Retarded Weeb
kiwifarms.net
- Joined
- Dec 17, 2022
I decided to really dig deep into things and compare each version counterpart in the Kanto games. I'm judging them mainly on how useful they are in taking through the main story, but I decided to also look some into their competitive viability.
Red vs. Green/Blue
Each version has 11 exclusive Pokemon, or 6 exclusive evo lines each. Going through them in about the order you encounter them in.
Ekans > Arbok vs. Sandshrew > Sandslash
Can both be caught on Route 4 at the earliest, and will evolve at level 22.
This one is really easy, the answer is Sandslash. 100 Attack and Ground-typing are pretty good. Level up movepool is bad with its best attack being Slash at level 17, but bad level up movepools are the norm in Gen 1. You can easily teach it Dig and later Earthquake by TM, plus possible Rock Slide, Submission, and Body Slam for coverage. Nidoking and Nidoqueen are the more optimal choices for a Ground-type, but Sandslash is probably your next best option, and you get early enough to counter Lt. Surge too.
Meanwhile, Arbok has an okay 85 Attack and 80 Speed, which it's going to use to do what exactly? Poison-type kind of sucks, and its best STAB move is Acid, which only has 40 BP and it doesn't learn until fucking level 47. It can learn Dig, Earthquake, Rock Slide, and Body Slam via TM, but Sandslash would do it better outside of being slower and lower crit rate. Overall, Arbok is kind of bad.
Even as far as competitive goes, both are bottom tier but Sandslash can be an okay set-up sweeper, while Arbok's only niche is having Glare which can paralyze Ground-types.
Point for Green/Blue
Oddish > Gloom > Vileplume vs. Bellsprout > Weepinbell > Victreebel
Both can caught on Route 24 at the earliest, and will evolve at 21 and then again by Leaf Stone (can be bought at Celadon City).
They're both Grass/Poison and are pretty similar stat-wise, both with 100 Special. Vileplume is slightly more physically bulky, but Victreebel is a little faster (50 vs. 70) which is especially important in Gen 1 where Speed decides crit rate. Both are stuck waiting until level 38 before you can evolve them if you want their best STAB move, with said move being Petal Dance for Gloom, and Razor Leaf for Weepinbell. The latter is way better, especially factoring in the high crit rate shenanigans in Gen 1, so Victreebel is just clearly a better Grass attacker than Vileplume. As far as anything else goes, they both learn Powder moves and their TM list is the exact same.
Even competitively, Victreebel is considered a lot more viable than Vileplume.
Point for Green/Blue
Mankey > Primeape vs. Meowth > Persian
Both can be caught on Route 5 at the earliest, and will evolve at level 28.
Stat-wise, their bulk is almost the exact same. Primeape is stronger with 105 Attack, and it has a respectable 95 Speed. Persian is quite weaker at only 70 Attack, but it's got a good 115 Speed.
Primeape isn't too bad of a choice. Note that Mankey learns Low Kick in Yellow only; in the context of RGB, it only learns Normal attacks by level up. But you can teach it Submission by TM once you reach Celadon, plus it gets access to stuff like Dig, Rock Slide, and Body Slam. Also strangely can learn Thunderbolt and Thunder by TM, which probably isn't that useful off 60 Special, it's there. The biggest issue with Primeape is that Fighting kind of sucked in Gen 1, what with how strong Psychic-types are, the lack of Steel-types in need of a counter for, and the lack of any Fighting attacks better than Submission. So Primeape's type doesn't really do much for it. It might even prefer to just be a Normal-type like Persian.
Persian's also not a bad choice, though it's got some iffyness in how late it learns its best attack. The main draw of Persian is that its high Speed means Slash has an almost guaranteed crit rate on it, so add in STAB and Slash is basically a 210 BP move with no real drawback. Amazing in a competitive context, but unfortunately for in-game, Persian doesn't learn Slash until level 51 when the game is almost over. If you keep it as a Meowth longer, it can learn it at level 44, but that's still painful in its own way. You can at least teach it something like Body Slam or Double-Edge to hold you over. It can also learn Bubble Beam and Thunderbolt by TM, which off 65 Special isn't much, but it's there. And it has the niche of Pay Day as a way to grind money, if you really want to.
Persian is clearly way better for competitive, but it's not so clear for in-game. Persian has better payoff, but Primeape will have better damage for a greater portion of the game and its base crit rate isn't that much lower. Although, Persian can at least be more useful against Sabrina.
This is a tough one. I'm gonna have end this one on a tie.
Growlithe > Arcanine vs. Vulpix > Ninetales
Both are Fire-types that can be caught on Route 8, and can evolve by Fire Stone - purchasable at Celadon City almost immediately after catching it.
Stat-wise, Ninetales wins with 100 Special and Speed, vs. Arcanine's 80 Special and 95 Speed. Arcanine is a little bulkier, but that doesn't matter that much for beating up in-game opponents, and it has 110 Attack but it can't make that much use of it outside of Dig and Normal attacks like Body Slam. Their TM list is the exact same except for Arcanine getting Dragon Rage, which doesn't really matter. Both are required to hold off on evolving to learn their strongest 100% accurate STAB, Flamethrower, but Vulpix learns it at level 35 while Growlithe not until level 50. The only other notable differences in their level up moves is that Growlith gets Agility and Vulpix gets Confuse Ray, which eh.
Competitively it seems some people like Arcanine more because it can spam stronger Body Slams and use Agility to boost, which kind of makes sense since Fire attacks aren't that great in the Gen 1 metagame. But it looks like right now, Smogon has Arcanine has NU and Ninetales in UU, so what do you know. In-game, you'll probably be catching either one to spam Fire attacks, and Ninetales just does that better, so it's really the better choice.
Point for Green/Blue
Scyther vs. Pinsir
Both can obtained either at the Game Corner or at the Safari Zone. Notably, Scyther in Red takes 5,500 coins, while Pinsir in Blue takes 2,500 coins.
Really, both are pretty iffy Pokemon for your in-game team since you need to either grind coins or mess with Safari Zone mechanics to get one, at mid-game when you have a lot of other options to add to your team, and the payoff isn't great. Bug really sucks in Gen 1. Scyther and Pinsir straight up get no STAB moves here. Yes, none. Well Yellow gave Scyther Wing Attack for its Flying STAB, that's 35 BP and it learns it level 50, so lol.
Pinsir is stronger and bulkier, with a whopping 125 Attack and 100 Defense, vs. Scyther's still respectable 110 Attack and 80 Defense. Scyther is faster and crits more with 105 Speed, vs. Pinsir's 85 Speed. As far as moves go, they both need to rely on Normal attacks, with Scyther's bread-and-butter being Slash for the same reason as Persian (bit lower crit rate through, about 82%), which it learns at level 29. With Pinsir you're gonna being using Body Slam, Double-Edge, or Submission.
Competitively, people are often drawn more to Pinsir for the allure of setting up with Swords Dance to sweep with its massive Attack stat, but in the end both are considered bottom-tier Pokemon.
Neither is really a great in-game party member, but I'm going to go with Scyther as slightly better since it maybe dodge some Ground attacks, and its main attack is learned by level up unlike Pinsir needing to fight others for TMs.
Point for Red
Electabuzz vs. Magmar
This one's a bit different, as they're entirely different types and found in different areas, though both are fairly late-game. They have similar stat spreads and TM movepools, but not identical.
Both have an okay 85 Special for their STAB attacks, and their bulk is the exact same. Magmar's 95 Attack makes it slightly stronger at physical coverage vs. Electabuzz's 83 Attack, but Electabuzz's 105 Speed makes it slightly faster vs. Magmar's 93 Speed.
Electabuzz is found in the Power Plant at level 33~36 and comes with Thunder Shock. You can wait until 42 to learn Thunder Punch, or just use your Thunderbolt TM if you saved it, which given the lack of physical/special is just plain better. For coverage TMs, it can learn the major Normal moves, Submission, and Psychic. Also gets Thunder Wave, of course.
Magmar is found in the Pokemon Mansion, which is pretty late in the game, at level 34~38 with Ember learned, with Fire Punch at level 43 and Flamethrower at level 55. Has the same coverage TMs as Electabuzz.
Honestly, both seem like poor choices for in-game. If you want an Electric-type on your team then you probably have a Raichu or Jolteon already, and if you are waiting until the Power Plant to catch one then you probably want Zapdos unless you have some self-imposed rule against using legendaries. But... at least you can teach it Thunderbolt right away and is available is little earlier. Magmar needs to wait to learn anything better than Ember, even as far as TMs go you have to beat Blaine for Fire Blast. And why are you catching a Fire-type so late in the game? None of the remaining major opponents are even weak to Fire except for some of Lorelei's team.
Competitively, Electabuzz is also better there too since a fast Electric-type is inherently better in that metagame than a Fire-type.
Point to Red
End result: Green/Blue wins 3 to 2. While that seems close to even, Blue's better counterparts are early-game Pokemon you're more likely to add on your team than the mid- to late-game ones that Red has better, and while I tied Primeape and Persian basd on in-game usefulness, Persian is way better in competitive or Stadium, so I think this is actually kind of a blow-out for Blue.
Each version has 11 exclusive Pokemon, or 6 exclusive evo lines each. Going through them in about the order you encounter them in.
Ekans > Arbok vs. Sandshrew > Sandslash
Can both be caught on Route 4 at the earliest, and will evolve at level 22.
This one is really easy, the answer is Sandslash. 100 Attack and Ground-typing are pretty good. Level up movepool is bad with its best attack being Slash at level 17, but bad level up movepools are the norm in Gen 1. You can easily teach it Dig and later Earthquake by TM, plus possible Rock Slide, Submission, and Body Slam for coverage. Nidoking and Nidoqueen are the more optimal choices for a Ground-type, but Sandslash is probably your next best option, and you get early enough to counter Lt. Surge too.
Meanwhile, Arbok has an okay 85 Attack and 80 Speed, which it's going to use to do what exactly? Poison-type kind of sucks, and its best STAB move is Acid, which only has 40 BP and it doesn't learn until fucking level 47. It can learn Dig, Earthquake, Rock Slide, and Body Slam via TM, but Sandslash would do it better outside of being slower and lower crit rate. Overall, Arbok is kind of bad.
Even as far as competitive goes, both are bottom tier but Sandslash can be an okay set-up sweeper, while Arbok's only niche is having Glare which can paralyze Ground-types.
Point for Green/Blue
Oddish > Gloom > Vileplume vs. Bellsprout > Weepinbell > Victreebel
Both can caught on Route 24 at the earliest, and will evolve at 21 and then again by Leaf Stone (can be bought at Celadon City).
They're both Grass/Poison and are pretty similar stat-wise, both with 100 Special. Vileplume is slightly more physically bulky, but Victreebel is a little faster (50 vs. 70) which is especially important in Gen 1 where Speed decides crit rate. Both are stuck waiting until level 38 before you can evolve them if you want their best STAB move, with said move being Petal Dance for Gloom, and Razor Leaf for Weepinbell. The latter is way better, especially factoring in the high crit rate shenanigans in Gen 1, so Victreebel is just clearly a better Grass attacker than Vileplume. As far as anything else goes, they both learn Powder moves and their TM list is the exact same.
Even competitively, Victreebel is considered a lot more viable than Vileplume.
Point for Green/Blue
Mankey > Primeape vs. Meowth > Persian
Both can be caught on Route 5 at the earliest, and will evolve at level 28.
Stat-wise, their bulk is almost the exact same. Primeape is stronger with 105 Attack, and it has a respectable 95 Speed. Persian is quite weaker at only 70 Attack, but it's got a good 115 Speed.
Primeape isn't too bad of a choice. Note that Mankey learns Low Kick in Yellow only; in the context of RGB, it only learns Normal attacks by level up. But you can teach it Submission by TM once you reach Celadon, plus it gets access to stuff like Dig, Rock Slide, and Body Slam. Also strangely can learn Thunderbolt and Thunder by TM, which probably isn't that useful off 60 Special, it's there. The biggest issue with Primeape is that Fighting kind of sucked in Gen 1, what with how strong Psychic-types are, the lack of Steel-types in need of a counter for, and the lack of any Fighting attacks better than Submission. So Primeape's type doesn't really do much for it. It might even prefer to just be a Normal-type like Persian.
Persian's also not a bad choice, though it's got some iffyness in how late it learns its best attack. The main draw of Persian is that its high Speed means Slash has an almost guaranteed crit rate on it, so add in STAB and Slash is basically a 210 BP move with no real drawback. Amazing in a competitive context, but unfortunately for in-game, Persian doesn't learn Slash until level 51 when the game is almost over. If you keep it as a Meowth longer, it can learn it at level 44, but that's still painful in its own way. You can at least teach it something like Body Slam or Double-Edge to hold you over. It can also learn Bubble Beam and Thunderbolt by TM, which off 65 Special isn't much, but it's there. And it has the niche of Pay Day as a way to grind money, if you really want to.
Persian is clearly way better for competitive, but it's not so clear for in-game. Persian has better payoff, but Primeape will have better damage for a greater portion of the game and its base crit rate isn't that much lower. Although, Persian can at least be more useful against Sabrina.
This is a tough one. I'm gonna have end this one on a tie.
Growlithe > Arcanine vs. Vulpix > Ninetales
Both are Fire-types that can be caught on Route 8, and can evolve by Fire Stone - purchasable at Celadon City almost immediately after catching it.
Stat-wise, Ninetales wins with 100 Special and Speed, vs. Arcanine's 80 Special and 95 Speed. Arcanine is a little bulkier, but that doesn't matter that much for beating up in-game opponents, and it has 110 Attack but it can't make that much use of it outside of Dig and Normal attacks like Body Slam. Their TM list is the exact same except for Arcanine getting Dragon Rage, which doesn't really matter. Both are required to hold off on evolving to learn their strongest 100% accurate STAB, Flamethrower, but Vulpix learns it at level 35 while Growlithe not until level 50. The only other notable differences in their level up moves is that Growlith gets Agility and Vulpix gets Confuse Ray, which eh.
Competitively it seems some people like Arcanine more because it can spam stronger Body Slams and use Agility to boost, which kind of makes sense since Fire attacks aren't that great in the Gen 1 metagame. But it looks like right now, Smogon has Arcanine has NU and Ninetales in UU, so what do you know. In-game, you'll probably be catching either one to spam Fire attacks, and Ninetales just does that better, so it's really the better choice.
Point for Green/Blue
Scyther vs. Pinsir
Both can obtained either at the Game Corner or at the Safari Zone. Notably, Scyther in Red takes 5,500 coins, while Pinsir in Blue takes 2,500 coins.
Really, both are pretty iffy Pokemon for your in-game team since you need to either grind coins or mess with Safari Zone mechanics to get one, at mid-game when you have a lot of other options to add to your team, and the payoff isn't great. Bug really sucks in Gen 1. Scyther and Pinsir straight up get no STAB moves here. Yes, none. Well Yellow gave Scyther Wing Attack for its Flying STAB, that's 35 BP and it learns it level 50, so lol.
Pinsir is stronger and bulkier, with a whopping 125 Attack and 100 Defense, vs. Scyther's still respectable 110 Attack and 80 Defense. Scyther is faster and crits more with 105 Speed, vs. Pinsir's 85 Speed. As far as moves go, they both need to rely on Normal attacks, with Scyther's bread-and-butter being Slash for the same reason as Persian (bit lower crit rate through, about 82%), which it learns at level 29. With Pinsir you're gonna being using Body Slam, Double-Edge, or Submission.
Competitively, people are often drawn more to Pinsir for the allure of setting up with Swords Dance to sweep with its massive Attack stat, but in the end both are considered bottom-tier Pokemon.
Neither is really a great in-game party member, but I'm going to go with Scyther as slightly better since it maybe dodge some Ground attacks, and its main attack is learned by level up unlike Pinsir needing to fight others for TMs.
Point for Red
Electabuzz vs. Magmar
This one's a bit different, as they're entirely different types and found in different areas, though both are fairly late-game. They have similar stat spreads and TM movepools, but not identical.
Both have an okay 85 Special for their STAB attacks, and their bulk is the exact same. Magmar's 95 Attack makes it slightly stronger at physical coverage vs. Electabuzz's 83 Attack, but Electabuzz's 105 Speed makes it slightly faster vs. Magmar's 93 Speed.
Electabuzz is found in the Power Plant at level 33~36 and comes with Thunder Shock. You can wait until 42 to learn Thunder Punch, or just use your Thunderbolt TM if you saved it, which given the lack of physical/special is just plain better. For coverage TMs, it can learn the major Normal moves, Submission, and Psychic. Also gets Thunder Wave, of course.
Magmar is found in the Pokemon Mansion, which is pretty late in the game, at level 34~38 with Ember learned, with Fire Punch at level 43 and Flamethrower at level 55. Has the same coverage TMs as Electabuzz.
Honestly, both seem like poor choices for in-game. If you want an Electric-type on your team then you probably have a Raichu or Jolteon already, and if you are waiting until the Power Plant to catch one then you probably want Zapdos unless you have some self-imposed rule against using legendaries. But... at least you can teach it Thunderbolt right away and is available is little earlier. Magmar needs to wait to learn anything better than Ember, even as far as TMs go you have to beat Blaine for Fire Blast. And why are you catching a Fire-type so late in the game? None of the remaining major opponents are even weak to Fire except for some of Lorelei's team.
Competitively, Electabuzz is also better there too since a fast Electric-type is inherently better in that metagame than a Fire-type.
Point to Red
End result: Green/Blue wins 3 to 2. While that seems close to even, Blue's better counterparts are early-game Pokemon you're more likely to add on your team than the mid- to late-game ones that Red has better, and while I tied Primeape and Persian basd on in-game usefulness, Persian is way better in competitive or Stadium, so I think this is actually kind of a blow-out for Blue.
FireRed vs. LeafGreen
Each version has 13 exclusive Pokemon, or 7 exclusive evo lines during the main story. Each version gets 9 or 10 more exclusive Gen 2/3 Pokemon during the post-game, for a total of 22 in FireRed and 23 in LeafGreen. Counting them by number of fully evolved Pokemon, each version gets 13 exclusives. For the post-game Pokemon, I'm just going to judge them by potential competitive use, since there's very little chance you're actually using them on your in-game team in any real capacity.
Ekans > Arbok vs. Sandshrew > Sandslash
Again, found on Route 4 at the earliest. Nothing seriously changes with this match up, Sandslash is still way better. Similar to Gen 1, Sandslash doesn't get any Ground attacks by level up (well, Sand Tomb at level 52, but that sucks) and has Slash at level 24 as its best level up move, but it gets a good amount of TMs. Dig is nerfed this Gen, but will make do until you get Earthquake before Victory Road, and for coverage you can teach it Rock Tomb, Brick Break, Aerial Ace, or Return (will probably fight with others over that one).
Arbok is still bad. Again, pure Poison-type isn't that useful, and its best STAB move is Acid, at least learned at level 38 now. At least it gets Bite at level 13. Hypothetically it can learn Sludge Bomb, which would be helpful, but the TM for it isn't until very late into post-game, so it's effectively off the table. Other than that, it can learn Dig, Earthquake, Return, and... Giga Drain?
Abilities were added this generation, and Arbok at least wins out there with Intimidate, but it's just not going to offer as much in killing opponents as Sandslash. I feel Sandslash's in-game movepool was kind of nerfed this gen, but it's still better overall. Arbok is also still worse competitively, with Sandshrew at least being an okay Sword Dancer, while Arbok is bottom tier.
Point for LeafGreen
Oddish > Gloom > Vileplume / (Bellossom) vs. Bellsprout > Weepinbell > Victreebel
Still found on Route 24 at the earliest as a potential Grass option right before Misty.
Not a whole lot changes here. The Special split means Vileplume is a bit bulkier specially, but that doesn't matter much. Both get Chlorophyll as their ability, which doesn't matter in-game. They're both still stuck needing to wait until the early 40s before you can use a Leaf Stone on them if you want Petal Dance or Razor Leaf, though the latter isn't as useful now without the Gen 1 crit mechanics. They're otherwise stuck with 60 BP Giga Drain. They only have Acid as their best Poison STAB, with Sludge Bomb locked off as said above. There's really not much else for them to do besides status moves.
They're both pretty mediocre as an in-game party member this Gen. Vileplume is a bit bulkier, while Victreebel is a bit faster, that's about it. They're also pretty close competitively, just varied by being a defensive Pokemon vs. a mediocre attacker, but it looks like Vileplume is a tier higher.
I'm just gonna say this one is a tie.
As for Bellossom, it's a low-tier Pokemon and generally considered the worst of these three, so I'm gonna say the possibility of being obtain one in FireRed's post-game doesn't affect things much.
Growlithe > Arcanine vs. Vulpix > Ninetales
Still found on Route 8, just before you reach Celadon City.
Both get Flash Fire as an ability, but Arcanine also gets Intimidate, which is quite nice. Arcanine also comes out the winner in the Special split, its 80 Special becoming its Sp. Defense, while it now has a nice 100 Sp. Attack. Meanwhile, Ninetale's 100 Special became its Sp. Defense, while it's Sp. Attack dropped to 81. Their special bulk remained the same, but their offensives effectively flipped.
So things are mostly now in Arcanine's favor, although Vulpix still gets the earlier Flamethrower, now at only level 29, while Growlithe needs to wait until level 49 (though it does learn Flame Wheel as a stop gap at level 31). You can now get Flamethrower as a TM in this Gen though, if you're willing to grind 4,000 coins at the Game Corner.
For coverage, they both get Normal moves, Dig, and Iron Tail, though Arcanine will be able use them better with its much higher Attack, as well as it getting Aerial Ace. It also gets Extreme Speed at level 49, which is late but arguably more neat than the status moves (Confuse Ray and Will-O-Whisp) Vulpix gets at lower levels.
Both are okay competitively, with Ninetales having status utility with decent power, while Arcanine is more popular with its raw power and Doubles utility.
Overall, I think these two are actually pretty close, with Ninetale's earlier access to Flamethrower without needing to grind the Game Corner for a TM as a pretty compelling reason to prefer Ninetales, but I think Arcanine has a bit more going on to edge things out for most people.
Point for FireRed
Scyther > (Scizor) vs. Pinsir
The methods of obtaining them are still the same as Gen 1. Immediate changes of note going into this Gen is that both are little more specially bulky due to the split, and both get abilities that don't matter that much: Swarm vs. Hyper Cutter.
Pinsir in this Gen still doesn't any Bug attacks to use its STAB with. It's still stuck using Normal and Fighting attacks like Brick Break, Submission, and Strength. Could also give it Dig, Earthquake, or Rock Tomb.
Though Scyther isn't much better, with just Fury Cutter at level 46, which is eeeeh... It does now get a somewhat usable Flying STAB, with 60 BP Wing Attack at level 26 or Aerial Ace by TM. For coverage you've got Normal moves like Slash, some weak stuff like Pursuit, and the okay Steel Wing.
If Scyther had Technician this Gen then I think it would clearly win, but without it, both choices here are really mediocre. I think Pinsir might win by a little if you're willing to use your Earthquake TM on it... But I guess we can consider that FireRed in the post-game can evolve Scyther into Scizor (if you've got someone to trade with) which is clearly the best of the three even without Technician yet. But I'm trying to judge more off of in-game use, and you can also get Pinsir a little easier (less coin cost at the Game Corner).
Point for LeafGreen
Psyduck > Golduck vs. Slowpoke > Slowbro / (Slowking)
Now treated as exclusives here when they weren't in Gen 1. Both are Water-types that evolve once, through Psyduck at level 33 and Slowpoke at level 37. They can be fished up in a variety of cities and routes once you get the Super Rod on Route 12. They can be caught as high as level 35, so that makes them quick to evolve.
Stat-wise, Slowbro wins. Golduck is just mediocre across the board with around 80 to 85 in everything except 95 Special Attack, while Slowbro gets 100 Special Attack and 110 Defense at the cost of only 30 Speed. Neither have particularly notable abilities, but Slowbro's Oblivous is probably the most likely to sometimes come in handy during in-game fights.
As far as moves go, both can learn Surf and Ice Beam (and Blizzard). Golduck can make a little more use of physical attacks like Brick Break and Aerial Ace, though only Slowbro can learn Shadow Ball and Earthquake (if you have no one better to give that to?). Slowbro of course is also part Psychic-type, and can learn Psychic either by TM or at level 44, and starts with Confusion as a stop gap until then. It can also weirdly learn Flamethrower or Fire Blast by TM.
I don't think I need to explain that Slowbro is just better here, in basically every way except for Speed (which even then is something Golduck is just average at). Golduck is just extremely mediocre as an in-game team member
Golduck does seem to have some use competitively as an anti-weather team attacker using its Cloud Nine ability, but Slowbro would generally be considered "better" at its own role as a more defensive Pokemon. Slowking is just Slowbro with its Defense stats swapped, it's not that different (though Slowbro is generally considered a little better).
Point to LeafGreen
Shellder > Cloyster vs. Staryu > Starmie
Another set of counterparts that weren't exclusive in Gen 1. They're both Water-types that evolve by Water Stone and can be fished up in Pallet Town, Vermilion City, or Cinnabar Island once you have the Super Rod.
Cloyster does not have Skill Link yet, so we've got Shell Armor making it immune to crits vs. Starmie's Natural Cure letting it recover from status effects by switching out.
Cloyster's main thing stat-wise is its massive 180 Defense, but being bulky isn't that important for in-game. It has 95 Attack vs. Starmie's 75, but not really much physical attacks in this Gen to make use of it. Starmie's stats are basically just better, with 100 Special Attack and 115 Speed, vs. Cloyster's 85 Special Attack and 70 Speed.
Neither's level up movepool matter that much. As far as TMs go, they both get Surf and Ice Beam/Blizzard, though obviously Cloyster gets STAB on the latter. But Cloyster doesn't really get anything else outside Water and Ice attacks. Meanwhile, Starmie gets STAB Psychic and Thunderbolt or Thunder.
Yeah, Starmie is really just better in this context. In fact, Starmie has the stats and moves to generally be a really solid in-game team member in any game it's in.
Point to LeafGreen
(Elekid) > Electabuzz vs. (Magby) > Magmar
What's different? Well their 85 Special is now their Sp. Def, with Electabuzz getting 95 Sp. Atk and Magmar getting 100 Sp. Atk. So they hit a little harder now. They got similar abilities, Static vs. Flame Body. Electabuzz is still found at the Power Plant, but Magmar is now found even later, at Mt. Ember, which isn't until after beating Blaine. They both practically start with their Punch move now, and Magmar gets Flamethrower after only a couple level ups. They've got similar coverage options with Normal attacks, Brick Break, and Psychic.
Overall, I'm gonna say Electabuzz is still better for the same reasons, especially with Magmar now being even later. Electabuzz also has a better niche competitively.
Point to FireRed
Post-Game Lines
Wooper > Quagsire vs. Azurill > Marill > Azumarill
Can both be found by surfing in Four Island, Icefall Cave, and Ruin Valley in their respective versions. Both are pretty neat Water-types competitively, but Quagsire has a much bigger use with its Water/Ground-typing and defensive uses. Azumarill has Huge Power, but suffers from this being before the physical/special split and before Fairy-type.
Point for FireRed
Murkrow vs. Misdreavus
Can be found in Lost Cave on Five Island. This clearly goes to Misdreavus. Neither Pokemon is amazing, but Misdreavus is at least a decent defensive Ghost-type in UU, while Murkrow struggles to do much outside of very low tiers.
Point vs LeafGreen
Qwilfish vs. Remoraid > Octillery
Can be fished up with the Super Rod in many of the post-game Sevii Island areas. Qwilfish seems to be the better one here, which surprises me a little since it feels like such a nothing Pokemon, but apparently it has some use on rain teams in higher tiers, whereas Octillery despite having really good coverage and high attacking stats is too slow and frail to do much with it before getting KO'd except at bottom tiers.
Point to FireRed
Delibird vs. Sneasel
Both Ice-types found in Icefall Cave. The answer is obviously Sneasel. Neither Pokemon are good competitively, but Sneasel at least has some offensive presence and can roll in RU. Delibird is one of the worst Pokemon in the game. Here's a little fact: Sneasel literally has higher stats than Delibird in every way except Special Attack (which is still a pitiful 65, and that's Delibird's best attacking stat).
Point to LeafGreen
Skarmory vs. Mantine
Are actually found in different parts of Seven Island, either in Sevault Canyon or Tanoby Ruins respectively. But they're keeping their counterpart relation from Gold/Silver.
Skarmory is considered one of the most dominant defensive Pokemon in Gen 3 competitive, while Mantine is a mediocre wall who hangs out in mid-tiers.
Point for FireRed
End result: If we're looking at just main story Pokemon; LeafGreen wins 4 to 2. If we're including the post-game Pokemon; LeafGreen wins 6 to 5.
Green wins this once again, though despite the point difference being bigger, I feel like it's actually a closer match in practice since the early-game choices are more evenly matched. LeafGreen really pulls ahead because of those two Super Rod choices they made into exclusives with the remake, where LeafGreen was just given the obviously better Water-types. You've got so many choices for Water-types though, is it that big a deal? FireRed got the better deal as far as competitively viable post-game additions, Skarmory and Quagsire in particular.
Each version has 13 exclusive Pokemon, or 7 exclusive evo lines during the main story. Each version gets 9 or 10 more exclusive Gen 2/3 Pokemon during the post-game, for a total of 22 in FireRed and 23 in LeafGreen. Counting them by number of fully evolved Pokemon, each version gets 13 exclusives. For the post-game Pokemon, I'm just going to judge them by potential competitive use, since there's very little chance you're actually using them on your in-game team in any real capacity.
Ekans > Arbok vs. Sandshrew > Sandslash
Again, found on Route 4 at the earliest. Nothing seriously changes with this match up, Sandslash is still way better. Similar to Gen 1, Sandslash doesn't get any Ground attacks by level up (well, Sand Tomb at level 52, but that sucks) and has Slash at level 24 as its best level up move, but it gets a good amount of TMs. Dig is nerfed this Gen, but will make do until you get Earthquake before Victory Road, and for coverage you can teach it Rock Tomb, Brick Break, Aerial Ace, or Return (will probably fight with others over that one).
Arbok is still bad. Again, pure Poison-type isn't that useful, and its best STAB move is Acid, at least learned at level 38 now. At least it gets Bite at level 13. Hypothetically it can learn Sludge Bomb, which would be helpful, but the TM for it isn't until very late into post-game, so it's effectively off the table. Other than that, it can learn Dig, Earthquake, Return, and... Giga Drain?
Abilities were added this generation, and Arbok at least wins out there with Intimidate, but it's just not going to offer as much in killing opponents as Sandslash. I feel Sandslash's in-game movepool was kind of nerfed this gen, but it's still better overall. Arbok is also still worse competitively, with Sandshrew at least being an okay Sword Dancer, while Arbok is bottom tier.
Point for LeafGreen
Oddish > Gloom > Vileplume / (Bellossom) vs. Bellsprout > Weepinbell > Victreebel
Still found on Route 24 at the earliest as a potential Grass option right before Misty.
Not a whole lot changes here. The Special split means Vileplume is a bit bulkier specially, but that doesn't matter much. Both get Chlorophyll as their ability, which doesn't matter in-game. They're both still stuck needing to wait until the early 40s before you can use a Leaf Stone on them if you want Petal Dance or Razor Leaf, though the latter isn't as useful now without the Gen 1 crit mechanics. They're otherwise stuck with 60 BP Giga Drain. They only have Acid as their best Poison STAB, with Sludge Bomb locked off as said above. There's really not much else for them to do besides status moves.
They're both pretty mediocre as an in-game party member this Gen. Vileplume is a bit bulkier, while Victreebel is a bit faster, that's about it. They're also pretty close competitively, just varied by being a defensive Pokemon vs. a mediocre attacker, but it looks like Vileplume is a tier higher.
I'm just gonna say this one is a tie.
As for Bellossom, it's a low-tier Pokemon and generally considered the worst of these three, so I'm gonna say the possibility of being obtain one in FireRed's post-game doesn't affect things much.
Growlithe > Arcanine vs. Vulpix > Ninetales
Still found on Route 8, just before you reach Celadon City.
Both get Flash Fire as an ability, but Arcanine also gets Intimidate, which is quite nice. Arcanine also comes out the winner in the Special split, its 80 Special becoming its Sp. Defense, while it now has a nice 100 Sp. Attack. Meanwhile, Ninetale's 100 Special became its Sp. Defense, while it's Sp. Attack dropped to 81. Their special bulk remained the same, but their offensives effectively flipped.
So things are mostly now in Arcanine's favor, although Vulpix still gets the earlier Flamethrower, now at only level 29, while Growlithe needs to wait until level 49 (though it does learn Flame Wheel as a stop gap at level 31). You can now get Flamethrower as a TM in this Gen though, if you're willing to grind 4,000 coins at the Game Corner.
For coverage, they both get Normal moves, Dig, and Iron Tail, though Arcanine will be able use them better with its much higher Attack, as well as it getting Aerial Ace. It also gets Extreme Speed at level 49, which is late but arguably more neat than the status moves (Confuse Ray and Will-O-Whisp) Vulpix gets at lower levels.
Both are okay competitively, with Ninetales having status utility with decent power, while Arcanine is more popular with its raw power and Doubles utility.
Overall, I think these two are actually pretty close, with Ninetale's earlier access to Flamethrower without needing to grind the Game Corner for a TM as a pretty compelling reason to prefer Ninetales, but I think Arcanine has a bit more going on to edge things out for most people.
Point for FireRed
Scyther > (Scizor) vs. Pinsir
The methods of obtaining them are still the same as Gen 1. Immediate changes of note going into this Gen is that both are little more specially bulky due to the split, and both get abilities that don't matter that much: Swarm vs. Hyper Cutter.
Pinsir in this Gen still doesn't any Bug attacks to use its STAB with. It's still stuck using Normal and Fighting attacks like Brick Break, Submission, and Strength. Could also give it Dig, Earthquake, or Rock Tomb.
Though Scyther isn't much better, with just Fury Cutter at level 46, which is eeeeh... It does now get a somewhat usable Flying STAB, with 60 BP Wing Attack at level 26 or Aerial Ace by TM. For coverage you've got Normal moves like Slash, some weak stuff like Pursuit, and the okay Steel Wing.
If Scyther had Technician this Gen then I think it would clearly win, but without it, both choices here are really mediocre. I think Pinsir might win by a little if you're willing to use your Earthquake TM on it... But I guess we can consider that FireRed in the post-game can evolve Scyther into Scizor (if you've got someone to trade with) which is clearly the best of the three even without Technician yet. But I'm trying to judge more off of in-game use, and you can also get Pinsir a little easier (less coin cost at the Game Corner).
Point for LeafGreen
Psyduck > Golduck vs. Slowpoke > Slowbro / (Slowking)
Now treated as exclusives here when they weren't in Gen 1. Both are Water-types that evolve once, through Psyduck at level 33 and Slowpoke at level 37. They can be fished up in a variety of cities and routes once you get the Super Rod on Route 12. They can be caught as high as level 35, so that makes them quick to evolve.
Stat-wise, Slowbro wins. Golduck is just mediocre across the board with around 80 to 85 in everything except 95 Special Attack, while Slowbro gets 100 Special Attack and 110 Defense at the cost of only 30 Speed. Neither have particularly notable abilities, but Slowbro's Oblivous is probably the most likely to sometimes come in handy during in-game fights.
As far as moves go, both can learn Surf and Ice Beam (and Blizzard). Golduck can make a little more use of physical attacks like Brick Break and Aerial Ace, though only Slowbro can learn Shadow Ball and Earthquake (if you have no one better to give that to?). Slowbro of course is also part Psychic-type, and can learn Psychic either by TM or at level 44, and starts with Confusion as a stop gap until then. It can also weirdly learn Flamethrower or Fire Blast by TM.
I don't think I need to explain that Slowbro is just better here, in basically every way except for Speed (which even then is something Golduck is just average at). Golduck is just extremely mediocre as an in-game team member
Golduck does seem to have some use competitively as an anti-weather team attacker using its Cloud Nine ability, but Slowbro would generally be considered "better" at its own role as a more defensive Pokemon. Slowking is just Slowbro with its Defense stats swapped, it's not that different (though Slowbro is generally considered a little better).
Point to LeafGreen
Shellder > Cloyster vs. Staryu > Starmie
Another set of counterparts that weren't exclusive in Gen 1. They're both Water-types that evolve by Water Stone and can be fished up in Pallet Town, Vermilion City, or Cinnabar Island once you have the Super Rod.
Cloyster does not have Skill Link yet, so we've got Shell Armor making it immune to crits vs. Starmie's Natural Cure letting it recover from status effects by switching out.
Cloyster's main thing stat-wise is its massive 180 Defense, but being bulky isn't that important for in-game. It has 95 Attack vs. Starmie's 75, but not really much physical attacks in this Gen to make use of it. Starmie's stats are basically just better, with 100 Special Attack and 115 Speed, vs. Cloyster's 85 Special Attack and 70 Speed.
Neither's level up movepool matter that much. As far as TMs go, they both get Surf and Ice Beam/Blizzard, though obviously Cloyster gets STAB on the latter. But Cloyster doesn't really get anything else outside Water and Ice attacks. Meanwhile, Starmie gets STAB Psychic and Thunderbolt or Thunder.
Yeah, Starmie is really just better in this context. In fact, Starmie has the stats and moves to generally be a really solid in-game team member in any game it's in.
Point to LeafGreen
(Elekid) > Electabuzz vs. (Magby) > Magmar
What's different? Well their 85 Special is now their Sp. Def, with Electabuzz getting 95 Sp. Atk and Magmar getting 100 Sp. Atk. So they hit a little harder now. They got similar abilities, Static vs. Flame Body. Electabuzz is still found at the Power Plant, but Magmar is now found even later, at Mt. Ember, which isn't until after beating Blaine. They both practically start with their Punch move now, and Magmar gets Flamethrower after only a couple level ups. They've got similar coverage options with Normal attacks, Brick Break, and Psychic.
Overall, I'm gonna say Electabuzz is still better for the same reasons, especially with Magmar now being even later. Electabuzz also has a better niche competitively.
Point to FireRed
Post-Game Lines
Wooper > Quagsire vs. Azurill > Marill > Azumarill
Can both be found by surfing in Four Island, Icefall Cave, and Ruin Valley in their respective versions. Both are pretty neat Water-types competitively, but Quagsire has a much bigger use with its Water/Ground-typing and defensive uses. Azumarill has Huge Power, but suffers from this being before the physical/special split and before Fairy-type.
Point for FireRed
Murkrow vs. Misdreavus
Can be found in Lost Cave on Five Island. This clearly goes to Misdreavus. Neither Pokemon is amazing, but Misdreavus is at least a decent defensive Ghost-type in UU, while Murkrow struggles to do much outside of very low tiers.
Point vs LeafGreen
Qwilfish vs. Remoraid > Octillery
Can be fished up with the Super Rod in many of the post-game Sevii Island areas. Qwilfish seems to be the better one here, which surprises me a little since it feels like such a nothing Pokemon, but apparently it has some use on rain teams in higher tiers, whereas Octillery despite having really good coverage and high attacking stats is too slow and frail to do much with it before getting KO'd except at bottom tiers.
Point to FireRed
Delibird vs. Sneasel
Both Ice-types found in Icefall Cave. The answer is obviously Sneasel. Neither Pokemon are good competitively, but Sneasel at least has some offensive presence and can roll in RU. Delibird is one of the worst Pokemon in the game. Here's a little fact: Sneasel literally has higher stats than Delibird in every way except Special Attack (which is still a pitiful 65, and that's Delibird's best attacking stat).
Point to LeafGreen
Skarmory vs. Mantine
Are actually found in different parts of Seven Island, either in Sevault Canyon or Tanoby Ruins respectively. But they're keeping their counterpart relation from Gold/Silver.
Skarmory is considered one of the most dominant defensive Pokemon in Gen 3 competitive, while Mantine is a mediocre wall who hangs out in mid-tiers.
Point for FireRed
End result: If we're looking at just main story Pokemon; LeafGreen wins 4 to 2. If we're including the post-game Pokemon; LeafGreen wins 6 to 5.
Green wins this once again, though despite the point difference being bigger, I feel like it's actually a closer match in practice since the early-game choices are more evenly matched. LeafGreen really pulls ahead because of those two Super Rod choices they made into exclusives with the remake, where LeafGreen was just given the obviously better Water-types. You've got so many choices for Water-types though, is it that big a deal? FireRed got the better deal as far as competitively viable post-game additions, Skarmory and Quagsire in particular.
