🐱 How conservatives lost the culture war

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As Americans take their politics to the street, comparisons abound with 1968. It is worth recalling a less kinetic showdown in that summer of urban strife and protest.

In a now inconceivable piece of broadcasting, the ABC network set the writers William Buckley and Gore Vidal against each other in a saga of debates. Buckley, the prince of organised conservatism, drawled the case for order and tradition. Vidal, a hedonist if not a progressive, defended the changes of the day. In retrospect, the two shared much, not least the high-born airs that are more overt in New England than England. Still, theirs was an ominous contrast of world views, prefiguring 50 years of culture war.

Whoever was “right”, the evidence that liberalism won continues to amass. Last week, the Supreme Court ruled to extend LGBT rights. It also frustrated President Donald Trump over the treatment of young undocumented migrants. And this is after the right’s Long March through the judiciary, masterminded by the Federalist Society and other campaign groups. Away from the recent cases, which dealt with statutes, the call for the strictest possible adherence to constitutional text has the romantic aura of all lost causes.

The failures do not end there. Take immigration. When conservatism hardened into a movement in the mid-20th century, 5 per cent of the US population was foreign-born. Now the level is near an all-time high at 14 per cent. Or take the status of gay people. Public opinion on same-sex marriage has flipped from two-to-one against to two-to-one in favour since the millennium.

There have been consolations along the way. The military is more revered than during the Vietnam war, when returning troops donned civilian clothes before braving the streets. Out-and-proud atheists are still amazingly scarce in frontline politics. The abortion rate is at its lowest since it became legal.

In the round, though, “movement conservatism” is most notable for the gap between its political success and actual outcomes, at least in the realm of culture. Its organisational flair, its ecosystem of journals and think tanks, even its elected presidents have stood athwart history, yelling “stop!”, as Buckley suggested. If anything, history sped up. The recent statue-felling is just the outward expression of decades of social change.

The best the movement can say is that, lacking a control experiment, we cannot know how much more liberal the US would now be had the New Right never emerged. As an argument, I suppose it will have to do.

None of this is written with a Vidalian smirk. Even we who tend to his view on things must see that conservatism has bleak truths to impart: about the fragility of order, the perverse consequences of well-meaning change, the loss of the individual in the push for group rights. Zealots for change who give no quarter to conservatism’s insights are prone to over-reach. In fact, it is not obvious on which side a strict liberal, in the old sense, now belongs.

The point here is not to crow, then, but to record the ultimate failure of a movement that has appeared so formidable. And also to explain where it went wrong. It is not teleological inevitability, after all, that societies become more liberal over time. Two mistakes stand out.
First, starting with the presidency of Ronald Reagan, social conservatives threw in their lot with free-market economics. Capitalism is miraculously good at lots of things. Fostering stable communities, a sense of national belonging and deference to the sacred are not among them. Not only did Vidal’s agenda win, then, but, by egging on the supply-siders, Buckley was complicit in his victory.
Second, politics turns out to be far downstream of culture. Doctrinal conservatives stormed the three branches of government handily enough, but not Hollywood, the publishing industry, academia and other trades that form our habits of mind without our knowing it. The best the right did was set up parallel bodies, such as Fox News, and even these often address true believers.

Conservatives resent the infusion of universities with critical theory and other relativist lines of thought. If it matters that much, the burden is on them to clamber into the arena and compete. It is a glacial turnaround job, yes, but only because it was decades neglected in favour of more obvious spheres of power. The movement does not want for lawmakers or jurists. It wants for professors.
Watching back now, Vidal was more lethally epigrammatic, Buckley a shade better in deep debate. In the studio, the culture war was closely fought. Outside, ever since, the same cannot be said.
 
All "winning the culture war" has done for the left is causing mainstream entertainment to stagnate and rot. Take video games for example, Amy Hennig was famous for being the writer and creative director of great games for about two decades, then she got pushed out for not being woke enough, hasn't been part of any video game developed for five years, and since she left concensus seems to be that the writing from her previous studio has plummeted in quality.

Martin O'Donnell was known for being the most conservative individual at Bungie. But more importantly he was known for being one of the best composers in the industry. For unspecified reasons he was fired without warning in 2014 and has not been offered work by 343 Studios or any other gaming studios for that matter.

It's clear that people with talent are being pushed out, and what we're left with is shit. How many years is it since we had a genuinly great title from Bungie or 343 studios? Last Halo game was basically the Last Jedi of the franchise.
 
All "winning the culture war" has done for the left is causing mainstream entertainment to stagnate and rot. Take video games for example, Amy Hennig was famous for being the writer and creative director of great games for about two decades, then she got pushed out for not being woke enough, hasn't been part of any video game developed for five years, and since she left concensus seems to be that the writing from her previous studio has plummeted in quality.

Martin O'Donnell was known for being the most conservative individual at Bungie. But more importantly he was known for being one of the best composers in the industry. For unspecified reasons he was fired without warning in 2014 and has not been offered work by 343 Studios or any other gaming studios for that matter.

It's clear that people with talent are being pushed out, and what we're left with is shit. How many years is it since we had a genuinly great title from Bungie or 343 studios? Last Halo game was basically the Last Jedi of the franchise.

Lol so what, gamerbros and consoomers will shove any crap into their mouths these days.
 
Lol so what, gamerbros and consoomers will shove any crap into their mouths these days.
Of course they will, Last of Us 2 sold like hot cakes even with the story being a stinking pile of garbage. But this has long term effects. This kills franchises, nobody is going to want a Last of Us 3. Same way Star Wars has been permanently tainted by the sequel trilogy. Nobody is going to sit down and remember fondly the decade that hollywood decided to collectively crap their pants to own the right wing.
And as a right winger you can still get your entertainment elsewhere, you will just stop going to the cinema to choke on the latest vomit from Disney.
 
All "winning the culture war" has done for the left is causing mainstream entertainment to stagnate and rot.


That's what I've been trying to impress on people..... they "won", but , what did they win? Their institutions are stale, soulless propaganda-factories, and in a free society, nobody buys socialist-realist artwork for any reason but to laugh at it, and you can't run an industry on ironic sales forever.

Nobody wants to play Troon Quest

Nobody wants to watch Queerbusters

Nobody wants to read "Ivan the Little Red Car Who Defeated the Capitalist Brainwashing of Detroit" to their kid at night

In wresting these institutions from the idea of free-thinking and forcing them to not do anything but supporting the pre-approved narrative blindly and without question, they have ensured thier own slow death that's already becoming apparent barely 4 years after the "Great Woke Forward" purged anyone not on board with progressive IDpol from positions of creative influence so that they would no longer sent secret hate messages and the "wrong" kind of government would never be elected by the populace again.

People are tired of having to perform online like a trained monkey, saying how much they support all this wonderful diversity every day, less they be banned as a "racist".
 
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they "won", but , what did they win?
a minority white america by ~2050, for starters.

you clowns being so hung up on fucking entertainment media and acting like you got some kind of sick gotcha moment on oyur hands because last jedi and tlou2 have low metacritic user scores is really sad tbh, becuase it's completely irrelevant and inconsequential. the important stuff that matters for the big picture is what happens to real people in the real world, and there things are looking more grim and doomed every single day
 
You sure?

You really sure?

Yes, I'm sure.

If the Left was truly assured of its 1000 Year Woke Reich, then they wouldn't be acting quite so desperate as they are now. TDS is utterly insane and it's the kind of irrational insanity that goes beyond the usual anti-GOP sperging that happens when a Republican gets elected president.

Even the peak years of anti-Bush sperging in the mid-late 2000's pales in comparison to the last four years of TDS.

I don't know what Trump's done or what he knows that seems to terrify the corporate bigwigs so much but they are legit scared of him and are resorting to every dirty trick in the book to try and get him out of the picture before the 2020 Election since Biden is an utterly worthless candidate.

The Left won the last culture war when they curb-stomped the Religious Right, and they're using all that power to try and prevent the same fate from happening to them.

But more and more, people are slowly getting sick of woke culture and I think the one-two punch of COVID-19 and the BLM riots that were endorsed by every major company seemingly all at once is only going to infuriate them further.

If they miss their shot and get another four years of Trump, expect the corporate elites to cut the line on the SJW's and try to save face while they do what they can to memory hole their support of BLM and Antifa.

They want to win back the public in the event of this backfiring on them politically, and I would not put it past amoral corporate neoliberal bigwigs to totally disavow the Woke Left and throw them under the bus when they're no longer useful. The neocons did the exact same thing to the fundies once Bush became a despised lame-duck president, and at this point the neocons and the neolibs are more or less in direct collusion since they're all globalists who love corporatism

I'm not really a social conservative, I don't view things like like the sexual revolution, legal birth control, legal abortion, condoms, pornography, prostitution and gay rights to be bad things. However, the modern left has forgotten that the culture war isn't something that ends as such, and they are presently engaged in the kind of overreach that results in a really nasty backlash.

THIS

The Left has "won" but it's shaping up to be a Pyrrhic Victory (cue the rainbow stickers) and a lot is riding on the 2020 Election. There's a palpable sense of desperation, which is probably why they went all in with the George Floyd riots. They're afraid and desperate, so they're taking their shot while they still have the momentum and hegemony.

If the Woke Left's victory was so assured and eternal, then why are they acting so desperate and trying to finally launch this big violent coup? The mask has fallen off completely and they're in the middle of making their play, but you only get one shot in something like this and if they miss, they're fucked.

If the Left overplays their hand and ends up losing this culture war because of their own hubris, infighting, and self-destruction, then things will cool off a bit and the next culture war begins all over again.

Moral guardians and culture wars are like the flu. Nobody likes them but they're always going to be around and they tend to come in cycles.

In Ancient Greece, Socrates was condemned by the moral guardians of Athens for "corrupting the youth" with his philosophy.

The Puritans used to lynch people for celebrating Christmas and enjoying Shakespeare.

All this has happened before and it will happen again.

a minority white america by ~2050, for starters.

you clowns being so hung up on fucking entertainment media and acting like you got some kind of sick gotcha moment on oyur hands because last jedi and tlou2 have low metacritic user scores is really sad tbh, becuase it's completely irrelevant and inconsequential. the important stuff that matters for the big picture is what happens to real people in the real world, and there things are looking more grim and doomed every single day

OK Traditionalist Faggot

Just because you're not getting your delusional "The Turner Diaries meets The Crucible but IRL" fantasy land doesn't mean the rest of us have to be butthurt doomers like you.

Try not to overdose on those black pills.

Lets be real, most of these so-called "traditionalists" who are going full doomer tard as of late are just burned out ex-euphorics who still want to be edgy, so they traded their fedoras for pilgrim hats since atheism is passe and fundie Christianity is seen as "edgy" and taboo nowadays.
 
OK Traditionalist Faggot

Just because you're not getting your delusional "The Turner Diaries meets The Crucible but IRL" fantasy land doesn't mean the rest of us have to be butthurt doomers like you.

Try not to overdose on those black pills.

Lets be real, most of these so-called "traditionalists" who are going full doomer tard as of late are just burned out ex-euphorics who still want to be edgy, so they traded their fedoras for pilgrim hats since atheism is passe and fundie Christianity is seen as "edgy" and taboo nowadays.
he asked "what have they won lol"
the answer is that they have won the power to enact replacement migration, to literally destroy the countrys people itself and replace it with hostile foreigners.
those are the facts on the table. ethnic replacement is their end goal, and they're succeeding at it. burying your head in the sand and acting like nothing is happening doesn't change the fact that it is in fact happening, nor does sperging and ranting about doomers and black pills.
 
he asked "what have they won lol"
the answer is that they have won the power to enact replacement migration, to literally destroy the countrys people itself and replace it with hostile foreigners.
those are the facts on the table. ethnic replacement is their end goal, and they're succeeding at it. burying your head in the sand and acting like nothing is happening doesn't change the fact that it is in fact happening, nor does sperging and ranting about doomers and black pills.

>muh "Great Replacement" meme

Somehow, I knew it'd boil down to that.

You can save us a lot of time if you just post a link to this clip.

 
he asked "what have they won lol"
the answer is that they have won the power to enact replacement migration, to literally destroy the countrys people itself and replace it with hostile foreigners.
those are the facts on the table. ethnic replacement is their end goal, and they're succeeding at it. burying your head in the sand and acting like nothing is happening doesn't change the fact that it is in fact happening, nor does sperging and ranting about doomers and black pills.
The only way you wouldn't get the third world to move to the west would have been for Hitler to win the world war. The moment the anglos won earth was speeding towards globalism, and that had little to do with the right vs left divide. Conservative leaders were all onboard mass immigration for decades.
Now unless you're planning to go full Einsatz 2 you're basically just as filled with hot air as the people complaining about the amount of brown people in their movies, be it for or against.
 

OK Israelite

And where do you get your concepts of what is immoral and degenerate?

That I can tell you in one word: TRADITIONALISM!

I'd also like to point out your entire concept of degeneracy was written down by literal kikes and your (((traditionalism))) is more Jewish than a Rothschild singing Hava Nagila in an Israeli kosher deli on Rosh Hashannah

Most of the Athenian elders were buttfucking their male slaves as well, just so you know.
 
How they lost?

Because they completely ceded it in the 70s. This is something everyone has known since before I was born. Conservatives gave up the culture because they thought it wasn't important and it came back to fucking bite them in the ass.

This is spot on. Even now I see a bunch of “the best thing to do in this situation is nothing :smug: ” when the left makes yet another demand. That or hope for a backlash that never comes. Thanks to globalism, Disney would rather push Marvel movies harder in India or Nigeria than cater to the American right wing or hell, even anything center-left for that matter. This is the problem people on the right face: they don’t need us and don’t mind taking the financial hit to do so either. Shareholders largely agree. Neither is the right allowed to create anything either. This is what ceding the culture war has done.
 
Moral guardians and culture wars are like the flu. Nobody likes them but they're always going to be around and they tend to come in cycles.

In Ancient Greece, Socrates was condemned by the moral guardians of Athens for "corrupting the youth" with his philosophy.

The Puritans used to lynch people for celebrating Christmas and enjoying Shakespeare.

All this has happened before and it will happen again.

It's not Woke Culture, it's anti-white culture. It won't stop until all whites are gone.

Nobody likes moral guardians, but nobody does anything about them either. You act like everything's going to just solve itself.

OK Traditionalist Faggot

Just because you're not getting your delusional "The Turner Diaries meets The Crucible but IRL" fantasy land doesn't mean the rest of us have to be butthurt doomers like you.

Try not to overdose on those black pills.

It's not even 2050 and we're already well on our way to South Africa. Name a single non-white, non-Asian modern country that has prospered. Name a single highly racially heterogeneous country that has remained stable. Redpills are hard to swallow, but you're going to have to take them if you want to change the bad situation we're in. Voting hasn't worked. Just look around you at all the demographics, laws, and court rulings.

The whitepill is that whites are waking up and becoming more and more uncomfortable. Meanwhile our "Vanguard" grows bigger and more antifragile. We'll be more than ready by 2050. But people need to stop with the copes and stop with this idea that things will magically get better on their own or that we can slowly "reform" our way out of this mess.
 
This is the problem people on the right face: they don’t need us and don’t mind taking the financial hit to do so either. Shareholders largely agree.

It's actually worse than you think.

The thing people don't quite understand is that liberals are ideology-driven consumers. Say they are... 20%. If you do not cater to them, you lose that 20%, period and ended. Conversely, moderates don't care. So if you do cater to liberals, you don't lose the moderates. Thus, may as well cater to the liberals. Go woke, go broke is simply not correct except in relatively niche industries.

This is the same kind of thing with halal meat in Britain. Muslims are a small minority, but you don't lose customers by making the meat halal, so everyone just eats the extra cost of accommodating the Muslims.

It's the same deal with the so-called "kosher tax."

The problem, as always, is with the moderates who just shrug.
 
Catholics lost control of the movie industry
They lost their bargaining chips once the SC made the Miracle Decision in 1950. Once movies were seen as art, they had nothing to lord over the industry with. Before the Miracle Decision, films were not seen as art, but as a business. And there legit threats from the feds they could take it over. The Hays code only worked because Catholics were a huge group back in '34 and they could sway decision making. The Studio System controlled every facit of movie making from the top down. If you didn't get approved, no one would play your film.

The removal of the Hays code in 68 was just semantics at this point. Europe were allowed to make the movies they wanted. Drive-ins chipped away control the Studio System had.
 
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the reality is very different though, with organisations such as the press and universities and corporations and NGOs exercising large amounts of soft (and increasingly not-so-soft) power over society. but constitutional conservatives are incapable of admitting this, since it would create some very ugly questions about how such powers are to be dealt with or regulated, so their only reaction is to bury their heads in the sand and pretend nothing is wrong and none of this matters.
The problem is, the Left's strategy is to use our laws to their advantage, while also deeming them unjust and therefore don't have to follow them themselves. So it's not about burying our head in the sand, it's about how do you fight on their terms without becoming them, or worse?

People talk about how the nu-left is holding so much power over culture and the media and how that means freedom is doomed, but since this all started in about 2012 the left have lost:

- The 2014 Scottish Independence referendum
- The 2015 UK General Election
- The 2016 Brexit Referendum
- The 2016 US Presidential Election
- The 2017 UK General Election
- The 2019 UK General Election

And they look set to lose the 2020 US general election as well. The simple fact is that the strategy of cultural hegemony isn't working. People can see that they're being preached to, they can just leave the spaces where wrongthink is punished and return at the ballot box.

Even my dad, who is normie boomer personified, won't watch the BBC any more because it's "just Greta Thunberg and Trannies all day" and if he can notice, then anyone can notice.
The Left grabbing power has been going on for decades, and neo-cons were fine with it. Trump and Brixit can be seen as a "fuck you" to both the left and the right, but how long can that last? Dems made gains in the 2018 mid-terms. The Left is already sowing the seeds that Trump is going to steal 2020 if he wins, through voter suppression via lack of mail in ballots, Covid fear mongering, more Russian collusion, and what ever else they have up their sleeve in the coming months. I don't think they are going to take another Trump win lying down. But if the Left takes power, they will make sure they will cut America's middle fingers off so we can never say "fuck you" again.

>muh "Great Replacement" meme

Somehow, I knew it'd boil down to that.
I don't like this conspiracy either, buuuut... look what's going on right now. "America is bad", "history is bad", "white people are bad" are becoming so mainstream that statues are being torn down with barely any push back. Politicians and Media excuse and justify it. The 1619 bullshit won a Pulitzer and is going to be taught as fact. Even if Republicans win, do you see them putting the statues back up? Is any public person or corporation going to say "America is pretty awesome"? Leftists even said decades ago that change is going to take generations. Now we have a generation of white people who hate America, so what are immigrants that have no ties to it, or were historically in opposition of it, going to feel?
 
I don't like this conspiracy either, buuuut... look what's going on right now. "America is bad", "history is bad", "white people are bad" are becoming so mainstream that statues are being torn down with barely any push back. Politicians and Media excuse and justify it. The 1619 bullshit won a Pulitzer and is going to be taught as fact. Even if Republicans win, do you see them putting the statues back up? Is any public person or corporation going to say "America is pretty awesome"? Leftists even said decades ago that change is going to take generations. Now we have a generation of white people who hate America, so what are immigrants that have no ties to it, or were historically in opposition of it, going to feel?
That isn't Replacement Theory though, that is the left trying to keep Niggers and Wetbacks under their control, because they know if People of Color were educated in how the Western World actually worked prior to Progressives getting their grubby little hands on shit their soylent drinking, bug eating, pod living Communist future would never, EVER be allowed to come to fruition.
 
But that's the thing, it is against my morals that I should be silent of my beliefs over fear. I've read what silence did for the supporters of the Czar, I would rather die heard in battle than die silently in a gulag.

The only battle you're going to die in is the one against heart disease you fat larper
 
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