for them

You'd probably have to do something like that. For the introduction movie they are treated like normal heroes but on the downlow they are sending xforce out to deal with any of these incidents by either kidnapping or killing these too dangerous mutants

Then one happens and goes public.

 

[Mr. 0]

magneto did nothing wrong

 

[Get the rope Macaulay!]

I think he does, but he is really doing it for the bag since I remember an anecdote where he said that he would've arranged himself to die so his family could benefit from his life insurance, so if he has to play Gus Fring to keep himself afloat, I can see him do that. Though he along with Pedro Pascal suffer the most from being typecast, and should be in sillier roles since I think both actually have good comedic potential that isn't used.

you're forgetting these two guys also were middle aged by the time they hit their big break, they were taking every shitty role playing crackheads and gay prostitutes and thugs who get shot by action heroes for years before they got roles that got them typecast. a fun thing people have been doing online is literally just bringing up past characters they've played whenever someone goes "wow these guys are so typecast" because they've played literally everything. they have 20 years of bullshit niche roles that no one has seen. its like calling liam Nesson an "action hero" and wishing he was in more dramas, like nigga just go on IMDB.

 

[XYZpdq Jr.]

Giving myself a reminder that I must check out Marvel Rivals ... I have heard nothing but good things.

Also, this might be an unpopular opinion, but here it goes:

When you really think about it, it doesn't make much sense for the X-Men and the other Marvel characters like the Avengers or the Fantastic Four to exist in the same universe. Makes no sense for the Mutants to be a "marginalized group" while the public unanimously praises other heroes. That's always bothered me in the comics, and it would for sure bother me in a shared cinematic universe where everything is half-baked at best these days.

After all that has happened in the MCU (and the fact that Marvel refuses to take a long break and then do a reboot), it really doesn't make sense for the X-Men to start showing up, especially if the MCU wants to accurately adapt them with the world being prejudiced against mutants.

The X-Men could easily stand on its own as a film franchise. I don't think anybody would be missing the Avengers being shoehorned in whatsoever if the X-Men were adapted faithfully on the big screen.

yeah I've brought it up before but I recall from reading marvel around the 80s and 90s there was a definite feel of The Marvel Universe and The X-Men Universe with some mix between them but not as much as say, any of the four hundred thirty-eight capes working Manhattan that week

the easiest way to work the X-Men in would have been "snap fix accidentally the universes, suddenly there's mutants"

and yeah the "muh oppressed peoples" falls flat in practice
when CWC flips his shit a clerk gets maced or a Barb gets boinked
when the young mutant "Explodio" goes off you get

Where a teenagers super power triggers and his power is he just leaks radiation and kills 250 odd people

Wolverine finds him and kills him because if it got out that that could happen. That a random teenager could just wake up one day and wipe a town out by accident then that's it for mutants it's camps for them

 

[Powerhouse of the Cell]

Makes no sense for the Mutants to be a "marginalized group" while the public unanimously praises other heroes.

You make a complete solid point.

I have actually seen a couple other people on the internet say the same thing.

It would be retarded to just see another civil war like arc and see the same themes we have already seen play out in Fox's X-men cinematic universe.

 

[Doctor of Autism]

So the last two episodes of that Spider-Man show came and went, and man it really went to be next level stupid.

This Peter has to be an absolute dumbass because he keeps making the same mistake when fighting Scorpion that when he takes him down, Scorpion keeps coming up, this happened to him two times (once in the previous episode), and then when he's knocked down the third time, he doesn't bother to keep him contained until after he gets up to cause shit again.

The predictable apology happened where Peter's friend apologizes for realizing she's wrong which I guess is neat for not putting him in the wrong for keeping it a secret, but that bar is low (Invincible Season 1).

But anyway the last episode really has got to be the worst one for how utterly stupid it is since not only does it insert time travel, but lots of bait for future seasons (which is normal now in modern streaming).

Dr. Strange has to be really stupid since he never once looks to see a version of him from the future was interacting at all in the present (especially when someone calls him out for aiding in destruction of a high school) because he accidentally created a time portal that leads back to the first episode, with the spider being a mutated spider done by Oscorp because Norman wants to make more Spider-Men after infusing Spider-Man's DNA with spiders. So Spider-Man got his powers from a time loop.

There is also blatant setup for Symbiotes with the Venom Alien being part of some greater thing reminiscent from the Web of Shadows video game, with a piece of the symbiote falling out (needs to be seen whether its another iteration of the Black Suit arc or someone gets the symbiote first as Norman Osborn finds it).

Harry also starts a young person Oscorp called "WEB" because Peter and his friend urge him too, which invites a bunch of random characters who are supposed to be future Marvel characters along with a younger teen Electro. Also Tombstone is invited to it as well. Like this feels specially crafted for comic youtubers to talk about easter eggs



Then more generic setup like Doc Ock planning his robot arms while in his prison cell, and speaking of prison, guess they're doing what the Amazing Spider-Man did and having Peter's Dad be alive and well, but he's in prison.



Anyway a big last fuck off to the fact they had the Watcher appear in the sky in a blink and you miss it cameo, but it shows the multiverse exists.



Honestly would've been funny if this show only had 1 season, but alas two more seasons with potential for another dumbass black suit arc without Eddie and possible Web of Shadows adaptation, multiverse stuff because god forbid a Spider-Man show be a street level show, and a bunch of other shit. The only saving grace could be villain adaptations as they did a good job with the street level villains (Doc Ock and Scorpion being standouts) with Norman Osborn also being a scumbag too. But other than that, this is show really is a bad introduction to the Spider-Man character since he's a dumbass with only book smarts and barely has the street smarts that Spider-Man has.

At least unlike the MCU Spider-Man, this Peter realized that his mentor figure is corrupt (because reminder MCU Tony nabbed Spider-Man to be a child soldier as extra muscle while lying to him about Captain America and also actively encouraged Spider-Man to look the other way while Vulture was causing problems).

Thank god its over though.

 

[Mayor Cody Travers]

I'm going to give my thought on X-Men in the same 'verse as non mutant heroes in a meta sense:

Spoiler: I will die on the hill the X-Men and mutants are a perfectly natural, workable part of a combined Marvel Universe.

They are perfectly workable within a united Marvel U.... on the conditions that one 1) they get "weirder" (can be cool or raw deal alike) powers versus the "popular" (strength, flight, hand lasers) powers the others have and 2) mutants are an extremely small group tied almost entirely to the X-books.

X-Men were once considered an equivalent to the Teen Titans as "young outcast heroes with funky powers and soap opera plots", and to make the comparison work, imagine a united DCU where EVERY SINGLE NEW hero after the New Titans' popularity was a teen hero, had a cool look and power-set, angst ahoy, and meant to fit into the Titans books however loosely. And like, when I say EVERY new hero, I really mean it! Yet you couldn't get rid of the core DCU in the Justice League... but with every hero becoming a "Titan"-style hero the look and feel of this DCU is heavily, permanently altered. In other words, the Titans were never meant to be the "core" of a wider DCU and "teen" heroes weren't meant to be the primary hero type. Where the soap opera angst overtook the straight-up superheroics.

That's what mutants became. Remember, once upon a time the X-Men and villains were just about the only muties in the Marvel U's town. They were able to interact with the other teams just fine because they were heroes and people first and foremost who happened to be mutants for the powers. And mutants were almost unheard of in other books because almost all mutants that people care about were costumed heroes who would go back to living regular lives. ....but then they really began hammering the "separate species" metaphor to everyone's detriment, kept making endless new mutants and teams, which fed into the first bit, and then tried to ironically portray them as different. They weren't like this once in de-facto, meta terms. The Marvel Universe could happily include muties but weren't meant to revolve around them! Much like a DCU can happily include teen heroes but isn't meant to be 100% about them. The entire point of mutants was they were just starting out as a POTENTIAL hint of humanity to come and just about the only ones around were running around as superheroes. ...and were still superheroes first and foremost! They just happen to be the teen-focused, soap-opera ones versus Cap handling politics, FF doing the super sci-fi stuff, yada yada. That was their actual niche.

And in-universe, like in the meta real world, it should be easy to praise the X-Men as fellow superheroes and nothing else! They aren't being a danger, they're trying to be good people. They've got weirder powers than the superstar FF and Avengers but making them work and get their own fans for it. And some will diss them... but didn't they do the same to that creepy wall-crawling eerily-flexible Spider-Man and the green overmuscled giant Hulk, who looked different from the movie-star Cap/Thor/Wasp or Mr. Fantastic/Invisible Woman? Yet those two got eventual genuine love and acceptance by the public (in-universe and out) for their heroics and association with the others, so too would the X-Men themselves! Any mistrust against them should be instead part of the general mistrust of heroes, and in time, the X-Men become as beloved as the Avengers and FF, frankly they SHOULD.

No doubt you still play into the mutant aspect, and get the horror stories of the radiation teen mentioned above. You should get conflicts on the X-Men themselves being "the beautiful people" versus Shitter-Dude, With the Unending Always-Working Anus. GOOD. But they should stress mutants on the whole are really fucking rare. You should have a much, MUCH better shot at becoming a non-mutant hero than being born a mutant. Magneto should see non-mutant heroes as a missing link between normies and mutants, the potential that they could evolve in the first place, and treat them as fellow evolutions if not mutants - "the good ones", heh heh.

I readily admit I may have over-worded this, or done so poorly. But the X-Men and mutants are perfectly workable in an overall Marvel U. They just stretched the 'mutants' concept WAY FARTHER than it ever should have been.

 

[Caligura]

I still think Sydney Sweeney would have made a good invisible woman.

She is supposed to be like some sort of trad housewife but also a fierce lioness queen.

Realistically Disney will just cast her as Asbestos Lady because they're fucking Disney.

 

[TheAmbiguousLurker]

I was playing Ultimate Spider-Man recently, it has a similar presentation style to this show where they frame certain scenes like comic book panels. Problem with the show's attempt is that none of the shots are actually framed like a panel in a comic, it's just a normal shot with white frame around it. Ultimate Spider-Man, since it was directly adapting an actual comic art, actually directed it's scenes to mimic a comic panel, with sound effects and even having the scene zoom out and freeze to go across the full comic page.

The predictable apology happened where Peter's friend apologizes for realizing she's wrong which I guess is neat for not putting him in the wrong for keeping it a secret, but that bar is low (Invincible Season 1).

It makes her being mad at Peter seem pointless since there's not real catalyst to her change of heart. She was still mad at Peter after Harry told her what really went down, but she just suddenly realizes "Oh wait, he saves people.". Why go through this dumb cliche in the first place if nothing is actually done with it?

Peter almost killing scorpion didn't work for me. Even with Scorpion almost killing him in their last fight, this Peter is just too much of a bland good boy for his sudden 'almost murders the bad guy' moment to have any weight.

This Peter has to be an absolute dumbass because he keeps making the same mistake when fighting Scorpion that when he takes him down, Scorpion keeps coming up, this happened to him two times (once in the previous episode), and then when he's knocked down the third time, he doesn't bother to keep him contained until after he gets up to cause shit again.

I like when the character keep talking about the gang war (Somewhere, Kingpin is looking at all these pussies playing gangster and shaking his head) going on around them during the fight and how many people are in danger... All while the camera constantly shows us that the street is clearly empty. If you don't want to worry about the background, have them take the fight into some random interior or something.

Then more generic setup like Doc Ock planning his robot arms while in his prison cell

Which is weird because we already had his arms in his last appearance.

I don't really get what Norman did wrong from the perspective of Peter and Co. Yeah, we as the audience know that he's full of shit and is just placating everyone with platitudes, but the characters don't know that yet. They act in horror at him revealing what he used their projects for like he just revealed a super weapon rather than a fucking portal. Then Strange comes in, does a terrible job of explaining what the problem with having a portal is ('You shouldn't open a portal into space because dangerous aliens exist') and gets easily merced by Oscorp goons. Yeah, the experiment went wrong and the symbiote gets in, but Peter acts afterwards like Norman completely fucked him over and was keeping too many secrets from him. And then Peter and co decides that it's better off for a bunch of teenagers to build potential dangerous technology in their basement with no supervision at all. Norman's biggest crime here is not installing an off switch on his portal.

Also, just... Why have this time loop bullshit at all? It adds nothing to the show. It honestly feels like they had an extra episode lying around and couldn't think of anything to make a climax out of so they just brought back Strange and the alien again.

 

[Polyboros2]

Also aren't Widows supposed to be attractive, isn't that like a tool in their arsenal?

Every Widow doesn't have to be a conventional bombshell, some times you want a little variety to play on different targets tastes. Movie Sambra definitely fills the "Semen Goblin" phenotype:

The post credits stinger is, I'm guessing, a holdover from the Kangz thing, with "others" being in reference to other Earths/multiverse incursion shit, which I guess means they're still going to do that moving forward. Which isn't so much a surprise as a disappointment.

Definitely Doom World, or whatever it was where different versions of Earth were colliding and obliterating each other until reality was just an amalgam of earths run by Emperor Doom., and they shoveled what was salvageable from the Ultimate Universe into 616, that's how they'll be adding Mutants and Fantastic Four to the MCU, plus Multiverse Cameos x11 despite already making jokes about how it's played out.

 

[AllieKat]

https://www.worldofreel.com/blog/2025/2/19/cap-67-drop

Captain Negro is going to get buck broken it seems

Every Widow doesn't have to be a conventional bombshell, some times you want a little variety to play on different targets tastes. Movie Sambra definitely fills the "Semen Goblin" phenotype:
View attachment 7002324

Definitely Doom World, or whatever it was where different versions of Earth were colliding and obliterating each other until reality was just an amalgam of earths run by Emperor Doom., and they shoveled what was salvageable from the Ultimate Universe into 616, that's how they'll be adding Mutants and Fantastic Four to the MCU, plus Multiverse Cameos x11 despite already making jokes about how it's played out.

The Doom Battleword thing did give us that scene where he rips out Thanos' spine. That was cool

 

[el bandito loco]

I was playing Ultimate Spider-Man recently

I'll die on the hill that's still the best Spider-Man game. It, the first PS1 game (in what-if mode), and a toss up between the second movie game and maybe web of shadows are the Mount Rushmore of Spider-Man games. The PS4 games were just more of the same with Arkham influence.

I watched Amazing Spider-Man for the first time in a decade recently and it's kinda funny because I remember bitching at my friend afterwards that it pissed me off Gwen, her dad, the lizard and whoever that guy in the end is (norman?) All knew he was Spider-Man. Granted Captain Stacy died but I was like goddamn in the first movie too many motherfuckers know he's Spider-Man. In the first Raimi movie only Norman knows and there's precedent for that.

I didn't know it would become a fuckin' trope every Spider-Man thing after it would have every nobody Mr Cocksuck off the street find out who he is. That's fucking wack. I absolutely HATED those movies when they came out outside of Garfield and I still think they suck but they might as well be the goddamn Dark Knight compared to every Spider-Man product (comics included) in the decade since.

 

[Commander X]