Sonic The Hedgehog Games

[Newcomer 42]

Tangle and Whisper are definately gonna be saved cuz they actually have a sizable fanbase that likes them, which I can't say for most of the IDW cast.

Eh, I dunno. They're quite one-note and their behaviour is a bit odd compared to the other Sonic characters, plus the writers behind them insist a lot they're lesbos. It would be funny if the new owner makes them straight because now there are only two genders back again, and showing LGTshit to children is seen badly, thankfully.

Starline's dead, but a new reboot could revive him if the new owners care to do so. The guy was actually smart enough to try and off the heroes then and there, but was repeatedly cucked due to Flynn enforcing the Status Quo, cuz God forbid your comic actually have stakes, Ian...

There were the Sega mandates which they follow with fixation. Such as how the guys can't wear pants, ever.
Surge may survive the transition (heh), but the pair is quite one-note and they no longer have a purpose, nor they can't accomplish it anyway as they sure as hell won't be able to kill Sonic or Tails.

 

[Pixy]

Creating the fourth set of Sonic look-alike nemeses after the mess that came with trying to write anything interesting with Scourge, you have to wonder what Flynn was thinking. It was never going to have a satisfying conclusion and the characters would always be wasted potential. This is Sonic's equivalent to the Clone Saga for Spider-Man.

 

[SSj_Ness (Yiffed)]

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Looks like one of the artists for the IDW Sonic comics is being outed as the ship sinks. Screencaps were gotten from Richmunk after I asked for them.

Feeling violent right now.

 

[Newcomer 42]

Creating the fourth set of Sonic look-alike nemeses after the mess that came with trying to write anything interesting with Scourge, you have to wonder what Flynn was thinking. It was never going to have a satisfying conclusion and the characters would always be wasted potential. This is Sonic's equivalent to the Clone Saga for Spider-Man.

They couldn't use Scourge anymore due to the Archie shitstorm, so these bootleg version were made... But they weren't killed or moved somewhere else, so they are kinda there, wondering why, as the obvious next step (becoming good and thus yet another pair of "Sonic friends"), is not taken for some reason. Sonic suffers from a lack of villains besides Eggman. For all of his faults, Penders gave a bunch of villains that Sonic and co could face.

Of course, this doesn't matter it Sonic and co can't be defeated. Or even better: A zombie virus plague breaks and "not-kills" a lot of people... But it doesn't matter because Sonic can't get infected for good, ever.

Feeling violent right now.

They can't help themselves, can't they? They must be gross 24/7. And nope, that's no bait, that's to own the chuds, n. 1251st.

 

[Lizard Machine Bugs]

Creating the fourth set of Sonic look-alike nemeses after the mess that came with trying to write anything interesting with Scourge, you have to wonder what Flynn was thinking. It was never going to have a satisfying conclusion and the characters would always be wasted potential. This is Sonic's equivalent to the Clone Saga for Spider-Man.

I don't think it's much like the Clone Saga at all, the clone saga story is about Spiderman questioning his identity due to all the clones of him jackal made which was all due to the green goblin, Peter even thinks he isn't the original at one point and lets the Scarlet Spider take over being Spider Man. Nothing comparable like that happens in the story, if anything Surge and Kit are like the androids from DBZ, with Surge herself being a weird composite of Cell and Android 18.
There are some meta similarities, like how both the IDW line and the clone saga came about due to corporate/editors wanting to simplify continuity and then ending up with a kind of meandering work that doesn't know what it wants to do, also due to partly due to conflict between the writers who are working on the line.
I also wouldn't say Scourge is hated or unpopular, I'm fairly certain he's more well liked than Surge. The biggest complaint I've heard about him, which even Archie fags agree with, is the whole rape thing with Bunnie, but aside from that he seems to be the Archie character that gets the most love sans Sally. That is too say, if you removed the rape plotline I think Scourge would be even more well liked, so trying to do Scourge 2 isn't some inherently bad idea.
Scourge is liked and Ian probably wanted to introduce a canon counterpart to him that lacked the baggage that came with Scourge.
I think the real problem is that there are two main writers on IDW(Ian and Evan), and that they don't agree on how to handle Surge. Of course the writers individually have their own problems, Ian dislikes Sally and wants to make the comic too much like Archie and making Sonic too preachy. While Evan has her own problems with characterizing characters weirdly like how Silver lacks any of his game versions bad attitude, which is a problem when the comic is supposed to take place in the same continuity as the games.

 

[GoodWinSon]

They couldn't use Scourge anymore due to the Archie shitstorm, so these bootleg version were made... But they weren't killed or moved somewhere else, so they are kinda there, wondering why, as the obvious next step (becoming good and thus yet another pair of "Sonic friends"), is not taken for some reason. Sonic suffers from a lack of villains besides Eggman. For all of his faults, Penders gave a bunch of villains that Sonic and co could face.

The antagonists in IDW are all uninteresting. Eggman has gone from a self-serving megalomaniac to "haha goofy mean scientist man" (same problem with reboot archie). Even in the most memorable arc, the metal virus, he gets pushed aside by the deadly six. Am I supposed to believe this moron managed to conquer most of the world?

Speaking of the deadly six, they aren't too bad in idw, but they haven't been utilized in over three years.

Starline could have easily had a story arc where he successfully replaces sonic and eggman, but he is killed almost immediately after he usurps eggman.

Opossum guy is a villain of the week stretched thin.

Mimic the octopus was recently reconnected from a ruthless traitor to "ahg I'm sad and lonely and jelous of whisper because she has friends aaahhhh"

I honestly like Surge and Kit and they have an interesting plot hook about their original identities. Unfortunately the writers have been too busy having them flip flop and I think the comic will be canceled before we see any payoff.

She's not an antagonist but I think the puppet girl will be dropped to the wayside. Sage made her redundant and fulfills the same role along with being better known. The puppet's not even that active in the comic regardless.

 

[NerdShamer]

Am I supposed to believe this moron managed to conquer most of the world?

Yes, according to his resumé

 

[The Lawgiver]

The antagonists in IDW are all uninteresting. Eggman has gone from a self-serving megalomaniac to "haha goofy mean scientist man

From what I've seen of IDW they still try making eggman edgy but it's like not always well implemented so it's like a switch flipping rather than just him being goofy but also clearly a threat. Early 3d sonic games and the classic era games really hit that balance well though the classic ones didn't have much spoken dialogue it gets acoss with character animationsand how he builds/designs shit. This is a man for the first 4 "mainline" games fucking put animals in goofy ass robots that were also animals but bigger to try and get rid of a blue fuck who kept showing up and breaking his shit. This is a man who's goals in life are pretty simple, it's either "take over the world and/or destroy a capital city to legally build amusement park utopia with my face on everything cause i'm cool", or "beat sonic". Archie eggman was the way he was because he was technically DiC Robotnik though sometimes they made him act a little more like the eggman/Robotnik from the games, be it literally copy and pasting adventure game dialogue or just capturing that vibe he had during the earlier modern era. Still inconsistent though, but it's fine.

Anyways, back to the games. This kinda reminded me how if you look at the "eggman built areas" throughout the classic games into adventure 1 they all have a kind of specific look about them. Really colorful and full of tech detail and occasional warning chevrons. Only real "exception" is the death egg in sonic and knuckles and some other places but it's a neat little albeit kind of obvious thing nobody really talks about.

Yes, according to his resumé

I always liked how early Archie Robotnik's characterization was basically "what if AoSTH robotnik somehow stumbled into ruling the world like SATAM Robotnik and had his outfit too?"

 

[MugolEx]

Yes, according to his resumé

Ahhhh. Another masterpiece for my notable Eggmans folder.

 

[Pixy]

There are some meta similarities, like how both the IDW line and the clone saga came about due to corporate/editors wanting to simplify continuity and then ending up with a kind of meandering work that doesn't know what it wants to do, also due to partly due to conflict between the writers who are working on the line.

That was what I was trying to say rather than narrative similarities. They've dredged up the clone storyline again for the Jackal/Ben Reilly again haven't they?

 

[GoodWinSon]

From what I've seen of IDW they still try making eggman edgy but it's like not always well implemented so it's like a switch flipping rather than just him being goofy but also clearly a threat. Early 3d sonic games and the classic era games really hit that balance well though the classic ones didn't have much spoken dialogue it gets acoss with character animationsand how he builds/designs shit. This is a man for the first 4 "mainline" games fucking put animals in goofy ass robots that were also animals but bigger to try and get rid of a blue fuck who kept showing up and breaking his shit. This is a man who's goals in life are pretty simple, it's either "take over the world and/or destroy a capital city to legally build amusement park utopia with my face on everything cause i'm cool", or "beat sonic". Archie eggman was the way he was because he was technically DiC Robotnik though sometimes they made him act a little more like the eggman/Robotnik from the games, be it literally copy and pasting adventure game dialogue or just capturing that vibe he had during the earlier modern era. Still inconsistent though, but it's fine.

See, I don't even mind when Robotnik is goofy. Heck, I like it when Robotnik is goofy. The difference is Archie, the games, etc. actually build Robotnik up and show what he is capable of. In Archie it's established controls large swathes of the world and has a giant robot enemy. In IDW he's just there. We don't know how strong he is, how much of the world he controls, etc. People treat him as a nuisance more than anything. There aren't any stakes to him in Flynn's world.

Robotnik tax

 

[The Lawgiver]

See, I don't even mind when Robotnik is goofy. Heck, I like it when Robotnik is goofy. The difference is Archie, the games, etc. actually build Robotnik up and show what he is capable of. In Archie it's established controls large swathes of the world and has a giant robot enemy. In IDW he's just there. We don't know how strong he is, how much of the world he controls, etc. People treat him as a nuisance more than anything. There aren't any stakes to him in Flynn's world.

He's similarly shown owning or colonizing some kind of large swaths of land in the game as well, just not 'world takeover" level. it's like "oh here's a huge city under construction" or "he's building these fucking cities all over this uninhabited tiny planet he chained to the earth as part of some wacked out scheme to get time travel crystals to beat sonic" or "oh he built a carnival on angel island... huh" or "hey he has an airship, airship fleet, or space station he escaped to cause you beat on him so hard, go up there and get his ass!" From what I've seen of IDW sonic it's like callbacks to those existing or having had existed but not in use or rotting away somewhere abandoned for being a "failure". And then the shit they pull out is stuff like as people have said the zombies thing which is like a weird reference to the the sonic heroes multiplayer alt metal character skins but without them retaining their knowledge and abilities and just being fucking shambling not dead zombies. Like imagine if it just turned them evil or something and wasn't just a plague of "oh you get touched and you're now zobie ohnooo" that'd probably be more "sonic-ish" in storyline. Oh wait they technically already did that in archie but with weird extra steps because the megaman comics. I only know about that shit though from people talking about them at the time they came out online lmao.


If you told me back in like 2003 that this goofy little easter egg where you hold B or whatever and the characters become chrome was gonna be repurposed into a zombie plotline my reaction would probably be the same level of "wait what? why?"

EDIT: My edit apperently undid itself? Adding it back now.

Robotnik tax

There really is something special about early archie robotnik and his whole characterization (Yes I already kind of talked about this lmao)

 

[Lizard Machine Bugs]

That was what I was trying to say rather than narrative similarities. They've dredged up the clone storyline again for the Jackal/Ben Reilly again haven't they?

Oh, my fault for being :dumb:
As for current spider man, I don't know, the last thing I remember is there being like 5 different Harry Osborns and there's this new spider kid who's a ginger and a venom junior who's white/blonde/blue eyes and hates Paul.

 

[Newcomer 42]

f you told me back in like 2003 that this goofy little easter egg where you hold B or whatever and the characters become chrome was gonna be repurposed into a zombie plotline my reaction would probably be the same level of "wait what? why?"

I didn't know it was stolen from one of the games. So it's barely an original idea, then? Also, having Shadow act like a retard is pure fail.
Either way: One thing I discovered is that the saying that Sonic fans are losers IS correct to some extent. They are all extremely politically correct even when not woke, have issues that no-one else cares about (such as blaming Jim Carrey of making fun of fat people, kek) or all three.

 

[Pixy]

I didn't know it was stolen from one of the games. So it's barely an original idea, then?

Depends what you consider unoriginality. The alt skins are given no context beyond just appearing when you hold a button down. Being inspired by the chromed-out look and writing a zombie apocalypse story with it is more original than the usual thinking that those are just robot lookalikes; something they'd already done to death in the Archie comics. The Starline, Surge, and Kit characters all have their impetus from texture glitches in the megadrive games, too.

 

[The Lawgiver]

The Starline, Surge, and Kit characters all have their impetus from texture glitches in the megadrive games, too.

Technically the first 2 are royalty free dupes of the archie ones after penders copyrighted all the archie characters including ones he didn't even fucking make lmao. I liked the archie implication of the green sonic being basically what happens if you get blueballs punched mid-going super because it actually pulled various shit from the games (the color glitch and the fact knuckles knocks sonic out of super form) . Think I rambled about this before tarline being a fucking platypus that looks like a duck is fucking goofy his name and him being is like the only thing referencing white knuckles. Maybe it's cause I found the 2 previous white knuckleses that existed in the various comics cooler than the duck with shitty haircut from a design and antics standpoint.

and then there's purple knuckles. I'm pretty sure we already brought up purple knuckles at some point in this thread.

 

[StoneKnightMan]

you guys are talking about the comics? well i wanna bring up a certain topic from archie comics. it's one of the controversies regarding the archie comic series.

but it's not Ken Penders this time. it's Karl Bollers.

it's Archie Comic's Sonic The Hedgehog Issue #134. released on March 2004.

the issue started and went on alright and good. but these three specific pages are what made fans hate this issue. they call this controversy, The Slap.

and they were right to call it that. a slap in the fucking face.

the issue was panned and caused outrage among fans. who all said that sonic and sally had their relationship building up those years before, and their argument and break up from these three pages rendered all of that build up completely pointless. fans even criticised how unlikable sally was and started the sally hatedom. fans even criticized karl bollers for this story, saying that he made them break up all because he didn't like the pairing.

 

[MugolEx]

The Starline, Surge, and Kit characters all have their impetus from texture glitches in the megadrive games, too.

Do you know which ones specifically? I never knew that and I find the interesting and also unsurprising given Ian's ability to pull references across the Sonic franchise even from the most narrow of corners.

 

[The Lawgiver]

you guys are talking about the comics? well i wanna bring up a certain topic from archie comics. it's one of the controversies regarding the archie comic series.

but it's not Ken Penders this time. it's Karl Bollers.

it's Archie Comic's Sonic The Hedgehog Issue #134. released on March 2004.

View attachment 6939387

the issue started and went on alright and good. but these three specific pages are what made fans hate this issue. they call this controversy, The Slap.

and they were right to call it that. a slap in the fucking face.

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the issue was panned and caused outrage among fans. who all said that sonic and sally had their relationship been building up those years before, and their argument and break up from these three pages rendered all of that build up completely pointless. fans even criticised how unlikable sally was and started the sally hatedom. fans even criticized karl bollers for this story, saying that he make them break up all because he didn't like the pairing.

I think an extra factor that added to it was the light hearted cool looking psuedo-manga chibi style they were doing for a bit here. Similar weird tones to how the vivziepop shows have character designs made for dynamic goofy antics and then it's just fucking badly forced melodrama. Homestuck fell to that before those shows technically with act 6 but this comic is an even earlier example of that shit. It eventually rebounded though a little when it went back to fun character interactions and adventure/fighting robotnik type stuff.

Framing sonic as in the wrong for deciding to not give up his whole deal for "safety" is just the cherry on the shit sundae.

Do you know which ones specifically? I never knew that and I find the interesting and also unsurprising given Ian's ability to pull references across the Sonic franchise even from the most narrow of corners.

This wasn't even the first time they were referenced in official licensed sonic materal in terms of glitches.

They're actually pretty well known glitches in terms of video game trivia which makes it surprising to me you didn't hear about them yet. The green sonic is a sonic 2 debug mode glitch involving a waterfall which when triggered turns sonic green and fucks up his shading so the front of his face turns black n some frames. Kids used to treat it like he was a secret character named "ashura" back in the day.

The white knuckles, or "wechidna" glitch is a bugged knuckles from Knuckles chaotix that's listed character name is just a row of star symbols. I apparently forgot he fucking breaks your game worse than missingno if you actually play as him unless you're using an emulator.

 

[MugolEx]

They're actually pretty well known glitches in terms of video game trivia which makes it surprising to me you didn't hear about them yet. The green sonic is a sonic 2 debug mode glitch involving a waterfall which when triggered turns sonic green and fucks up his shading so the front of his face turns black n some frames. Kids used to treat it like he was a secret character named "ashura" back in the day.

That's were I seen it from. I hear green Sonic and I'm thinking of Scourge. I forgot that the "ashura" glitch makes Sonic's face black. I am very disappointed to hear that Ian would just make such a problematic character like Surge in the current year.


And "wechidna" looks a little like Dr. Finitevus baring the red gloves. And I know that Starline is basically Finitevus's spiritual sequel. I notice too that the Knuckles recolor appears slightly flamboyant in design without looking like a massive faggot. Unlike Starline who have those golden finger tips that ugly 30 year old women like to put on men for some reason. Massive downgrade in my opinion.


What about Kit though? Was Tails just blue at some point because of a glitch? I actually don't recall anything looking like Kit due to a glitch.