Deus Ex Franchise - Immersive Sims

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The Helios merge ending seems too tainted. There's a Voltaire quote about the necessity to create God at the end of it, but JC (heh) + Helios isn't really God. It's something that could've been a literal deus ex machina mixed with a human. And all humans are fallible.
But I'd still rather trust myself to run shit after merging with Helios than the Illuminati not backstabbing me randomly and doing petty bullshit once I'm out the picture. The Tong ending will just cause millions of people to die, so a new corrupt structure can emerge.

Helios best ending. Humans might be fallible, but Denton's got augmented vision, nerves of steel and an aqualung.
 
same thing for "boomer shooters". who tf invented those stupid names? first person shooter was just fine
This shit is just a modern outcrop of younger gamers not knowing what they talk about. It's essentially "Halo invented FPS" all over again.
The most painful experience on /v/ was watching the "Halo invented FPS" crowd slowly taking over.
 
same thing for "boomer shooters". who tf invented those stupid names? first person shooter was just fine
It's gay and meme-tier but Allah forgive me if it doesn't at least vaguely sub-categorize the game in a way that I and I think the rest of this thread, understand in a more specific sense than simply saying "FPS". Kinda like how saying metroidvania or souls-like gives some /v/irgins an aneurysm, we all get what that descriptor entails broadly speaking.

I agree that the terms are thrown around loosely though.
 
This shit is just a modern outcrop of younger gamers not knowing what they talk about. It's essentially "Halo invented FPS" all over again.
The most painful experience on /v/ was watching the "Halo invented FPS" crowd slowly taking over.
I utterly despise those people since for all the ground Halo broke, it foisted upon us checkpoints and two-weapon loadouts. No, fuck you, I'm a cyborg super-soldier. If a random Marine on Mars or a theoretical physicist in New Mexico can carry a small arsenal on him, I should be able to as well.
 
I remember playing the Deus Ex demo that came on a magazine cd and it was amazing.
I thought so as well and it was all I could think of the next day so I left work early, with a shitty excuse, to go buy it. The wrinkle in this story is that it was very seasonal work, my boss was my dad and I stayed at my parents house during that lucrative period.
True and yet also in the design documents (which you inspired me to read), both in the original 1997 one and the revised 1999 one, reference is made to either JC finding a piece of alien tech or the reactor in Area 51 being made from alien tech, so who knows where they were going with that.

The 1997 design document was a trip to read, back when the game was called "Shooter" and was very radically different than the final game, one really cool detail is one of the original levels would have been "The Vault" below the Denver International Airport, which was only a couple of years old at the time, I wasn't even aware that it was a focus of conspiracy theory going that far back, but in said vault you would have found objects from conspiracy lore like a water based engine, a perpetual motion machine, info on the Kennedy assassination and a piece of alien tech that if you had the foresight enough to take with you could affect the ending of the game.

Later in the 1999 design document they planned on Area 51 containing stuff like that like info on the Kennedy assassination and even the Ark of The Covenant? Maybe that was a joke, but I wish the final game had even more more conspiracy stuff referenced like the water engine and more clear info on the Kennedy assassination, which in the final game wound up just a throwaway line from Lucius DeBeers.
I think Spector said in an interview that the Deus Ex was built around the idea that every conspiracy theory is true. I always like that idea because to me that means that the more you know about the world, the crazier you get because it makes less and less sense. If someone accidentally discovers 5% of the truth there is no need to disappear him, he will just be an insane conspiracy theorist in the eyes of other people. It's like Lovecraft's indescribable horrors that makes people go mad but easier to imagine.
 
I utterly despise those people since for all the ground Halo broke, it foisted upon us checkpoints and two-weapon loadouts.
I think it also introduced regenerating health (technically an energy shield that recharged, but it lay the foundation for that game mechanic) as well as a designated grenade button (iirc), and that became something copied ad nauseum to this day.

Halo in general is a decent shooter I guess. I couldn't be bothered to play it all the way through, but the thing that should be kept in mind is that by the time it actually hit the market on consoles, it wasn't really remarkable in its genre and when it released on PC, it was utterly generic.

Yet to some it was their introduction to FPS games or console games and it shows.
 
Omar ending is best. Fuck all your politics, capitalist-Darwinism where the strong are placated by weapon discounts.
 
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same thing for "boomer shooters". who tf invented those stupid names? first person shooter was just fine
But Boomer shooter describes a very specific kind of FPS, FPS kind of is too broad and generic a term.

I think Spector said in an interview that the Deus Ex was built around the idea that every conspiracy theory is true. I always like that idea because to me that means that the more you know about the world, the crazier you get because it makes less and less sense. If someone accidentally discovers 5% of the truth there is no need to disappear him, he will just be an insane conspiracy theorist in the eyes of other people. It's like Lovecraft's indescribable horrors that makes people go mad but easier to imagine.
That's why it would have been cool to see even more conspiracy stuff referenced.

I think someone should make a game based on Steve Jackson's Illuminati TCG as a more humorous version of Deus Ex.

I think it also introduced regenerating health (technically an energy shield that recharged, but it lay the foundation for that game mechanic) as well as a designated grenade button (iirc), and that became something copied ad nauseum to this day.

Halo in general is a decent shooter I guess. I couldn't be bothered to play it all the way through, but the thing that should be kept in mind is that by the time it actually hit the market on consoles, it wasn't really remarkable in its genre and when it released on PC, it was utterly generic.

Yet to some it was their introduction to FPS games or console games and it shows.
As someone that was a big fan of the Medal of Honor FPS games on the PS1, I think people forget just how much of a revelation Halo's controls were at the time, I mean using one stick for movement and one stick for looking around is the standard for almost every game now, I think people forget it started in a big way with Halo.

Also Halo's sense of scale was impressive, even little things like when the Warthog drives over a bump in the opening cutscene was mind blowing at the time, you really can't understate how mind blowing the transition from PS1/N64 to PS2/Xbox/GameCube was at the time and you have to keep Halo in that context.

I still think it's a good game to this day though, although what bothers me is the fact that the second half of the game is basically the first half in reverse, would have been much cooler if the whole game was unique levels.

Who cares about the ending to DE:IW lol
IW gets a bad rap, flaws aside the story was all still pretty interesting, especially the endings.
 
As someone that was a big fan of the Medal of Honor FPS games on the PS1, I think people forget just how much of a revelation Halo's controls were at the time, I mean using one stick for movement and one stick for looking around is the standard for almost every game now, I think people forget it started in a big way with Halo.
Can't speak for the control scheme, I will give it that, but people pretend like it was the first FPS on console or the first FPS in total and that's just silly.

Also Halo's sense of scale was impressive, even little things like when the Warthog drives over a bump in the opening cutscene was mind blowing at the time, you really can't understate how mind blowing the transition from PS1/N64 to PS2/Xbox/GameCube was at the time and you have to keep Halo in that context.
The scale is what felt like a massive letdown to me when I actually played Halo on PC, it was a painfully generic shooter. By then, the graphics were lackluster and the few unconventional gameplay elements weren't that hot either (like the shield).

The thing that blew my mind when I saw the first trailer was the fidelity of graphics, I literally could not fathom that those screenshots weren't just pre-rendered cutscenes. I was blown away by being able to drive vehicles and walk around a rather large map... But here's the thing: Halo got postponed to launch as flagship title with the XBox and by the time it released there, it had already been outdone in those aspects that originally made it stand out. For instance: Operation Flashpoint had far larger maps and you had dozens of vehicles, including cars, tractors, tanks and helicopters. The graphics of other games of the era caught up as well. By the time it went to PC, it didn't offer anything new.

I mean, it's still a fun game I guess, but the kind of praise it gets as this trailblazer is entirely unwarranted from my perspective.
 
The scale is what felt like a massive letdown to me when I actually played Halo on PC
Found your problem right there. The PC port was scuffed to hell and you have Gearbox to thank for that. The Xbox version had far more visual fidelity that still stands the test of time, and not many games came close to outperforming the console release.
 
The Xbox version had far more visual fidelity that still stands the test of time, and not many games came close to outperforming the console release.
I'm trying to find a video that compares the graphics. Found one video, but there was barely any difference visible at all tbh...
 
I'm trying to find a video that compares the graphics. Found one video, but there was barely any difference visible at all tbh...
I don't want to stray too much further off-topic with this tangent, given that this isn't the Halo thread, but any comparison video showcasing older versions of Halo 1 on the MCC versus Xbox versus current versions of MCC are good examples since the MCC version of Halo 1 was using the scuffed Gearbox port until somewhat recently, when they started updating most of the game's visuals to match what was present on the original Xbox.


If you still can't see any differences, then I just don't know what to tell you.
 
I think it also introduced regenerating health (technically an energy shield that recharged, but it lay the foundation for that game mechanic) as well as a designated grenade button (iirc), and that became something copied ad nauseum to this day.
Also a dedicated melee button and melee actually dealt good damage(insta-kill from behind).

The regenerating energy was necessary for their checkpoint system to work and to create the flow of the game(game rewinds, fast respawn, just keep trucking). Without regenerating health the game would absolutely check-point you in spots where you have no health and every time you turn the corner you die instantly.
If the game they released checkpointed you with a sliver of health it only did so knowing it was safe and you could take a breather to regenerate. It will not save if an enemy is in the checkpoint area.
 
I don't want to stray too much further off-topic with this tangent, given that this isn't the Halo thread, but any comparison video showcasing older versions of Halo 1 on the MCC versus Xbox versus current versions of MCC are good examples since the MCC version of Halo 1 was using the scuffed Gearbox port until somewhat recently, when they started updating most of the game's visuals to match what was present on the original Xbox.

https://youtube.com/watch?v=kofbdbfSSs4
If you still can't see any differences, then I just don't know what to tell you.
With the many re-releases and remasters of Halo, I frankly didn't really know what to look for, since I found something that was a compairson between the windows version and the Xbox version, but it also mentioned the MCC version and "Xemu" whatever the fuck that is.

Now having seen that video, yeah, there is a difference, but frankly, that's not really mind blowing stuff to me. It looked nicer on the console and it released 2 years earlier, I guess I can understand that it was still received warmly, but iirc by the time it hit XBox, games on decent PCs didn't look much different from Halo on XBox.

Also a dedicated melee button and melee actually dealt good damage(insta-kill from behind).

The regenerating energy was necessary for their checkpoint system to work and to create the flow of the game(game rewinds, fast respawn, just keep trucking). Without regenerating health the game would absolutely check-point you in spots where you have no health and every time you turn the corner you die instantly.
If the game they released checkpointed you with a sliver of health it only did so knowing it was safe and you could take a breather to regenerate. It will not save if an enemy is in the checkpoint area.
They put a lot of thought into their regenerating health, that's for sure. I just never warmed up to this particular game mechanic, since it is way too easy to cheese. It allows faster gameplay in the best case scenario, so I can see the appeal.
 
They put a lot of thought into their regenerating health, that's for sure. I just never warmed up to this particular game mechanic, since it is way too easy to cheese. It allows faster gameplay in the best case scenario, so I can see the appeal.
You can pretty much chalk it down to what was considered "accessibility" 20 years ago, before the term became a joke. Dedicated grenade/melee buttons, only two weapons so you ALWAYS knew what you were swapping to and the vehicle controls. Everything was made to be intuitive. I really like Halo 1 but it is not the correct formula for every type of shooter, though HL2 coming out in 2004 with grenades and crowbar nestled somewhere in the weapon-tree was fucking bullshit, that felt archaic as fuck to me.

But going back to Deus Ex 1, in that game it works because it's an RPG of sorts with different melee weapons so juggling that and poking around the inventory all the time is perfectly fine. You know what, the sneaky melee knock-out in Halo might very well have been inspired by Deus Ex 1.
 
I am up to Deus Ex: Human Revolution in my replay of the series. Holy fuck none of these games can hold a candle to Deus Ex. They are so much worse and represent significant regressions from the original. I am starting to realize why I never bothered to buy or play Deus Ex: Mankind Divided. :stress:
 
I am up to Deus Ex: Human Revolution in my replay of the series. Holy fuck none of these games can hold a candle to Deus Ex. They are so much worse and represent significant regressions from the original. I am starting to realize why I never bothered to buy or play Deus Ex: Mankind Divided. :stress:
I've yelled this from all ends of the Earth, and now here: The new DX games literally should NOT have been DX games. Literally call them anything else, change the lore totally, and be something original, because looking at them they hold not an inch of worth compared to the OG Deus Ex. The plot is dumb, the mechanics HEAVILY focus on stealth and Adam frankly doesn't have the charisma and charm of JC to hold his story up in it's rougher spots.

Also, I hear people say the Helios ending is dumb, but what would you rather prefer;
-A status quo continuation where nothing is changed and vague promises "enlightening" the masses are made but are likely to never be fulfilled.
-A nigh genocide of more than half the world for the sake of "starting over", effectively becoming worse than the fucking villians from the sheer collateral of a world wide technology blackout. Not to mention the hints that Tong is part of a secret Chinese cabal that would take advantage of the chaos and rule from there.
-A legitimate chance to change things with the combination of JC's desire to do things right and Helios's desire to properly tend to Humanity and heal Earth of it's conspiracies and secret plots.

Anybody who advocates for a Tong ending, or Allah willing, an Illuminati ending are buying into the sweet words of a gangster turned revolutionary and a former world leader grasping at lost glory and control. You might say the same of Helios, but remember how Helios freed up the roads and shut down the gangs terrorizing Hong Kong? Would you say Tong or Everett would give up their power to make things right when all the evidence points towards the negative?

I think I'll take my chances with the AI. Sides, it makes for cool sequel bait; imagine a DX 2 where JC Helios goes to fight the remnants of the Illuminati and Paul joins in for real, not getting sidelined by his implants going haywire?
 
I've yelled this from all ends of the Earth, and now here: The new DX games literally should NOT have been DX games. Literally call them anything else, change the lore totally, and be something original, because looking at them they hold not an inch of worth compared to the OG Deus Ex. The plot is dumb, the mechanics HEAVILY focus on stealth and Adam frankly doesn't have the charisma and charm of JC to hold his story up in it's rougher spots.

Also, I hear people say the Helios ending is dumb, but what would you rather prefer;
-A status quo continuation where nothing is changed and vague promises "enlightening" the masses are made but are likely to never be fulfilled.
-A nigh genocide of more than half the world for the sake of "starting over", effectively becoming worse than the fucking villians from the sheer collateral of a world wide technology blackout. Not to mention the hints that Tong is part of a secret Chinese cabal that would take advantage of the chaos and rule from there.
-A legitimate chance to change things with the combination of JC's desire to do things right and Helios's desire to properly tend to Humanity and heal Earth of it's conspiracies and secret plots.

Anybody who advocates for a Tong ending, or Allah willing, an Illuminati ending are buying into the sweet words of a gangster turned revolutionary and a former world leader grasping at lost glory and control. You might say the same of Helios, but remember how Helios freed up the roads and shut down the gangs terrorizing Hong Kong? Would you say Tong or Everett would give up their power to make things right when all the evidence points towards the negative?

I think I'll take my chances with the AI. Sides, it makes for cool sequel bait; imagine a DX 2 where JC Helios goes to fight the remnants of the Illuminati and Paul joins in for real, not getting sidelined by his implants going haywire?
There should have been an ending where JC throws a wrench into each plan, then walks the fuck away and leaves them all to kill each other.
 
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