Star Trek - Space: The Final Frontier

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I was meh about journey's end too. Opinions on best season finale? I liked Voyager's finale. I felt like the others felt flat.
I'm having trouble sleeping lately, so naturally I decided to watch TNG: Night Terrors (season 4). This one and TNG Schisms (season 6) are both pretty spoopy.
Though god damn Deanna "no one else can sleep except me, but when I do I have bad dreams :(" fuck off
 
Shit All Good Things was pretty dope. Doesn't make up for the rest of Season 7, but it was probably the best episode of the season. Old Picard was pretty feelsy and man the way it ended was pretty damn perfect. "...and the sky's the limit." really is a great line to end TNG.
Finally I get to move onto DS9 Season 4. Time for some Worf baby.
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Edit: GOD fucking DAMMIT they sped up the DS9 theme. I really liked it a lot and now it sounds retarded please tell me this is some sort of issue with Netflix
 
GeorgeDaMoose said:
Shit All Good Things was pretty dope. Doesn't make up for the rest of Season 7, but it was probably the best episode of the season. Old Picard was pretty feelsy and man the way it ended was pretty damn perfect. "...and the sky's the limit." really is a great line to end TNG.
Finally I get to move onto DS9 Season 4. Time for some Worf baby.
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While you've been doing that, I've been going through Enterprise again. I've reached the point where there is only one bad episode left, but the rest are pretty solid.
 
GeorgeDaMoose said:
Isn't the last episode the worst?
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That's the bad one I meant. I didn't say it was the last since I didn't know if you knew, and nothing is a bigger bummer than saying... X of these are fantastic... some of the best Trek ever IMHO, but the finale was utter shit.

But since the cat is out of the bag... that episode stinks on ice. I have a fan edit that took most of the BS out, and it ends up being like a 17 min episode.
 
YankeeTrader said:
That's the bad one I meant. I didn't say it was the last since I didn't know if you knew, and nothing is a bigger bummer than saying... X of these are fantastic... some of the best Trek ever IMHO, but the finale was utter shit.

But since the cat is out of the bag... that episode stinks on ice. I have a fan edit that took most of the BS out, and it ends up being like a 17 min episode.
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Yeah I stumbled upon it while looking through the Star Trek site that lists episodes chronologically. Was really surprised to see it in the middle of DS9 and TNG so I looked it up. Really weird how they decided a thinly veiled TNG episode would work for a ENT finale.
Anyways, what's the episode gap like between the shitty episode you were talking about and These Are the Voyages...? Hopefully it's not a small one.
 
GeorgeDaMoose said:
Yeah I stumbled upon it while looking through the Star Trek site that lists episodes chronologically. Was really surprised to see it in the middle of DS9 and TNG so I looked it up. Really weird how they decided a thinly veiled TNG episode would work for a ENT finale.
Anyways, what's the episode gap like between the shitty episode you were talking about and These Are the Voyages...? Hopefully it's not a small one.
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Season 4 is the magic year for ENT. After they wrap loose ends from the big arc in the first 2 episodes, everything else is pretty solid. We get a few two parters, a three parter and one story that sets up another down the road.

I'd say 19 pretty solid episodes. With maybe 2 in the middle that are a little weaker than the rest, but not bad by any means.
 
Shiiiiiiiiieeeeeeeetttttt The Way of the Warrior was way too kickass. Worf was fucking shit up left and right and Klingons in general just were cool as hell.
Worf was really fun in TNG, but DS9 makes him feel more like a warrior so far which is great.
 
GeorgeDaMoose said:
Shiiiiiiiiieeeeeeeetttttt The Way of the Warrior was way too kickass. Worf was fucking shit up left and right and Klingons in general just were cool as hell.
Worf was really fun in TNG, but DS9 makes him feel more like a warrior so far which is great.
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This is where the Klingons really come into their own as a culture in the Trek universe.
 
YankeeTrader said:
What do you disagree with about my season 7 comment?
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I think quite a few season 7 episodes were quality. Parallels, Pegasus, Thine Own Self, Bloodlines, Emergence, Preemptive Strike...but also my favorite of the whole series: All Good Things.
 
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Holdek said:
I think quite a few season season 7 episodes were quality. Parallels, Pegasus, Thine Own Self, Bloodlines, Emergence, Preemptive Strike...but also my favorite of the whole series: All Good Things.
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Fair nuff. That still leaves 19 stinkers :D

Compared to 3-6, 7 just seemed like a big letdown
 
melty said:
Opinions on best season finale? I liked Voyager's finale. I felt like the others felt flat.
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Voyager's finale was awful. It made no effort to give us any kind of closure for any of the characters (ironically Neelix, the most hated character on the show, was the only one who had closure to his storyline), it created a huge plothole by showing the Borg basically had a jump point right to earth which they never used, the shot of Voyager coming out of an exploding Borg sphere was only put in there because "it looked cool" and Voyager didn't even reach earth. The last shot was Voyager flying towards earth. For all we know an asteroid could've hit it and it never would've arrived.

The finale's an embodiment of Voyager's overall storytelling failure rather than just a bad finale. The crew should've got home at the latest halfway through season seven so we could've seen the impact of the long journey on them and their friends and family back home. Instead they copped out and hit the reset button like they always did. Long-term story arcs? Storylines with consequences? What are those?

Best finale is "All Good Things...". "What you Leave Behind" is terrible and the less said about Enterprise's finale (and Enterprise itself) the better.

Oh and just as a warning @GeorgeDaMoose if you though season 7 of TNG was terrible, season 7 of DS9 is just as bad if not worse. They dropped the ball after being consistently excellent since season 3. With TNG and DSG, they both spent their first two seasons being bad imitations of their predecessors (TOS in TNG's case and TNG in DS9's case), then hit their stride in the third season and kept that streak up until season 6, before falling flat with season 7. With Voyager, each season is pretty much the same - a string of mediocre-to-bad episodes with a few good ones sprinkled in adding up to a mixed bag that leans more towards bad than good.

Also, some people were posting convention stories here so I thought I'd share some of my own.

TNG Cast

I've only been to one Star Trek convention because I live in the UK and conventions like that only show up here once in a blue moon. I saw most of the cast of TNG live on stage, with the panel moderated by William Shatner. A lot of people make fun of Shatner, but he's actually got a great sense of humour and he's a very skilled entertainer. Before the panel started, I witnessed my first ever gay marriage proposal (and my first ever proposal full stop) - a guy took to the stage and proposed to his boyfriend with a series of Star Trek clips. It was actually very sweet.

It was mentioned earlier in the thread that Brent Spiner comes off as aloof but is actually a great guy. I didn't meet him personally but he was very funny during the panel. A fan stood up to ask a question and English wasn't his first language so he ended up garbling it a bit, but the question came out as: "Which was your favourite of all Star Trek episodes of all the series?". There was a long pause, then Brent said "I particularly liked the episodes with the character Data" which cracked everyone up.

Wil Wheaton wasn't on the panel which I was very thankful for because I can't stand the guy. Someone who follows him was in the audience though and if you've followed Wheaton's blogging you know he doesn't exactly have the best memories of his time on the show. This person asked the panel about the stuff Wheaton's said about the show and the way he was treated. There was a rather uncomfortable silence before Marina Sirtis jumped in and said rather impatiently "He was just a kid. We tried our best with him but he was just a kid." Didn't really know what to make of that.

Jeri Ryan

I also went to Jeri Ryan's talk. As you can probably guess, Star Trek conventions are a magnet for autists and the Jeri Ryan panel was a magnet for something far worse - thirsty autists. Thankfully no-one asked or did anything too awkward although Jeri was talking about the impact Seven of Nine had had on people's lives and she mentioned the character having a positive impact on autistic fans at which point a huge cheer went up from the crowd. I also saw more than a few creepers looking way too interested when she was describing how tight her costume was (although I can't say I really blame them).
 
TheImportantFart said:
The last shot was Voyager flying towards earth. For all we know an asteroid could've hit it and it never would've arrived.
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Really? what kind of a complaint is that?
Granted I haven't seen it in awhile, but I felt like it was the only one that gave any kind of resolution and was at least semi positive.
I disagree they should have gotten home, I rather liked the arc of them being in communication with earth and discussing the consequences of actually making it home, especially for characters like Seven and B'elanna. I think showing any more would have been lame.

TNG - also haven't seen this one in years but Picard having dementia or whatever and finding out him and Beverly get married and then divorced in the future just made me sad. I guess "made me sad" isn't that valid of a reason and IIRC that future doesn't have to happen, I guess I should rewatch this one, it's been awhile.

DS9 - I saw this one just the other day and it's not good. Dukat and Kai Winn apparently stand in the same spot in the fire caves for like six hours and of course there is sisko turning into space Jesus. apparently the writers wanted his leaving to be made permanent but avery brooks didn't like the idea of a black man abandoning his baby lol. I don't think that was the wrong decision.

Enterprise is Enterprise.

I guess I should rewatch All Good Things, it's the one I've seen least recently.

When I went to a Trek con, it was the Voyager 20th anniversary and they did a panel with the entire cast (except Kes I think). I have to say Garrett Wang was actually really really funny. Neelixs actor (forget his name) said to Kate Mulgrew that Neelix always had a crush on Janeway.
That's pretty interesting about Jeri Ryan's panel.
 
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melty said:
Really? what kind of a complaint is that?
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In Babylon 5 they wrapped up the Shadow War arc and the War with Earth arc at the end of the penultimate season. The fifth and final season dealt with the aftermath of these conflicts. Now the fifth season of Babylon 5 was arguably the weakest, but it was a hell of a lot more interesting than if they'd just ended after they took back Earth. I wanted to see what would happen when Voyager's crew got home - see them adjust to life in the Alpha Quadrant after the lawlessness of the Delta Quadrant.

Since this was Voyager I guess I was expecting too much but showing their lives after they got home seemed like a no-brainer. Even Enterprise got this right - there was a whole episode dedicated to the crew recovering from their time in the Expanse during the third season. It wouldn't preclude a happy ending either. I think what they should've done is have some of the crew get home but at the expense of having to leave some of the other crewmembers behind. Janeway's then wracked with guilt that they left people behind so the finale could've been her going to rescue them.

But like I said, this was Voyager. I was expecting too much.
 
TheImportantFart said:
In Babylon 5 they wrapped up the Shadow War arc and the War with Earth arc at the end of the penultimate season. The fifth and final season dealt with the aftermath of these conflicts. Now the fifth season of Babylon 5 was arguably the weakest, but it was a hell of a lot more interesting than if they'd just ended after they took back Earth. I wanted to see what would happen when Voyager's crew got home - see them adjust to life in the Alpha Quadrant after the lawlessness of the Delta Quadrant.

Since this was Voyager I guess I was expecting too much but showing their lives after they got home seemed like a no-brainer. Even Enterprise got this right - there was a whole episode dedicated to the crew recovering from their time in the Expanse during the third season. It wouldn't preclude a happy ending either. I think what they should've done is have some of the crew get home but at the expense of having to leave some of the other crewmembers behind. Janeway's then wracked with guilt that they left people behind so the finale could've been her going to rescue them.

But like I said, this was Voyager. I was expecting too much.
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Season 5 of Babylon 5 was cobbled together in haste since JMS didn't think he was going to get to finish it. That's kind of why The Deconstruction of Falling Stars feels like a finale in itself. Had TNT not jumped in, that's where it would have finished.
 
YankeeTrader said:
Season 5 of Babylon 5 was cobbled together in haste since JMS didn't think he was going to get to finish it. That's kind of why The Deconstruction of Falling Stars feels like a finale in itself. Had TNT not jumped in, that's where it would have finished.
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I know that, but even then there was an episode after the battle to give us some cooldown time.

Also, (off-topic but what the hey) it's not so much that JMS cobbled together the final season - he had it planned out in advance, it's more that he had to squeeze stuff he wanted to spread out more into the fourth season. For reference, "The Face of the Enemy" where Sheridan gets captured was supposed to be the season four finale.
 
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