- Joined
- Aug 11, 2019
Nah, that would have been very confusing as well. I dont see the greek/roman gods, being as proud as they are, accepting they are lower tier compared to say, norse or egyptian gods, and vice versa.
The Riordan Autism
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Nah, that would have been very confusing as well. I dont see the greek/roman gods, being as proud as they are, accepting they are lower tier compared to say, norse or egyptian gods, and vice versa.
- Joined
- Jan 3, 2019
I always got the impression this was just Greek Mythology Harry Potter. The movie, the only thing I've seen of this franchise, basically had Gabe as the Durlseley's. And the main trio were basically carbon copies of Harry, Ron, and Hermionie to a T.
Are the books worth checking out?
Are the books worth checking out?
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- Joined
- Aug 11, 2019
If you are aware they are meant to be books for a younger audience (older kids and teens), then the Percy Jackson books are fine, the first ones up to The Last Olymptian that is. There is this feel of progression and character growth with each entry. Also its cool to see ancient greece stuff clashing with modern age (I recall that there was an evil ghost character with one of the recurring ones that wanted the toy of a Mc Donalds Happy mean that was being used as as sacrifice...in retrospect, it was pretty stupid and even kind of cringy but again, younger audiences).
Ah yes, let me warn you, if you think this will be any loyal to the greek mythos? Curb your expectations...its a very kid friendly version where the gods never raped and/or murdered a bunch of innocents usually out of selfish spite...lets say that if it was, between Cronos and the gods, it would be an evil vs a greater evil (either way, mortals lose).
I guess if you buy in its own version of the mythos, they are good enough. Just stop at The last Olympian because then Rick goes crazy and begins to want other myths into the same universe and it becomes a metaphysical mess.
Oh and fuck the movies with a hellish passion.
- Joined
- Jan 17, 2018
Of course it was.
But since it's the Norse pantheon- a set that is known, to the Woke sectors of American society, as being associated with white supremacy (apparently?)- it's okay. It's the White pantheon fetishized by Neo-Nazis, so it's okay if we offend them (while casually ignoring any legitimate, modern adherents to Norse religious practices/mythology.)
It's all about that Privilege Hierarchy, man: I sincerely doubt that Riordan would have the balls to apply those words to, say, the Hindu pantheon. His Hindu readers would eat him the fuck alive- or at least, they would if someone at Penguin Random House didn't tackle Riordan to the ground, duct-tape him to a chair, and give him a lightning-round history lesson on the formation of modern Pakistan and India.
Honestly, I think that's something else that would have gotten nixed at the publishing level. To imply that there is any sort of hierarchy to the various pantheons (beyond the exception I just mentioned with the Norse pantheon) is dangerous because someone is going to get shit-face offended by it. To imply that the Hindu Gods are more powerful than the African Gods would be anti-black; to imply that the South American Gods are a sort of alien race mistaken for Gods would be "colonizing" and undermining the importance of Latino culture and religion; etc, etc, etc.
The DCU system works because it's been long-established and well-written, and the authors and artists were willing to take risks; risks that were considerably easier to take twenty years ago before you had to worry about being cancelled and having your "sins" spread all over the internet.
Rick Riordan lives in the here and now, and he has a line to toe just like J.K. Rowling does. If he makes a misstep, it's going to get blasted all over the internet and social media and he will be raked over the coals for it. The actual, tangible consequences might end up being negligible (he's gotten pretty big, so much like Rowling I don't think a bunch of pissy adults boycotting his books would make a difference) but a publisher isn't going to take the chance. Hell, if anything, the shit with J.K. Rowling would be a warning to a lot of publishers to keep their authors on a leash when it comes to what they write (and tweet).
...technically, Riordan's books aren't filed as YA in a lot of retail stores. Maybe some places do, but most file them as Juvenile Fiction (Juvenile Fiction (8-13) and Young Adult (14-19), roughly). And you'll find that Juvenile Fiction is just as likely to be flooded with SJW fiction because- well, y'know- "life-saving representation for the children".
As for the flood of SJW shit in both categories, there's three problems here: Opportunism, Idealism, and Fanaticism.
There are Opportunistic Writers who cram woke shit into their stories because they know it will make them look good, not because they believe in it (J.K. Rowling's become a cautionary example of this). They're in it for the attention and the money, and the pat on the back they get for having the Right political views.
Idealistic Writers genuinely feel as though they want to be equal and give everyone "representation" and make everyone happy- right side of history, etc, etc. These are the writers that genuinely think that they're doing something good for their readers, even if they don't understand all the nuances of the politics going into it, when really all they're doing is feeding into the entitlement of a group of people that think everything and everyone should kowtow to them.
Fanatic Writers are the lunatic SJW cultists like Alex Gino that fucking apologize for where they live/have lived because the land was "unceded" by the Native Tribes that lived there before colonization. They are the first to call themselves out on their own privilege, and the first to flog themselves and grovel for forgiveness when they make a misstep.
Of these three, I suspect Riordan is the Idealistic Writer. I don't think he's just doing it for money, and I don't think he's doing it because he's slaughtered the goat and been inducted into the cult of SJW. I think he genuinely wants to give "representation" to his readers, and he probably takes his cues from social media as to how to do that. Allowing other authors to contribute to his universe with their own books kills two birds with one stone: It's one less book (or series) for him to research and write, and he's getting credit for giving a voice to "marginalized voices and cultures".
Based on my own observations at my workplace, though, I don't know how much the kids are biting at the new stuff. The original Percy Jackson series still sells like hotcakes, in no small part because it was the original and the best known (and, if I'm reading the room right in this thread, the best written). But Magnus Bane, Trials of Apollo, the miscellaneous books written by other authors for his universe?
Meh. I don't see them selling nearly as well. They make a stir when they first come out, and then they kinda just taper off and become less popular.
Riordan may not be going broke, but going woke doesn't seem to be bringing him in that much more money from what I can see.
- Joined
- Feb 13, 2018
He even had an easy out: "I don't worship these Vikings, I'm just their intern. If Allah asks me to do something, I'm leaving."
- Joined
- Feb 3, 2013
I had no idea Riordan was woke now. Dammit. I liked the first two Percy Jackson series well enough--bit cheesy but a decent way to kill time in an airport or at the dentist's office. Tried the first book of the Egypt series, but I'm a massive Egypt sperg and went "Nope, this isn't gonna work for me, not worth raging over" and gave the book away.
But they/them golems and a Norse pantheon subservient to Allah? Fucking what? Dude should probably just stop writing and enjoy his piles of money.
But they/them golems and a Norse pantheon subservient to Allah? Fucking what? Dude should probably just stop writing and enjoy his piles of money.
- Joined
- Jun 14, 2018
A "pantheon hierarchy" could work if there was an equalization between the pantheons, i.e. Zeus portrayed as equal to Odin, Mithra portrayed as equal to Mithras, Shiva portrayed as equal to Vairocana, Yahweh portrayed as equal to Allah, Olorun portrayed as equal to Nana Buluku, etc.
I personally think that was just Riordan trying to reconcile the existence of multiple polytheistic deities with a monotheistic God. I do want to know why you found that to be disgusting and insulting though.
- Joined
- Sep 3, 2014
Reminds me of how I have a three way discussion over the nature of the pantheons in a DnD setting I came up with. The positions were that the deities as a whole were reflections of a larger force (United), that similar deities exist to fulfill same role (Doric), or that each deity was just the same deity under a different guise (Atenist).
I also had a pretty big mess with Tengriism; stuff was fun to set up.
If I had to guess it has something to do with breaking prior statements about avoiding the monotheistic deities in his works (including killing a christian or something, I dunno, never read the books) and it just so happened to be with the "woke" option he broke it.
- Joined
- Dec 12, 2018
I'm not going to claim that Norse paganists are particularly sincere in their belief, most of them are in it for attention, but at the very least it was an actual religious belief system at one time and claiming that one religious being created entirely different religious beings is just off-putting. It's like writing a book where God created the Hindu gods and ultimately they're subservient to him, people would be rightfully angry at that. But since Norse paganists are few in number/non-existent, they can't exactly do anything about an English-language children's series saying that their entire religion is subservient to another one. The fact that Riordan did it with the current pet religion is just the icing on the cake, but if he had said in the books that they were created by the Jewish or Christian God I'd be just as displeased.
That, too. Up until Magnus Chase, the series took a joking stance towards popular modern day religions and didn't really dwell on them. The fact that an actual in-universe character is theorizing on the cosmology of the series is just odd, and it brings up questions that do not belong in a kid series.
- Joined
- Jan 17, 2018
I mentioned in my last post here that the "Rick Riordan Presents" books don't sell nearly as well in my store as the Rick Riordan ones.
Well, I had some free time at work today and decided to look up some numbers. Our sales (in terms of numbers of books sold) records only go back for a year, so I can't look at anything past a year ago. But I think the differences here are still pretty telling. Obviously these numbers aren't representative of the U.S. sales overall (they are strictly MY store's numbers) and different areas have different demographics that might make different purchases.
Those are Riordan's actual books that he's actually written. It's worth mentioning that all of the books listed here are paperbacks and don't reflect the kind of numbers that sold during their initial releases.
As for the Rick Riordan Presents books:
Now, I have read exactly zero of any of these books, so make of these numbers what you will in terms of which series were better than others, or whether or not getting woke is making him broke.
As for my own observations: I have worked at my store for nearly four years. Magnus Chase #2 and #3, all of the Trials of Apollo books, and all of the Rick Riordan Presents books have come out while I have worked there. I vividly recall people coming in and asking for the Magnus Chase and Trials of Apollo series. Almost all of the people asking for these books were either kids, or parents/grandparents shopping for kids.
I have maybe one recollection of someone asking me for the Aru Shah and the End of Time book about a year ago; incidentally, that was the first time I even found out that Rick Riordan was allowing other authors to contribute to his universe (I should also mention that it was a woman in her early twenties buying the book, not a kid). The Tristan Strong book was a total surprise when it came out; and I literally found out today, when I was pulling these numbers, that Race to the Sun was even a thing. It's based off of Navajo mythology iirc.
When a Rick Riordan book came out in the past, there was usually a good degree of fanfare: Often it would get a dedicated table or endcap so that people could find the other books in the series easily. We would have posters and other promotional material out telling people the release date, and we would often get asked "Hey, when's the next Rick Riordan book coming out?" When the books did come out, we would get sent dozens of casepacks of them and they would fly off the shelves pretty quickly.
These Rick Riordan Presents books? Nah. No fanfare. Tristan Strong was on a promotional stepladder for, like, a week, but beyond that there's been no dedicated promotional space for them. And personally, I don't know if that's my company's thing, or if maybe that's the publisher's thing. But even if the publisher's not pushing them hard, these books are attached to Rick Riordan's name and universe, and that should at least be enough to stir some interest- but it's not. These books are definitely not selling the way the actual Rick Riordan books did when they first released; hell, they're not even competing with the paperback sales numbers, years after they've been released!
Like I said, make of these numbers what you will. Those of you who've actually read this stuff will probably have a better understanding of why some of these series are doing better than others. Personally, I almost wonder whether or not the Rick Riordan Presents books might be aimed more at the Woke 20-something crowd than they are the kids who primarily read the Percy Jackson series.
ETA: Edited to clean up the formatting.
Well, I had some free time at work today and decided to look up some numbers. Our sales (in terms of numbers of books sold) records only go back for a year, so I can't look at anything past a year ago. But I think the differences here are still pretty telling. Obviously these numbers aren't representative of the U.S. sales overall (they are strictly MY store's numbers) and different areas have different demographics that might make different purchases.
Those are Riordan's actual books that he's actually written. It's worth mentioning that all of the books listed here are paperbacks and don't reflect the kind of numbers that sold during their initial releases.
As for the Rick Riordan Presents books:
Now, I have read exactly zero of any of these books, so make of these numbers what you will in terms of which series were better than others, or whether or not getting woke is making him broke.
As for my own observations: I have worked at my store for nearly four years. Magnus Chase #2 and #3, all of the Trials of Apollo books, and all of the Rick Riordan Presents books have come out while I have worked there. I vividly recall people coming in and asking for the Magnus Chase and Trials of Apollo series. Almost all of the people asking for these books were either kids, or parents/grandparents shopping for kids.
I have maybe one recollection of someone asking me for the Aru Shah and the End of Time book about a year ago; incidentally, that was the first time I even found out that Rick Riordan was allowing other authors to contribute to his universe (I should also mention that it was a woman in her early twenties buying the book, not a kid). The Tristan Strong book was a total surprise when it came out; and I literally found out today, when I was pulling these numbers, that Race to the Sun was even a thing. It's based off of Navajo mythology iirc.
When a Rick Riordan book came out in the past, there was usually a good degree of fanfare: Often it would get a dedicated table or endcap so that people could find the other books in the series easily. We would have posters and other promotional material out telling people the release date, and we would often get asked "Hey, when's the next Rick Riordan book coming out?" When the books did come out, we would get sent dozens of casepacks of them and they would fly off the shelves pretty quickly.
These Rick Riordan Presents books? Nah. No fanfare. Tristan Strong was on a promotional stepladder for, like, a week, but beyond that there's been no dedicated promotional space for them. And personally, I don't know if that's my company's thing, or if maybe that's the publisher's thing. But even if the publisher's not pushing them hard, these books are attached to Rick Riordan's name and universe, and that should at least be enough to stir some interest- but it's not. These books are definitely not selling the way the actual Rick Riordan books did when they first released; hell, they're not even competing with the paperback sales numbers, years after they've been released!
Like I said, make of these numbers what you will. Those of you who've actually read this stuff will probably have a better understanding of why some of these series are doing better than others. Personally, I almost wonder whether or not the Rick Riordan Presents books might be aimed more at the Woke 20-something crowd than they are the kids who primarily read the Percy Jackson series.
ETA: Edited to clean up the formatting.
- Joined
- Oct 6, 2014
I had to read the first Percy Jackson book for school when I was in the sixth grade, it was alright, but I liked the Kane Chronicles better. It's sad that all the newer books are bloated with IdPol silliness. Kids don't want to be preached to, they want to read about fun adventures.
Lucille Bluth
kiwifarms.net
- Joined
- Jan 19, 2019
I loved the Percy Jackson books growing up. Even if it was a Harry Potter ripoff (that author has also become "woke" in recent years) and there were problems with the books. I didn't like the sequel and stopped reading all books after the second series ended. Most of the new characters were annoying or very boring. I also noticed that Rick was basically drawing random backgrounds out of a hat to represent new Demigod characters that he didn't represent in the past series to be more "inclusive", as well as including the Roman gods into the mix.
A "Cherokee" girl, one African American from Louisiana, some Chinese Canadian shapeshifter, a Mexican American mechanic and a Puerto Rican whose sister is an Amazon who actually runs Amazon (the company). Now I'm finding out that there's a Norse demigod whose dating a pan-gender fluid cuck and a Muslim character talking about Norse gods and Allah? And there's also more shitty books based on other mythologies and ghost written? I'm happy I stopped reading this stuff years ago.
They're making a tv show for Disney+. The original books weren't that "woke" to begin with, so I'm sure that will change.
ew.com
A "Cherokee" girl, one African American from Louisiana, some Chinese Canadian shapeshifter, a Mexican American mechanic and a Puerto Rican whose sister is an Amazon who actually runs Amazon (the company). Now I'm finding out that there's a Norse demigod whose dating a pan-gender fluid cuck and a Muslim character talking about Norse gods and Allah? And there's also more shitty books based on other mythologies and ghost written? I'm happy I stopped reading this stuff years ago.
They're making a tv show for Disney+. The original books weren't that "woke" to begin with, so I'm sure that will change.
Rick Riordan announces new Percy Jackson TV series coming to Disney+
Rick Riordan's Percy Jackson books are getting a new live-action adaptation — this time as a TV series on Disney+.
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- Joined
- Mar 9, 2020
like most people here I stopped reading after the heros of olympus series. for me percy jackson was an interesting narrator so changing the perspective all the time really hurt what made the series good. same with the artemis fowl series. even if artemis becoming good was important to his growth as a character books 4-8
I really hate that being gay or trans automatically tells you something about a character in a YA novel. like for example i can guess that the shapeshifting lady probably did not fit in with the other kids and probably loves anime, is moody and more sensitive than the other folks. thing is characters like that just create a stereotype that anyone who isnt 100% masculine is trans or something when there are plenty of people who fall into neither catagory.
also can someone post some quotes from the book? especially the norse gods talking about allah
I really hate that being gay or trans automatically tells you something about a character in a YA novel. like for example i can guess that the shapeshifting lady probably did not fit in with the other kids and probably loves anime, is moody and more sensitive than the other folks. thing is characters like that just create a stereotype that anyone who isnt 100% masculine is trans or something when there are plenty of people who fall into neither catagory.
also can someone post some quotes from the book? especially the norse gods talking about allah
- Joined
- Dec 27, 2015
Does that mean being the trillionaire owner of a company that treats its workers like dogshit is suddenly #WOKE now? Or do they address it in a "of course she would never allow those things, what kind of horrible person would?
" way?
- Joined
- May 19, 2018
You could pull this off by having all the Hindu gods be aspects of Brahma, which is an actual theory in Hinduism; a bit controvertial but not outright heretical. You could say (or at least hint) that all deities are facets of some overarching divinity that's known by the names God, Allah, Brahma, etc. Perhaps it's a bit abstract for YA, but it would actually solve the problem of multiple polytheistic pantheons.
Buddhists, Jains, and so on would be in trouble, though. Not sure how they fit into the Riordan cosmology.
- Joined
- Mar 18, 2016
Had a talk about a friend about this exact thing were we have been conjuring up a story revolving sharing pantheons. We thought about how pagan religious beliefs tend to meld into Abrahamic sects. Concepts like "Hell" for example weren't believed in by Early Christians and Jews. That would be Tartarus in Hades. Same goes for Elysium being the Greek counterpart to Heaven.
With Buddhism, various Taoist and other more eastern polytheistic beliefs also become molded along as well. The legend of the nagas of Hindu origin protecting the Buddha comes to mind. Regarding afterlifes, they also believe they are temporary.
My point being is that you can deduce that though the gods aren't worshipped, it doesn't mean their influence is entirely lost. Could be via practices or cultural influences. Even in the early days of Judaism, "angels" were once referred to as "gods" in older texts of the Old Testament. I don't know, just something and wondering.
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- Joined
- Aug 21, 2018
In all fairness, God did start several wars, killed a few people for inane reason and is an autist over his rules.
As far as the books goes, I only read the one with the labyrinth in my teens and that was an but of an dry read; and the bit with the sphinx and flaming horses were the only good scenes from that book.
I just never expected it to go thermonuclear with progressiveness.
- Joined
- Oct 15, 2016
IIRC the Amazons keep enslaved men to do all the manual labor at the company, and are portrayed in a mostly negative light. That may have changed in later books though, I haven't kept up with the series.Does that mean being the trillionaire owner of a company that treats its workers like dogshit is suddenly #WOKE now? Or do they address it in a "of course she would never allow those things, what kind of horrible person would?
- Joined
- Apr 25, 2019
Will Grover get blacked again?I loved the Percy Jackson books growing up. Even if it was a Harry Potter ripoff (that author has also become "woke" in recent years) and there were problems with the books. I didn't like the sequel and stopped reading all books after the second series ended. Most of the new characters were annoying or very boring. I also noticed that Rick was basically drawing random backgrounds out of a hat to represent new Demigod characters that he didn't represent in the past series to be more "inclusive", as well as including the Roman gods into the mix.
A "Cherokee" girl, one African American from Louisiana, some Chinese Canadian shapeshifter, a Mexican American mechanic and a Puerto Rican whose sister is an Amazon who actually runs Amazon (the company). Now I'm finding out that there's a Norse demigod whose dating a pan-gender fluid cuck and a Muslim character talking about Norse gods and Allah? And there's also more shitty books based on other mythologies and ghost written? I'm happy I stopped reading this stuff years ago.
They're making a tv show for Disney+. The original books weren't that "woke" to begin with, so I'm sure that will change.
Rick Riordan announces new Percy Jackson TV series coming to Disney+
Rick Riordan's Percy Jackson books are getting a new live-action adaptation — this time as a TV series on Disney+.
- Joined
- Oct 15, 2016
Riordan is pretty well known for hating all the changes the movies made to his story, so if he's involved in the Disney+ show in any capacity I'd imagine it will be somewhat more true to the books. The real question is if he's become so woke that he'll use the show as an excuse to make the original characters more "diverse" to appeal to his increasingly SocJus fanbase. After that awful genderqueer character, I honestly wouldn't put it past him to decide that Grover is a proud trans-goat or something.