Star Trek - Space: The Final Frontier

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If you are just starting to watch TOS recently, the special effects probably don't look horrifically bad because every episode was digitally remastered and in some places had totally new CGI effects and sequences added in when TOS started being syndicated again for reruns in the early/mid 2000s. Most of it is minor stuff like replacing the old rotoscoped phaser beams and transporter shimmer with modern digital effects or using animated CG models of spaceships and planets in space scenes instead of the original footage of miniatures dangling in front of matte paintings.
I think partially why I don't like TNG as much is because it seems to use a lot more CG than TOS. I might be wrong on this, but most of the cool shit in TOS was done with either models or sets. I see a lot more CG use in TNG than I did in the 20 or so episodes I watched of TOS. The most CG I remember in TOS was when you see the Enterprise moving or for the phasers/lasers/explosions/flashy shit. With TNG I remember seeing an entire CG planet in one episode, CG for the hangar area of the Enterprise, etc. Like the Star Trek equivalent of Attack of the Clones for Star Trek.
 
I think partially why I don't like TNG as much is because it seems to use a lot more CG than TOS. I might be wrong on this, but most of the cool shit in TOS was done with either models or sets. I see a lot more CG use in TNG than I did in the 20 or so episodes I watched of TOS. The most CG I remember in TOS was when you see the Enterprise moving or for the phasers/lasers/explosions/flashy shit. With TNG I remember seeing an entire CG planet in one episode, CG for the hangar area of the Enterprise, etc. Like the Star Trek equivalent of Attack of the Clones for Star Trek.

CGI wasn't even used in feature films until the '70s. I doubt they used any of it at all in a '60s TV show with chronic budget problems.
 
CGI wasn't even used in feature films until the '70s. I doubt they used any of it at all in a '60s TV show with chronic budget problems.
There was a Star Wars-like special edition they did of TOS where they swapped out the models, matte paintings, and big bright color splashes with CG effects. They were decent-enough looking and generally respectful to the original concepts. Also tossed in a few odds and ends, like the WhateverDrive Spaceship in Spock's Brain looks like the WhateverDrive Spaceship in the cartoon instead of a vague glob of light.
 
And what about the animated series skip those one too? I'm thinking of going though all the series up to Enterprise.
Gene Roddenberry declared the Animated Series non-canon, although a lot of fans and subsequent Trek writers disregard that because it's surprisingly good. Some of the animation is a bit ropy, but the writing stands up pretty well.
So I've started watching a few episodes of The Next Generation and it's kind of...weird.
Quality of the original Star Trek episodes ranged from very good to okay like I said earlier, but TNG has a range of very good to absolutely terrible from what I've seen.
Probably the best episode I've watched involved Data (who I really, really want to love as a character, but I haven't seen enough of him yet) being in danger from some scientist schmuck that wants to disassemble him. Most of the episode is pretty much going over his sentience and his rights as an android which is really, really cool. Then there's the episode that came on right after that which involved some random fuckboy ensign falling in love with a shapeshifting alien and it's full of god damn cringe to the point where I don't want to even remember it.
The CG also somehow looks worse to me than the original series which I can't explain for the life of me. Episodes also aren't too memorable and it kind of seems to lack that world building focus mixed in with sci-fi jargon to explain the dumb away. I probably need to watch more to like it, but the 6 episodes I've seen don't leave me very hopeful. I'm also hoping Picard will shine more as a Captain in more episodes because he was only really fantastic in that Data episode I was talking about where he gave a really cool defense of Data's sentience.
https://youtube.com/watch?v=vjuQRCG_sUw
TNG had some problems in its early episodes. Firstly, Roddenberry was in charge, and he tended to put his vision ahead of what made for good TV. For instance, he thought that by the 24th century, humans would have evolved beyond interpersonal conflict, which doesn't exactly make for compelling storytelling. Secondly, a lot of the scripts were recycled from the aborted Phase II. Thirdly, they ran into a writers' strike in the second season. And in general, they were trying to create a show with its own identity in the Star Trek universe at a time when most fans viewed the concept of a non-Kirk Enterprise as blasphemy.

There's still some great stuff in there, 'The Measure of a Man' being a case in point. But I'd say the series as a whole only really got good around season 3, when Roddenberry stopped running things and the other producers figured out what they were doing. My personal favourite episodes are 'Best of Both Worlds,' in which we see for the first time how truly alien the Borg are, and 'Darmok,' in which the crew encounter a species whose culture is so idiosyncratic that communication is impossible, and Picard has to form an alliance with their captain to save them both.
 
Gene Roddenberry declared the Animated Series non-canon, although a lot of fans and subsequent Trek writers disregard that because it's surprisingly good. Some of the animation is a bit ropy, but the writing stands up pretty well.

Okay i feel like i am going to watch a bit of it and see if i will continue or not, And is their any good TOS books that i should read after watching the series?
 
Gene Roddenberry declared the Animated Series non-canon, although a lot of fans and subsequent Trek writers disregard that because it's surprisingly good. Some of the animation is a bit ropy, but the writing stands up pretty well.

TNG had some problems in its early episodes. Firstly, Roddenberry was in charge, and he tended to put his vision ahead of what made for good TV. For instance, he thought that by the 24th century, humans would have evolved beyond interpersonal conflict, which doesn't exactly make for compelling storytelling. Secondly, a lot of the scripts were recycled from the aborted Phase II. Thirdly, they ran into a writers' strike in the second season. And in general, they were trying to create a show with its own identity in the Star Trek universe at a time when most fans viewed the concept of a non-Kirk Enterprise as blasphemy.

There's still some great stuff in there, 'The Measure of a Man' being a case in point. But I'd say the series as a whole only really got good around season 3, when Roddenberry stopped running things and the other producers figured out what they were doing. My personal favourite episodes are 'Best of Both Worlds,' in which we see for the first time how truly alien the Borg are, and 'Darmok,' in which the crew encounter a species whose culture is so idiosyncratic that communication is impossible, and Picard has to form an alliance with their captain to save them both.
The one season 1 episode I saw which involves Picard and a vengeful Jew alien was pretty decent, guess I'll have to see how the rest of the show is. I'll probably finish the original before I go any farther though. Kind of excited to get past TNG and into DS9 though because the Captain looks really kick ass in that show. Not saying that I don't like Stewart/Picard because he's really excellent when the show wants him to shine, but I've heard that the Cap in DS9 is a kind of morally grey figure which I dig a lot in my sci-fi.
 
Kind of excited to get past TNG and into DS9 though because the Captain looks really kick ass in that show. Not saying that I don't like Stewart/Picard because he's really excellent when the show wants him to shine, but I've heard that the Cap in DS9 is a kind of morally grey figure which I dig a lot in my sci-fi.
The whole series is more morally grey. A lot of fans rate it for that reason - we start seeing that maybe the Federation isn't all that. Characters aren't all they seem. People have to make difficult moral choices, and maybe they don't choose correctly. For people tired of the moralising of the Roddenberry era, it's a breath of fresh air.
 
Someone please tell me the point of the two part episode "The Menagerie" and why Captain Pike was made into a beeping block with wheels and a head.
Shit just annoys me to hell. Could have mentioned Pike's status in some offhand comment in a different episode and it would have been better than sitting through "Star Trek Cast Watches Star Trek: The Episode".
 
Someone please tell me the point of the two part episode "The Menagerie" and why Captain Pike was made into a beeping block with wheels and a head.
Shit just annoys me to hell. Could have mentioned Pike's status in some offhand comment in a different episode and it would have been better than sitting through "Star Trek Cast Watches Star Trek: The Episode".

If memory serves, they had a script shortage and already had the Cage footage in the can, so it saved money and solved a story problem. It's the TOS equiv of Shades of Gray from TNG. Filler. As for why was Pike was wheeled out like that.. it never occurred to me before you mentioned it, but it does seem kinda weird.
 
If memory serves, they had a script shortage and already had the Cage footage in the can, so it saved money and solved a story problem. It's the TOS equiv of Shades of Gray from TNG. Filler. As for why was Pike was wheeled out like that.. it never occurred to me before you mentioned it, but it does seem kinda weird.

I think they had to justify caking him in make-up and being silent, because the original Pike actor was unavailable (or dead? He died sometime in that timeframe) for filming.
 
So I've started watching a few episodes of The Next Generation and it's kind of...weird.
Quality of the original Star Trek episodes ranged from very good to okay like I said earlier, but TNG has a range of very good to absolutely terrible from what I've seen.
Probably the best episode I've watched involved Data (who I really, really want to love as a character, but I haven't seen enough of him yet) being in danger from some scientist schmuck that wants to disassemble him. Most of the episode is pretty much going over his sentience and his rights as an android which is really, really cool. Then there's the episode that came on right after that which involved some random fuckboy ensign falling in love with a shapeshifting alien and it's full of god damn cringe to the point where I don't want to even remember it.
The CG also somehow looks worse to me than the original series which I can't explain for the life of me. Episodes also aren't too memorable and it kind of seems to lack that world building focus mixed in with sci-fi jargon to explain the dumb away. I probably need to watch more to like it, but the 6 episodes I've seen don't leave me very hopeful. I'm also hoping Picard will shine more as a Captain in more episodes because he was only really fantastic in that Data episode I was talking about where he gave a really cool defense of Data's sentience.
https://youtube.com/watch?v=vjuQRCG_sUw
TNG's biggest weakness is that frankly, most of it's episodes are shit. It's strengths are its most fondly remembered and easily has the best two-parters and some of the greatest Trek episodes ever. A typical viewing on TNG for me is browsing through the list and going: "This episode was shit, so was the one, and this one was okay but mostly trash..." etc and eventually settle on a two-parter or anything involving the Klingons since those are always good for some reason.

The one season 1 episode I saw which involves Picard and a vengeful Jew alien was pretty decent, guess I'll have to see how the rest of the show is. I'll probably finish the original before I go any farther though. Kind of excited to get past TNG and into DS9 though because the Captain looks really kick ass in that show. Not saying that I don't like Stewart/Picard because he's really excellent when the show wants him to shine, but I've heard that the Cap in DS9 is a kind of morally grey figure which I dig a lot in my sci-fi.
Deep Space 9 is best Trek and anyone who disagrees is either stupid or butthurt how gray it is.

Reminder the Ferengi were dreamed up by Roddenberry to be scary. An orange Jew with big ears is the best he could think of.
 
Most likely explanation is that Hunter was busy on something else, or they were already cash-strapped and so couldn't afford to bring him back (the guy who played him in The Menagerie was a regular background extra on the show).

Though I do recall hearing that Hunter's then-wife also happened to be his agent, and she acted like a complete bitch to Roddenberry throughout filming of the first pilot, so that might also have had something to do with it.
 
Most likely explanation is that Hunter was busy on something else, or they were already cash-strapped and so couldn't afford to bring him back (the guy who played him in The Menagerie was a regular background extra on the show).

Though I do recall hearing that Hunter's then-wife also happened to be his agent, and she acted like a complete bitch to Roddenberry throughout filming of the first pilot, so that might also have had something to do with it.

I'm too lazy to go get my books, but I remember reading that Hunter wanted a lot more money as the second pilot production was starting to quickly ramp up, and either Solow, or Coon told him to get lost. I do remember the released explanation to him not being in the second pilot was that he was a 'movie star', not a TV actor.
 
Since I last posted here I've watched a few VOY and ENT episodes. I even selected them because the stories sounded interesting. And I guess they were. But there was just something...off...about them compared to TOS and TNG. Maybe it's the cast and crew being different. Regardless I have no interest in watching anymore from those two series. I may try to get into DS9, I've watched a couple of episodes and they were okay, but I have a feeling I'm just a regular Trek guy.

Question: should I bother watching Star Trek V? I just keep reading about how shitty it is, so it's the only Trek movie I haven't seen. It can't be that much worse than Generations or Nemesis though, right?
 
Question: should I bother watching Star Trek V? I just keep reading about how shitty it is, so it's the only Trek movie I haven't seen. It can't be that much worse than Generations or Nemesis though, right?
V has some good TOS stuff that hadn't been in the movies too much, like Climbing Rocks, Your God A Shit, and Kirk Preaches Why Human Flaws Are Important.
 
So I just finished the first season of TOS and it was pretty fucking fantastic. 30 episodes and I only really disliked 2 (The Menagerie). There were a few that fell flat in the beginning for some reason (Mudd's Women had a really, really, REALLY dumb twist at the end for the sake of shoving in a pointless moral, What Are Little Girls Made Of was kind of confusing towards the end, and Miri was very close to being unbearable with the manchildren and Kirk flirting(???) with the main manchild) otherwise though I loved it all.
The second season had some of my favorite episodes when the marathon on BBC was going on so I think I'm going to like it more.
 
Season 2 was nothing short of fantastic. Mostly every single episode was really enjoyable with the exception of Assignment: Earth which I really wasn't that into for some reason. Halfway through Season 3 and I found an episode that rivals Journey to Babel as my all time favorite, The Empath. Pretty great stuff, situation Kirk, Spock, and McCoy were in was pretty intense. Ending was fantastic with the aliens explaining their motives for why they were doing what they did and Kirk kind of shoving their own shit in their face. The main cast gets in trouble a lot so it's kind of hard to maintain that suspense throughout the show when one of them is in serious danger, but this episode pulled it off really well with McCoy.
Speaking of McCoy, I kind of dig that Season 3 puts more of the spotlight on him. He was a pretty central character in 3-4 of the episodes I've watched and while I liked all the Spock and Vulcan fun in Season 2, McCoy is pretty fucking cool too and needed to shine.
 
Season 2 was nothing short of fantastic. Mostly every single episode was really enjoyable with the exception of Assignment: Earth which I really wasn't that into for some reason. Halfway through Season 3 and I found an episode that rivals Journey to Babel as my all time favorite, The Empath. Pretty great stuff, situation Kirk, Spock, and McCoy were in was pretty intense. Ending was fantastic with the aliens explaining their motives for why they were doing what they did and Kirk kind of shoving their own shit in their face. The main cast gets in trouble a lot so it's kind of hard to maintain that suspense throughout the show when one of them is in serious danger, but this episode pulled it off really well with McCoy.
Speaking of McCoy, I kind of dig that Season 3 puts more of the spotlight on him. He was a pretty central character in 3-4 of the episodes I've watched and while I liked all the Spock and Vulcan fun in Season 2, McCoy is pretty fucking cool too and needed to shine.

May I recommend "The Eugenics Wars" two parter novels. It deals with the rise of Khan and has Gary Seven and Roberta. Fleshes out their characters a bit more and gives some meaty filler story into how Kahn got rolling.
 
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