Mega Rad Gun Thread
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- Joined
- Feb 17, 2018
Fudds are the worst. I hate them more than anti gunners.
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- Oct 2, 2018
Speaking of already having the itch, are the Arsenal Bulgarian AKs worth the extra 3-400 over the WASRs or PAPs?
- Joined
- Feb 17, 2018
From the look of shotshow, it's going to be a good year for ak. I'd wait and see what hits the market.
- Joined
- Jun 9, 2016
depends on what you want out of a rifle - in my personal opinion they are very well made.
Petey Wheatstraw
kiwifarms.net
- Joined
- Dec 28, 2019
Looking to build my first AR and looking for suggestions on uppers. I wanted to build a CAR-15 tribute so I bought an Anderson lower and parts kit along with a CAR stock and original M16 pistol grip, but I'm not sure what upper to get to finish off the build. Buying this as a range toy in 5.56 so that I can get my partner into guns, but might want to convert it later into .300 Blackout for hunting things. Del-Ton seems to make decent upper assemblies for the money but I'm looking for other CAR-ish uppers at a sub-300 cost that aren't PSA...
- Joined
- Jun 9, 2016
a fairly "correct" one would be a model 733/735, possibly with an older xm177 from Troy or something: https://retrorifles.com/colt-733-commando-735-c8-6933-movies-black-hawk-down-heat/
i used, and still use a rather retro (now at least) early 80's model 733 as a handy carbine. it is quite loud in doors, but is small enough that it will not feel "big" to new shooters. be aware that you should try to use an H or heavier buffer depending on the precise gas system (gas port size, position, et c) for the barrel you are purchasing. the model 733 never had consistent specifications and over the years of production would be seen with A1, A1E1, and A2 parts with only a handful of unique parts (pencil profile 10.5 to 11.5 barrel, FSB with the bayonet lug milled off, single heat shield carbine handguards, two or four position carbine buffer tubes, et c).
Brownell's has a pretty competitive one in their retro line as well: https://www.brownells.com/rifle-par...upper-receivers-complete-5-56-prod123698.aspx
if you are looking for a more modern M16 Commando, you would want to review model 933 uppers, which are less expensive since the parts are produced in greater quantities than the older patterns. lots of clones out there, most being high quality (considering the two important criteria are an 11.5" barrel in a "pencil" profile: https://palmettostatearmory.com/psa-11-5-5-56-nato-1-7-nitride-upper-with-bcg-charging-handle.html
.300 AAC Blackout would require a new barrel in 1:10 or for bullets heavier than 180gr, 1:8, readily available from quality retailers.
MrJokerRager
kiwifarms.net
- Joined
- Nov 2, 2019
Went to a gun store recently and learned that you can have pistol grips on AR style rifles if they fire 22lr ammo.
Also the guy sells mosins and other ww2 rifles if the 400 to 600 dollar range. Is the Mosin full barrel or the carbine better?
Also the guy sells mosins and other ww2 rifles if the 400 to 600 dollar range. Is the Mosin full barrel or the carbine better?
- Joined
- Mar 17, 2019
In my personal opinion the M44 carbine (short length version with fixed side-folding bayonet) is the coolest of the post-WWI Mosin variants. Although if you've never shot something with a such a short barrel that fires a full power rifle round, I'd recommend if at all possible you try shooting one belonging to somebody else before you buy one. Not everybody enjoys the experience.
From what I've seen in US northeast market, the going rate is about $300 for a round receiver Mosin M91/30 in good condition, and about $400 for an M38 or M44. If someone is charging more than that, they're probably trying to gouge you unless the gun they have for sale is an unusual example with more desirable/rare features.
If you post what specific things he has you were interested in, and the amounts asked, I can give a rough guess as to if it's a fair price or not, as well as some pointers on what to look for if buying one.
I mentioned a bit back in the thread, but the price of M91/30 and other Mosin-Nagants has absolutely skyrocketed in the last few years, to the point where they're no longer a good cheap entry point to get into surplus collecting. There are much better options now in the same approximate price range.
- Joined
- Feb 7, 2018
If you want to go a on the unique exotic side and are willing to spend a little under 500$ you can go with a Wolf A1 upper: https://www.atlanticfirearms.com/products/wolf-a1-upper
It's the import version of the upper used on the Taiwan's military assault rifle the T91, a piston system that's similar to the H&K offering for quite a bit less.
400 to 600$ for a Mosin? That's pretty steep for something that isn't a sniper model or a Cadillac quality Finnish or American contract WWI model. Call me out of date with my old man yelling at clouds but I got my 91/30 less than a decade ago for 120 bucks with all the bells and whistles and save for the wood needing a good revarnishing was in cherry condition.
- Joined
- Sep 1, 2016
Yeah assault weapon regs only cover centerfire, not 22LR. Also a note re: Club Sandwich's comments above, if you're in california (given your mention of pistol grips) all NFS items (e.g. barrels shorter than 16") are banned, and AR pistols are assault weapons (and all AR receivers are automatically registered as "'rifles").
- Joined
- Feb 7, 2018
Welcome to the club now lets see Paul Allen's card:I ended up joining Deagle nation.
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- Joined
- Mar 17, 2019
Nah, same here. I bought a very nice 1931 hex receiver Izhevsk 91/30 around 2014 for $125, and like yours it included the full kit (cleaning and disassembly tools, ammo pouches, sling, bayonet). Every gun show had at least one vendor with a crate of them packed in straw, and you could usually pick through it looking for particularly nice or desirable ones. Unfortunately, those days (not too long ago) are probably never coming back.
My understanding is that the pipeline bringing imported ex-Soviet military surplus to the US originated in Ukraine and it was permanently disrupted by the 2014 Russian annexation of Crimea (thanks, Putin). As supplies of new imports dried up, previously bargain-priced Russian guns like Makarovs, Nagant revolvers, and M91/30s have more than tripled in the past half decade.
As horrifying as it is, these price increases are across the board, so ones that were already expensive before have increased by the same amount over that time frame. SVT-40s are pushing $2000, genuine M91/30PU snipers over $1000 (although the market is absolutely flooded with reproductions and fakes, so the real value could be even higher), Finnish rebuilt or [SA] marked Finn capture guns pushing $450-600. You're unlikely to find a non-rebuilt M1891 in any condition for less than $450, and the really desirable manufacturers (New England Westinghouse, Remington, Chatellerault and Sestroryetsk) are priced at $550+.
The only silver lining on the clouds is that people don't really seem to be buying Mosins or other ex-Soviet junk at these prices, so it's possible they might eventually stabilize and even start coming back down. We can only hope.
- Joined
- Feb 7, 2018
You must be in Canada because I have never for the life of me seen a SVT in the wild but from what I hear they sent a shitton up North and they were going for pretty cheap like sub $1000. Something to do with the import laws on milsurp firearms, also they get those Norinco M1A clones that can be hit or miss but you get what you pay for.
- Joined
- Mar 17, 2019
Northeast USA here. SVT-40s have become one of those things (like Type 2 "Paratrooper" takedown Arisakas, G43s, scoped M1C/M1D Garands, Johnson rifles, etc.) that can usually be found at large gun shows, but with insane price tags that ensure no one would actually buy them. If I was more cynical I'd suggest that guns like that are only brought out to shows to flex your personal collection on the poors, but maybe they see it as a way to generate interest in traffic for their table. I've probably seen at least five SVT-40s in the last few months at shows.
There were probably two dozen SVT-40s, and at least one unicorn SVT-38, sold in RIAC's most recent sporting & collector auction for similarly outrageous prices.
I have also heard they're more common in Canada but cannot personally confirm. If so, the Canadians do not deserve them.
MrJokerRager
kiwifarms.net
- Joined
- Nov 2, 2019
This is his collection for sale. I also dig the Lee Enfield but it was made in India in the 1960s according to what the clerk told me. Also has a original mauser and a communist yugoslavia mauser.
Also to settle the debate, is the AK-47 based off the STG-44 or the Mosin Nagant? I have read different accounts of how the famous rifle came into existence and the clerk believed its based of the STG-44.
- Joined
- Feb 1, 2015
I've never shot an M44, but I have heard that the muzzle flash and report, to say nothing of the recoil, are insane compared to the full length M91/30. You see lots of photos of Soviet frontoviks carrying the M44 around in late war urban combat like in Berlin, but I can only imagine that they'd be rendered completely blind and deaf trying to fire one of those things indoors.
There's definitely something to be said for having a long enough barrel length to burn off most of the powder and enough mass to give some inertial dampening to the recoil. I imagine that is a big part of the reasoning behind why many countries standardized on the "short" or "universal" rifle (ie midway between carbine and full length)
There's definitely something to be said for having a long enough barrel length to burn off most of the powder and enough mass to give some inertial dampening to the recoil. I imagine that is a big part of the reasoning behind why many countries standardized on the "short" or "universal" rifle (ie midway between carbine and full length)
- Joined
- Mar 17, 2019
As a general rule, seeing that $424.99 tag on what appears to be a regular old Mosin 91/30 makes me think you should probably avoid the place. That is an absolutely delusional price.
Postwar Indian Enfields (made by Rifle Factory Ishapore and marked "R.F.I.") are generally not very well thought of by collectors, with a poor reputation for fit/finish. They're probably the most obtainable and affordable Enfield pattern gun, though. Don't pay full price for one. If you decide you want an Enfield there's a long list of things you should check, which I can elaborate on in an effortpost although I think British Muzzleloaders or one of the other anglo historical gun youtubers did a pretty good in-depth special about inspecting Enfield rifles before buying.
"Yugoslavian Mauser" typically refers specifically to the postwar Zastava M48. They're an interesting Mauser action variant, much closer to the Belgian FN Model 24 than the German Karabiner 98k they're usually advertised as being a copy of. Build quality is usually quite good, and they tend to be in very good condition because they were rarely used and apparently carefully maintained in storage. They're one of the best bargain milsurp bolt actions you can get right now, as the market for them is very saturated due to a large volume of recent imports, and they're not considered "cool" in the same way WWII-era Mauser action guns tend to be. You can probably snag one for $350-450 and I'd consider that a good value.
Quite correct. All full power short military rifles of that type (M38 and M44 Mosin carbines, Mannlicher M.95 "Stutzen" carbines, Berthier Mousquetons, No. 5 Mk. I Enfields, etc.) tend to be pretty brutal as far as recoil and muzzle blast go. The M.95 is in my opinion the worst of the lot in that regard, but the M38/M44 Mosin is a close second. Some people (like me) think that makes them more fun to shoot, but for others they're just unpleasant, which is why I always recommend trying a gun of that type before you buy.
Edit to add:
AK and StG – Kissing Cousins
When people see the AK-47 and the StG-44 side by side an know nothing about their internal mechanisms, the nearly universal assumption is that one is a copy of the other. The overall layout of the …
www.forgottenweapons.com
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- Joined
- Jun 9, 2016
i'm assuming you live in a state (like California) that has a prohibition on pistol grips on semi-automatic centerfire rifles. the key word there is centerfire. .22LR is not centerfire, ergo you can generally have whatever "evil features" you would like on it, as long as it meets other regulations. likewise a manual action rifle can have a pistol grip even if it's centerfire.
what you must be careful of is making sure that you meet other assault weapon laws as defined in your jurisdiction - overall length, prohibited features, magazine size and design, et c.
$400-$600 is probably a bit too much for a 91/30 in average condition but decent for a shooter condition Lee-Enfield No. 1 Mk III or a 7mm Mauser export rifle (1909 Brazilian for example or a Turkish contract 8mm). none of these would be collectible, really, but would be excellent and inexpensive hunting rifles.
you can find good condition 91/30 Mosin-Nagant rifles (say, Spanish Civil War surplus) for under $400 if you shop around.
not quite true. it's possible to create a .22LR "assault weapon" if it's a pistol with a magazine outside the grip, or a rimfire AR receiver you made yourself and registered as a pistol that has a fixed magazine of 10 rounds or less, and so on.
AR receivers are not automatically registered as anything in CA (barring the importation declaration or the manufacturer doing the transfer to another manufacturer or to a dealer). you can transfer them as an a pistol, a rifle, or as an "other".
however the problem arises with the CA DOJ's roster of approved handguns for sale. it only affects transfers from dealers, not firearms you manufacture yourself into a pistol... however with the passage of AB-857 you have compulsory markings that you must apply to the DOJ to receive and then apply to the pistol which you must then build within 30 days into a compliant pistol configuration, following all other applicable laws.
even then, there is some dubiousness as such a pistol can very easy fall into "assault weapon" definitions as it has a pistol grip and has a magazine outside that grip and assuming the builder follows typical AR-15 conventions and parts, it would be semi-automatic. you would have to have a fixed magazine ("requiring disassembly of the action") of 10 rounds or less and no ability to accept more than 10 rounds, which is taken to mean it can't look like a normal magazine with a false lower area or something.
the only good deal on that rack is the Vz.24 for $350. the rest is either retail average (Zastava M48 for $500), slightly overpriced "for convenience" which can be reasonable or not depending on where you are (Mosin-Nagant 91/30 for $430 is okay assuming it's in very good shape with some accessories), to very overpriced (that's a very rough looking Indian Lee-Enfield for $500, and it's missing the magazine too).
the original AK-47 is mechanically closer to the M1 Garand and many design cues from the StG. 44. it had no relation to the Simonov designs or Degtyaryov who also were contemporaries doing weapons design. the long stroke gas piston and the bolt and receiver rails and machining plans are very similar to the action of the M1 Garand, while the breech block and magazine (and sturmgewehr concept) originated with the StG. 44. Sergei Mosin and even less Leon Nagant had nothing to do with it.
- Joined
- Jun 2, 2019
I build out my first lower last weekend. Couple scratches on the finish, but nothing too terrible. No broken or lost parts, mag seats well, hammer works, I’m really pretty happy with myself, it was a great experience.
The only thing I’m paranoid about are the trigger and hammer pins, because only one of the three guides told me what side to put in first, and even then it was unclear. I didn’t even think of it until after the buffer tube was installed (not staked though, I’m not doing that till I know the fucker actually works). The trigger works smoothly for now, but I’ll keep an eye on it. No I haven’t been dry firing it, just pulling the trigger while holding the hammer and walking it down.
Now to just wait until I can afford an upper. I’m probably going to just a get a completed upper for simplicity, but I still intend to dig in there and really get a feel for how it works.
@MrJokerRager
There was a WWII era Czech rifle that likely influenced the design as well, at least in terms of the mechanics. The STG-44’s contribution was mainly its design philosophy; a more manageable intermediate cartridge that could be reasonably effective in fully automatic fire. The Soviets developed the AK as a successor to their line of sub-machine guns and some documents even show they referred to it as one. Their combat doctrine emphasized volume of fire as opposed to individual marksmanship, and the STG was the first weapon they faced that took the idea to heart, while still being very effective at typical combat ranges where pistol caliber SMG’s struggled.
The only thing I’m paranoid about are the trigger and hammer pins, because only one of the three guides told me what side to put in first, and even then it was unclear. I didn’t even think of it until after the buffer tube was installed (not staked though, I’m not doing that till I know the fucker actually works). The trigger works smoothly for now, but I’ll keep an eye on it. No I haven’t been dry firing it, just pulling the trigger while holding the hammer and walking it down.
Now to just wait until I can afford an upper. I’m probably going to just a get a completed upper for simplicity, but I still intend to dig in there and really get a feel for how it works.
@MrJokerRager
Czech M14: The ZK-420S Battle Rifle at James D Julia
The ZK-420S is an experimental Czech rifle that is virtually unknown today, but which was remarkably influential, bearing significant elements of the Garand and several other Czech designs, and inf…
www.forgottenweapons.com
There was a WWII era Czech rifle that likely influenced the design as well, at least in terms of the mechanics. The STG-44’s contribution was mainly its design philosophy; a more manageable intermediate cartridge that could be reasonably effective in fully automatic fire. The Soviets developed the AK as a successor to their line of sub-machine guns and some documents even show they referred to it as one. Their combat doctrine emphasized volume of fire as opposed to individual marksmanship, and the STG was the first weapon they faced that took the idea to heart, while still being very effective at typical combat ranges where pistol caliber SMG’s struggled.
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