Undertale / Deltarune / Toby Fox Discussion

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Someone didn't watch the cutscene. Tenna confirms that he pressured Spamton into signing the contract with Friend-Gaster-whatever and that it caused Spamton's downfall. Spamtenna is MORE CANON.
In a better world, Spamtenna wouldn't be so mainstream because it's clear they're both in it for the money and this was a textbook manipulative and abusive relationship. Tenna forced Spamton to take on a shady deal both parties didn't know the full scope of and it led to Spamton's eventual madness and Tenna to become a functional drug addict chasing the high of having people pay attention to him.
 
In a better world, Spamtenna wouldn't be so mainstream because it's clear they're both in it for the money and this was a textbook manipulative and abusive relationship. Tenna forced Spamton to take on a shady deal both parties didn't know the full scope of and it led to Spamton's eventual madness and Tenna to become a functional drug addict chasing the high of having people pay attention to him.
Alternative: Spamtenna isnt mainstream bc one of them is a women
 
Regarding Undertail's meta elements, there are issues in how the game sometimes can't make up its mind on whether to address the player or Frisk, and how in a logical perspective, exterminating the monsters would be the best choice, as they DO want to do the same against humanity, and everyone is trying to kill you.
Alas, the evil ending sucks ball, being completely 4th-wall breaking in a clumsy, edgy try-hard way that might be similar to The Line mentioned before. It's not worth the effort, either (worse, you MUST play it to get the full story). At least these issues were fixed in DR, for what's worth, as the evil route is fun, for one.
 
I hate how true that statement is. But it'd also depend.
If Tenna's the woman, then it'd be 'fine'.
If Spamton's the woman then it'd be an allegory for rape or some shit.
I’d argue that if Tenna was the women in this scenario, people still wouldn’t like the ship either but I can see it being somewhat loved bc fanon will interpret them as the Jessica and Roger rabbit troupe (which isnt as annoying) or make some tranny cope about how “they are t4t guys!1” bc they are ashamed for liking a straight ship.

but never go to the lengths of how popular as it is today and instead ships like spamtonxjevil would replace its spot but that’s just my prediction.

As for Spamton being the women, 100% would’ve led to Tenna being much more hated than beloved and have some shitty drama abt how bad tenna is.
 
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Deltarune ARG shenanigans have returned.
https://deltarune.com/chapter4/thankyou/
1766193756846.png
This page let you input an email in the first box, and a number or a time (example, 1 hour, 2 days, 1225, etc.) in the second box for a time before Chapter 3 and 4 came out, and quickly changed so you could no longer enter information. Now, a few days before Christmas, it is once again open for input. The page title for the webpage reads "How long did it take her to smile?"
So how long did it take her to smile? Who is she? Is the answer 1225 like every other number input in the game? Is it how long it took for Noelle to smile during the rape scene? Who knows! But if you answer correctly and Toby sends you a special email be sure to add an offensive watermark to your screencap and only post it here!
 
Regarding Undertail's meta elements, there are issues in how the game sometimes can't make up its mind on whether to address the player or Frisk, and how in a logical perspective, exterminating the monsters would be the best choice, as they DO want to do the same against humanity, and everyone is trying to kill you.
Alas, the evil ending sucks ball, being completely 4th-wall breaking in a clumsy, edgy try-hard way that might be similar to The Line mentioned before. It's not worth the effort, either (worse, you MUST play it to get the full story). At least these issues were fixed in DR, for what's worth, as the evil route is fun, for one.
I misread your Undertale type as "Underrail". My biggest problem with Undertale was that the overall goal of the game or of "Frisk" or whoever the hell we are gets really muddy the further you go into the game. At first it was a matter of escaping the underground, but you can never switch gears during the course of the game and tell people you want to actually release the monsters from imprisonment (at least as far as I can tell on my first playthrough also I was doing this pacifist).

Instead you kind of just escape and everyone says their farewells and that's that. Sure you can play it again to get the full pacifist run, but at no point can you elucidate or tell people that your priorities changed. It's been a while since I've played it so maybe I missed times when I could, but I don't remember ever being able to. The theming really starts to get into muddy territory too once I got to the character Undyne.

Papyrus for me worked and I don't really need to elaborate as to why but let's just say he's humble and he actively rescinds himself as your enemy once you defeat in a game of combat. Undyne however is where it really starts to get suspect.

I don't hate Undyne as a character, but the problem is she openly declares herself as an impediment towards your goal. She says she has no intentions of sparing and that the only thing she wants is your death. The game's "good" route is done by sparing all of the monsters including this warrior that wants me dead. Maybe my personal philosophy is just fucked up and I'm a sociopath, but I don't care how good intentioned this rival or antagonist is, if she's actively impeding my goal of freeing the monsters (which was initially my goal as I was playing maybe I was just misaligned with the character but that's beside the point) I don't see how it's morally evil to kill her. It really is a trolley quandry of just do you save millions of people by killing this one noble and good aligned knight? Or do you spare him somehow and risk yourself dying and failing to save those millions? Also her plan of freeing the monsters is essentially doomed to fail in my death because there's no one to bridge the divide between them according to the game's opening.

But whatever, I played by this game's rules by... running away from the fight and wearing her down which is a weird way of going about it, but whatever. I don't know, maybe I'm looking at this wrong and I just don't know what I'm talking about, but that was my raw reaction to Undyne and this game's theming and, to me, it really began crack in this moment.
 
if she's actively impeding my goal of freeing the monsters (which was initially my goal as I was playing maybe I was just misaligned with the character but that's beside the point) I don't see how it's morally evil to kill her.
I don't think it's meant to be taken as morally wrong to kill Undyne when she's attacking you. Even during part where Sans "judges your sins" he usually says he can't really blame you for acting in self-defense, he only says something that could be taken as preachy if you killed his brother, in which case he'll question if you have a power that lets you redo things, and if so, if you have the responsibility to go back and do things better.

I think Toby Fox himself underestimated just how seriously people would take the Pacifist Route. It seems like he expected the vast majority of people playing the game for the first time to go about the game killing or sparing who they see fit and achieve one of the neutral endings. You're not supposed to feel truly judged by the game if you acted in a normal way, like kill Undyne because she was really aggressive and there was no obvious way to spare her, mostly it wants you to further consider how you could go back and redo things another playthrough to see how things change. The True Pacifist Route is then meant to be sort of a secret for someone who goes back to try out an extreme that might seem impractical on a first go, which is sparing everyone, even the ones who are really asking for it. The Genocide Route is meant to be the same in the other direction. That's why you can't do True Pacifist until at least a second playthrough, and why the game gets its most meta in the True Pacifist and Genocide content. But people quickly started taking the Pacifist Route super seriously as the "true" way to play the game, leading to people acting like going onto a neutral route is straight up a fail state. The way the fanbase acts makes the game sound like it's moralistically pushing you to do pacifist more than it actually is.

To be fair, it's partially Toby's fault for making the True Pacifist ending so much longer and more final than any of the Neutral endings, so it's very much feels like the true ending to the game. But it's also understandable that he'd think it natural for the hidden ending where everyone lives and escape the underground to be a more special ending. But it helped make people sort of dismiss the Neutral endings more so than I think Toby intended.
 
he only says something that could be taken as preachy if you killed his brother
Honestly? Pretty understandable, character-wise.

Papyrus is basically an autistic manchild who, at worst, mildly inconveniences you. He's never malicious or actually trying to hurt you. The guy is basically a silly LARPer.

He's also the only monster in the entire game who cannot kill you. He always stops himself from actually hurting you, so any reasonable self-defence argument basically goes out the window. It also takes a while to actually kill him, so you can't even handwave it away as a heat-of-the-moment thing either. He will actively plead with you and tell you that it's not too late as you kill him.

Even Toriel can at least accidentally kill you during her fight.
eq6yd9gvkbg71.jpg


If you decide to kill Papyrus you would need to be a complete psycho from any kind of in-universe perspective, because there is basically zero reason to do it. You're more or less strangling the retarded kid wearing a cop outfit to death because he tried to playfully "arrest" you using a warrant made out of glue and macaroni.
 
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But if you answer correctly and Toby sends you a special email be sure to add an offensive watermark to your screencap and only post it here!
1766226797510.png
Leaving it empty asks "she never smiled?" so I put 0 as a meme.
Did I win or does it do this for every guess?
 
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View attachment 8308745
Leaving it empty asks "she never smiled?" so I put 0 as a meme.
Did I win or does it do this for every guess?
I put 7 days and got that too.

Here's the javascript code, I don't know js but ChatGPT says that it throws the server response away after submitting it so I assume you'll get "Thank you" regardless of what the second textbox is

JavaScript:
if (!window.plausibleloaded) {
    window.plausibleloaded = true;
    var onloadfunc = function() {
        ! function() {
            "use strict";
            var t = window.location,
                e = window.document;

            function a(t, e) {
                t && console.warn("Ignoring Event: " + t), e && e.callback && e.callback()
            }

            function n(n, i) {
                if (/^localhost$|^127(\.[0-9]+){0,2}\.[0-9]+$|^\[::1?\]$/.test(t.hostname) || "file:" === t.protocol) return a("localhost", i);
                if (window._phantom || window.__nightmare || window.navigator.webdriver || window.Cypress) return a(null, i);
                try {
                    if ("true" === window.localStorage.plausible_ignore) return a("localStorage flag", i)
                } catch (r) {}
                var l = {},
                    o = (l.n = n, l.u = t.href, l.d = "deltarune.com", l.r = e.referrer || null, i && i.meta && (l.m = JSON.stringify(i.meta)), i && i.props && (l.p = i.props), new XMLHttpRequest);
                o.open("POST", "https://plausible.fangamer.eu/api/event", !0), o.setRequestHeader("Content-Type", "text/plain"), o.send(JSON.stringify(l)), o.onreadystatechange = function() {
                    4 === o.readyState && i && i.callback && i.callback()
                }
            }
            e.currentScript;
            var i = window.plausible && window.plausible.q || [];
            window.plausible = n;
            for (var r, l = 0; l < i.length; l++) n.apply(this, i[l]);

            function o() {
                r !== t.pathname && (r = t.pathname, n("pageview"))
            };
            o();
        }();
    };
    onloadfunc();
}
 
This is the exact same thing that was out when spamton sweepstakes updated, then it closed for a bit, though it is weird that it's open again.
 
Neat, it's my first time with one of Toby's esoteric arg.
What does this shit usually entail?
No clue, this is the one thing that never had a conclusion. Don't have any pictures since I'm phone posting but back in May people found this page by deciphering what keys of an invisible keyboard were different (each key played either the beginning or end of the sound effect that plays when the player activates Kris Rape Mode during the funny Noelle scene) and from the different keys they unscrambled "thankyou" which eventually they figured out to put that into the web address. Normally with the Deltarune ARG stuff you have to solve a little puzzle or go through a maze of links and your reward is a little lore piece that hints at future chapters.
My point is, this was all very esoteric to get to and I just want that sweet nugget of payoff because this was all "The Raped" related before anyone experienced chapter 4, so I'm curious why it opened back up. Oh, also Toby sent out an email yesterday linking back to the page just saying "Another Chance." And that's why people know about it now.
 
It's probably some absolutely fuckin insane obscure answer that'll only be discovered either on pure accident or after several hints are dropped.

How much you wanna bet some dickhead got it right the first time and got like, some arg puzzle piece that he just kept to himself for a laugh?
 
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