Red Letter Media

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Favorite recurring character? (Select 4)

  • Jack / AIDSMobdy

    Votes: 257 24.0%

  • Josh / the Wizard

    Votes: 77 7.2%

  • Colin (Canadian #1)

    Votes: 460 42.9%

  • Jim (Canadian #2)

    Votes: 230 21.4%

  • Tim

    Votes: 386 36.0%

  • Len Kabasinski

    Votes: 208 19.4%

  • Freddie Williams

    Votes: 274 25.5%

  • Patton Oswalt

    Votes: 27 2.5%

  • Macaulay Culkin

    Votes: 541 50.4%

  • Max Landis

    Votes: 64 6.0%
  • Total voters
    1,073
King Dead said:
I know that "it gets better after [x] episodes" is kind of a meme, along with "the first season of a Trek show is always the worst," but DS9 really does take a little bit to get going. In the first season, they seemed to be having some difficulty with figuring out what they wanted to do with it, so it frequently feels like TNG but with a different cast for a while. I think that's why you see a fair number of episodes of some of the crew getting on a runabout to go explore some Gamma Quadrant world; maybe some executive thought it would be too boring to spend all their time on the station. As time goes on and more serial storylines are introduced, along with a healthy dose of character development, it starts to hit its stride and set itself apart from TNG. It helps that it maintains a healthy balance of serial and episodic storytelling as well, so a lot of episodes are enjoyable on their own even if they're referencing events from earlier episodes.

I'm not saying you should drop everything and marathon DS9 right now (well, maybe), but I can understand why you were having issues with it, especially if you jumped into it straight after TNG. Hell, I'd really understand if you had problems with VOY after TNG.
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Well I got sidetracked on politics ranting, but I'm watching this. The problem is, I heard this when it was pretty new, and I just didn't like the characters or actors. I didn't watch a ton of VOY but I kinda liked them more than DS9.

I remember when Janeway showed up in Nemesis as an Admiral and me and my friend both yelled out NOOO lol. I just don't think I can go back to post TNG trek again except for watching these guys talk about it.
 
mlanguishi said:
Well I got sidetracked on politics ranting, but I'm watching this. The problem is, I heard this when it was pretty new, and I just didn't like the characters or actors. I didn't watch a ton of VOY but I kinda liked them more than DS9.

I remember when Janeway showed up in Nemesis as an Admiral and me and my friend both yelled out NOOO lol. I just don't think I can go back to post TNG trek again except for watching these guys talk about it.
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Again, it's similar to TNG in that regard, where a lot of what people typically like about the characters doesn't show up until after they've had time to develop. The Bashir of season 1 is very different from the Bashir of season 3 or 4, as an example of a character whose early appearance can feel strange or bad to viewers. If nothing else, though, they got the Quark/Odo dynamic down from the start, and it only got better from there.

But hey, if you're tired of Trek, then you're tired of Trek. Up to you if you ever want to give it another go.
 
This reminds me, half way through. There's something about Avery Brooks that puts me off. I just don't like seeing his face. I can't watch American History X cause of that either. It's really not a race thing, there's just something that makes me wanna puke when I look at his face.,
 
I forgot to mention Mike being retarded in a specific way that I've seen elsewhere: thing X happened 10+ years ago in fiction ∴ everyone must have been cool with it.
Idiots online talking about the 1920s, the 1970s, doesn't matter -- they act like rape was legal or some shit just because a lazy writer didn't have a better way to introduce characterization than to make his leading man a horndog. [image related]
police squad fetish.png
It's actually 2 problems, a stupid writer and a stupid audience. There are known lazy writing conventions for women, like pregnancy/miscarriage/rape aka the soap opera triad, but Trek seems to cycle through early episodes/seasons of goofing around with some rando's libido in the same way.
 
Man these guys couldn't look more disinterested in DS9 if they tried. They looked forced to do it or something. That was a brutal slog to get through and I've watched almost all of their vids over the years and I think this was the worst they've done. I doubt I'll watch part 2. At least with Picard and other nutrek they've done they reveled in the badness so it was watchable. This was paint drying boring.
 
mlanguishi said:
Man these guys couldn't look more disinterested in DS9 if they tried. They looked forced to do it or something. That was a brutal slog to get through and I've watched almost all of their vids over the years and I think this was the worst they've done. I doubt I'll watch part 2. At least with Picard and other nutrek they've done they reveled in the badness so it was watchable. This was paint drying boring.
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Everyone kept asking them to after their TNG reviews. Just the difference in enthusiasm is enough to make or break a video like this.
 
Protistology said:
Everyone kept asking them to after their TNG reviews. Just the difference in enthusiasm is enough to make or break a video like this.
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Their mistake is in doing it season by season. Everything that's truly great about DS9 only gets going once the Dominion is introduced. The first couple of seasons aren't bad by any means, but they're mostly just mid-tier TNG episodes with a pricklier set of characters. You do get Odo, Quark, and some Garak, but none of that on its own is enough to show off what's best about the show.
 
Eventually, the only people still watching and discussing RLM's videos within the KF thread will be Christians mentioning Star Trek for the sake of mentioning that they're Christian, and it will contrast even more with RLM's Reddit audience consisting of a bunch of copies of Max Landis wearing masks of Rich, aidsmoby, beardfat, and the canadians.

It will be glorious.
 
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Marc said:
Eventually, the only people still watching and discussing RLM's videos within the KF thread will be exclusively Christians mentioning Star Trek for the sake of mentioning that they're Christian, and it will contrast even more with RLM's Reddit audience consisting of a bunch of copies of Max Landis wearing masks of Rich, aidsmoby, beardfat, and the canadians.

It will be glorious.
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It doesn't take a Christian to see Rich is something of a douchebag when confronted with something outside his comfort zone.
 
King Dead said:
I know that "it gets better after [x] episodes" is kind of a meme, along with "the first season of a Trek show is always the worst," but DS9 really does take a little bit to get going. In the first season, they seemed to be having some difficulty with figuring out what they wanted to do with it, so it frequently feels like TNG but with a different cast for a while. I think that's why you see a fair number of episodes of some of the crew getting on a runabout to go explore some Gamma Quadrant world; maybe some executive thought it would be too boring to spend all their time on the station. As time goes on and more serial storylines are introduced, along with a healthy dose of character development, it starts to hit its stride and set itself apart from TNG. It helps that it maintains a healthy balance of serial and episodic storytelling as well, so a lot of episodes are enjoyable on their own even if they're referencing events from earlier episodes.

I'm not saying you should drop everything and marathon DS9 right now (well, maybe), but I can understand why you were having issues with it, especially if you jumped into it straight after TNG. Hell, I'd really understand if you had problems with VOY after TNG.
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Id argue it goes from alright to great when you hit season 2. Season 4 is just when it goes from great to AWESOME. Its definitely a show that gets better and better when you go back after finishing and realize: oh wow this paid off great.


There's a shit ton of character development that practically makes everyone awesome to some degree
 
Mola Ram said:
Their mistake is in doing it season by season. Everything that's truly great about DS9 only gets going once the Dominion is introduced. The first couple of seasons aren't bad by any means, but they're mostly just mid-tier TNG episodes with a pricklier set of characters. You do get Odo, Quark, and some Garak, but none of that on its own is enough to show off what's best about the show.
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At least in part 2 they will likely have a lot to say about 'Duet'. Mike mentioned season 1 of DS9 had one of his favourite episodes of Star Trek and I am going to assume that will be it. It does feel like just highlighting the better episodes is a better use of time since as you said, early DS9 was pretty average.
 
Gregg Turkington said:
At least in part 2 they will likely have a lot to say about 'Duet'. Mike mentioned season 1 of DS9 had one of his favourite episodes of Star Trek and I am going to assume that will be it. It does feel like just highlighting the better episodes is a better use of time since as you said, early DS9 was pretty average.
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Duet is amazing. And yeah, going through every single episode, even briefly, is an enormous waste of time.
 
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