KR North Korea Megathread - Dear Leader and his shenanigans

MOD NOTE:

There's so much news about North Korea right now and what Un is doing, I got a suggestion for a NK megathread, so here it is. Post the world's greatest nation's antics here. I'm merging a few of the more recent threads to continue discussion.

ORIGINAL POST:
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https://www.yahoo.com/finance/news/south-korea-planning-war-decapitation-132232777.html

South Korean President Moon Jae-in has pushed for a new plan for a rapid war with North Korea and an overhaul of the country's defense industry to overwhelm and crush the North's government, the South Korean newspaper The Chosun Ilbo reported Tuesday.

Moon took office in May promising to attempt to engage diplomatically with North Korea and seek peace, but in the months since, the North has provoked the international community with missile tests at a blistering pace.

For some time, South Korea has been training a "decapitation force," reportedly with the help of the US Navy's SEAL Team 6, but now an increasingly bold North Korea may demand quicker action.

South Korea's new plan identifies more than 1,000 targets for precision missile fires and sites for marines to drop in and quickly kill North Korean leader Kim Jong Un, the paper reported.

The plan represents a more independent version of South Korea's current plan, which relies on support from US aircraft carriers. As it stands, no major military commander recommends military action against North Korea, which has a staggering array of conventional — and potentially nuclear — weapons pointed at Seoul, where 26 million call home.

But South Korea's new plan to quickly and decisively dominate the North relies on reforming the defense-acquisition process and cutting out wasteful spending to wield the full might of its economic dominance against Pyongyang, according to the report. For that reason, don't expect the plan to take effect anytime soon.

 

[PS1gamenwatch]

http://www.newsweek.com/russia-and-...tegy-case-trump-kim-summit-falls-apart-937170

RUSSIA AND JAPAN PLAN NORTH KOREA STRATEGY IN CASE TRUMP-KIM SUMMIT FALLS APART
BY CRISTINA MAZA ON 5/21/18 AT 1:55 PM


Japanese Prime Minister Shinzo Abe is preparing to visit Moscow, where he will sit down with Russian President Vladimir Putin to discuss North Korea and other matters.

“I would like to confirm cooperation in resolving the North Korea issue," Abe told journalists Monday ahead of the meeting. Top foreign affairs and defense officials from both countries will also meet over the coming week. Experts say that Abe, whose country lives in fear of a nuclear North Korea, is preparing a contingency plan in case the upcoming summit between President Donald Trump and North Korean leader Kim Jong Un doesn’t produce results.

"For Japan, Russia could be a useful partner to help put pressure on Pyongyang, especially as Moscow has been accused on several occasions of not fully enforcing sanctions [against North Korea]. The Putin government does have a decent relationship with the Kim regime, and could prove useful,” Harry Kazianis, director of defense studies at the Center for the National Interest, a public policy think tank in Washington, told Newsweek.

"Japan could be worried that if a Trump-Kim summit fails, and especially if U.S.-Russia relations were to get worse, Russia could act as a spoiler when it comes to North Korea. They could easily damage the sanctions regime, aid Pyongyang with advanced air defense aid and much more. For Japan, North Korea is an existential issue--and Russia could make it far worse,” Kazianis continued.

The U.S. relationship with Russia has soured over the Kremlin's attempts to interfere in the 2016 U.S. presidential election. The U.S. has worked closely with China and South Korea, however, to facilitate the upcoming meeting with Pyongyang. Japan's Abe has worked to maintain a positive relationship with Trump and joined U.S. calls for the complete denuclearization of the Korean Peninsula.

During the meetings between Russian and Japanese officials, Tokyo is also expected to lobby for charter flights to begin ferrying Japanese citizens to the South Kuril Islands to visit the graves of their ancestors. The four islands are at the center of a dispute between Russia and Japan, which have not signed a peace treaty after World War II because of their disagreement over their sovereignty. Russia took control of the territory in 1949 and subsequently deported all of its Japanese residents. Moscow permitted Japanese citizens to visit the islands visa-free last year, and Japan is pushing for this to become an annual occurrence.

The meetings between the two leaders will take place between May 24 and 27.

 

[ChuckSlaughter]

he's also so confident in the meeting that he's not even rehearsing for it and just plans to play it off-the-cuff.

Well John Bolton mentioned using Libya as a model for North Korea's denuclearization. Gaddafi got fucked when he tried to normalize relations with the US and gave up his nukes and it's exactly what has North Korea so eager to develop nukes in the first place.
I understand what he actually meant but then Trump commented on the situation later and seemed to only half understand the situation.

For Bolton to say what he did though, I almost think he wants to fuck things up. He could have outlined Libya's entire denuclearization and never said the L word the entire time.

n exchange for giving up their nuclear ambitions, North Korea could be freed from Chinese influence.

We're not free of Chinese influence and really that's low on North Korea's list of problems.

 

[TheScooper]

And Trump pulled out of the summit.

 

[RP 520]

And Trump pulled out of the summit.

I knew it was going to happen honestly. NK has started getting uppity at the US in the last few weeks and Trump's patience started wearing thin ever since NK and China met with each other.

 

[tehpope]

 

[TheScooper]

View attachment 457401

His right you know.

 

[Keystone]

Unfortunate. Though he did get those hostages back and proved that he really means it when he says he'll back out of things if they aren't copacetic, so it kinda balances out I guess.

Although I'm sure (((CNN))) and other "non biased" news sources are jerking themselves raw right now because this fell through.

 

[RomanesEuntDomus]

View attachment 457401

I guess this is the diplomatic version of saying "So, I heard you talk shit behind my back as if I wouldn't find out..."?

It looked too good to be true, I always expected this to fail at some point, but I wasn't expecting it so soon. I would have guessed that USA/SK insist on NK giving up on their nukes (as if they weren't the reason NK was willing to negotiate in the first place) and that leading to either talks stalling indefinetly or being called off.

It's a damn shame, if Trump had managed to get even just a token success where both Koreas announce to work towards rapprochement in the future, the leftist salt would have been flowing like crazy. Just imagine trolling libtards with "Trump ended the Korean War" for eternity.

 

[PS1gamenwatch]

A day ago:

https://www.usatoday.com/story/news...ign-minister-taro-kono-north-korea/637604002/

Japan's foreign minister seeks U.S. help on abductees in North Korea
Oren Dorell, USA TODAYPublished 11:13 p.m. ET May 23, 2018 | Updated 2:19 a.m. ET May 24, 2018



WASHINGTON — Japan’s Foreign Minister Taro Kono pressed the Trump administration Wednesday to remember Japanese interests in talks with North Korea.

Kono met with Secretary of State Mike Pompeo and John Bolton, President Trump's national security adviser, according to Toshihide Ando, deputy press secretary for Japan's Ministry of Foreign Affairs.

Kono reminded Bolton and Pompeo that North Korea doesn't always live up to its agreements, Ando said. Japan wants the United States to pressure North Korea on three key issues: Abolishing the North's nuclear weapons program; disbandment of the nation's short-, medium- and long-range missile production; and the return of Japanese citizens who have been captive in the hermit nation since the 1970s.

"We have to remember past mistakes," Ando said, referring to previous agreements that North Korea has broken with other countries. "Today (Kono, Bolton and Pompeo) agreed to press North Korea for complete action of dismantlement of North Korean weapons of mass destruction in a complete verifiable and irreversible manner — and they also agreed on the abduction issue."


North Korea’s diplomatic overtures this year, offering to discuss its nuclear weapons program in return for economic aid, have resulted in the first-ever face-to-face meetings between the North's leader Kim Jong Un and several other national leaders in the region. So far, he has not met with top leaders of Japan.

Kim met in recent months with Chinese President Xi Jinping, South Korean President Moon Jae-in, and Secretary of State Mike Pompeo. Last summer he was visited by Russian President Vladimir Putin. But Kim has held no direct talks with Japan.

Kim offered to meet with President Trump in Singapore on June 12, and Trump accepted. But it's not clear if that meeting will take place.

"We will know next week about Singapore," Trump told reporters at the White House, the day after acknowledging that there's a "very substantial chance" the summit will be canceled.

“The Japanese are worried they’re being left behind,” said Frank Jannuzi, CEO of the Maureen and Mike Mansfield Foundation, who traveled recently to Japan with a Congressional delegation that met with Prime Minister Shinzo Abe.

Japan was included in previous rounds of nuclear talks with the North, which were known as the Six-Party Talks and included China, Russia, South Korea, Japan and the U.S.


The North Koreans are wary of returning the 12 abductees because they want to be sure that settles the issue with Japan, Jannuzi said.


Takehiro Shimada, a spokesman for Japan's embassy in Washington, said his government's official position is that North Korea should return those 12 abductees. "If they show us other victims that would be welcome," Shimada said.

Katsunobu Kato, Japan’s minister for the abduction issue, told USA TODAY on May 4 that Japan is prepared to deal directly with the North, to normalize relations and provide financial assistance, but that outcome depends on the return of all abductees.

Trump on Tuesday said Japan, together with South Korea and China, would help North Korea develop economically if the North abandons its nuclear weapons program.

Referring to conversations he’s had with leaders from all three countries, Trump said: “They will be willing to help and, I believe, invest very, very large sums of money into helping to make North Korea great.”

Ando said Japan would not agree to such investment "until we see concrete action" on North Korean disarmament and abductees.

 

[It's HK-47]

North Korea has dismantled its nuclear test site, in a planned move portrayed by the isolated regime as a goodwill gesture ahead of a potential summit next month with the US.

It is not known to what extent the northeastern Punggye-ri facility has been demolished, but foreign journalists invited to witness the destruction described a series of 'huge explosions'.

The explosions at the nuclear test site deep in the mountains of the North's sparsely populated northeast were reportedly centered on three tunnels into the underground site and a number of observation towers in the surrounding area.

'There was a huge explosion, you could feel it. Dust came at you, the heat came at you. It was extremely loud,' Sky News' Tom Cheshire, who was among those invited to attend the ceremony, wrote on the British broadcaster's website.

Yonhap news agency, citing South Korean reporters at the scene, said multiple explosions were heard throughout the day, beginning at 11am (3am GMT) until 4.17pm.

Punggye-ri has been the staging ground for all six of the North's nuclear tests, including its latest and by far most powerful one in September last year, which Pyongyang said was an H-bomb.

Experts are divided over whether the demolition will render the site useless. Sceptics say the facility has already outlived its usefulness with six successful nuclear tests in the bag and can be quickly rebuilt if needed.

North Korea also did not invite any independent observers from overseas. (HK-47: What? You just fucking said foreign reporters were there.)

But others say the fact that North Korea agreed to destroy the site without preconditions or asking for something in return from Washington suggests the regime is serious about change.

The demolition comes amid reports that dictator Kim Jong Un will be hiding his nuclear arsenals in a mountainous region of North Korea to avoid satellites being able to detect them.

NK News reports that that the regime has designated Chagang Province a 'Special Military-first Revolutionary Zone'.

The region, which borders China, will reportedly be fortified and access restricted to ensure that Kim can hide its weapons and materials in tunnels beneath the mountains there.

A high-level source told the news website: 'Nuclear weapons can be hidden anywhere, but the North Korean authorities have chosen, it seems, a place where even satellites will have difficulty locating them.'

And right after they blew up what was left of that nuclear test site. Is it just me, or is that letter weirdly formal and polite, too? Everyone was expecting Trump to barrel in and make a deal with North Korea ASAP no matter what the cost, and then he just up and fucks off from the negotiating table out of the clear blue.

You know, it's a really wild, off-the-wall speculation, but what if that's it? We got our hostages back, North Korea's pretty much completely dismantled their nuclear program, and the North and South are openly talking again. Isn't that really all that needed to happen, where we're concerned? North Korea has a Chairman who's actually acting like a Chairman now, and with the hostilities between the North and South winding down, do we really need to be involved anymore?

I'm completely spit-balling here, so don't take me too super-serious, but the more I'm mulling it over the more I'm wondering what this summit would really put into play that isn't already taking place. Do we really need to be involved more than we already have been, or can't South Korea and Japan pretty much just take it from here? At this point the summit meeting would just be sort of a formalized rubber stamp, wouldn't it?

 

[PS1gamenwatch]

And right after they blew up what was left of that nuclear test site. Is it just me, or is that letter weirdly formal and polite, too? Everyone was expecting Trump to barrel in and make a deal with North Korea ASAP no matter what the cost, and then he just up and fucks off from the negotiating table out of the clear blue.

You know, it's a really wild, off-the-wall speculation, but what if that's it? We got our hostages back, North Korea's pretty much completely dismantled their nuclear program, and the North and South are openly talking again. Isn't that really all that needed to happen, where we're concerned? North Korea has a Chairman who's actually acting like a Chairman now, and with the hostilities between the North and South winding down, do we really need to be involved anymore?

I'm completely spit-balling here, so don't take me too super-serious, but the more I'm mulling it over the more I'm wondering what this summit would really put into play that isn't already taking place. Do we really need to be involved more than we already have been, or can't South Korea and Japan pretty much just take it from here? At this point the summit meeting would just be sort of a formalized rubber stamp, wouldn't it?

Don't forget Russia, as posted several posts earlier Russia and Japan planned talks in case talks with North Korea fell through.

 

[Trans Fat 41g]

People don't accept that there's a nucleus to any context, so I seen this reaction a mile away.

What I will say though is, this just goes to show how fucking batshit far gone North Korea is.

 

[That fucking snake robot]

And right after they blew up what was left of that nuclear test site. Is it just me, or is that letter weirdly formal and polite, too? Everyone was expecting Trump to barrel in and make a deal with North Korea ASAP no matter what the cost, and then he just up and fucks off from the negotiating table out of the clear blue.

You know, it's a really wild, off-the-wall speculation, but what if that's it? We got our hostages back, North Korea's pretty much completely dismantled their nuclear program, and the North and South are openly talking again. Isn't that really all that needed to happen, where we're concerned? North Korea has a Chairman who's actually acting like a Chairman now, and with the hostilities between the North and South winding down, do we really need to be involved anymore?

I'm completely spit-balling here, so don't take me too super-serious, but the more I'm mulling it over the more I'm wondering what this summit would really put into play that isn't already taking place. Do we really need to be involved more than we already have been, or can't South Korea and Japan pretty much just take it from here? At this point the summit meeting would just be sort of a formalized rubber stamp, wouldn't it?

I think you're pretty much right, at this point NK can't do much militarily or politically to be a threat without putting themselves in danger of a multi pronged attack or near total economic ruin. I think we've ultimately reached the point where NK either putters out or violently lashes out it's last few times if it can't get what it wants. But personally I have no fucking clue NK is a crazy ass wild card.

 

[Hux]

With the summit being cancelled, you all have to remember one important thing: the way politics and negotiations work in East Asia are in no way comparable to how the West does it.

You have the likes of Jinping, Un, Duterte and Abe, all of which have a huge penchant for posturing and showing their strength which is something they all have a common respect for. Putin understands this too. When they see the way Macron, May, Merkel, Lofven and Trudeau conduct their politics and their negotiations, which is usually consists of kissing each other's asses, the first thought that comes to mind is "lol what a bunch of pansies". It's why Obama turned out to be incredibly well liked in the EU but routinely disrespected by East Asian leaders and Putin. Because Trump understands these differences as well as put that famous loudmouth WWE strongman image of himself to use, he's able to actually get their respect. If Trump went to the summit after Un showed his ass like he did concerning Pence, Trump would have looked like a whipped dog in the eyes of Un and the rest and would go in thinking he could run roughshod over him at the negotiation table.

If anything, these negotiations are just going to be pushed back a few months.

 

[It's HK-47]

We got our hostages back, had the North Koreans dismantle their nuclear program and blow up their nuclear testing site, and brought the North and South back to the same table, and America had to give them absolutely nothing in return. But... Why not, Trump got played I guess. By someone's standards, I'm sure.

These people are fucking ridiculous.

 

[BubbleButt]

Boy, I'm really glad I don't work in the news industry anymore.

This would have been a hell of a headache to deal with

 

[RomanesEuntDomus]

North Korea has a Chairman who's actually acting like a Chairman now, and with the hostilities between the North and South winding down, do we really need to be involved anymore?

and

Do we really need to be involved more than we already have been, or can't South Korea and Japan pretty much just take it from here?

Due to the multiple treaties of military partnership that the US has with these nations, I doubt there can be true progress without them.
This letter isn't Trump bowing out of the conversation to let the other's take over from there (it would be way too passive aggressive for that anyway), the way how international politics are set up in Asia with the US as one of the major key players, these other, smaller nations are simply in no position to take over at all.

had the North Koreans dismantle their nuclear program and blow up their nuclear testing site

Not to put a damper on you or anything, but this might be an exaggeration. NK might not be working on new bombs, but it's not like they dismantled their existing ones. And the test site they "blew up" was the one that got mauled by an earthquake anyway, afaik.

 

[MeatRokket08]

View attachment 457401

"Thanks for the hostages though"

 

[Techpriest]

Romanes is right. The North Koreans have no incentive to give up nukes. Economic investment, large amounts of international aid, all of that jazz sounds nice, but at the end of the day the Kim Regime needs to stay on top. Limited disarmament was an unlikely but still possible potential outcome of this - the removal of weaponry close to the DMZ, a scaling back of forces on both sides of the border, that sort of thing. Nuclear disarmament for the Kim's is like saying 'Hey America, invade us in the next decade or two please' especially after the Libya comments and the withdrawal from the Iran deal. Why even want to negotiate when you know the other side might just go 'No' a few years down the line and rip everything up?

The Chinese might also view this as the ideal result. No negotiations, they don't need to promise anything or force the North Koreans into agreeing with anything, they remain uninvolved directly but still can arguably pull on Kim's leash if they need to.

This was a no win from the start.

 

[It's HK-47]

Romanes is right. The North Koreans have no incentive to give up nukes. Economic investment, large amounts of international aid, all of that jazz sounds nice, but at the end of the day the Kim Regime needs to stay on top. Limited disarmament was an unlikely but still possible potential outcome of this - the removal of weaponry close to the DMZ, a scaling back of forces on both sides of the border, that sort of thing. Nuclear disarmament for the Kim's is like saying 'Hey America, invade us in the next decade or two please' especially after the Libya comments and the withdrawal from the Iran deal. Why even want to negotiate when you know the other side might just go 'No' a few years down the line and rip everything up?

The Chinese might also view this as the ideal result. No negotiations, they don't need to promise anything or force the North Koreans into agreeing with anything, they remain uninvolved directly but still can arguably pull on Kim's leash if they need to.

This was a no win from the start.

Well, no incentives apart from the crushing, economic sanctions that were more than enough to get us to this point in the first place. If this was a no-win situation and it was completely hopeless, then how did we go from everyone in the planet panicking about a nuclear war to everyone just trying to dunk on Trump because he just decided to wander off away from the negotiating table? I'd posit that a Hell of a lot of progress has already been made, even if it turns out that this summit meeting just becomes indefinitely suspended.

I don't particularly understand how the Kim regime "stays on top" by keeping itself underneath all of those multi-billion-dollar sanctions and surrendering hostages and keeping itself poised at the mercy of China and Russia and not opening itself up to economic investment and international aid, though. None of that really sounds like it's helping the North Korean regime much at all, to be honest.