Naruto/Boruto Griefing Thread

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Has anyone tried to make sense of the body replacement/substitution (Kawarimi) jutsu in the way it's presented in the series? How it actually, supposedly works.

I obviously think that this is pure theatrics in the sense that is a "cool thing" that ninjas do (so it must be in the series!), but in truth, it would either make little sense to use, be impractical, or be impossible to execute.
If you don't know how this technique resolves, is that when a character is (apparently) hit by something, the body will look for a split second (or several seconds) as if it took damage, but then would disappear in a blast of smoke, as if a smoke bomb exploded, leaving other object in its place, like a log of wood, with the real character not taking damage.

kawarimi.png

So I heard people saying that the ninja would "teleport" and escape danger, but this is obviously not the case, as teleporting is not something many can do (like the 4th Hokage), so it would be ridiculous for let's say Sakura do it, before the exams.

The most logical conclusions I can come up with are:

- The one who executes it, puts the other in a state of Genjutsu (illusion) briefly or way before the battle, that way when it happens, they can escape without problem by fooling the adversary.
- Major inconsistencies: if that's the case, why not use the illusion at a more critical point in order to swiftly deal a lethal blow to the opponent; how did they successfully put the opponent in that state anyways, seems like everyone is doing it without trouble; if against several opponents, they'd have to execute the Genjutsu for all of them in order to work, which seems unlikely; not sure if Rock Lee uses it, but Naruto does and he sucks at this branch of jutsus, so it's unlikely he could do it; if it is indeed an illusion, there would be no need to "swap" with a physical object like a trunk of wood.

- The one who executes it has at some point hidden & replaced themselves with a clone, making the enemy chase the clone instead.
- Major inconsistencies: this is done at critical points in the anime, I find hard to believe some would have been able to do this (escape the enemy's line of sight) in order to replace themselves and hide in the meantime; if they hit the clone, then again, there is no need to "swap" with a trunk when that happens.

- The one who executes it is truly themself just right before getting hit, but at the last second they become slippery like an eel and for some reason put a trunk in front of them, then escape.
- Major inconsistencies: there's no need to swap with a trunk; if that happened, you'd still see them getting out/away even if out of the smoke bomb, which does not happen, instead it's like they vanished or teleported; sometimes you can see them getting impaled, so you'd have to assume that the body is fake to some degree, so they can't just escape like this.

So how does it work? There is no teleporting as that would be ridiculous, sometimes the body is seen as impaled (which I should assume it visibly happens, and it's not someone imagining it) so at that moment it has to be fake to some degree because they escape the impalement, and that they most likely have to be really themselves until that point, so they're spotted by the enemy until the technique happens.

It's pure ninja idealized magic (yes, not the one that resurrects people, but this one).
 
We Are The Witches said:
The one who executes it, puts the other in a state of Genjutsu (illusion) briefly or way before the battle, that way when it happens, they can escape without problem by fooling the adversary.
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This method is far too slow. It's more than likely that it's a combination of the body flicker technique where the ninja reaches for anything within their vicinity to replace themselves with. More advanced users have been known to replace themselves with pebbles or even water.

Then again, yeah, it's just another 'cool' ninja technique that doesn't make much sense on paper.
 
Gorillion others said:
This method is far too slow. It's more than likely that it's a combination of the body flicker technique where the ninja reaches for anything within their vicinity to replace themselves with. More advanced users have been known to replace themselves with pebbles or even water.

Then again, yeah, it's just another 'cool' ninja technique that doesn't make much sense on paper.
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Seems like we agree, but in regards to the supposed "body flicker", that also makes zero sense.

And sometimes they have perfectly cut trunks, so you'd have to assume that they carry them, but also, you also see them taking damage (an illusion I'd guess), so it's not just swapping. Also if you can do that so fast, you might as well "body flicker" to their throat and slash it.

That's the ultimate forbidden technique, forget about Rinnegan or whatever.
 
We Are The Witches said:
Seems like we agree, but in regards to the supposed "body flicker", that also makes zero sense.

And sometimes they have perfectly cut trunks, so you'd have to assume that they carry them, but also, you also see them taking damage (an illusion I'd guess), so it's not just swapping. Also if you can do that so fast, you might as well "body flicker" to their throat and slash it.

That's the ultimate forbidden technique, forget about Rinnegan or whatever.
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Body flickering that close would either open you up or just get blocked, but yeah, it's really dumb. Cool when you're a kid, but eye bleeding retarded when you're an adult.
 
Party Hat Wurmple said:
I know it's badly written, but from what I expect is coming later based on what has happened, kind of relies on us feeling something for Matsuri. If we don't feel anything for Matsuri, why should we care when she's ultimately defeated? They're building the Trees up to be sympathetic to some degree, but we need those scenes to really cement them as tragic figures. Without them, or just glossing over them, there's just no point.
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What I am saying is that even if we DID get such a scene, it would be badly written and it might have made us hate Matsuri more rather than sympathise with her. The -motos do not know how to write female characters.

Party Hat Wurmple said:
He doesn't know. He was literally born a few days ago. If Jura does have some kind of grand plan, he's not telling anyone about it. The last few chapters have tried to paint the trees as unwitting pawns in Jura's game. But to be honest I don't know what Jura is after or why.
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Too bad then, it would have been interesting to show more initiative from the Trees.

Party Hat Wurmple said:
Kawaki is just the worst. I understand the logic behind his idea, because I think he does understand the Trees might destroy the planet to some degree. He has a tendency to get slapped in every chapter either physically or through commentary. I don't know if that stops after this event or not, but I'll miss it.
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They are trying to catch lightning with a bottle again like they did with Sasuke but they fail. I remember the scenes where Naruto and Sasuke were bonding and how Sasuke regretted briefly having to fight Naruto during their first bout at the Valley. We did not get any of that with Kawaki. He was a piece of work from the beginning and we knew that so neither Boruto nor the audience got invested in him. This is Ikemoto's greatest flaw: All of his teacher's flaws but none of the strengths.

Party Hat Wurmple said:
To be fair, I don't think any of them intended to attack. It was JUST Yodo. I don't think any of them expected her to lose her cool and leap in. It just happened because Yodo is retarded and a danger to this mission. Which, if she's this hot headed, why send her on this mission at all? Although, Konohamaru didn't fair off much better when he lost his cool....
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My question is however how do they survive so long when they are that hot headed and incompetent? Also, reread Naruto. I just realised that every time there is a major fuck-up, it is usually (but not always) by a woman. Sakura gets captured in the Forest, Tsunade poisons Jiraiya, Sakura is useless and nearly gets herself killed by Sasuke, Sakura fails to stab Obito etc etc. It is amazing how often do women fail considering they are so underrepresented in the fights! It is as if the -motos decide someone has to fuck-up it is the women that are around always draw the short straw.

Party Hat Wurmple said:
I think what makes it worse is that this Boruto Shippuden and by comparison, neither parts of Naruto had the characters act this incredibly stupid.
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They were barely better though, let's face it.

We Are The Witches said:
Has anyone tried to make sense of the body replacement/substitution (Kawarimi) jutsu in the way it's presented in the series? How it actually, supposedly works.
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It is misdirection and quick movement. The same way a stage magician does it but through fantasy lens and such.
 
We Are The Witches said:
I see a couple of references to PlagueOfGripes, so I'll take my chance to locally archive his old video on it (which is very funny in my opinion), it's a classic:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=v2tkz92eG_E
https://preservetube.com/watch?v=v2tkz92eG_E
Naruto, the Self-Made Hypocrite
Naruto, the Self-Made Hypocrite [v2tkz92eG_E].mp4
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The video does get most things right but not all of them. It does show that Naruto is Dragonball by a man who liked Dragonball but never understood it beyond the cool fights though.
 
My thought is that the replacement log thing is just a catch-all for multiple techniques that do the same thing. It basically just is tricking someone into taking what they think is an opening.
 
We Are The Witches said:
Found this in some folder, love it:
View attachment 6899755

I completely forgot this was a character.
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That has been debunked. Kurenai is a genjutsu specialist. Illusions are her strongest weapon. What exactly was she supposed to use in order to cause damage? Shuriken? Have you seen Itachi handling those? It would be a bigger slaughter. Or was she supposed to use Ninjutsu against an Uchiha?
 
Incecticyder said:
That has been debunked. Kurenai is a genjutsu specialist. Illusions are her strongest weapon. What exactly was she supposed to use in order to cause damage? Shuriken? Have you seen Itachi handling those? It would be a bigger slaughter. Or was she supposed to use Ninjutsu against an Uchiha?
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Isn't itachi effectively immune to genjutsu due to his sharringan? I get she had limited options and as a woman in naruto is already useless but still that's a dumb element.
 
TerminalTryHard said:
Isn't itachi effectively immune to genjutsu due to his sharringan? I get she had limited options and as a woman in naruto is already useless but still that's a dumb element.
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He is not immune but he has an enormous advantage due to talent, mastery and the Sharingan. However, he also mastered weapons, Ninjutsu and probably Taijutsu. Nothing she or any of the Jonin present could have tried would have been effective. She was not stupid, she was dealt an unwinnable hand and played it as best as she could.
 
Incecticyder said:
That has been debunked. Kurenai is a genjutsu specialist. Illusions are her strongest weapon. What exactly was she supposed to use in order to cause damage? Shuriken? Have you seen Itachi handling those? It would be a bigger slaughter. Or was she supposed to use Ninjutsu against an Uchiha?
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I just love how Kurenai is completely dropped once she's done being useful. We never see or hear from her again once she gets knocked up and Asuma dies. The anime gives her maybe a scene or two with Shikamaru but the manga doesn't give her fuck all. She's literally just there to milk the moment and once it's passed, she's just random single mom.
 
Party Hat Wurmple said:
I just love how Kurenai is completely dropped once she's done being useful. We never see or hear from her again once she gets knocked up and Asuma dies. The anime gives her maybe a scene or two with Shikamaru but the manga doesn't give her fuck all. She's literally just there to milk the moment and once it's passed, she's just random single mom.
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Your favourite Naruto characters never get anywhere enough screen time. One cool scene is the most of what they get. A shame because there are a lot of characters with cool designs/personalities/powers. You start the series because you think to yourself that the cool characters will be seen doing awesome stuff and you end up disappointed. Kishimoto would have a grand career making videogame character design, perhaps more so than any of his Big 3 contemporaries but he should be kept away from the writing.
 
Party Hat Wurmple said:
I just love how Kurenai is completely dropped once she's done being useful. We never see or hear from her again once she gets knocked up and Asuma dies. The anime gives her maybe a scene or two with Shikamaru but the manga doesn't give her fuck all. She's literally just there to milk the moment and once it's passed, she's just random single mom.
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Doesn't her kid play a semi-big role in boruto (atleast in the anime) and hanging around Ten-Ten (remember Ten-Ten? lol!)?
 
Gravityqueen4life said:
Doesn't her kid play a semi-big role in boruto (atleast in the anime) and hanging around Ten-Ten (remember Ten-Ten? lol!)?
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She gets a one-shot mini arc in Boruto where she has to fight against a cult with similar abilities to Hidan. It's incredibly forced. Outside of that, she doesn't even make an appearance in the Boruto canon manga. Although at this point, the anime might as well be more canon than the manga. The anime staff at least gave the Kara Members a personality, goals, and something to do....
 
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