Red Dead 3/Red Dead Redemption 2 - IT'S HAPPENING.gif

[William Murderface]

I figured that was just an oversight on the part of the writers.

 

[xXx: State of the Union]

And that's what I was getting at earlier. It just feels like Chapter 5 is unfinished. It's like they said, "okay we need the guys to land on Guarma with nothing, save Javier and get involved with a revolution so they have something to do, Dutch needs to be brutal, say John is the rat, Arthur should call Dutch on his needless brutality and then needs to start coughing, and then the boys get off the island. Let's break for lunch." At least do something with the island like make Aguadulces accessible, and Arthur has to go into town and do stuff (find supplies, meet certain people, scout the fort) and avoid roving patrols so he can't actually get into fights.

They could even have a few unique encounters like maybe Arthur stumbles on a local attacking a girl. He could either intervene and gain honor and get a contact that will help them attack the fort or do nothing and lose honor. Or stumble on a different girl and guy, think he's helping her when she's a hooker and that's her john, and she runs to get help from the soldiers. Have a Stranger mission string where he finds a guy who says his brother is a soldier who wants to desert the Cuban Army, Arthur has do stuff like steal some clothes without getting caught, get the clothes to the guy, then get the guy to a small boat. In exchange, the guy gives Arthur a trinket or something.

As it is, it's just a game on rails kind of a level and is unfulfilling and is just filler between the bank job and getting back to America in the same situation you were in before the bank job, except that now Hosea and Lenny are dead and John is in prison.

It's easily the weakest part of the whole game.

I've never been able to decide if they just over extended themselves, but realized that Dan wrote himself into a corner so they *had* to have a Guarma chapter even if it was linear and out of place as fuck, or if the "open world" Guarma was just so boring and out of place that they cut it down.

RDR2 is such a cluster fuck of development. It'd be amazing if someone wrote a book about it once any NDA's are up but I feel like the only person that even could would be Dan Houser at this point.

 

[Bunny Tracks]

I figured that was just an oversight on the part of the writers.

Real talk, that's the problem with Chapter Five. It feels like an oversight. To be specific, it feels like a half-baked Tahiti DLC that accidentally made its way into the game.

Chapter 5 is the primary reason Chapter 6 way too long. You have an entire chapter of pointless nothing, and then you get bombarded by an entire chapter of nonstop important lore, and missions that really feel like they should've happened during the one before.

On top of that, you have these tiny details that while very minor, start to build-up, and become distracting by the end. They end not being that crucial to the plot (most of them), but after all while, it starts to feel like you'd missed something more interesting, and important while you were languishing away in Guarma.

 

[Agarathium1066]

Can we talk about how Dutch strangles an old lady to death for demanding more money, and tries to justify it because of that, and then just doesn't pick up the gold bar that she drops? Or any of the money she has on her? And you can't either for some reason?

No?

Okay.

I was playing an honorable playthrough and still frisked her dead ass for the bar. Its a whole dead bar and she's already dead. She only had a bottle of liquor on her.

I feel like Dutch would've made a better argument by saying that 'We're literally out of money and she was going to turn us in'. I figured she was in the first place. I'm not really sure why they felt THAT was the line where Arthur is suddenly disillusioned. There's so much that Dutch does afterward that would've been more fitting. He could've even tried to leave Javier or tried to side with the island's "Ruler".

Nah, he just chokes out a greedy old woman.

 

[William Murderface]

I don't think seeing Dutch choke out a woman who just pulled a knife on him was Arthur's line in the sand, just that it was yet another example of Dutch doing the stuff he told Arthur to never do and then justifying it.

If there had to be a single point where Arthur said "that's it" it would be when he and Sadie break John out of prison and all Dutch can do is go on and on about how getting John back was going against his plan that nobody knew the details of but Dutch (and maybe Micah).

Even after all of that, when Arthur and Charles go to bust Eagle Flies out of the army fort, Arthur even says, "I guess I just keep thinking there must be a way to save the situation, to pull Dutch out of the place he's in." And when Charles says Rains Fall is in a tough spot Arthur says, "I gotta try." Even though Arthur accepts by that point the gang is over, John and his family have to go to give them a chance at a normal life, and that their whole way of life is done, he still doesn't want to give up on Dutch or the others. But they don't listen and it goes back to what he said on the mountain top after fighting Micah, that John made it, and the others didn't, but that Arthur did try.

 

[Agarathium1066]

I don't think seeing Dutch choke out a woman who just pulled a knife on him was Arthur's line in the sand, just that it was yet another example of Dutch doing the stuff he told Arthur to never do and then justifying it.

I get you I just felt like the entire issue was highly contrived. The woman was already cranky before you even meet her, demands more money and then pulls a knife. I'd have felt the shock and disgust would've been justified if he'd choked her out unprovoked to keep the gold bar. It felt tossed in to try to vilify Dutch when he'd already gotten multiple gang members killed, the remainder with him marooned, and he'd already left John to get captured.

It would've served better as an interesting variant option for Arthur if he's low or high honor personally. Have him suggest or have the option to kill the woman to take the money back. By then if you've done any treasure hunting a single gold bar may not be significant to the player but it might seem a wise choice. Or it might tempt the player to act greedy or shitty to make some sort've point. Instead she's just choked out, Arthur acts pissy, and then we move on.

Yet another part of Guarma that is just 'some shit happens then is immediately left behind'.

 

[PHILLIP BANKS]

the game was fun
played it but was extremely boring
Reaching the main mission and continuing the stories was a pain as the game slows down so fucking much
and i liked the bounty hunting system
and you just wanna click photos but god damn it they where only 6 guys and unlike every rockstar game, there is no complex mission i can play
or was so hard that i got filtered.
Stories are interesting but the other side activities are just too short......its rarely a treat when bandit corner you or when some actual interesting thing goes on which bored me and was very disappointing

i also despise sadie adler, she is a bitch and should have died with her good for nothing in the mountains, that old lady was much of a badass then she will ever. She ruined the game for me

 

[DeadwastePrime]

best mission is the bar mission with lenny hands down

 

[CuzinEd]

I love RDR1 and RDR2. I would rather have more RDR than GTA at this point. It sucks that Rockstar cancelled the RDR1 remake after what happened with those garbage tier remasters of the first 3 games. From what I have heard it isn't a permanent cancellation. They said cancelled for now. I was really looking forward to a RDR1 remake and being able to play the game on PC using the RDR2 engine. RDR1 is still a pretty good looking game. Going from RDR1 to RDR2 or back to RDR1 isn't that much of a shock to the senses.

Actually, it's more likely that we'll see one.. Since the ports of Max Payne 3 and GTA V were good, and Rockstar seems to have gotten that down.

Just don't expect it right away.

This didn't age well. The PC port of RDR2 was pretty rough for like a year or so after they released it. I know because I have had it since release. It was a mess. Not the worst mess of a port ever but still not very good.

I thought Rockstar could do it as well because of what the PC port of GTA V was like. But nope. They dropped the ball with the RDR2 port.

 

[D.Angus]

This didn't age well. The PC port of RDR2 was pretty rough for like a year or so after they released it. I know because I have had it since release. It was a mess. Not the worst mess of a port ever but still not very good.

I was much more optimistic in 2016, keep in mind this is when the everyone good was still at rockstar, and GTA V had not be completely milked to death. A year or so later and GTA V was considered unplayable due to the load times it had before a modder stepped in and literally said that the game was loading everything unoptimized. I think the biggest problem I have with Red Dead 2 is the load times are waaay too long, even on PC with a SSD.

 

[Übertroon]

I've started to dislike Red Dead Redemption II just because of how stupid people on the internet have to make everything in Red Dead Redemption 1 about the prequel. Not everything about the first game has to be about Arthur somehow

 

[Bunny Tracks]

I've started to dislike Red Dead Redemption II just because of how stupid people on the internet have to make everything in Red Dead Redemption 1 about the prequel. Not everything about the first game has to be about Arthur somehow

Arthur fanboys are the worst thing in this entire fandom.

It's nearly impossible to say anything about the first game without them showing up to say that John isn't as cool, or as badass as Arthur is, or retardedly ask why Arthur isn't mentioned in it at all.

 

[Snekposter]

I hated the version they have in it now since it feels like they just shunted in a weird section from a generic uncharted ripoff. You even shoot some weirdass rotary cannon at a fucking Ironclad warship that inexplicably shows up to respond to around a dozen insurrectionists with small arms.

That rotary cannon actually existed IRL, but it was a 37mm that would have barely scratched the paint on a naval vessel of any real size, never mind a steel-hulled warship where at that range the rounds are more likely to bounce than do anything. It would have come in real handy against those rowboats though...

As to the ironclad showing up, I figure Fussar figured out who they were and had called it in just in case before sending word to the USA. He's a rich man, high-ranking in the military, and overall very well-connected, and he could easily pull strings with the Spanish government to get them to send a landing force to deal with the insurrection. Hell, Hercule even calls out during Hell Hath No Fury that it doesn't matter how many men you kill because Fussar has the money to buy more, and throwing a bunch of disposable soldiers at a problem is the sort of thing a tinpot dictator like him does.

best mission is the bar mission with lenny hands down
https://youtube.com/watch?v=P9fNkyem63E

LENNAHY!

 

[Agarathium1066]

That rotary cannon actually existed IRL, but it was a 37mm that would have barely scratched the paint on a naval vessel of any real size, never mind a steel-hulled warship where at that range the rounds are more likely to bounce than do anything. It would have come in real handy against those rowboats though...
View attachment 4532061
As to the ironclad showing up, I figure Fussar figured out who they were and had called it in just in case before sending word to the USA. He's a rich man, high-ranking in the military, and overall very well-connected, and he could easily pull strings with the Spanish government to get them to send a landing force to deal with the insurrection. Hell, Hercule even calls out during Hell Hath No Fury that it doesn't matter how many men you kill because Fussar has the money to buy more, and throwing a bunch of disposable soldiers at a problem is the sort of thing a tinpot dictator like him does.

Mildly surprised to hear that rotary cannon existed but I knew it was being oversold given the size of each barrel. The entire sequence just felt strange and unneeded. Context and alleged wealth be damned a small portion of the gang wiping out dozens upon dozens of hired mercenaries feels like something they'd be able to manage once as the climax. It makes running from the Pinkertons seem so strange once you're back to it. Maybe if there were more resistance fighters and build up to the chapter I would've felt differently.

Arthur fanboys are the worst thing in this entire fandom.

It's nearly impossible to say anything about the first game without them showing up to say that John isn't as cool, or as badass as Arthur is, or retardedly ask why Arthur isn't mentioned in it at all.

I still think John is a better man than Arthur in just about every regard. He actually managed to learn from all the sacrifices, actually got some hard lessons through his skull and went to hell and back for his family. They're both interesting protagonists and I like them a lot but Arthur felt like he was a story showing what happens if you don't wise up and change until its way too late.

 

[Snekposter]

Mildly surprised to hear that rotary cannon existed but I knew it was being oversold given the size of each barrel. The entire sequence just felt strange and unneeded. Context and alleged wealth be damned a small portion of the gang wiping out dozens upon dozens of hired mercenaries feels like something they'd be able to manage once as the climax. It makes running from the Pinkertons seem so strange once you're back to it. Maybe if there were more resistance fighters and build up to the chapter I would've felt differently.

They actually did some research into the guns. Granted not a lot, but some. Sadly they went with stuff like the Mauser and FN Model 1899 because everyone knows about those or can guess instead of some of the stuff that you'd be more likely to find in the USA, especially in the 1907 map. I guess a quasi-1911 would be too out there for a Wild West setting though, either in its .38 ACP or .45 ACP form.

I still think John is a better man than Arthur in just about every regard. He actually managed to learn from all the sacrifices, actually got some hard lessons through his skull and went to hell and back for his family. They're both interesting protagonists and I like them a lot but Arthur felt like he was a story showing what happens if you don't wise up and change until its way too late.

I mean, you should feel that way about Arthur's story because that's exactly its about. Or did you think Arthur's words of "John made it" weren't about John escaping from the gang life like Arthur insisted he try and do ever since the start of the game? A Short Walk in a Pretty Town outright has Arthur telling John to take his family and his family and get. Hell, you can already see some of the creeping dissatisfaction with Dutch from Arthur there, too. "Once, I was the prize pony, just like you are. Now I'm the workhorse." While there's a lot of inconsistencies and holes, the game is remarkably consistent on its overall message.

 

[Bunny Tracks]

I still think John is a better man than Arthur in just about every regard. He actually managed to learn from all the sacrifices, actually got some hard lessons through his skull and went to hell and back for his family. They're both interesting protagonists and I like them a lot but Arthur felt like he was a story showing what happens if you don't wise up and change until its way too late.

I like both, too. My only problem is that they watered down John, and gave all his best traits to Arthur in RDR2. I get it's a prequel, and John's still young, and stuff, but it feels like they weren't confidant enough in Arthur to have an unnerfed John around.

I do like John better, though. I think he's wittier, funnier, has a better story, and does more impressive feats than Arthur does. Not to mention his sheer determination really resonates with me.

 

[Mega Black]

It just feels like Chapter 5 is unfinished.

This has been pretty well known for a while. Tons of code and assets linger in the files that point to Guarma being a fully explorable location you would have been able to interact with like anywhere else but it wound up cut for lord knows what reason.

 

[Agarathium1066]

I mean, you should feel that way about Arthur's story because that's exactly its about. Or did you think Arthur's words of "John made it" weren't about John escaping from the gang life like Arthur insisted he try and do ever since the start of the game?

Its the intended message but as mentioned a lot of people seemed to have completely missed it or think Arthur was right and John was a big ol' fink.

 

[TVB]

I've started to dislike Red Dead Redemption II just because of how stupid people on the internet have to make everything in Red Dead Redemption 1 about the prequel. Not everything about the first game has to be about Arthur somehow

The only positive thing I can say about RDR II in this day and age is the original score. It's the best the game has to offer nowadays. It's one of those games that was highly praised when it came out and then months later (and even to this day), it's been forgotten, and that's actually for a good reason. It's just not a good game at all.

 

[Bunny Tracks]

The only positive thing I can say about RDR II in this day and age is the original score. It's the best the game has to offer nowadays. It's one of those games that was highly praised when it came out and then months later (and even to this day), it's been forgotten, and that's actually for a good reason. It's just not a good game at all.

I disagree with it not being a good game. I think it's a great game.

The problems are the continuity snarls it causes with the first one, and the fact the devs were so focused on making an "immersive", interactive movie, they sacrificed the gameplay.