Naruto/Boruto Griefing Thread

[Stanley Ipkiss]

felt like he got an easy way negating the damage Rasenshuriken by simply mastering sage form (a form that Jiraiya spent his hole life training but never fully mastering it, while Naruto did in just a few days). then with Kyuubi, he throw nuke Resengans like they candy. cant remember if he even bothered naming those attacks.

Yeah not gonna defend the post-Pein writing. Sucks completely imo.

Just wanted to address the idea that the weakness of the RS wasn't brought up again.
I don't see too much wrong with a character discovering a weakness and then finding a way to mitigate it through natural growth. He was always gonna become a sage the moment we saw the form, and we saw him trying something that obliterated mountains during his sage training, which turned out to be throwing the RS.
Sage mode buffs all of his ninjutsu and taijutsu, and while it's not explicitly stated, probably helps with chakra control a lot. And let's not forget he used RS on Kakuzu literally minutes after he completed it. Using it in the way he would use rasengan on the first try makes sense for anyone, not just Naruto.
Between sage mode and just having more time to train with RS in base form, him learning to throw it (or any other damage mitigation technique he may have come up with) really seems inevitable, even if a bit fast in this one case.

As to him learning SM in days, we're taking about the most innovative character in the entire series. It's always been a thing with Naruto that he learns things that took previous masters years within days. From Multi Shadow Clone to Rasengan to Rasenshuriken to Sage Mode, he always finds a way to drastically speed up the process his predecessors created. It's worth noting that rather than trivializing the way they mastered them, he does it in a completely new way that only he, Uzumaki Naruto, can do it. Not exactly stellar writing but really it doesn't come across as convenient to me at all.

Now all the bullshit he pulled in the war arc on the other hand though............

 

[Party Hat Wurmple]

As to him learning SM in days, we're taking about the most innovative character in the entire series. It's always been a thing with Naruto that he learns things that took previous masters years within days. From Multi Shadow Clone to Rasengan to Rasenshuriken to Sage Mode, he always finds a way to drastically speed up the process his predecessors created. It's worth noting that rather than trivializing the way they mastered them, he does it in a completely new way that only he, Uzumaki Naruto, can do it. Not exactly stellar writing but really it doesn't come across as convenient to me at all.

The problem was to me that the Akatsuki were scaled up too high. It took Sakura and Chiyo working together to bring down Sasori. It took Sasuke sacrificing Manda to take down Deidara. Itachi was never trying to kill Sasuke, but he almost did. Hidan only lost because Shikamaru had a lot of time to lay out a plan and he's simply not the most intelligent of the group. His immortality made him reckless.

So bearing that all in mind Kakuzu getting one shotted by not just Rasenshuriken but the literal OLDEST clone trick in the book was pretty disappointing. I feel like Sage Mode was a a response to this and it only happened so quickly because Naruto had a lot of scaling up to do. He was relatively weak all things considered at the time and they just stripped him of RS.

 

[Saturnalia-1918]

One thing I noticed about the theme of "ending the cycle of hatred" is that it feels kind applied randomly.

Like Sasuke is condemned for being obsessed about revenge and how people tell him to essentially move on and live his life. With the showcase of Sasuke steadily becoming more of a monster the more he obsesses and drives towards revenge.

Then you have Shikamaru going on a half-cocked suicide mission with Ino and Choji and successfully get revenge for their Sensei? So which is it?

Is revenge and hatred something one should let go of and the pursuit of revenge is self destructive? Because Shikamaru got revenge on Hidan for his sensei pretty handily with no great loss.

 

[Starscream's Loyalty]

At this point, I'd take fanfiction over this. Especially with Kakashi and that Hanare chick. Hella more interesting than Boruto rn.

 

[God of Nothing]

Is revenge and hatred something one should let go of and the pursuit of revenge is self destructive? Because Shikamaru got revenge on Hidan for his sensei pretty handily with no great loss.

Shikamaru doing Hidan in wasn't completely to avenge Asuma but to protect what he was protecting. Granted, he still nearly died and got his team killed during it. I remember it being very impersonal. And Shikamaru actually takes a moment to grieve and process his feelings than going straight into revenge. The anime only scene with his dad really helped with that.
Sasuke wants to kill everyone in Konoha for the sake of his dead clan, which doesn't accomplish anything. He doesn't take the time to think. In the end, Itachi still chose to kill their family of his own free will. Danzo was right.

At this point, I'd take fanfiction over this. Especially with Kakashi and that Hanare chick. Hella more interesting than Boruto rn.

Fanfiction's been pretty dry in general lately, if you're anywhere familiar with those circles.

 

[Party Hat Wurmple]

Then you have Shikamaru going on a half-cocked suicide mission with Ino and Choji and successfully get revenge for their Sensei? So which is it?

This is why I like Bleach. Bleach addresses this much better imo. Yes, revenge should generally be let go of because it is self destructive, but if you choose to go down that path, then you need to accept the consequences and understand that revenge can still be in service to a greater good.

In Naruto, we don't really get an answer. Obito literally took out his malding against the entire fucking planet and he pays no price for it. Sure he dies, but Naruto remembers him fondly despite the awful things he does. Something I never particularly liked is that nobody bothers to tell Sasuke "Yeah, I'd want to kill Itachi too. I don't blame you."

At this point, I'd take fanfiction over this. Especially with Kakashi and that Hanare chick. Hella more interesting than Boruto rn.

I'll go over the entirety of the Boruto TBV manga someday and cover the chapters I missed. But yeah, overall all that's happened so far is Boruto fights some people, Sasuke is a tree and is evil again. Code's Claw Grimes that he made from the ten tails became sentient Divine Trees after they caught hosts like Sasuke. Divine Trees attack Konoha. That's basically it. Yeah, Sasuke lost to fucking fodder. Not even a lot of them, like maybe 5. The same things we see random side characters handle with relative ease. Imagine Sasuke basically losing to 5 White Zetsus. That's what actually happens.

 

[Stanley Ipkiss]

The problem was to me that the Akatsuki were scaled up too high. It took Sakura and Chiyo working together to bring down Sasori. It took Sasuke sacrificing Manda to take down Deidara. Itachi was never trying to kill Sasuke, but he almost did. Hidan only lost because Shikamaru had a lot of time to lay out a plan and he's simply not the most intelligent of the group. His immortality made him reckless.

So bearing that all in mind Kakuzu getting one shotted by not just Rasenshuriken but the literal OLDEST clone trick in the book was pretty disappointing. I feel like Sage Mode was a a response to this and it only happened so quickly because Naruto had a lot of scaling up to do. He was relatively weak all things considered at the time and they just stripped him of RS.

I dunno. Rasenshuriken is an S class jutsu. I'd expect it to one shot anyone it hit short of Nagato and above. Kakuzu had been put through the ringer by Kakashi and Team 10 up to that point, and he was high enough on his own farts after nearly killing Kakashi that he underestimated a kid who seemed only good with Shadow clones.
I feel the main problem is inserting Naruto into that battle in the first place. Makes complete sense for Konoha but shits on what Team 10 actually set out to do

 

[Gorillion others]

Fanfiction's been pretty dry in general lately, if you're anywhere familiar with those circles.

There's already too much of Naruto fanfiction. Way too much. Especially concerning crossovers.

 

[Gorillion others]

Daily reminder that Masashi Kishimoto is a shithead who simply got lucky. By appealing to the lowest common denominator.

 

[Party Hat Wurmple]

Daily reminder that Masashi Kishimoto is a shithead who simply got lucky. By appealing to the lowest common denominator.

The fact Sasuke was never originally part of the story and was a last minute edition is really telling. He really was just pulling it out of his ass literally the entire time. Very little of this was planned for. It's literally just all made up on the fly. I think I'm convinced that Samurai 8 is what you get when Kishimoto's autism is left completely unchecked. That's arguably the worst written manga I've ever read with the exception of Boruto.

If y'all are ever doubting yourself, remember he made the most popular anime on the planet next to Dragonball and it was all last minute bullshit.

 

[Trollblade69]

The fact Sasuke was never originally part of the story and was a last minute edition is really telling.

Sasuke was introduced in Chapter 3. It's more than early enough for Kishimoto to formulate long-term plans for the character, even if the events that developed him were pretty on the fly (such as surviving the battle with Haku and the encounter with Orochimaru) and cribbed plenty of inspiration from Togashi. Itachi's existence was almost certainly planned from the start, and thus the only major change Kishi made to how the Tsunade arc's inciting events played out had to be Sasuke's presence in it. And then the Sasuke Retrieval arc ended up being some of the best shonen storytelling I've ever read. People need to get over the idea that because he was an editorial addition, it meant there were no plans for him and that we should instinctually hate him even before Sasuke & Sai wrecked him utterly.

 

[Party Hat Wurmple]

Sasuke was introduced in Chapter 3. It's more than early enough for Kishimoto to formulate long-term plans for the character, even if the events that developed him were pretty on the fly (such as surviving the battle with Haku and the encounter with Orochimaru) and cribbed plenty of inspiration from Togashi. Itachi's existence was almost certainly planned from the start, and thus the only major change Kishi made to how the Tsunade arc's inciting events played out had to be Sasuke's presence in it. And then the Sasuke Retrieval arc ended up being some of the best shonen storytelling I've ever read. People need to get over the idea that because he was an editorial addition, it meant there were no plans for him and that we should instinctually hate him even before Sasuke & Sai wrecked him utterly.

Usually mangaka have an idea for a story long before they land the job. So a lot pre-planning and long term planning is done before the story even gets approved. Sasuke is a pretty integral part that was added last minute. The fact Naruto never had a rival character at all is pretty telling. The more and more that comes out talking about the development process, it seems Kishimoto only thought this through to Haku and Zabuza. That being said, no Itachi was never always planned. If Sasuke wasn't planned, then neither could Itachi have been.

Sasuke on paper is a relatively simple character. Rival to Naruto, hellbent on revenge due to brother killing his clan, done. You really don't need anything else for a side character like Sasuke. So yeah, chances are this was done in an afternoon. However, that means Itachi was only created for giving Sasuke a goal. Everything else was literally pulled out of their asses on the fly. That means Itachi coming to the village was done on the fly, Sasuke retrieval, Valley of the End, etc. all were done on the fly. The problem people have with Sasuke being a last minute add on is because he's so integral to the story. He's the very crux of it himself. When Naruto's first chapter came out, the story was literally going nowhere and apparently Kishimoto was the one panicking and saying this. It was literally lightning in a bottle.

 

[Gorillion others]

https://ww1.mangafreak.me/Read1_Boruto_Two_Blue_Vortex_10

 

[Party Hat Wurmple]

https://ww1.mangafreak.me/Read1_Boruto_Two_Blue_Vortex_10

FINE. FINE. I WILL DO MY AUTISTIC MONTHLY BORUTO RANT RITUAL, JEEZ.

I Read Boruto TBV So You Don't Have To - Ch. 10.

Not gonna lie, I'm running thin on material for this chapter. Not a whole lot happens pacing wise. Most of the retardation happens in the beginning. So we'll start there.

We open with a cover art of Himawari and Kurama. I'm not particularly fond of it. Kurama and Naruto are supposed to be friends, and it's weird having him and his daughter look so antagonist towards each other. You figured maybe he would've told Himawari a bit about him, but I guess not. You could write off Kurama as being a new Kurama, but apparently as we'll find out later, Kurama remembers everything. Either way, you could take it or leave it, it's just cover art. It's just a quirk I find odd.

Inojin, Cho Cho, Shikadai, and Himawari are on a big bird fleeing the trees, Jura and Tree Sasuke. Konohamaru and his team show up confront the two though before they can make chase. He has a new design which I'm not sure I mentioned. He gets this new Kage style cloak but the rest of his design is very generic and makes him blend in. It's very strange, he doesn't stand out at all. Everyone else is over designed to hell but Konohamaru who's supposed to be important to this arc doesn't stand out. It's not a bad design, it's just a bland one. Either way, he shows up to stop them.

We cut to Shikamaru who talks with Kawaki and tells him to forget Boruto, Himawari is in danger. Kawaki says Shikamaru should've started with that and flies off to help. Nigga, just a chapter ago you didn't give a rats anus about Himawari. Boruto even TOLD YOU Himawari was in danger and you didn't give a shit. What the fucking hell? NOW you care? I guess I can write off this moment as Kawaki trying to keep up the illusion of Omnipotence, but he hasn't done anything like this before, so I think that's giving Ike and Kishi too much credit.

Boruto says he needs some time recover from his fight with Kawaki, and takes a few minutes. We cut to Jura and Sasuke and Konohamaru. Jura leaves Sasuke to deal with them and flies off after Himawari. I guess I'll take a moment to talk about the Divine Trees, one thing I will give Ike/Kishi credit for is that they really don't act like humans and don't understand simple concepts. Here, Sasuke doesn't understand why they're interfering with what they want to do. It's a rare compliment but so far these villains are leagues better than Code. Either way, Sarada shows up before a fight starts, Sasuke recognizes her and IMMEDIATELY attacks her with Chidori and she counters with her own. She says that's a Chidori just like hers and Dad's and asks who Tree Sasuke is.

Before we get an answer we cut back to Himawari. Kurama begins an exposition dump. Bottom line is, he explains that much like the audience he has no clue how he revived inside Himawari. And frankly, neither do Ike/Kishi. It's just because. We cut back to Himawari waking up on the bird and begging Kurama for help. He doesn't and Jura shoots down the ink bird. Cho-Cho grabs everyone and I shit you not...INFLATES HER STOMACH like a giant balloon to cushion their fall. Weird fetish moment, but also ow. Jura catches up to them and Himawari is still asking for help. Kurama says don't be a spoiled baby....Dick. Apparently it's her choice to quash or use his powers even though, she's been begging for dear life. Dick. The real kicker is Kurama says Himawari has a higher affinity to his chakra than even Naruto, because ya know....Gotta just shit on the OG even more than we have. So congrats Himawari, you're a full blown woke 2024 era Mary Sue. You're better than your dad for no reason at all other than existing.

Kurama says in order to use his power she just has to believe in herself...so she charges Jura and he tosses her aside like a rag doll. Seriously, new Kurama is a fucking ass hole. Jura traps Himawari and prepares to make her a tree. Inojin jumps in to save her, making Jura question why, before stabbing him through the chest with roots. I'm sure he'll be fine. This is Boruto. Nobody dies in Boruto. I don't even know why they bothered with this fake out death. Nobody buys it. He'll reveal a substitute or clone next chapter. Or just get revived later with karma. Somehow. If he actually dies here, Neji is no longer the most pointless death in anime then. Either way, chapter ends with Kurama FINALLY helping. So....Kurama doesn't help until a kid gets stabbed through the chest. What a prick. Keep in mind, he helped Naruto whenever he asked for it. He has no seal this time. He can help Himawari whenever he God damn feels like it and just chooses not to. What an ass hole...

Either way, art this chapter was actually a touch above the level we've come to expect. I could easily tell what was going on during the fights. The pacing and paneling was just slow. Not the worst chapter, just a lot of awkward characterization being needlessly drawn out in some places and not on what I think the audience wants to see. I mean, I don't know about anyone else but I don't give a rats anus about Himawari, I'd rather see Sarada and Sasuke. But that will get its own dedicated 40 page chapter later which is fine.

 

[Gorillion others]

Not the worst chapter

Not the-? Just reading a summary of this chapter makes me go, "HUH?!" Reading the chapter halfway gave me a headache.

 

[Party Hat Wurmple]

Not the-? Just reading a summary of this chapter makes me go, "HUH?!" Reading the chapter halfway gave me a headache.

Meh, I struggled finding things to talk about this time. The art was mostly fine. I could follow things easily. My biggest issue art wise was Konohamaru, but everything else was easy to follow and somewhat on model. Most of the problem with fighting chapters is that fighting is relatively boring in the scope of the grand narrative. Unless they're going to try to make it interesting, it just needs to have the art going for it to be effective.

 

[RybenZ999]

Something I've been wondering, where is Sakura? Her closest friend is presumed dead and her husband is once again labelled a traitor. How come we haven't seen anything from her recently?

 

[Party Hat Wurmple]

Something I've been wondering, where is Sakura? Her closest friend is presumed dead and her husband is once again labelled a traitor. How come we haven't seen anything from her recently?

Sakura is off doing.....Sakura things. I really don't know. I was going to save this rant for when I inevitably post my thoughts on the first 5 chapters, but this is a massive problem.

The real problem with Boruto, TBV's plot is that it's really asking people to pretend the OG Naruto never happened. Sasuke betrays the village to help Boruto after he killed Naruto, his surrogate father? And his daughter, Sarada is in Shikamaru, the Hokage's office screaming about how they're all under a spell called Omnipotence and Boruto and Kawaki switched places? That doesn't sound like anything Sasuke would do. Shikamaru should be able to figure that out. Sakura to our knowledge doesn't buy it either apparently and trusts her daughter but that's all we hear about her. You'd imagine as Naruto's partner since childhood, she'd have more sway in this village. Hell, Shikamaru is a genius but this plot basically REQUIRES him to be a dense retard in order to slip any of this by his watchful eyes. Kawaki ain't a genius, he's not hiding Omnipotence at all. He's an ass hole to everyone around him for no reason. It's not like he's cleverly pretending that he's Boruto to dupe everyone.

That's why none of the OG characters really show up in TBV, at least I think so. Their mere presence and existence and knowledge of Sasuke and Naruto as people and who they are, would just rip the plot on half. They KNOW Sasuke isn't a traitor. They KNOW something isn't right. Sasuke is a man who saved the planet, multiple times. Then he teams up with Naruto's supposed killer? That's a hard fucking pill and it's extremely unreasonable to ask any of the OG cast to buy it. So yeah, Sakura doesn't show up more because she would snap the story in literal two by just being there.

 

[Incecticyder]

Hi, new here.

Kishimoto deserves a A LOT of shit for forgetting characters, plotpoints, his own worldbuilding and retconing everything instead of finding ways to fit in his new ideas to his existing work etc etc. Shukaku being a Tailed Beast is my favourite as he could have said that the story about him being a dead priest was just mythology that sprang up from misconception (people do not have to be omniscient) but that would require commitment to continuity. Or how about how Gaara 's level 1 cloak lacks the bubbly red chackra every other Jinchiruki has (they could have made it so that every Tailed Beast cloak look different and Shukaku would not be an outlier but that would be too much as well).

Ok, now for the main course. I noticed that nobody talked about the biggest plot hole in Boruto!
The newspapers, articles and archives of the world! That bitch Ada can affect memories but she can't do shit about physical stuff! Every newspaper or internet article that says"Naruto 's wife gave birth to a son and his name is Boruto" or "Boruto, son of the Hokage, cheated on the Chunin exams" has been preserved in full! Same goes for the ones that announce the adoption of Kawaki by Naruto or all the photos of Boruto lying around such as those from his childhood or his class photos from the academy! If the established rules for Omnipotence are at play, when you realise there are inconsistences, you are cured! If the folk that handle archives or go through old articles out of boredom or whatever start talking to their friends and family about what they found, news would be spread around the world and Omnipotence would have been undone within the time skip. The only way they could have come up with this plot hole filled plot is if they forgot things such as news articles, photos and arcives exist in Naruto!

TLDR; Kishimoto is a much bigger hack than you thought and he stopped putting effort to his story a while ago.

 

[Party Hat Wurmple]

If the established rules for Omnipotence are at play, when you realise there are inconsistences, you are cured! If the folk that handle archives or go through old articles out of boredom or whatever start talking to their friends and family about what they found, news would be spread around the world and Omnipotence would have been undone within the time skip. The only way they could have come up with this plot hole filled plot is if they forgot things such as news articles, photos and arcives exist in Naruto!

So, that problem has been brought up numerous times and has received several retconned explanations in the first five chapters. (Seriously, it's a fucking mess.)

The first retcon they try to do is simply say people don't believe evidence, they listen to what their memories tell them. Yes, I'm not fucking lying. The reason they don't believe pictures and stuff of Boruto and Naruto is because they legitimately simply "don't believe evidence". There's a panel in chapter 2 or 3 where Sarada says this. They literally tried to hand wave this away. That didn't work. For the editors, or the readers apparently.

Our second retcon is that swap DOES transfer to some physical items like photos. People will look at a photo of Boruto and see Kawaki and vice versa. It doesn't apply to everything but it applies to some things. However that's also a bunk retcon because the internet exists in Boruto's world so....yeah.

We got our last retcon a few chapters ago and that's the fact that once someone breaks out of Omnipotence, they'll eventually forget about it and be placed back under it again. Borutards like to pretend this isn't a retcon, but Kishi and Ike tried and failed to explain Omnipotence multiple times to just utter failure. At least this time, we have an official catch-all reason. Mind you, they had a year and a half to figure out the finer details of this thing. In universe, they had 3 years. Instead Sarada and Sumire basically sit on their asses.

Omnipotence is just a giant fucking mess and that seems to be why the current status quo is to just let it go. It's why we rushed into this Divine Trees arc so quickly. I think Kishimoto/Ike realized how much of a friggin mess Omnipotence was and wanted to get away from it as quickly as possible. Every time Omnipotence is mentioned in the story though, it's a friggin headache and a paragraph of me complaining.