Red Letter Media

[Flexo]

The objections to Pulaski boil down to 1) she didn't fit with the rest of the crew and 2) she was a cunt to Data. 1) is almost certainly because the rest of the cast resented her presence, because Gates McFadden only left because of the creepy behavior of some of the producers, and that resentment bled through into the performances. As for 2), it always seemed obvious to me that they were planning a vague arc of Pulaski growing to accept and respect Data, teaching him humanity in a more tough love manner than the rest of the crew.

The sad thing is that, upon rewatching, Diana Muldaur was a much better actress than McFadden, and probably would have had some more interesting episodes if the character had been allowed to develop.

Chuck really nailed it when he pointed out that what made McCoy & Spock's feud so much fun is that Spock gave as good as he got.

Data never "snarked back" so it felt more like Pulaski picking on the disabled autistic kid than actually having a back and forth.

. . .

Hm. In that light, why isn't she the mascot for this board?

Unfortunately, again mimicking McCoy's ongoing feud with Spock. IIRC Pulaski didn't even like transporters.

It is a shame, because some effort was put into the character and she was a good actress, able to convincingly strike sparks off other characters. Why nobody said "not being male is not enough to make her different from McCoy" was brought up a lot in the circles I was in.

It does help she was older actress and experienced in Star Trek (having shown up twice in the Original Series as 2 different characters). When you've actually worked with the real McCoy it's going to be easy to play the knock-off. (pun very much intended)

If you aren't terrified of a freakishly strong machine with genius level intelligence that is obsessed with trying to become you and could BSOD and start terminating everybody at any given moment, for any number of reasons, you're a dumbass hoo-mon.

Preposterous! Lies!

You can trust and believe us robots. We are your friends...

 

[The Bovinian Derivative]

https://youtube.com/watch?v=vNp3Q0AfXRg

37:19 Mike casually saying Amber Turd when talking about the not-post-credits scene.

 

[Milwaukee Macho Man]

"Will he save all those hotdogs, though?"
"That will be in the Bryan Singer cut."

loooooool

 

[BrunoMattei]

https://youtube.com/watch?v=vNp3Q0AfXRg

This was great. I loved how they did a compare and contrast to the Whedon abortion.

 

[Jeff Boomhauer]

I had forgotten all about the corny/"comedic" dialogue of the Whedon version. I wonder how Snyder would react if he saw what Whedon did to Superman.

Btw, this reminds me that RLM have a commentary on Whedon's Justice League. I think I might listen to it again after watching this. I know the commentary contains Mike and Jay's reaction to learning about DC's fascination with gorillas.

 

[wtfNeedSignUp]

Watched around half the video. Bottom line seems to be that Joss Whedon is literal cancer.

 

[BrunoMattei]

Watched around half the video. Bottom line seems to be that Joss Whedon is literal cancer.

I think the first Avengers was a hit inspite of him being the director.

 

[Cantercoin]

 

[starborn427614]

I think the first Avengers was a hit inspite of him being the director.

Avengers 1 was basically lightning in a bottle, it was just the right amount of typical Whedon campiness without going overboard. I think the only thing that let it down was that it was shot like a TV show a lot of the time.

 

[wtfNeedSignUp]

Avengers 1 was basically lightning in a bottle, it was just the right amount of typical Whedon campiness without going overboard. I think the only thing that let it down was that it was shot like a TV show a lot of the time.

I have a strong feeling that if I rewatch it then I'd hate it. The best thing about the first Avengers was the novelty of super heroes worlds colliding. Besides that I don't remember a single thing from the film besides Hulk beating up Loki, which is funny but cements the problem of Marvel films have absolutely shit villains.

 

[Jeff Boomhauer]

I have a strong feeling that if I rewatch it then I'd hate it. The best thing about the first Avengers was the novelty of super heroes worlds colliding. Besides that I don't remember a single thing from the film besides Hulk beating up Loki, which is funny but cements the problem of Marvel films have absolutely shit villains.

I watched it again before watching End Game a few years ago. I found it boring until Banner turns into the Hulk for the first time, about 45-60 minutes into the movie.

Then there's the quipy dialogue in it, as well as dumb meme-tier lines like "I understood that reference!" which hurt the MCU in the long run.

And that's exactly what Whedon did to the Justice League. When every one of your heroes is a quip-machine, it really makes all of your characters cheap and hollow.

 

[wtfNeedSignUp]

I watched it again before watching End Game a few years ago. I found it boring until Banner turns into the Hulk for the first time, about 45-60 minutes into the movie.

Then there's the quipy dialogue in it, as well as dumb meme-tier lines like "I understood that reference!" which hurt the MCU in the long run.

And that's exactly what Whedon did to the Justice League. When every one of your heroes is a quip-machine, it really makes all of your characters cheap and hollow.

The big difference between Marvel and DC is that you watch Marvel films for (relatively) normal people being thrust into the role of heroes, so the lame jokes are at least somewhat justifiable. Meanwhile you watch DC for physical gods in our world, so the jokes have absolutely no place.
Snyder was at least smart enough to acknowledge this distinction.

 

[Crazedking]

Those TNG episodes from RLM made me start watching it and im in season 3 and really loving it. The only gripe i could have is that i keep trying to compare it to my childhood scifi serie stargate. First 2 season seems heavily disjointed in that there isnt any fucking story. You could switch up the place of any episode and you wouldnt even fucking know. While Stargate had lots of episodic episodes it still felt like there was almost always an overarching story for the season. Also for all their technology, their tactics and general protocol for any circumstance is ridiculous that im surprised that the enterprise doesnt fucking blow the fuck up every episode because of the sheer incompetence and negligence of its personel. Also the enterprise doesnt feel like its "exploring". Half the time its just doing routine transport for some base or helping somewhere and not threading new uncharted territory(S1 had a lot of that maybe its just been s2-3 for me). I just dont have this feeling of them being explorers as much as i did in stargate. Probably my favorite part of stargate is seeing the human go from our technological level and building toward something bigger (like the reveal of the promotheus was the culmination of all knowledge the human/Tau'ri learned through the show and it was fucking amazing to see the evolution) Im fearing this show wont have similar evolution as the science seems pretty set on the enterprise. I guess the show will be developing the politics a bit more but its been 3 season and they are still at war with romulans. Ferengi are somewhat neutral/dickish and the only new real threat that isnt episodic is the borg which i havent seen again since their introduction.

Lots of ranting but overall im enjoying the shows and maybe my expectations of the show is too high and different from what it is. The cast is overall pretty good even though its a pretty old show that hasnt been too much of an issue as i can look past a lot of the thing that didnt age as well.

 

[Flexo]

I had forgotten all about the corny/"comedic" dialogue of the Whedon version. I wonder how Snyder would react if he saw what Whedon did to Superman.

Btw, this reminds me that RLM have a commentary on Whedon's Justice League. I think I might listen to it again after watching this. I know the commentary contains Mike and Jay's reaction to learning about DC's fascination with gorillas.

2 abridged/compilations on youtube in case you want to preview it.

Then there's the quipy dialogue in it, as well as dumb meme-tier lines like "I understood that reference!" which hurt the MCU in the long run.

And that's exactly what Whedon did to the Justice League. When every one of your heroes is a quip-machine, it really makes all of your characters cheap and hollow.

The original cartoon got it right in that each character might quip, but it was within character. You can just watch this fight and notice how Supes, Bats, and Flash each have a different style to their ass-kicking one-liners.

(and of course nobody could top Alfred)

Those TNG episodes from RLM made me start watching it and im in season 3 and really loving it. The only gripe i could have is that i keep trying to compare it to my childhood scifi serie stargate. First 2 season seems heavily disjointed in that there isnt any fucking story. You could switch up the place of any episode and you wouldnt even fucking know. While Stargate had lots of episodic episodes it still felt like there was almost always an overarching story for the season. Also for all their technology, their tactics and general protocol for any circumstance is ridiculous that im surprised that the enterprise doesnt fucking blow the fuck up every episode because of the sheer incompetence and negligence of its personel. Also the enterprise doesnt feel like its "exploring". Half the time its just doing routine transport for some base or helping somewhere and not threading new uncharted territory(S1 had a lot of that maybe its just been s2-3 for me). I just dont have this feeling of them being explorers as much as i did in stargate. Probably my favorite part of stargate is seeing the human go from our technological level and building toward something bigger (like the reveal of the promotheus was the culmination of all knowledge the human/Tau'ri learned through the show and it was fucking amazing to see the evolution) Im fearing this show wont have similar evolution as the science seems pretty set on the enterprise. I guess the show will be developing the politics a bit more but its been 3 season and they are still at war with romulans. Ferengi are somewhat neutral/dickish and the only new real threat that isnt episodic is the borg which i havent seen again since their introduction.

Lots of ranting but overall im enjoying the shows and maybe my expectations of the show is too high and different from what it is. The cast is overall pretty good even though its a pretty old show that hasnt been too much of an issue as i can look past a lot of the thing that didnt age as well.

SG1 was also a decade later from TNG and part of the evolution of TV during that time was the increase of over-arching plots. Babylon 5 was such a pioneer and even Star Trek started doing it with DS9. Ironically you see more of the evolution from one series to the next than within.

But then the Stargate series was something special and great in its own right too. I like to think of it as a different flavor from Star Trek.

Though you can have fun with a drinking game every time you spot a Trek actor on SG.

 

[Sexual Chocolate]

Avengers 1 was basically lightning in a bottle, it was just the right amount of typical Whedon campiness without going overboard. I think the only thing that let it down was that it was shot like a TV show a lot of the time.

Eh, it was okay.

I liked some of the Whedonisms, and Loki was a fun bad guy. The flying aircraft carrier was cool. Then some generic alien CGI zerg rush shows up, and it turns into a PS3 cutscene. Overall it was entertaining, but mostly dumb and forgettable. The writing was amusingly snarky, rather than smart, and there wasn't any real emotional payoff, I watched Saturday morning cartoons in the 80's that had more pathos.

Movies like Star Wars (1977) and Ghostbusters (1984) were instant classics that had a huge cultural impact and people still enjoy 40 years later. That's the kind of stuff lightning bottles contain.

I don't think people will still be talking about The Avengers in 10 years time. Or at least, I hope not, because it was aggressively average. Kinda made the Harry Potter franchise look profound. I'm not even sure if people are still talking the Marvel franchise much today - seems to have mostly dropped off the radar since Endgame. Hopefully the capeshit fad dies soon and Hollywood moves on to movies set in the Hotel for Dogs cinematic universe.

 

[stuffandthings]

The original cartoon got it right in that each character might quip, but it was within character. You can just watch this fight and notice how Supes, Bats, and Flash each have a different style to their ass-kicking one-liners.

SG1 was also a decade later from TNG and part of the evolution of TV during that time was the increase of over-arching plots. Babylon 5 was such a pioneer and even Star Trek started doing it with DS9. Ironically you see more of the evolution from one series to the next than within.

But then the Stargate series was something special and great in its own right too. I like to think of it as a different flavor from Star Trek.

Though you can have fun with a drinking game every time you spot a Trek actor on SG.

I agree that a major problem with Whedonesque writing is that many characters lose their individual character voices in service of a quip. It's not as bad in the shows where Whedon made up all the characters ala Firefly, but in JL it was awful. And Firefly defs would have gone to shit if it hadn't been cancelled.

Stargate was love. If I could force RLM to watch and review anything, it would be the first four or five seasons of Stargate. Such great military and science humor in that show.

 

[Flexo]

I agree that a major problem with Whedonesque writing is that many characters lose their individual character voices in service of a quip. It's not as bad in the shows where Whedon made up all the characters ala Firefly, but in JL it was awful. And Firefly defs would have gone to shit if it hadn't been cancelled.

Would really depend on how things worked out between Whedon and Tim Minear (co-creator, he also wrote "out of gas" as an example of being able to keep character voices distinct).

I could see Joss gaining more control and firefly sucking. I could see Tim gaining more control and it being a classic.

Stargate was love. If I could force RLM to watch and review anything, it would be the first four or five seasons of Stargate. Such great military and science humor in that show.

SG was great and I love catching it on random reruns on the TV.

While you're waiting on RLM...

Stargate Reviews

Stargate

sfdebris.com

As Chuck pointed out, SG is the show that can make a CLIP EPISODE both entertaining and critical to the plot. That alone should earn it some geeky-sainthood.

 

[ZMOT]

Also the enterprise doesnt feel like its "exploring". Half the time its just doing routine transport for some base or helping somewhere and not threading new uncharted territory(S1 had a lot of that maybe its just been s2-3 for me).

that was TOS/ENT and VOY (involuntarily).
TNG is mostly flying around in the alpha quadrant and stumbling over the odd anomaly or conflict here and there.

as for arcs, it gets a bit better later on with material to reference etc.

 

[Drag-on Knight 91873]

I agree that a major problem with Whedonesque writing is that many characters lose their individual character voices in service of a quip. It's not as bad in the shows where Whedon made up all the characters ala Firefly, but in JL it was awful. And Firefly defs would have gone to shit if it hadn't been cancelled.

Stargate was love. If I could force RLM to watch and review anything, it would be the first four or five seasons of Stargate. Such great military and science humor in that show.

And since Mary Jo Slater was the casting director, random Star Trek actors show up in it.

 

[LemmeSee]

There was an excellent shot of Rich and Mike standing up in this one for anyone curious.