Tabletop Roleplaying Games (D&D, Pathfinder, CoC, ETC.)

[p1138]

What's your opinion on "it's what my guy would do"? Should RP always take the back seat to efficiency? If not, what's the limit?

Is it actually what their guy would do? And if it's not disruptive, it shouldn't matter. Now if it makes the PC into a scizophrenic weirdo that has no consistent thought process for anything could maybe talk to them about that if it's distracting to people.

 

[Brain Problems]

I don't think I've ever seen someone use the ole "it's what my character would do" if it wasn't in the context of being totally retarded and lolsorandumb chaotic stupid. It doesn't happen often but when it does you roll your eyes.

 

[CrunkLord420]

The Traveller 5E (as in DnD 5E, not Traveller5 aka T5) people keep putting out short little clips about their thing. The more I hear, the more bizarre it seems. They're straight up using DnD classes like "Barbarian". They've basically gotten rid of the traditional character creation system (it's there, but not mechanically).

They've created a "new universe" for Traveller called CivX. At this point they've removed both the system and the setting from Traveller. I don't know what else is left.

What's your opinion on "it's what my guy would do"? Should RP always take the back seat to efficiency? If not, what's the limit?

What else would your guy do? The thing he wouldn't do? Just play a video game if you're not going to care about the internal logic of narratives and characters. My characters do all sorts of reckless and suicidal stuff. Sometimes they just shoot each other in the head unceremoniously. Very inefficient, However it is the most memorable/enjoyable.

 

[Blarmed&Dangerous]

What's your opinion on "it's what my guy would do"? Should RP always take the back seat to efficiency? If not, what's the limit?

I will take every opportunity to advocate the braunstein style of play.

Let them.

GMs worry about PVP, or players making roleplaying choices that in any way impedes the party being a hivemind of itinerant junk dealers inexorably drawn as if by magnetism to the next dungeon, while simultaneously bemoaning players treating their characters as nothing more than stat blocks.

A truly engaged player wants to embody their character, but even in a good party where one player isn't hogging the spotlight, how often in an average campaign is that character actually in the roleplay focus?

Do a braunstein. Let every player do what their character would do. Let every character be in the spotlight literally 100% of the time. Let them fight, plot against, conspire with, backstab, and kill each other. The Fellowship of the Ring had more intraparty conflict than your average D&D party.

 

[AnOminous]

I don't think I've ever seen someone use the ole "it's what my character would do" if it wasn't in the context of being totally retarded and lolsorandumb chaotic stupid. It doesn't happen often but when it does you roll your eyes.

The question should be whether it's something anyone capable of functioning would do. If it isn't, they shouldn't be in a party in the first place. Basically, is this something only a jerk would do who you would kick out of any group or, if he does have an obnoxious personality, is he still useful?

If neither, why is he still around?

So having a jerkass character is one thing, but not carrying your own weight isn't acceptable.

 

[Capsaicin Addict]

The Traveller 5E (as in DnD 5E, not Traveller5 aka T5) people keep putting out short little clips about their thing. The more I hear, the more bizarre it seems. They're straight up using DnD classes like "Barbarian". They've basically gotten rid of the traditional character creation system (it's there, but not mechanically).

Bizarre. That Neon Odyssey thing people posted a few pages ago at least renamed and reskinned all the classes.

 

[Juke and Jam]

The Traveller 5E (as in DnD 5E, not Traveller5 aka T5) people keep putting out short little clips about their thing. The more I hear, the more bizarre it seems. They're straight up using DnD classes like "Barbarian". They've basically gotten rid of the traditional character creation system (it's there, but not mechanically).

They've created a "new universe" for Traveller called CivX. At this point they've removed both the system and the setting from Traveller. I don't know what else is left.
https://youtube.com/watch?v=l1HhbRIYvy8

What an absolutely worthless project. Pretty much everything I've learned about it has come across as an exersice in moronic futility. Of course it's also a boldfaced cashgrab aimed at the latest generation of hobbyists who are still too green to understand, that there are more games out there than D&D and in fact most of them are far superior, especially when it comes to expressing different genres.

 

[LovisXVI]

What an absolutely worthless project. Pretty much everything I've learned about it has come across as an exersice in moronic futility. Of course it's also a boldfaced cashgrab aimed at the latest generation of hobbyists who are still too green to understand, that there are more games out there than D&D and in fact most of them are far superior, especially when it comes to expressing different genres.

T20, the original d20 Traveller product, is far superior anyway, and it's set in Charted Space with its own set of sectors. You get up fight villainous militant vegan centaurs, who doesn't love that? You can also purchase the whole thing for 35 dollars from Marc Miller, which I did a few months ago along with everything else Traveller.

 

[The Mighty Bundus]

Why are people so apprehensive to play anything but D&D or pathfinder anyways? Especially when they are clearly trying to go for a different genre and trying to homebrew it into something else entirely. Surley it is easier to just learn another system.

 

[Scream Aim Fire]

Why are people so apprehensive to play anything but D&D or pathfinder anyways? Especially when they are clearly trying to go for a different genre and trying to homebrew it into something else entirely. Surley it is easier to just learn another system.

Widespread appeal and marketing, really; those two games are advertised a lot compared to others, and there's also the fact that DND 5E in particular was designed for a wide variety of settings, homebrew and such. Other settings like Warhammer are more focused and designed for a more specific idea in mind, not to mention the respective communities tend to be... different.

 

[The Mighty Bundus]

Makes sense, something I've also noticed the people who only play those D&D also never choose to be humans as their race. Its just strange that they don't even try something else I guess.

 

[Konigsberg]

Why are people so apprehensive to play anything but D&D or pathfinder anyways? Especially when they are clearly trying to go for a different genre and trying to homebrew it into something else entirely. Surley it is easier to just learn another system.

I think it mostly comes from a place of laziness to be frank. A lot of people can't be bothered to learn the rules of the game they're currently playing, and mostly rely on learning the rules at the table from the GM or a more experienced player in the group, instead of on their own. So to these reading-averse motherfuckers the idea of a new game where nobody is more experienced to leech knowledge from probably seems pretty scary.

It absolutely is easier to just outright learn a new game then try to break 5e or Pathfinder apart until you can rearrange the pieces to poorly resemble the thing you actually want to play. However, to the brainlets that suffer from this particular hangup the idea of putting the upfront effort to learn a new game is more intimidating than putting in an assload more overall work to rebuild 5e into a completely different game.

Edit: I should also say, being averse to learning a new game seems to mostly be a player issue, so if a GM has to rebuild 5e into a sci-fi space opera because their group wants to play a sci-fi game but refuses to learn a new system, all that effort is now on the GM to rebuild the game and the lazy players can coast by doing nothing.

 

[Red Dragon]

Don't forget how some people like to make games but not play them. For a certain kind of nerd, making up rules is more fun than using them.

 

[Sayer of the N-Word]

Edit: I should also say, being averse to learning a new game seems to mostly be a player issue,

I play at a game store, and sometimes curious people will wander over from the Magic section and express interest in joining, and there's a subtle shift in their posture and tone when they're told that it's not 5e D&D, but if they know 5e they''ll pick this up in just a few minutes. They never join.

For a certain kind of nerd, making up rules is more fun than using them.

It's a great writing exercise. Rules, presentation, setting. What level of crunch do you want, what do you want to do that the systems you play don't allow? Should it be pretty with lots of pictures, or the old school two columns of text? Will you include an essay about a fully fleshed out planet, or will there just be a one page sample encounter?

 

[Konigsberg]

express interest in joining, and there's a subtle shift in their posture and tone when they're told that it's not 5e D&D

An old co-worker of mine DMs for a group of players that do just outright refuse to move on from 5e, because they're cripplingly lazy. At the time they had been telling him they wanted to play something sci-fi, and I was wrapping up a Fallout 2d20 campaign at the time so I suggested the game to him, he ran it by his players and they seemed into it because half of them were Fallout fans.

Weekend rolls around and I get a text from him saying his group gave up on the game just 2 hours into the session, because his players told him and I quote "Using 2 d20s is just too confusing". These chode smokers got through character creation and gave up trying to learn in literally the first encounter. There's being lazy, and then there's whatever the fuck is going on with 5e players.

Spoiler: And

Fuck those lazy speds, I like Fallout 2d20 and the basic rules are so simple an actual chimp could probably play it.

 

[CrunkLord420]

Most of Traveller's rules is stuff that DnD doesn't cover at all. Like spaceships, freight & passengers, jump travel, vehicles and robots. I don't see how people who do d20+mod vs TN can't handle 2d6+mod vs TN.

 

[Sleazy Car Salesman]

I don't think I've ever seen someone use the ole "it's what my character would do" if it wasn't in the context of being totally retarded and lolsorandumb chaotic stupid. It doesn't happen often but when it does you roll your eyes.

I've been forced to use the excuse in a situation where I know that what I am about to do or propose to the group is a stupid idea, but my character genuinely would not. Yeah, I know as a player that telling this guy to go fuck himself is a bad idea because I have metaknowledge that tells me he won't take that lying down, but Grunlug Bloodtooth doesn't.

 

[p1138]

I play at a game store, and sometimes curious people will wander over from the Magic section and express interest in joining, and there's a subtle shift in their posture and tone when they're told that it's not 5e D&D, but if they know 5e they''ll pick this up in just a few minutes. They never join.

There's a venn diagram to be made but I'm too lazy, however there's 3 major reasons why.

1. Anything not D&D, including older versions of D&D, is just Temu D&D because the latest version is clearly the superior version
2. Lazy assholes have seen it requires no brainpower to play, but they assume anything else requires some MENSA level IQ that they assume they aren't nerdy enough to possess even if it means 2nd and 3rd grade arithmetic. This is why WotC was afraid to brand 2024 as 6e or 5.5e.
3. This may sound like #1 but it isn't because the #1 people actually want to play D&D. These people want to appear to be playing D&D as it is a lifestyle brand because popular people play D&D, they don't play other games. You especially don't see the beautiful people getting millions of views playing anything else(except the critical role people do) other than to placate the nerds on occasion who demand it.

 

[LovisXVI]

I think it mostly comes from a place of laziness to be frank. A lot of people can't be bothered to learn the rules of the game they're currently playing, and mostly rely on learning the rules at the table from the GM or a more experienced player in the group, instead of on their own. So to these reading-averse motherfuckers the idea of a new game where nobody is more experienced to leech knowledge from probably seems pretty scary.

It absolutely is easier to just outright learn a new game then try to break 5e or Pathfinder apart until you can rearrange the pieces to poorly resemble the thing you actually want to play. However, to the brainlets that suffer from this particular hangup the idea of putting the upfront effort to learn a new game is more intimidating than putting in an assload more overall work to rebuild 5e into a completely different game.

Edit: I should also say, being averse to learning a new game seems to mostly be a player issue, so if a GM has to rebuild 5e into a sci-fi space opera because their group wants to play a sci-fi game but refuses to learn a new system, all that effort is now on the GM to rebuild the game and the lazy players can coast by doing nothing.

I play at a game store, and sometimes curious people will wander over from the Magic section and express interest in joining, and there's a subtle shift in their posture and tone when they're told that it's not 5e D&D, but if they know 5e they''ll pick this up in just a few minutes. They never join.

There's a venn diagram to be made but I'm too lazy, however there's 3 major reasons why.

1. Anything not D&D, including older versions of D&D, is just Temu D&D because the latest version is clearly the superior version
2. Lazy assholes have seen it requires no brainpower to play, but they assume anything else requires some MENSA level IQ that they assume they aren't nerdy enough to possess even if it means 2nd and 3rd grade arithmetic. This is why WotC was afraid to brand 2024 as 6e or 5.5e.
3. This may sound like #1 but it isn't because the #1 people actually want to play D&D. These people want to appear to be playing D&D as it is a lifestyle brand because popular people play D&D, they don't play other games. You especially don't see the beautiful people getting millions of views playing anything else(except the critical role people do) other than to placate the nerds on occasion who demand it.

As someone who has years of breaking people away from D&Drone play, I find that the best way to get someone to learn a new system is to:

1. Sell them on the idea of the campaign, give the rundown of the world, campaign conceit, types of characters you want them to play
2. Once sold, sell them on the fact that the system you are going to use is necessary
   • If resistant, feel free to deploy "All roads lead to Ravenloft because that is what I am running"
3. Designate a player as your "stool pigeon", who collaborates with you to demonstrate core mechanics you want the other players to pick up on, like a tutorial companion in a cRPG.
   • I would go so far as to suggest this is actually the most important part; every successful introduction has a player fulfilling this role. It is much easier for someone to pick up on a system in action than in text alone.
4. Run a one-shot with pre-gens to get people to feel it out once sold.
5. Structure a campaign such that the number of mechanics necessary to engage in are slowly ramped up
   • For example, if new to Traveller, don't start them on the ship just yet. Have them be on a planet, and they get the ship as an early quest reward. Then give them a cargo that conveniently takes up most of the space they need to move somewhere. Then they have a bunch of money to do speculative trading with, and now suddenly need money they can get via speculative trading. Now laden down with speculative tradegoods, they are attacked by pirates who had agents looking out for soft targets, so now they must do space combat.

 

[p1138]

As someone who has years of breaking people away from D&Drone play, I find that the best way to get someone to learn a new system is to:

Sure, of course. But none of that works with these 5e braindead people who aren't willing to do something different. Other genres may as well not exist for them, let alone other systems.