Islam

[Sheikh_Speare]

Why do western muslims support left wing politics when they have socially conservative leanings? It almost feels like they want to help trannies conquer the west as vengeance for colonialism. Why don't they just help the west when it needs help by assisting the fight against degeneracy that they themselves are opposed to?

"all that is necessary for the triumph of evil is that good men do nothing"

I don't know European Muslims, but American Muslims mostly voted Republican prior to G.W. Bush's second run. It's just that people tend to vote for the candidate that doesn't openly want to start more wars with your homeland. Now American Muslims are growing weary with the Democrats as well, given President Dronestrike's eight years of bullshit.

 

[MarineTrainedTard]

I've known quite a few Muslims, and most of them voted for Bush in 2004. But, as @Sheikh_Speare said, I imagine this year they're going to vote for whoever says they'll stop blowing up their relatives abroad.

 

[DirkBloodStormKing]

I've known quite a few Muslims, and most of them voted for Bush in 2004. But, as @Sheikh_Speare said, I imagine this year they're going to vote for whoever says they'll stop blowing up their relatives abroad.

I know a lot of them are rooting for Bernie.

 

[Vitriol]

In the uk they vote left because the activist left here is in favour of mass immigration and restrictions on freespeech that make criticising islam difficult due to risks of accusations of 'hatespeech' or racism. Hatespeech laws in particuliar are used as psuedo blasphemy laws.

The socialist left in much of europe, esp the uk, also has a problem with israel and the jews something shared by the local islamic populations.

 

[Lorento]

given President Dronestrike's eight years of bullshit.

President Dronestrike....god I want to write that one down.

In the uk they vote left because the activist left here is in favour of mass immigration and restrictions on freespeach that make criticising islam difficult due to risks of accusations of 'hatespeech' or racism. Hatespeach laws in particuliar are used as psuedo blasphemy laws.

The socialist left in much of europe, esp the uk, also has a problem with israel and the jews something shared by the local islamic populations.

As much as it pains me, I have to agree with pretty much all of this. Though I will say that some also vote for Labour because most Muslim migrants are working class and are in big cities, places where it is natural to vote for Labour anyway.

 

[Ntwadumela]

Let me preface this by saying I'm a Muslim, and whatever horrible things have been happening in recent news I do NOT advocate at all. Neither do a lot of people who are also Muslims. Many of us are normal people like you and me. Those phrases that mention killing people who disagree with us are only applicable in times of war.
Quran 5:32 mentions this:
“Whoever kills a person [unjustly]…it is as though he has killed all mankind. And whoever saves a life, it is as though he had saved all mankind.” (Qur’an, 5:32)

In addition, my country of Kuwait is far more tolerant and open-minded of western ideals and cultures, and is improving continuously to this day. If you have any questions about Islam, ask and I will answer honestly.

 

[Ruin]

Let me preface this by saying I'm a Muslim, and whatever horrible things have been happening in recent news I do NOT advocate at all. Neither do a lot of people who are also Muslims. Many of us are normal people like you and me. Those phrases that mention killing people who disagree with us are only applicable in times of war.
Quran 5:32 mentions this:
“Whoever kills a person [unjustly]…it is as though he has killed all mankind. And whoever saves a life, it is as though he had saved all mankind.” (Qur’an, 5:32)

In addition, my country of Kuwait is far more tolerant and open-minded of western ideals and cultures, and is improving continuously to this day. If you have any questions about Islam, ask and I will answer honestly.

According to the Pew Research Center's global values survey. 43 percent of Muslims believe the killing of non muslims is justifiable in defense of Islamic values. I understand you personally are a moderate Muslim but study after study confirms the horrific violence and disregard for human rights coming from the Muslim world aren't isolated incidents.

What are your thoughts on this?

 

[Ntwadumela]

According to the Pew Research Center's global values survey. 43 percent of Muslims believe the killing of non muslims is justifiable in defense of Islamic values. I understand you personally are a moderate Muslim but study after study confirms the horrific violence and disregard for human rights coming from the Muslim world aren't isolated incidents.

What are your thoughts on this?

Those people's beliefs usually come from Third World countries and have primitive ideals. The fact is that it is not a religious reason, but more of a cultural one. If you haven't noticed, those people who have voted live in countries with extensive political instability and corruption, and are brainwashed that the West is the enemy. It's a governmental and cultural issue, they just happen to be Muslims (and poor examples of them). If that wasn't the case, my country of Kuwait wouldn't be allies with the U.S. at all, and people wouldn't go to the U.A.E., Egypt and Morocco even if their lives depended on it.

 

[Ruin]

Those people's beliefs usually come from Third World countries and have primitive ideals. The fact is that it is not a religious reason, but more of a cultural one. If you haven't noticed, those people who have voted live in countries with extensive political instability and corruption, and are brainwashed that the West is the enemy. It's a governmental and cultural issue, they just happen to be Muslims (and poor examples of them). If that wasn't the case, my country of Kuwait wouldn't be allies with the U.S. at all, and people wouldn't go to the U.A.E., Egypt and Morocco even if their lives depended on it.

Studies in Britain and Germany show strikingly similar results. A 2013 joint study between Columbia and the University of Tel Aviv reported that second and third generation Muslims who were born in the UK were more receptive to extremist activity not less. Lastly if it is purely due to cultural factors why do we not see similar levels of violence from poor Christians and Jews in third world countries?

 

[MarineTrainedTard]

I would argue you do see it from time to time from poor Christians in third world countries, I seem to recall reading that in the Central African Republic there are or were Christian militias running around murdering Muslims with machetes.

Can't speak to why it's less frequent.

Also you don't hear about Jews in third world countries acting this way because there are almost no Jews in third world countries.

 

[Ntwadumela]

Studies in Britain and Germany show strikingly similar results. A 2013 joint study between Columbia and the University of Tel Aviv reported that second and third generation Muslims who were born in the UK were more receptive to extremist activity not less. Lastly if it is purely due to cultural factors why do we not see similar levels of violence from poor Christians and Jews in third world countries?

It's all a matter of ethnicity as well. The poor Christians and Jews don't care about wanting to kill others because their societies' cultures don't mention anything about it. In Britain, the majority of Muslims there come from Pakistan, a country full of corruption and hatred not just for the west, but even their father country India. As for Germany, it's mostly Turkish immigrants, but Turkey is a very secular country, believe me, I have traveled there. In fact, Christians and Jews coexist there with Muslims. Same applies to Egypt.

 

[QI 541]

Those phrases that mention killing people who disagree with us are only applicable in times of war.

Yeah you're not setting a good example either.

 

[Ntwadumela]

Yeah you're not setting a good example either.

Maybe I didn't explain it properly: When we're at war, and in self-defense, when the other party starts and instigates the situation.

 

[Ruin]

It's all a matter of ethnicity as well. The poor Christians and Jews don't care about wanting to kill others because their societies' cultures don't mention anything about it. In Britain, the majority of Muslims there come from Pakistan, a country full of corruption and hatred not just for the west, but even their father country India. As for Germany, it's mostly Turkish immigrants, but Turkey is a very secular country, believe me, I have traveled there. In fact, Christians and Jews coexist there with Muslims. Same applies to Egypt.

You seem like a nice guy, but you've responded to every one of my posts with opinions, personal experiences, and quoted scripture. With all due respect those aren't arguements and I'm going to need a little more.

 

[QI 541]

Maybe I didn't explain it properly: When we're at war, and in self-defense, when the other party starts and instigates the situation.

These are all the same justifications terrorists use when they blow up a school.

 

[Ntwadumela]

You seem like a nice guy, but you've responded to every one of my posts with opinions, personal experiences, and quoted scripture. With all due respect those aren't arguements and I'm going to need a little more.

The quoted scripture is straight from our holy book, which means that it's part of the official rules in Islam. Included is a file which proves my point that the majority of Muslims in the United Kingdom come from Pakistan.

 

[Ruin]

The quoted scripture is straight from our holy book, which means that it's part of the official rules in Islam. Included is a file which proves my point that the majority of Muslims in the United Kingdom come from Pakistan.

Scripture isn't credible evidence. I can't whip out a verse from the new testament to prove a majority of Christians love gay people. That's not how formal debate works.

 

[Ntwadumela]

These are all the same justifications terrorists use when they blow up a school.

They are lying through their teeth, because an entire school is not an advancing army. Also, the Columbine and VirginiaTech massacres were started by non-Muslims, so your point is moot.

Scripture isn't credible evidence. I can't whip out a verse from the new testament to prove a majority of Christians love gay people. That's not how formal debate works.

Then there is no reason to use the "Kill them wherever you find them" verse now is there?

 

[QI 541]

They are lying through their teeth, because an entire school is not an advancing army. Also, the Columbine and VirginiaTech massacres were started by non-Muslims, so your point is moot.

The country's government is responsible for pissing them off, so they consider attacking the entire country as fair game. Admittedly, every country went and bombed civilians during the World Wars for the same reason.

 

[Ntwadumela]

The country's government is responsible for pissing them off, so they consider attacking the entire country as fair game. Admittedly, every country went and bombed civilians during the World Wars for the same reason.

As I've said before, those same countries who condone such actions such as terrorists bombing schools are Third World countries with dictatorial regimes.