Mega Man General Thread - Mega Man Battle Network Legacy Collection announced

[X Prime]

So let met get this straight, there aren't enough people that would buy a new Mega Man X game, but there are enough people that would buy MMX1 remade in Minecraft?

Well it's pure nostalgia bait.

Many people like X1 despite never playing it, because they were told it's good and they feel like they have to like it to be hip or what have you.

Only X4 has that phenomenon worse, because it was pretty mediocre and also the beginning of the downward spiral.

 

[Croaking Spider]

Well it's pure nostalgia bait.

Many people like X1 despite never playing it, because they were told it's good and they feel like they have to like it to be hip or what have you.

Only X4 has that phenomenon worse, because it was pretty mediocre and also the beginning of the downward spiral.

I feel like anyone who has any interest in the Mega Man franchise has played X1 by now, either through a port or the original through emulation.

X1 was a really strong first entry to the X series. All of the Maverick designs are fun both in design and gameplay, the soundtrack is easily the best of the 16 bit MM era, and the new mechanics were implemented well. I'd say that X1 was the most accessible (easy) game in the 16 bit era as well, so it's an easy point for people new to the series to dip their toes in.

X4 was the first 32 bit entry and Capcom went all out with the spritework and sound. Plus, it was the first game where Zero was a separate playable character outside of X3's swap-in mechanic where you'd lose access to him if you died while playing him. Just about every MM-inspired game that comes out these days usually has both an X character and a Zero character that specialize in ranged or melee.

The X series started going downhill when Kenji Inafune starting putting his OC (Zero) front and center of the story. It's especially bad once you hit X6 X5 through X7. It's only made worse when you consider the Mega Man Zero series canonically takes place in the same timeline, where Zero pretty much completely replaces X by the end of events. Don't get me wrong, I enjoy the gameplay of the Zero series and I like Zero as a character, they just did my boy X dirty.

Interestly enough, Inafune apparently didn't learn his lesson from his time with the MM franchise, because he pulled the same shit at Inti Creates. GV from Azure Striker Gunvolt has been reduced to a powerup/mercy mode in the latest entry, and the main character is, surprise, a sword user with a red color scheme and a dash mechanic.

 

[X Prime]

The X series started going downhill when Kenji Inafune starting putting his OC (Zero) front and center of the story. It's especially bad once you hit X6 and X7. It's only made worse when you consider the Mega Man Zero series canonically takes place in the same timeline, where Zero pretty much completely replaces X by the end of events. Don't get me wrong, I enjoy the gameplay of the Zero series and I like Zero as a character, they just did my boy X dirty.

I assume you mean X5 there. That's when virtually everyone had the trait "Zero simp" on their characterization with the noted exception of Dynamo.

X6 was actually pretty good about it being about X, Gate,. and Alia, with Zero's DNA as just a mechanism for Gate's (arguably justified) Reploid supremacist ambitions. You didn't need to find Zero, and the ending was arguably more interesting if you didn't. It was the one game after X4 where characters other than Zero got room to breathe as a result.

Less said about X7 the better.

 

[Croaking Spider]

I assume you mean X5 there. That's when virtually everyone had the trait "Zero simp" on their characterization with the noted exception of Dynamo.

Yes actually, thank you. You also reminded me of the fact that Zero's shuttle in X5 is RNG, so even if you do everything you're supposed to, you can still fail. What's the point when you can just reload saves until you get your desired outcome?

Actual dogshit. I'm actually kinda mad I remembered that now. But yeah, I'll give X6 credit for being alright. The item routing was jank as FUCK though.

X7 is an absolute disgrace that almost put me off from even trying X8. Which isn't stellar, but it's mile ahead of X7. Pretty much the only games I come back to are X1-X4. If that doesn't do it for me, I'll just dick around on 30XX until I get bored.

 

[UtadaWasabi2]

I love megaman battle network and starforce so much. Yes, I love my cheesy moment, bond power and feel good stuff very much.

 

[X Prime]

Yes actually, thank you. You also reminded me of the fact that Zero's shuttle in X5 is RNG, so even if you do everything you're supposed to, you can still fail. What's the point when you can just reload saves until you get your desired outcome?

Actual dogshit. I'm actually kinda mad I remembered that now. But yeah, I'll give X6 credit for being alright. The item routing was jank as FUCK though.

X7 is an absolute disgrace that almost put me off from even trying X8. Which isn't stellar, but it's mile ahead of X7. Pretty much the only games I come back to are X1-X4. If that doesn't do it for me, I'll just dick around on 30XX until I get bored.

X5 actually has a dummied out hidden mechanic where if you get infected by the Sigma Virus too many times, Zero will always fail. Beyond that, for speedrunners, a guy figured out how to manipulate RNG to always have the shuttle succeed very recently.

X6 is made better by the improvement romhack. It really adds a lot to the game.

I actually find your comment on X7 to be a good point. It would arguably have been better if Zero had stayed dead and it was about X mentoring Axl. If you let X keep the saber, you could also make him markedly different from Axl instead of copying over several Special Weapons: just let him learn a couple saber techniques.

 

[NERF or NOTHIN']

The X series started going downhill when Kenji Inafune starting putting his OC (Zero) front and center of the story. It's especially bad once you hit X6 X5 through X7.

It's refreshing to see this take every once in a while. Zero fans on the internet are usually mentally ill and see themselves as Zero/see themselves as Iris, so if you dare say something negative about him (or her since she's just Kuato) you're downvoted/ganged up on. All discussion gets tossed out the window. You are then forced to comply to the church of Zero.

Honestly I wonder how a lot of these people even know about the X series. Is it really just Dive, or a "retro revival" because some popular guy on Twitch ran through it? How else does someone who's 20 years old know about a series that had its last entry 20 years ago?

 

[Inafune Fanfiction]

https://youtube.com/watch?v=0bCESQZmMwU
Everyone collectively came at once

Oh my god the Japan exclusive physical cards are now in-game to be used.

Also they are uploading the entire NT Warrior anime to watch for free.

Really wish they'd show more gameplay instead of turning game development into a soap opera.
They didn't even make these games most of the time when they re-release them. Case in point: "from the creators of left 4 dead".

It's refreshing to see this take every once in a while. Zero fans on the internet are usually mentally ill and see themselves as Zero/see themselves as Iris, so if you dare say something negative about him (or her since she's just Kuato) you're downvoted/ganged up on. All discussion gets tossed out the window. You are then forced to comply to the church of Zero.

Honestly I wonder how a lot of these people even know about the X series. Is it really just Dive, or a "retro revival" because some popular guy on Twitch ran through it? How else does someone who's 20 years old know about a series that had its last entry 20 years ago?

Someone took a look at the reddit and 4chan cults I see.

 

[NERF or NOTHIN']

Someone took a look at the reddit and 4chan cults I see.

Yes.

But how did it get this way? They don't all appear to be 30-50 something's that grew up with NES Mega Man, and in fact those people seem to be in the minority. It's a lot of Zero Cultists. Did most of them grow up playing Mega Man Zero?

Yet I thought MMZ "wasn't that popular"?

Why do we have people obsessed with characters from a series that they don't even play because it's too hard? Is it from watching Let's Play, Twitch? Playing Dive?

Or are they just the worst of the internet joined together in one place to talk about games they can't even play? It can't merely be autism.

It does appear that the Sonic fandom mingles with the Mega Man one, though...

 

[Super Guido]

It's refreshing to see this take every once in a while. Zero fans on the internet are usually mentally ill and see themselves as Zero/see themselves as Iris, so if you dare say something negative about him (or her since she's just Kuato) you're downvoted/ganged up on. All discussion gets tossed out the window. You are then forced to comply to the church of Zero.

Honestly I wonder how a lot of these people even know about the X series. Is it really just Dive, or a "retro revival" because some popular guy on Twitch ran through it? How else does someone who's 20 years old know about a series that had its last entry 20 years ago?

With the female fans, they're usually yaoi fangirls who only focus on the MMX series (they tend to dislike MMZ from what I noticed) and want to see Zero and X have sex.

 

[Inafune Fanfiction]

Yes.

But how did it get this way? They don't all appear to be 30-50 something's that grew up with NES Mega Man, and in fact those people seem to be in the minority. It's a lot of Zero Cultists. Did most of them grow up playing Mega Man Zero?

Yet I thought MMZ "wasn't that popular"?

Why do we have people obsessed with characters from a series that they don't even play because it's too hard? Is it from watching Let's Play, Twitch? Playing Dive?

Or are they just the worst of the internet joined together in one place to talk about games they can't even play? It can't merely be autism.

It does appear that the Sonic fandom mingles with the Mega Man one, though...

They seem to be your typical banhappy discordniggers and glowies in training. All they do is spam coomershit and never have any sentient discussion about the thread topic at hand.

Other Kiwis have already explained the current state of the fanbase far more concisely.

 

[X Prime]

With the female fans, they're usually yaoi fangirls who only focus on the MMX series (they tend to dislike MMZ from what I noticed) and want to see Zero and X have sex.

Some of those latch onto Cyber Elf X and MMZ-era Zero, but yeah, this is a factor.

From the very beginnings of this sort of shit on the Internet years ago back when shit like Gundam Wing was just hitting the West, many yaoi fangirls were obsessed with the concepts of "seme" and "uke." These can be roughly understood as "pitcher" and "catcher" in gay slang you may be more familiar with, combined with the concepts of "dom" and "sub" that I imagine I do not need to explain. In accordance with this, Zero is typically portrayed as large and extremely aggressive; many of the kind of people who like this get very upset if you reverse it.

You see the problem when both of them look like little boys as in MMZ. They can't get off as easily to imagined vaguely-if-not-outright-rapey seme/uke dynamics.

I kind of wish I could bleach this kind of knowledge from my brain, some days.

 

[Super Guido]

Some of those latch onto Cyber Elf X and MMZ-era Zero, but yeah, this is a factor.

From the very beginnings of this sort of shit on the Internet years ago back when shit like Gundam Wing was just hitting the West, many yaoi fangirls were obsessed with the concepts of "seme" and "uke." These can be roughly understood as "pitcher" and "catcher" in gay slang you may be more familiar with, combined with the concepts of "dom" and "sub" that I imagine I do not need to explain. In accordance with this, Zero is typically portrayed as large and extremely aggressive; many of the kind of people who like this get very upset if you reverse it.

You see the problem when both of them look like little boys as in MMZ. They can't get off as easily to imagined vaguely-if-not-outright-rapey seme/uke dynamics.

I kind of wish I could bleach this kind of knowledge from my brain, some days.

Large and extremely aggressive, huh? Incidentally, I don't see many Sigma fangirls. I think shippers tend to go for bishounen.

Them both looking like prepubescent boys in MMZ feels kinda gross for pairing in general, tbh.

 

[X Prime]

They really don't like Sigma, either. I think they like bishies too much.

But yeah, I got the impression that was why a lot of them don't like MMZ designs. Them both looking like prepubescent boys feels kinda gross for that sort of thing.

There are some fujoshis who like large non-bishie men, but they are comparatively few. My sense is that a lot of the LGBT who like such men are gay men themselves, with the odd woman out.

To be perfectly fair, there are a large number of individuals into lolicon who lurk around the MM fandom, you can typically see them getting very defensive about age of consent, and reacting in an almost comically exaggerated manner when they get noticed. They typically are into either Roll or MMZ for obvious reasons.

 

[Super Guido]

There are some fujoshis who like large non-bishie men, but they are comparatively few. My sense is that a lot of the LGBT who like such men are gay men themselves, with the odd woman out.

To be perfectly fair, there are a large number of individuals into lolicon who lurk around the MM fandom, you can typically see them getting very defensive about age of consent, and reacting in an almost comically exaggerated manner when they get noticed. They typically are into either Roll or MMZ for obvious reasons.

Spoiler

I may or may not be one of them, though I don't write fanfic or actively ship anyone..

Usually I see people into X and Sigma for size difference - Sigma's 7ft tall and X is a manlet.

Oh yeah I know. Lotsa creepers over Roll and I used to see a nsfw Mega Man roleplayer on Tumblr. It was gross.

 

[X Prime]

Tumblr's containment breach was a disaster for the Internet. I'm not sure I can ever forgive Verizon for it.

 

[Croaking Spider]

Them both looking like prepubescent boys in MMZ feels kinda gross for pairing in general, tbh.

The part that's offputting about the redesigns for me is how it makes the end of the Zero series feel disconnected from the rest of the franchise story-wise.

Even though it's just Toru Nakayama's redesign, it technically isn't. MMZ Zero is a completely different chassis from the X series. He sealed himself away at the end of the X series so that progress could be made towards anti-virus research. In the Zero series, even though his "mind"/data has been preserved, he's in a different body.

Omega is the original body of Zero, but there isn't a distinction besides being a slight palette swap and some dialogue to let the player know. I feel like they missed a good opportunity to end on Zero fighting against Omega as the original Zero/Black Zero design.

This decade-old fan animation pretty much sums how I felt it should have went.

Spoiler: This shit still goes fucking hard

 

[X Prime]

Even though it's just Toru Nakayama's redesign, it technically isn't. MMZ Zero is a completely different chassis from the X series. He sealed himself away at the end of the X series so that progress could be made towards anti-virus research. In the Zero series, even though his "mind"/data has been preserved, he's in a different body.

This is waffled on depending on who you ask.

If I recall correctly, one interview claimed the body had the same physical form, but with a different art interpretation.

The issue is, Inafune then came around later and said the difference is due to technological advancements. This created a plot hole with Omega being just a palette swap. The gacha game tried to fix this by claiming Dr. Weil modified the original body and also maybe made the copy body.

 

[Croaking Spider]

This is waffled on depending on who you ask.

This is what I mean tho. It's a rather weird sendoff. There's a message in there that brings the White/Wily rivalry full circle. X is instrumental in helping Zero in the end. It's a symbolic ending for White's greatest creation to bring peace through the means of Wily's greatest weapon. In the beginning of the X series, Zero helps X find find his reason to fight. In MMZ, X gives Zero the final push he needs to end the conflict.

I feel like this dynamic wasn't really properly touched on in the way it should have been. Still a fun series, the ending just felt a little flat.

 

[X Prime]

Well, that's likely not an intended reading.

You're forgetting that IntiCreates and Inafune originally intended X to die a worthless death after going insane, as happened to Kikaider in the Hakaider movie. Given that, they likely were just looking for an excuse for X to fully fade away, after destroying his body in MMZ2.

If you are referring to X's little pep talk, that's just bog-standard shonen stuff. It even happened to an extent in Bandai's Mega Mission cards, with Zero giving a very similar talk to X so that he would shoot iX, if I remember the circumstances.

Further, it was actually the Mother Elf that ended up shielding Zero and co, and the Mother Elf is made from Zero's own cognitive program. He effectively helped himself at the end there.