1. I did, you are going to have to link the specific posts that directly debunks HC and Kues numbers. I don’t seem then addressing the numbers part. Kues says 1.9. HC says 2.3. Do you have another number in mind?
2. I am not going to read a 1500 page book on this. Link me something showing this small settlement existed.
3. Ok, so the Jews scattered around the world. Can you tell me how these Jews who left the eastern front, then travelled around the world, did not tell anyone they were deported to the east? 2 million people attesting that they were sent to the east without being murdered would be a pretty big thing, and a lot of people would have known about it. You can’t cover something like this. Also, witnesses would still attest to the fact that a bunch of Jews were in their towns before they moved again.
1. They generally don't think the numbers are definitive from Kues though he does evidence the likelihood of alot of Jews going east.
2. Of course you're not! And you had this thread of me posting from this book at times too!
3. Why would it be a big thing to say "I was not murdered!"
people talk, hear rumors, etc, even if they weren't direct witnesses to transports or the resettlement camps . in the same way people talked about extermination activities occuring at various camps
https://www.ns-archiv.de/verfolgung/polen/rawaruska/umsiedlung.php
yes
https://codoh.com/library/document/evidence-for-the-presence-of-gassed-jews-in-the/en/
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We can remember Himmler's resettlement order for the non-working Jews of Poland
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as well as the resettlement of Jews in Russia (which aren't counted in Kues's article), eg the 320k Jews living in Western Ukraine . So the number is well into the millions.
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yeah if it led to peaceful coexistence it would be worth it. i dunno, bomb deaths? what's the point of these questions mrolonzo?
1. People talk? People talked alot about death camps too. Does that mean electric baths happened?
2. Kues does some pretty good scholarship to show at least some went east and takes down the going east as code for death. He doesn't end the story though.
3. All you've done definately is show the nazis actually moving Jews east.
4. Given that. And given there are no mass graves of these Jews. The conclusion that they either or in part escaped or remained quiet is inescapable.
It is revealing that the only denier response to the mainstream challenge - 'show me an example of Jews being transited out of the Nazi camp system and resettled in the East' - are non-sequiturs intended to confuse and mislead. For example deniers will bring up stuff like the deportation of Jews from Germany to the Warsaw ghetto, or deportations of working Jews from Treblinka to camps in the West, or deportation of Jews to the East from before the Holocaust began, none of which have anything to do with the issue at hand - millions of Jews disappearing in the Nazi camp system.
Can you please Zo provide some evidence (or a page from Mattogno) of Jews being transited out of the camp system and resettled in the East? Train records would do, a letter would do, a picture would do, a witness would do. We are talking about settlement(s) comprising millions of people, so there must be something, just as there are records attesting to the existence of the nation of Estonia under Nazi rule, and all the Ghettos the Nazis made for Jews in Poland, etc.
I mean Zo, use your common sense. Do you think also think it is a plausible that a secret and unknown nation of millions of Russians or Mexicans existed in the 1940s (despite no evidence)? Common sense requires us to reject such absurdities. And it should also require us to reject the Jewlantis theory that deniers pathetically must rely upon in order to explain away the "problem" of millions of Jews disappearing in the Nazi camp system.
As for Mattogno, are you seriously denying that he advocates the "resettlement hypothesis"? See pic related.
1. Chugger just provided you with Jews going east. There's no obfuscation here. Kues did a study in 2010 using evidence at hand that Chugger produced.
2. And now you're demanding pages from Mattogno on this when you didn't accept them about other aspects of the subject. What game are you playing?
3. You use common sense. If they're not in the ground either west or east what do you have left?
4. And what do you mean train records? Do you have the complete train records ? Why not?
5. Im saying he thinks it likely. That's not definitive. I refer you to the various codoh threads.
6. Im not saying revisionists have the final study on all this that everyone agrees with as rock solid. We've not tracked down every Jew. It's just that they weren't massacred. That's been demonstrated in this thread that you lost hard in right here when you refused to answer point after point about the holocaust. What's so hard about that?
I actually don’t care too much about the camps themselves, I really only care about the fate of the 1.9-2.3 million Jews taken to the east. Chugger and HS can argue about the bodies and gas and whatnot.
Well of course you don't!
The irony is that the smarter deniers (Mattogno, Rudolf, Graf) recognize that they have a burden of proof to meet, since millions of Jews appear to have disappeared in the camp system, and this requires explanation as people do not simply disappear.
Why do you think these "leading" deniers all promote the baseless "resettlement" thesis? It is to meet the burden of proof - the need for a counter-explanation for the problem of the millions of disappeared Jews - that they implicitly recognize themselves as shouldering.
(Of course, we have a burden of proof to provide an explanation too, and our explanation - supported by mountains of evidence - is that the vast majority of the missing Jews were murdered. I do not see how a rational person could support the "resettlement thesis" over our explanation, when there is zero evidence - no witnesses, no infrastructure, no communications, nothing - of these resettlements having existed.)
They present the resettlement thesis because it's literally in the documents over and over again. That doesn't mean that that situation remained so in the post war years.
You tell us millions disappeared while not even defending the numbers problems. So that's out.
Your explanation of murder is silly because it's been debunked as nonsense from numerous angles. So that's out.
The fact that you cannot defend the holocaust methods and remains as existing in this thread showed you don't have a case. You already admitted you lost the debate. You told us that you "don't agree" and decide to say nothing instead but to move on to your problem with Jews being in the east implicitly admitting the debate is over. Leaving you with one final option - demand that I prove to you that Jews went and remained east or I must admit that they were instead murdered in the west, never mind all the devastating problems we've already been over.
he has no assertion so far. he disagrees with the leading revisionists about the deported east theory -- he thus has to provide some alternative. they were in the ghettos >> then deported >> then what?
So I think a good approach when evaluating which historical theory is more likely is to choose the one with the greater amount of evidence/proof
Do you think this approach makes sense? Can you think of an example where a historical theory is accepted over a better evidenced alternative?
I've happily admitted again and again that the final picture is vague so why do I have to provide definitive alternatives?
Does me not doing so mean I have to admit that there was indeed a holocaust in the west? Does it?
Ive simply stood on the well evidenced parts specifically on revisionist history in the west. This has proven entirely successful in this thread. So you move the debate east.
Generally your evidence is hearsay and conjecture. That's all. Code words and "testimony ". You can't argue that's not so, so instead you demand we accept that the holocaust is ordinary and well demonstrated despite the issues and prove to you that the holocaust didn't happen because after all, so many people say different.
www.youtube.com
"There is no confirming evidence that positively demonstrates every detail of a position I assigned to you, therefore you are wrong and I am right."
"Uh, that's cool and all, but then where is your positive evidence proving your thesis?"
