Religion Discussion

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Oh, fun thread! I'm not religious, but there's something which needs to be investigated. Anyone who says "All religion is bad" is fucking dumb, they're just too stupid to read and think themselves above it. My own beliefs are similar to that one really good Doctor Who episode.

The two-parter's story starts with the Doctor and his companion becoming stranded on an ancient, barren planet in orbit around a black hole. They encounter an expeditionary team, and a planet full of ruins and a language "too old to decipher" and escalates from there. While one man, Toby, falls victim to the influence of an unknown entity, they discover that the planet contains an ancient prison, a pit, and their space niggers - the submissive, telepathic slave-race, the Ood - become host to the beast contained within the prison.


So, Islam is explicitly Satanism. I have no doubt about that. Whatever entity it was, it was absolutely not whoever Jesus was talking about, and absolutely the exact opposite. Muslims worship Satan.

So, the Satanic Verses - Mohammad did say, explicitly, that he was talking to multiple entities. They were three Pagan gods worshipped in Mecca who he made references to, and then later retracted them to say "There is no God, but Allah" and that he was being led astray by yet another entity, who he called Iblis. This isn't what I'm talking about, though. This is just to say that lore-wise, Mohammad was talking to a lot of different entities.

Iblis is denoted as the Kafir, the one who causes disbelief, in Islam. Allah, the most common Arabic word for "God"- Iblis, formerly known as "Azazel" was kicked out of heaven for failure to prostrate himself before Adam (mankind) - which is fucking bizarre. Iblis comes up multiple times, often in the same positions formerly held by God (Allah) - he who sits upon his throne over the water. This refers to both Iblis and God, himself, at different times.

Allah isn't the only name - there are "Ninety-nine Names" in Islam, and those include some which make sense - "The Merciful" and "The Creator" - but then there's a few which are a bit less pleasant.

Al-Qahhar - The Subduer/Conquerer.

Al-Khafid - The Humiliator (contrasted with "Turn the Other Cheek" in Christianity, that you must always face your enemies as if they are your equal)

Al-Bat - The Necromancer (Jesus was supposed to be God, himself, who is immune to death, this explicitly refers to raising the dead)

Al-Makirina - The Deceiver

These are all things which are directly associated with Satan - the Accuser, the Humiliator and the Deceiver - and other interpretations of "The Bad Guy" - while the Islamic version, Iblis, seems more like a "messenger" - but the real "Nail in the Coffin" is this specific "Morning Star"

The Morning Star is seen as Islam's guiding light, or some shit. The Morning Star, the Fallen Angel, is where the name "Lucifer" actually comes from. The brightest star in the sky, which was visible in daytime, because it was seen as "vying for power" with God and sought to become the only source of light. Following the Morning Star was seen as "bringing eternal darkness" - hence, Satanism.

The brightest star which wanted to become the only source of light is, explicitly, the guiding star for Mohammad. This was the theology for hundreds of years by that point - everyone else who was familiar with the Morning Star saw it was the "Usurper" while Mohammad was literally guided by it. This isn't a minor deal, it's the opening verse of multiple prayers. Some Islamic scholars counter this by saying "Jesus once referred to himself as the morning star" - there's a bit of a difference in context, Jesus didn't say "I will do whatever you say, sinister talking star" he said "I will guide you like the stars" to a bunch of dudes who were in need of directions.

The sinister part is - according to Islamic scholars, this means that Satan himself is just God, pretending to be Satan, for some reason. I suggest that the opposite is true, that if there is some series of "entities" which influence the world, then the God of the Bible is "Iblis", and Lucifer is the Islamic "Allah" - implying that Muslims have resigned themselves to the idea that God is evil, and that God will make them do evil things - but evil things are okay, because God is also Satan. This is fucking horrifying, they have nuclear weapons.


Islam runs directly counter to common sense, and is by definition, fucking wrong. For example, in Christian and Jewish theology, Moses was adopted by the Pharaoh's daughter who found him, as an orphan, in the reeds of the River Nile. In Islam's "interpretation" of this event, it was the Pharaoh's wife - who then immediately began to breast-feed baby Moses. She later martyred herself and was allowed into heaven because she was a virgin. Virgins generally don't nurse children.

This happens again, later, where the Pharoah's wife orders her mother-in-law to breastfeed Moses. This is explicitly cited as a sign of the apocalypse. I'm not sure how far along the timeline this was, but I'm fairly sure Moses was an adult by the time Revelation came about. This is not abnormal for Mohammad, he regularly drank random women's breast milk.

It may be possible that she had cancer, I don't know, but it's not really common for women to lactate on an as-needed basis. This is one of the common tropes of Islam - extremely unlikely, impossible-to-prove leaps of judgement to cover up for obvious errors in the narrative. This is a very important part of the narrative, by the way. There's a whole bunch of Islamic Lore about breastfeeding.

One of the few times where a man is permitted to engage with another man's wife is if he is sucking on her titties.

You can approach any Muslim woman and suck on her titties for a bit and her husband can do nothing about it. It's in the Hadiths, Mohammad himself ordered it. But if you do, remember - according to Islam, breast milk contains sperm. Yes, you would be drinking her husband's jizz if you did. Never mind that this directly contradicts the Pharaoh shit, you will be stoned to death if you mention it. Drink your jizzy milk.

To explicitly say - Muslims believe that breast milk is a mixture of male and female ejaculate. They still drink it. Well into adulthood. They also have a special term for this - "Milk Brothers" - which is like "Blood Brothers" but weirder.

You can probably guess - most Arab women were pregnant or nursing for most of their sad, short lives. Mohammad extended this to the Jews and Ancient Egyptians, not knowing that this was really fucking weird and probably unhealthy.

Mohammad also explicitly states that the Holy Trinity is the Father, the Son and the Virgin Mary. For non-Catholics, it's the Holy Spirit. It was always the Holy Spirit. I have no idea why he said Mary. No Muslim does either.

Back onto the weird shit with the breast-milk - the famed 72 virgins refer to Houri, an angelic kind of "woman" - there are two interpretations, since it expressly talks about their breasts being swollen and perky.

The breast-feeding one is the least weird interpretation, the more likely one is that they are 12. Reading actual Islamic literature is like reading the Zoo thread.

And the worst part - being a Christian is a death sentence under any Blasphemy law, explicitly. You will be guilty if you insist "God had a son" - directly aimed at Christians. Every single Mosque preaches anti-Christian hatred, from the exact beginning to the end. For a Muslim who doesn't, explicitly, wish death upon all Christians - there's a word for that - "Apostate" - and the sentence is death, too. Any sentence for "hatred targeted at Muslims" should be considered as a legitimate threat to civilisation, itself. Anyone who advocates for it should be tried at the Hague.
 
And the worst part - being a Christian is a death sentence under any Blasphemy law, explicitly. You will be guilty if you insist "God had a son" - directly aimed at Christians. Every single Mosque preaches anti-Christian hatred, from the exact beginning to the end. For a Muslim who doesn't, explicitly, wish death upon all Christians - there's a word for that - "Apostate" - and the sentence is death, too. Any sentence for "hatred targeted at Muslims" should be considered as a legitimate threat to civilisation, itself. Anyone who advocates for it should be tried at the Hague.
Yeah? The muslims are goat fuckers, news at 11. Don't go to the middle east, problem solved.
 
Nigger, while I agree Islam is a booger that needs to be wiped off the nose of the earth as quickly as possible, Christianity is no better. Spirituality that says 'I'm right and everyone else is wrong' is just as fucked up as the rest.

"religion" in the theistic sense that says 'kill the heretic' is inherently evil and self-limiting. It leads to hatred in any form. Islam may well be the worst of these, but it's a matter of degrees.
 
Spirituality that says 'I'm right and everyone else is wrong
No, they don't.

Literally Islamist propaganda. This is like:

Muslims - "the Quran says that drinking human piss is the cure for cancer. So I will now piss on some kids with cancer."

Everyone else "please don't"

Then you saying PFFF IT'S A TWO WAY BATTLE.

It's not a religion, it's a totalitarian nightmare. The equivalent to the Quran isn't the Bible - it's the Magna Carta.
 
They have been a presence in Europe for their entire history.

I think we should push back into Asia, and remove them by force. We didn't get the chance, thanks to Woodrow Wilson.

Yes, that recent - it was actually the USA who stopped Europe from pushing back.
There is no one to blame in Britain for your plights than yourselves. You don't blow up their boats. Their religion is winning because of it and your Europe's laxadasial attitude towards faith. Either drive them out, submit, or convert to Christianity to counter it. Those are your options.
 
The Quran is just the sequel to the Bible and Christian fundamentalists have more in common with wahabbists than they do with more moderate Christians.
 
Their religion is winning because of it and your Europe's laxadasial attitude towards faith
...they're winning because Europeans are too eager to fight eachother.

Last time they tried to invade Europe was to try to sneak attack Russia. Then, after those wars, the USA actively defended them - for seemingly no reason.
 
I don't really give a fuck about religion either way, but let's just say I'd rather be stuck in the bible belt than I would in the Islam equvliant. I'd also rather be around hyper religious people than some lawless gangs or crackheads.
 
I don't really give a fuck about religion either way, but let's just say I'd rather be stuck in the bible belt than I would in the Islam equvliant. I'd also rather be around hyper religious people than some lawless gangs or crackheads.
Implying the Bible belt isn't trying to be the Jesus version of Saudi Arabia (which actually has less restrictive abortion laws than states like Alabama).

We also have plenty of gangs, crackheads, and meth labs in addition to all the noncery fundies get up to.

Speaking of...

Tennessee youth pastor arrested for statutory rape

Texas youth pastor arrested for sexual assault of a minor

More than a dozen new charges filed against Florida pastor arrested for child porn
 
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Remove Shirdi Sai Baba idols from Hindu temples, insists a PIL at Madras High Court​

The litigant said the religious identity of Shirdi Sai Baba remains unknown, and since he was known to have preached about both Islam and Hinduism, his idols should not be allowed at Hindu temples

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A public interest litigation (PIL) petition has been filed in the Madras High Court seeking a direction to the Tamil Nadu Hindu Religious and Charitable Endowments (HR&CE) Department, to remove the idols of Shirdi Sai Baba from all temples under its control on the grounds that their installation was against the Agama Sastras.

Acting Chief Justice R. Mahadevan and Justice Mohammed Shaffiq on Tuesday, June 25, 2024, directed the government counsel to take instructions from the HR&CE Department alone, within two weeks, after the petitioner’s counsel submitted that he was not pressing the case against the Government Chief Kazi and the All India Sai Samaj.

In his affidavit, the petitioner, D. Sureshbabu of Uppilipalayam post in Coimbatore, said he was a Saivite devoted to the worship of Lord Shiva. He was disturbed with the increasing practice of installing white marble idols of Shirdi Sai Baba in many Hindu temples and contended that this practice went against the Agamas.

The litigant contended that there was conflicting views about the parentage of Sai Baba, which meant poor old man/holy father/saintly father, and that even his real name was not known. There was also no confirmation about his religious identity though he had many Muslim followers, he added.

Quoting from a book on the life and teachings of Sai Baba, the petitioner said, the saint was reported to have often quoted Persian verses and spoke about Allah and the Quran. “Sai Baba frequently used the expression ‘Allah rakhega vaiia rahena (let us be content with what we have and submit our will to Allah) and in some instances with his Hindu followers, he talked about Hindu Gods,” the affidavit read.

The petitioner also brought it to the notice of the court, that since the worship of Sai Baba was not restricted to the Hindu religion, those who administered places of worship dedicated to the saint claimed exemption from being brought under the control of the HR&CE Department.

However, on the other hand, idols of Shirdi Sai Baba were being freely installed in Hindu temples though he was a person who preached both Islam and Hinduism, the petitioner said and complained that in some cases the white marble idols of Shirdi Sai Baba were being installed right next to the Nandi, which was against the Agamas.

The petitioner sought a direction to the HR&CE Department to remove the idols of Shirdi Sai Baba from Hindu temples and to ensure that such idols were not installed in the future too, in these temples.

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North River church sheds Methodist affiliation
Parish renamed 'Christian Hill Bible Church'

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NORTH RIVER | A church in North River with Methodist ties for 177 years is now an independent parish, locally owned and managed.

The North River United Methodist Church’s local leaders cut ties with the regional Methodist church's governing body, and renamed their parish Christian Hill Bible Church.

Church member Amy Sabattis said the principal reason for ending the affiliation was the local congregation’s adherence to different spiritual beliefs and practices than the mainline United Methodists.

“We wanted to stick with the traditional Biblical teachings,” she said.

Church Trustee Roxy Freebern said the Upper New York United Methodists Conference wanted $20,000 for the divorce, but the local church's leaders researched the church’s original deed and discovered the conference’s claim of church ownership was not valid.

Armed with this information, the separation was achieved by the North River congregation paying the Conference $12,300, a sum drawn from the congregation’s building fund. She said the local church had been paying the Upper New York United Methodists Conference $3,000 annually for the affiliation, and that money will now be invested in the upkeep of the church building.

Freebern said she had asked a conference representative to tell her what benefits the Conference provided the church, and the person said “We do online stuff for you,” and Freebern responded, “We not only don’t have Internet service, we don’t even have a telephone.”

Sabattis said the North River congregation decided to rename the church “Christian Hill” because Fourteenth Lake Road, where it is located, has been known by that name for generations because the road historically hosted three churches within a short distance.

“Ours is the last one standing now,” Sabattis said.

The church was established in 1847 as the North River Episcopal Methodist Church, Freebern said.

Freebern’s father-in-law William F. Freebern Jr. and grandfather-in-law William F. Freebern Sr. both were carpenters and they invested a lot of volunteer time and effort in repairs and upgrades to the church building, as have so many other people in North River and beyond, she said.

“We’ve always had a lot of community effort to help the church in any way that was needed,” she said. “Community support has been unreal.”

One recent example of that support was a parish bake sale that yielded $750 in revenue.

“Raising that amount of money from a bake sale is unheard of,” Freebern said.

The congregation also raises money through returnable container collections, holds a strawberry festival in July with a white elephant sale, and has weekly craft sessions to make items that are sold in an early-November craft sale.

The revenue from these events is donated to the Adirondack Community Outreach Center for their schoolchildren’s backpack program as well as the center’s food pantry.

One prominent upcoming event in the Christian Hill Bible Church is a concert with multi-Grammy-winning contemporary Christian music singer Bruce Carroll. Sabattis said the church holds about two such high-profile concerts per year, and as many as 30 people attend.

The Bruce Carroll concert is set for 7 p.m. Sunday July 21. The concert is free of charge, but “love offerings” are accepted.

Sabattis said that although the North River church has a small congregation of a few dozen members, it hosts concerts featuring contemporary Christian singers with national reputations several times per year.

Sabattis credited WGNA Radio personality Brian Larson for connecting the parish with renowned musicians. She added that he has donated a sound system to the North River church so the recording artists and other musicians performing there don’t have to bring their own sound equipment.

Sabattis said these concerts are a way churchgoers in the rural southern Adirondacks stay in touch with each other.

“Through the concerts, we check in on each other, hear how the churches and their parishioners are doing,” she said. “There’s very good community spirit up here.”

By Thom Randall

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Madonna statue that ‘weeps tears of blood’ is fake, declares Vatican​

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ROME – A widespread and bizarre controversy in Italy has finally come to an end after the Vatican announced that a notorious Marian statue that allegedly shed tears of blood was deemed to be false.

The claims have centered in the small Italian town of Trevignano Romano near the shore of Lake Bracciano, about 40 minutes north of Rome, and which is home to roughly 6,000 people.

There, a Sicilian woman named Gisella Cardia has a statue of the Madonna she bought in Medjugorje several years ago, and which has claims has been bleeding from the eyes since 2016. Cardia has also claimed the Madonna has been giving her private revelations since then.

As word spread about the famed Madonna di Trevignano, a swath of devotees would visit the statue on the 3rd of every month, gathering at a makeshift shrine set up in an open field in Trevignano Romano to pray the rosary, venerate the statue, make confessions, and hear the latest of Cardia’s revelations.

Many pilgrims who flocked to the site are local, however, scores of others come from throughout the Italian peninsula, giving the statue national fame.

Last year, locals skeptical of the bleeding Madonna called in a private investigator, who met with the carabinieri, the Italian military police, reportedly presenting evidence suggesting that the liquid on the statue was pig’s blood.

An earlier investigation in 2020 had claimed that the blood found on the statue then was a genetic match to Cardia’s own.

A video of Cardia later surfaced in which she discussed the supernatural phenomena she claims to have experienced, including an occasion when she found herself needing to feed 15 people with only a few leftovers from the previous day’s lunch of gnocchi and rabbit.

However, Cardia said that when she started serving the reheated leftovers, the amount never diminished no matter how much she dished up.

A preliminary report from an investigation by the Diocese of Civita Castellana concluded that there’s nothing supernatural about the statue, and that finding was confirmed by the Vatican.

In a June 27 communique, the Vatican’s Dicastery for the Doctrine of the Faith issued its first decree according to a new set of norms for vetting alleged Marian apparitions and spiritual phenomena.

The decree referenced Bishop Marco Salvi of Civita Castellana’s initial report on the Madonna di Trevignano, dated March 6, saying that “in agreement with this institution, regarding the alleged apparitions and revelations by Mrs. Gisella Cardia…and Mr. Gianni Cardia, this Dicastery recognises the validity of the aforementioned judgement expressed therein (constat de non supernaturalitate),” meaning, “it is clear that it is not supernatural”.

“May the Blessed Virgin Mary, Mother of Jesus, Mother of the Church and our Mother, restore peace and serenity in view of the spiritual good of the faithful of the parish of Trevignano Romano and of the people of God who are throughout the Diocese of Civita Castellana,” the decree said.

It comes less than two months after the Vatican in May rolled out a new expedited procedure for vetting alleged Marian apparitions or other spiritual phenomenon, ruling that they will no longer be deemed supernatural, but simply that nothing stands in the way of encouraging devotion.

According to the new norms, the discernment process for making a ruling on alleged spiritual phenomena now ends “not with a declaration of ‘de supernaturalitate’ (of the supernatural).”

Rather, six different “prudential conclusions” can be given, depending on the case, but unless the pope directly intervenes to declare something supernatural, that designation will no longer be given.

That decision, according to DDF officials, was made largely on grounds that a ruling on alleged supernatural phenomena would be reached faster, which is especially important in the digital age, and to avoid any confusion that belief in these phenomena is obligatory.

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Resident pitches Brant councillors on Islamic school​


Longtime Brantford resident Anwar Dost is hoping to build an Islamic community centre, school, gym, and place of worship on five acres of land he co-owns in Brant County.

Dost appeared before Brant County council last week to tell councillors more about the vision and gain their support.

Paris is seeing an influx of South Asian and Islamic community members, Dost told councillors, pointing to affordability and proximity to the highway.

In the 2021 census profile from Statistics Canada, 410 Brant County residents identified as Muslim — a marked increase from the 2011 census, when no one reported identifying as Muslim.

With a growing community in the area, Dost said a community centre — open to all members of the public — gym, Islamic school and place of worship is “desperately” needed.

The closest Islamic school (and prototype for what Dost is proposing) is the International School of Cambridge.

The school follows the Ontario curriculum, but doesn’t receive any public funding, according to its website. Instead, it is supported through student fees and donations from the Muslim community, the website says.

Dost said around 50 children from Brantford and Brant County are currently commuting there for school.

But the school has reached its capacity of 200 students, and has warned the community that in future it might not be able to accommodate students from outside of Cambridge, highlighting an urgent need for another school in the area, Dost said.

Dost and two other community members have owned the land in question — on Greens Road, just east of the Brantford Municipal Airport — since 1980, he said.

He figures it will take around $20 million to bring this plan to fruition, but indicated they’ve been in talks with the State of Qatar, who he said helped sponsor the project in Cambridge.

Dost said they’ve been told they may face restrictions to building a school on that land, due to the proximity to the airport.

However, Dost argued that there’s already another elementary school — St. Theresa — next door. He said they let the Catholic school use part of their land for sports.

MPP Will Bouma has offered to address the restrictions at the provincial level, if the project receives council’s blessing, project secretary Mazher Latif told councillors.

Mayor David Bailey visited the school in Cambridge in April, and told councillors “we should be excited” they want to bring the project to the county.

Councillors received the presentation and referred it to staff for a report.

By Celeste Percy-Beauregard

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