The Mary Sue

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You know, there's a podcast called the Savage Fincast (http://fincast.guttertrash.net/), about Erik Larsen's long running superhero comic Savage Dragon.

In an episode from earlier this year (can't remember which one off hand), they talked about how Erik accidentally and innocuously stumbled into the gender culture wars when he criticized the current Ms. Marvel's costume and received a ton of flak for that. In the episode, one of the guys calls the Mary Sue "the Mary Jane", and another jokingly adds in "stop having fun, guys".
 
Here's something on the Bechdel Bill where they want people to pledge to have at least 80% pass the Bechdel test. The problem I've always had with the test is there's films that would understandably have little to no female characters like Shawshank Redemption. (A film set in an all-male prison in the mid 1900's.) Or female centered films where she's mostly alone (Gravity) would also fail.
 
Yaoi Huntress Earth said:
Here's something on the Bechdel Bill where they want people to pledge to have at least 80% pass the Bechdel test. The problem I've always had with the test is there's films that would understandably have little to no female characters like Shawshank Redemption. (A film set in an all-male prison in the mid 1900's.) Or female centered films where she's mostly alone (Gravity) would also fail.
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I'd thought we all agreed the Bechdel Test was a joke.
 
Splendid Meat Sticks said:
Yeah, it came out in a webcomic. And I think the person who made it said that it shouldn't be taken seriously too.
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Yaoi Huntress Earth said:
Yeah, but these women are taking it too seriously.
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I believe in the comic, it was a punchline. The gag is that it's so restrictive the last movie the woman was able to see was Alien.

If your criteria on judging a movie is how well women are represented in it, and not how good the story, acting, direction, etc. are, then clearly you have something to grind and need to get off your high horse.
 
Yaoi Huntress Earth said:
Here's something on the Bechdel Bill where they want people to pledge to have at least 80% pass the Bechdel test. The problem I've always had with the test is there's films that would understandably have little to no female characters like Shawshank Redemption. (A film set in an all-male prison in the mid 1900's.) Or female centered films where she's mostly alone (Gravity) would also fail.
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You know what else probably wouldn't pass the Bechdel test- Disney's Mulan, y'know... that movie that is supposed to have strong themes of female-empowerment.
Oops.
 
Steamboat_Bill said:
I believe in the comic, it was a punchline. The gag is that it's so restrictive the last movie the woman was able to see was Alien.

If your criteria on judging a movie is how well women are represented in it, and not how good the story, acting, direction, etc. are, then clearly you have something to grind and need to get off your high horse.
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I think the problem with the Bechdel test is too much grinding and not enough dicking.

Sorry, I had to.
 
Yaoi Huntress Earth said:
Here's something on the Bechdel Bill where they want people to pledge to have at least 80% pass the Bechdel test. The problem I've always had with the test is there's films that would understandably have little to no female characters like Shawshank Redemption. (A film set in an all-male prison in the mid 1900's.) Or female centered films where she's mostly alone (Gravity) would also fail.
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So how many people are actually pledging this?

Anybody that matters?
 
Yaoi Huntress Earth said:
According to the FB page and such, mainly small indy directors.
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Well of course.

How else are they going to come up with a film that literally no-one will see? Shit like Buffalo 66 is for fucking losers man!

On a side note, I fucking love Buffalo 66!
 
I've come to the conclusion that TMS hates the idea of white CIS males having anything major. Cultural icons like Dr. Who, Spider-Man and now James Bond should have their race, gender or sexuality changed. Because white cis-het men shouldn't be these characters. I believe in the best person for the job and diversity is great, but this feels a little bigoted they're judging on race, sexuality and gender and acting as if it's gross if a person is a certain way through no fault of their own.
 
Yaoi Huntress Earth said:
I've come to the conclusion that TMS hates the idea of white CIS males having anything major. Cultural icons like Dr. Who, Spider-Man and now James Bond should have their race, gender or sexuality changed. Because white cis-het men shouldn't be these characters. I believe in the best person for the job and diversity is great, but this feels a little bigoted they're judging on race, sexuality and gender and acting as if it's gross if a person is a certain way through no fault of their own.
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Oh I was wondering when they were going to jump on Pierce Brosnan's comments.

I don't know why SJWs are so bothered about a black/female/gay/toasterkin James Bond. He's not exactly a paragon of virtue, and with all his countless flaws (womanising, misogynist, alcoholic, thuggish, tendency to shoot foreign nationals) you'd think they'd want him to stay as cishet white male scum.

I can understand Dr. Who, as he can drastically change his appearance, it's in the lore, and Spider-Man is a guy in a suit, who says the guy can't be black? But yeah, trying to change established characters such as James Bond for some bullshit diversity agenda always pisses me off
 
CWCissey said:
Oh I was wondering when they were going to jump on Pierce Brosnan's comments.

I don't know why SJWs are so bothered about a black/female/gay/toasterkin James Bond. He's not exactly a paragon of virtue, and with all his countless flaws (womanising, misogynist, alcoholic, thuggish, tendency to shoot foreign nationals) you'd think they'd want him to stay as cishet white male scum.
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It seems from the comments section, they'd love to get rid of his "toxic massculinity" and that changing his gender would be a step in that right direction.
 
CWCissey said:
I can understand Dr. Who, as he can drastically change his appearance, it's in the lore, and Spider-Man is a guy in a suit, who says the guy can't be black? But yeah, trying to change established characters such as James Bond for some bullshit diversity agenda always pisses me off
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It's a bit perplexing, and a bit insulting, when someone makes the argument that the motives that drive Spider-Man in all his media incarnations (trying to balance personal sacrifice with personal gain, doing great things even if they go uncredited or misattributed) are somehow incapable of being understood if a white male does them. But, if they're done by a black person, or a trans person, or whatever, then they make TOTAL sense.

The hypocrisy of denying that white people could have ANY virtuous qualities, let alone the SAME ones as other HUMAN BEINGS is apparently lost on them, no surprise.
 
CWCissey said:
I don't know why SJWs are so bothered about a black/female/gay/toasterkin James Bond. He's not exactly a paragon of virtue, and with all his countless flaws (womanising, misogynist, alcoholic, thuggish, tendency to shoot foreign nationals) you'd think they'd want him to stay as cishet white male scum.
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I think expecting TMS to actually know about James Bond's characterization and flaws would be giving them too much credit.

For the record, I'm all for different imagining of the characters, whether it be race, gender, or sexuality (Even though I think the last one can be a bit tricky depending on the character). But what annoys me about TMS and other SJWs is how they go about it. Instead of saying "Hey, what if this character was black/female/gay?", there tend to me like "OMG X HAS TO BE Y! IT MAKES SENSE! HE CAN'T BE A CISHET WHITE MALE!", it just comes off entitled as fuck. You're ignoring decades worth of canon and characterization just so you can feel good about yourself and pat yourself on the back while convincing yourself that you're definitely not racist/sexist/homophobic for the umpteenth time that day.
 
TowinKarz said:
The hypocrisy of denying that white people could have ANY virtuous qualities, let alone the SAME ones as other HUMAN BEINGS is apparently lost on them, no surprise.
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SJW really do see white people, particularly cis hetero white men, as subhumans deserving death. It is not hyperbole in the least to say that SJW are this generation's Nazis. The only difference is that SJW will never be in power because of their spoiled, stupid nature and inability to work together for a common goal.
 
TheMightyMonarch said:
I think expecting TMS to actually know about James Bond's characterization and flaws would be giving them too much credit.

For the record, I'm all for different imagining of the characters, whether it be race, gender, or sexuality (Even though I think the last one can be a bit tricky depending on the character). But what annoys me about TMS and other SJWs is how they go about it. Instead of saying "Hey, what if this character was black/female/gay?", there tend to me like "OMG X HAS TO BE Y! IT MAKES SENSE! HE CAN'T BE A CISHET WHITE MALE!", it just comes off entitled as fuck. You're ignoring decades worth of canon and characterization just so you can feel good about yourself and pat yourself on the back while convincing yourself that you're definitely not racist/sexist/homophobic for the umpteenth time that day.
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Oh definitely. I'd also say it's rather insulting to minorities/women/homosexuals/oppressed peoples of the week as what they're suggesting is that a character of their genotype/sexuality is unable to succeed without riding on the tails of a white character.
 
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