Mega Rad Gun Thread

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I think the ATF ruling said that rifle length barrels or other extensions on a lower originally designated as a pistol do not change the firearm classification.
if the lower was manufactured or transferred as a pistol, you can freely rebuild it into a rifle configuration (16" barrel, 26" overall length, shoulder stock, et c). you can revert it back to it's pistol configuration (no shoulder stock pretty much, although typically this is also a barrel shorter than 16" or shorter overall length than 26").

it is generally considered constructive intent to have a short barreled upper and either a rifle lower or any such frame or receiver in a rifle configuration under your control in such a manner where it would be trivial to combine the upper with the firearm (lower) to create an unregistered short barreled rifle.

if this is confusing, i would recommend sticking to a complete pistol or rifle configuration and not mix and match with odd spare parts laying around in a ready-to-use manner. the crux of constructive intent is where you have no other purpose for a configured upper or lower except in such a way that it would be trivial to combine them into an unregistered SBR. even having an SBR upper and zero pistol or stripped lowers can be construed as constructive intent on the face of a complaint or arrest for such.

your stated intent of having a pistol-configured lower with a typical rifle upper is fine, as described.
 
Is the QC on WASR/N-Paps as bad as the memes make them out to be?
 
Is the QC on WASR/N-Paps as bad as the memes make them out to be?
the WASR series is Romanian and made by Cugir. they've been on the market for a long time and while they generally function fine, it is Century Arms that does the inspection in the US prior to selling to distributors and retailers. the "canted front sight" can also include canted gas blocks, canted trunnions, and sometimes canted barrels. i would not recommend purchasing one unless you examine it yourself.

the NPAP is part of the PAP series from Serbia and made by Zastava. and has been on the market since the 90's (imported through EAA in Florida back then) and while new models sometimes had teething issues, the biggest difference is that the PAP rifles are all milled receivers instead of stamped steel, and consequently are more expensive, heavier, and more "quirky" to work on if that's your thing, complete with some unique M70/Yugoslavian type parts that will not work with other AK's.

as both are imported rifles, they must be imported in a certain configuration, which is typically a single-stack magazine well that is milled out in the US, along with other parts being swapped around. if you do not have a rifle already converted to a "normal" configuration, the PAP rifles will be more difficult to work with as the milled receiver more or less requires an end mill and some minor welding and filing to properly perform a conversion. on the flip side, the WASR is just stamped sheet metal and easier to work with, and unlike the PAP (typically unless they've changed that recently) the WASR will have a chrome-lined barrel.

it should be noted that the NPAP never had a single stack configuration, that was the "Gen 1" PAP M70 rifle from around 1999. the NPAP (or PAP Gen 2) feeds from a normal double stack magazine, and they were imported with 10 round "shorty" magazines which are just cut down AKM magazines with a plastic follower and floorplate.

personally, if you just want an AK rifle that will shoot minute of man, is cheap to own and operate, both with do the business, with the WASR probably better suited as a beater rifle. the NPAP is probably a bit better all-around, and will generally require little, if any, adjustments - assuming you aren't looking to get a lot of accessories for it.
 
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I have an old Para-Tac 4, and it is starting to have some feed issues after many thousands of rounds have been put through it.

It was a fairly nice .45 acp handgun with a 13+1 rd capacity.

I was wondering if any of you guys knew a modern upgrade/replacement that won't break the bank.

Preferably in the same caliber just so that I can have something that shoots .45 that isn't a 1911.
Para-Ordnance made the Tac 4 more or less a clone of the P13-45, except with a light double action trigger. they are a little too similar: they share Para's weak early extractor material that would wear prematurely and some magazine incompatibility and edge cases prior to the introduction of the power extractor... which still had some issues, but at least didn't break as often.

1. try different ammunition - hollow points, or really any ammunition with a meplat (the "tip" of the bullet is flat instead of a rounded ogive) can interact with the feed ramp or other parts of the barrel/slide/frame differently than typical ball ammunition. make sure that an ammunition change isn't your culprit.
2. make sure your issue isn't magazine-specific. try using a different magazine for a while, see if there is a difference between magazines in terms of fit or function - take a known good and known bad one apart (keep them separated) and compare the parts. sometimes with stamped magazines, the welding can be slightly uneven and cause a hiccup in the movement of the follower or spring - enough to prevent reliable presentation of the round to the breech face for feeding.
3. if 1 and 2 aren't the culprit, closely examine the failure mode: with deactivated ammunition or a dummy cartridge load a few into the magazine and do a function check that the slide isn't catching, that the slide moves into battery smartly and that the extractor snaps over the rim of the cartridge (do a press check by slightly drawing the slide back to make sure the cartridge is easily held to the breech face by the extractor). if your failure mode occurs, see what position (bullet nose up, nose down, bullet catching on something, et c) and what step (feeding from the magazine, loading into the chamber, moving into battery, removing from battery, extracting, ejecting) the failure occurs on.

some common issues:
1. on many Para-Ordnance 1911 designs (P13 and Tac-4 included), the ramp is built into the barrel (known as the Para-Clark ramp) and this ramp can pick up debris or burrs with high round counts. this is unlikely in a few thousand rounds, but it's a solid idea to clean it with acetone or something and run a fingernail gently across the surface to determine any imperfections.
2. 1911 based designs require at least 3 points of contact for the bullet to function reliably. this is called "controlled feeding" and they are:
2a. when feeding: the top rear of the case is touching the interior rear of the magazine, the case is being presented by the feed lips of the magazine, and the bottom of the case is pushed upwards by the magazine follower or next cartridge. the top rear of the case is briefly touching the bottom of the ejector. the cartridge is almost entirely horizontal.
2b. when chambering: the top rear of the case is touching the lower portion of the breech face, the case is being held by the feed lips of the magazine, the tip of the bullet is touching the feed ramp, the bottom of the case is holding the case against the bottom of the ejector. the cartridge is pitched upwards as the feed lips "let go" of the front of the case and the ejector acts as a pivot point for the upwards force of the magazine follower or next cartridge. if chambering is done slowly enough, the bullet can "pop-up" and misfeed - this is a magazine problem either with feed lip geometry, follower geometry, or the magazine spring is slightly too strong or the action/recoil spring is too light.
2c. when locking: the rear of the case is being pushed forwards into the chamber by the breech face, the case is released by the magazine feed lips entirely and the extractor slips over the rim of the case and hold the case to the breech face. the ejector no longer touches the case as the slide moves into battery. the tip of the bullet touches the underside of the barrel hood which guides the cartridge into the chamber, the bottom of the case is touching the feed ramp briefly which guides the cartridge into the chamber. the next cartridge should be touching the bottom of the slide now.
2d. when extracting: the top and bottom of the case is surrounded by the barrel, the rear of the case is held to the breech face by the extractor on the rim of the cartridge. the case is almost entirely horizontal.
2e. when ejecting: the rear of the case is being held to the breech face by the extractor, the ejector impinges upon the left rear portion of the case, pitching the case against the extractor's leverage as the slide continues rearward. this combination throws the case outwards and to the upper right (from the view of the shooter) as the extractor releases the spent case and the cycle begins again.

check that your pistol conforms to the 3 points of contact rule. another thing i see sometimes is improper lubrication - try to either use a film lubricant like molybdenum disulfide based products, white lithium grease, or something similar. light machine oils tend to get gummy with exposure to carbon, requiring gas-actuated system to "flush" itself with each cycle. recoil operated firearms tend to cycle slower and can leave a carbon residue with light machine oil, which can make the feed ramp or other parts a bit gritty. if you clean thoroughly every few hundred rounds, then light machine oil should be fine if applied with a light touch (enough to be slick, but not feel oily to the fingertip).

special note on the Para extractor - check that the body or claw isn't cracked with a strong light and your finger nail. it's thin extruded metal and a cracked extractor sleeve can widen enough during a firing cycle to have a failure to extract or eject sometimes. the claw's interior surface (the surface that actually pulls on the case rim) should be very slightly concave by a few degrees and have a sharpness to the edge - not rounded or convex.
 
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Para-Ordnance made the Tac 4 more or less a clone of the P13-45, except with a light double action trigger. they are a little too similar: they share Para's weak early extractor material that would wear prematurely and some magazine incompatibility and edge cases prior to the introduction of the power extractor... which still had some issues, but at least didn't break as often.

1. try different ammunition - hollow points, or really any ammunition with a meplat (the "tip" of the bullet is flat instead of a rounded ogive) can interact with the feed ramp or other parts of the barrel/slide/frame differently than typical ball ammunition. make sure that an ammunition change isn't your culprit.
2. make sure your issue isn't magazine-specific. try using a different magazine for a while, see if there is a difference between magazines in terms of fit or function - take a known good and known bad one apart (keep them separated) and compare the parts. sometimes with stamped magazines, the welding can be slightly uneven and cause a hiccup in the movement of the follower or spring - enough to prevent reliable presentation of the round to the breech face for feeding.
3. if 1 and 2 aren't the culprit, closely examine the failure mode: with deactivated ammunition or a dummy cartridge load a few into the magazine and do a function check that the slide isn't catching, that the slide moves into battery smartly and that the extractor snaps over the rim of the cartridge (do a press check by slightly drawing the slide back to make sure the cartridge is easily held to the breech face by the extractor). if your failure mode occurs, see what position (bullet nose up, nose down, bullet catching on something, et c) and what step (feeding from the magazine, loading into the chamber, moving into battery, removing from battery, extracting, ejecting) the failure occurs on.

some common issues:
1. on many Para-Ordnance 1911 designs (P13 and Tac-4 included), the ramp is built into the barrel (known as the Para-Clark ramp) and this ramp can pick up debris or burrs with high round counts. this is unlikely in a few thousand rounds, but it's a solid idea to clean it with acetone or something and run a fingernail gently across the surface to determine any imperfections.
2. 1911 based designs require at least 3 points of contact for the bullet to function reliably. this is called "controlled feeding" and they are:
2a. when feeding: the top rear of the case is touching the interior rear of the magazine, the case is being presented by the feed lips of the magazine, and the bottom of the case is pushed upwards by the magazine follower or next cartridge. the top rear of the case is briefly touching the bottom of the ejector. the cartridge is almost entirely horizontal.
2b. when chambering: the top rear of the case is touching the lower portion of the breech face, the case is being held by the feed lips of the magazine, the tip of the bullet is touching the feed ramp, the bottom of the case is holding the case against the bottom of the ejector. the cartridge is pitched upwards as the feed lips "let go" of the front of the case and the ejector acts as a pivot point for the upwards force of the magazine follower or next cartridge. if chambering is done slowly enough, the bullet can "pop-up" and misfeed - this is a magazine problem either with feed lip geometry, follower geometry, or the magazine spring is slightly too strong or the action/recoil spring is too light.
2c. when locking: the rear of the case is being pushed forwards into the chamber by the breech face, the case is released by the magazine feed lips entirely and the extractor slips over the rim of the case and hold the case to the breech face. the ejector no longer touches the case as the slide moves into battery. the tip of the bullet touches the underside of the barrel hood which guides the cartridge into the chamber, the bottom of the case is touching the feed ramp briefly which guides the cartridge into the chamber. the next cartridge should be touching the bottom of the slide now.
2d. when extracting: the top and bottom of the case is surrounded by the barrel, the rear of the case is held to the breech face by the extractor on the rim of the cartridge. the case is almost entirely horizontal.
2e. when ejecting: the rear of the case is being held to the breech face by the extractor, the ejector impinges upon the left rear portion of the case, pitching the case against the extractor's leverage as the slide continues rearward. this combination throws the case outwards and to the upper right (from the view of the shooter) as the extractor releases the spent case and the cycle begins again.

check that your pistol conforms to the 3 points of contact rule. another thing i see sometimes is improper lubrication - try to either use a film lubricant like molybdenum disulfide based products, white lithium grease, or something similar. light machine oils tend to get gummy with exposure to carbon, requiring gas-actuated system to "flush" itself with each cycle. recoil operated firearms tend to cycle slower and can leave a carbon residue with light machine oil, which can make the feed ramp or other parts a bit gritty. if you clean thoroughly every few hundred rounds, then light machine oil should be fine if applied with a light touch (enough to be slick, but not feel oily to the fingertip).

special note on the Para extractor - check that the body or claw isn't cracked with a strong light and your finger nail. it's thin extruded metal and a cracked extractor sleeve can widen enough during a firing cycle to have a failure to extract or eject sometimes. the claw's interior surface (the surface that actually pulls on the case rim) should be very slightly concave by a few degrees and have a sharpness to the edge - not rounded or convex.
Thank you very much for your very informative post. I learned a lot.

It will take me a few days to start diagnosis with your new information (I need to locate a verified magazine as mine might just be worn, and some snap-caps, and dig the gun out of the safe), but I will most definitely update when I get the chance.

I will say that the ammunition wasn't the problem. I knew about the hollow-point issue for a while, as I had to figure that out the hard way myself a few years before this new feed problem came along.

As for the lubricant, is there a specific brand(s) you recommend?

Thank you again, you have been a great help already.
 
I knew about the hollow-point issue for a while, as I had to figure that out the hard way myself a few years before this new feed problem came along.
Remington Golden Saber has been a very reliable product for JHP's since the early 90's and was popular for law enforcement in both revolvers and those that stuck with 1911's. earlier than that you had SJHP (semi-jacketed hollow point) rounds that were a carry over from breaching teams (pre-SWAT) that had a shield, body armor, and a Charter Arms .44 Bulldog. SJHP's are still a popular choice for .44 Magnum, and you can find them for .45 from Fiocchi, Magtech, Remington, and some others (Remington's Scalloped SJHP is pretty good in most Series 70 and 80, as well as the Para Warthog). picky 1911's that don't work well with modern HST, GD, or V-Crown stuff might perform much better with SJHP or Golden Saber.

As for the lubricant, is there a specific brand(s) you recommend?
Lubriplate works very well and is inexpensive, applied sparingly (a pea sized portion should be sufficient to apply in a nearly-transparent film to all bearing surfaces on a standard 1911, if in doubt a little dot won't hurt anything) with a non-absorbent applicator or cloth (or finger, et c). the precise product is Lubriplate 130-A (or AA if you have match parts or use +P ammunition which wear harder on bearing surfaces).
 
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I would keep anything, that isn't your regular weapon, separated just as a matter of routine (I never know what combo I am going to take to the range next).

But in the end, unless you have someone gunning for you, or you are stupid on the internet, it really doesn't matter.
_
Edit: I guess I could ask here.

I have an old Para-Tac 4, and it is starting to have some feed issues after many thousands of rounds have been put through it.

For Reference:
View attachment 1111783

It was a fairly nice .45 acp handgun with a 13+1 rd capacity.

I was wondering if any of you guys knew a modern upgrade/replacement that won't break the bank.

Preferably in the same caliber just so that I can have something that shoots .45 that isn't a 1911.

I'm a big Heckler and Koch fan, and right now you can get the HK45 and the HK45 Compact for around $800. The capacity won't be as high as your ParaOrd, but they're excellent pistols that will last a lifetime and are extremely reliable. The HK45 Compact was adopted by USNAVSPECWAR/the SEALs as their official handgun. You can also get the USP 45 for about the same price and that holds 12+1, but they're a bit of a brick if you don't have largish hands.
 
Is the QC on WASR/N-Paps as bad as the memes make them out to be?
No.

WASRs got that reputation from the original WASR-10/63s having canted sights, improperly dremeled magwells, etc...
New production WASR-10s don't have these issues anymore, and even some of the older 10/63s are fine but you should thoroughly inspect them first.

NPAPs got that reputation from a mix of the Gen 1 PAP being improperly converted single-stack guns and Gen 2 NPAPs having Tapco G2 FCGs that would damage the bolt carrier (later production ones from 2015 onward have RAK-1 FCGs instead that fix this) and weak recoil springs (a $10 fix). The newest gun is the ZPAP and from what I hear has all of the previous issues ironed out. Some complain about the lack of a chrome-lined barrel on Yugo guns, but they are still good mil-spec barrels; they just need to be cleaned good especially after firing corrosive ammo. Also, the aftermarket for Yugos as far as furniture and spare parts is alot better now than it was a few years ago.

With both guns, replace the garbage balsa wood furniture with something better (I use Ironwood Designs laminate birch and a Yugo surplus pistol grip with my NPAP).
 
I would keep anything, that isn't your regular weapon, separated just as a matter of routine (I never know what combo I am going to take to the range next).

But in the end, unless you have someone gunning for you, or you are stupid on the internet, it really doesn't matter.
_
Edit: I guess I could ask here.

I have an old Para-Tac 4, and it is starting to have some feed issues after many thousands of rounds have been put through it.

For Reference:
View attachment 1111783

It was a fairly nice .45 acp handgun with a 13+1 rd capacity.

I was wondering if any of you guys knew a modern upgrade/replacement that won't break the bank.

Preferably in the same caliber just so that I can have something that shoots .45 that isn't a 1911.
Could be your extractor. Slowly hand cycle a few snap caps to see if the extractor is holding onto the rim too long, or is releasing the rim prematurely. You can pull the extractor out and give it a very gentle bend to tighten or loosen the extractor. Also, if your para has a typical 1911 extractor, they are inexpensive to replace.

Or just get an H&K, they arent expensive any more.
 
Are $70 acog 4x32s with the chevron sight from ebay a good beginners scope as I bought my first gun, the ruger 10/22 takedown a while ago?
ACOG (Advanced Combat Optical Gunsight) is generally around $1k, with used models often around $500. clones are very common, but are generally inexpensive LED driven optics which may or may not be magnified and are often a craps shoot in quality.

currently, in magnified optics, a fixed power Bushnell Banner 4x32 is tough to beat and versatile enough to stay with you through multiple firearms, despite it's $99 MSRP price point.

a step up might be a Vortex Crossfire II 2-7x32. MSRP of $149.99 with a generous eye relief, it's flexible to use, inexpensive for the quality of glass and features available (adjustable magnification , multi-coated lenses, et c) and Vortex Hunter scope rings are only $24.99. just like the Bushnell, it'll stay with you through multiple firearms.

"airsoft" quality scopes are fine for their intended use and on actual firearms can be a budget solution for someone that doesn't shoot often, or has a .22LR target rifle and isn't out in the wilderness or throwing their rifle in the bed of a truck. just be aware of what you're buying and make sure you know what you are getting.

Or just get an H&K, they arent expensive any more.
depends on the exact firearm. most H&K pistols are still on the upper end of the "average" pistol price range for example.
 
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ACOG (Advanced Combat Optical Gunsight) is generally around $1k, with used models often around $500. clones are very common, but are generally inexpensive LED driven optics which may or may not be magnified and are often a craps shoot in quality.

currently, in magnified optics, a fixed power Bushnell Banner 4x32 is tough to beat and versatile enough to stay with you through multiple firearms, despite it's $99 MSRP price point.

a step up might be a Vortex Crossfire II 2-7x32. MSRP of $149.99 with a generous eye relief, it's flexible to use, inexpensive for the quality of glass and features available (adjustable magnification , multi-coated lenses, et c) and Vortex Hunter scope rings are only $24.99. just like the Bushnell, it'll stay with you through multiple firearms.

"airsoft" quality scopes are fine for their intended use and on actual firearms can be a budget solution for someone that doesn't shoot often, or has a .22LR target rifle and isn't out in the wilderness or throwing their rifle in the bed of a truck. just be aware of what you're buying and make sure you know what you are getting.


depends on the exact firearm. most H&K pistols are still on the upper end of the "average" pistol price range for example.
I got a Bushnell red dot for ~$70 for my 16" upper (plus a Bushnell 3x magnifier for ~$130 I think) and a Vortex Crossfire II 3-9x40 for ~$200 for my 20". They seem to be working out alright.
 
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I got a Bushnell red dot for ~$70 for my 16" upper (plus a Bushnell 3x magnifier for ~$130 I think) and a Vortex Crossfire II 3-9x40 for ~$200 for my 20". They seem to be working out alright.
yeah, i like the Vortex budget optics - made in Japan, Philippines, or China, but the individual factories are "the good ones" that actually do make optical glass and assemblies for microscopes and other things. the Hakko (Japan) made Viper product line is excellent, as Hakko has always been top shelf since the 70's. if you think about upgrading to better glass for a match rifle, think about a Vortex Viper hovering around (usually under) the $500 mark. best bang for the buck as an all-purpose scope (up there with some Nikon or Belomo glass) unless you want specific features.

i should also mention not to discount Russian/Belarusian made optics - their glass quality and assemblies are superb and extremely durable... just lacking in "technology", some whiz-bang features, and sometimes overly heavy.
 
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I ended up joining Deagle nation.:deagleleft:

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1579383926982[1].jpg
 
yeah, i like the Vortex budget optics - made in Japan, Philippines, or China, but the individual factories are "the good ones" that actually do make optical glass and assemblies for microscopes and other things. the Hakko (Japan) made Viper product line is excellent, as Hakko has always been top shelf since the 70's. if you think about upgrading to better glass for a match rifle, think about a Vortex Viper hovering around (usually under the $500 mark. best bang for the buck as an all-purpose scope (up there with some Nikon or Belomo glass) unless you want specific features.

i should also mention not to discount Russian/Belarusian made optics - their glass quality and assemblies are superb and extremely durable... just lacking in "technology", some whiz-bang features, and sometimes overly heavy.
If anyone wants any new Nikon scopes, they'll need to get them quick. Nikon is cucking out of the scope market.
 



Are any of these guns good for a beginner? They look great asthetically for me compared to the CA legal AR-15 and the mini-30 can fire 7.62s. However they need to discount both mini-30 and mini-14 to at least 100 dollars in my opinion, $50 makes sense for the PC carbine or the 10/22 takedown but not for those two.
 



Are any of these guns good for a beginner? They look great asthetically for me compared to the CA legal AR-15 and the mini-30 can fire 7.62s. However they need to discount both mini-30 and mini-14 to at least 100 dollars in my opinion, $50 makes sense for the PC carbine or the 10/22 takedown but not for those two.
they are all alright and generally quality firearms, however they run into the same issues that have plagued Ruger for a long time: initial "break-in" troubles, magazine compatibility, and parts/magazine availability. the PC carbine largely rectified this as it has a replaceable magazine well, however even then you're limited to Ruger or Glock magazines until other variations are available. the price point is on the fence too, as it will depend on where you live. options for feature-parity in competitors might be prohibitive whereas the Mini 14 or Mini 30 is readily adapted for many sorts of compliance configurations.

you might also want to consider a SU-16CA or an Ares Defense SCR. the Sub-2000 and Cx4 Storm can also be comparable models and you can usually find a cheap Type 56 (Chinese SKS) nearly anywhere. they all have upsides and downsides, but you do have options. consider narrowing down the exact features that you want to have and what would be nice-to-haves, and you can narrow down the makes and models that meet those preferences.
 
Where can i find the steel slides for P38s? I picked up a P38 for cheap cause the aluminum slide had a crack from shooting hot 9mm. I've been looking but only see the aluminium ones
 
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