He Man Reboot Announced

[Godzilla@1989]

Oh Bear did the music?

Yeah, his work was really good too. Another talent being wasted in this show.

You fix the writing and all the tools are there to make something special. Goddamn it.

This was a frustrating series for sure.

I’m going to lie, the animation is superb and the music is very catchy. But the writing and character development from Kevin wastes their strengths.

 

[Fluoxetine Man]

I think racebending is a much more nuanced concept than it gets credit for. I’ve noticed that racebending has become much more controversial in the last several years compared to how it was perceived in prior decades. There are examples of well known characters being racebent from white to non-white and not inspiring the controversy we see now.

I think that it’s possible to racebend a fictional character and still be respectful of their history. A key problem with many of these recent racebendings is that they make tons of other mistakes that end up sabotaging any attempts at genuinely non-vengeful representation. Then the creators blame racism when that has nothing to do with it.

It’s normal for reboots to explore new incarnations of characters in different but similar ways. Such as Renegades Snake-Eyes being raised by the Arashikage as a child. Does the show ruin his character by doing that instead of replacing him with a new character?

There’s the issue of hard limits on how many characters you can adequately explore at a time. Do you want a cast of entirely new characters a la Beast Wars to be the norm for new entries long-running franchises just to avoid racebending white characters?

Racebending Velma to Asian-American in Scooby-Doo didn’t ruin her character. (Unless you count making her an Asian nerd stereotype. But I digress.) She’s still recognizable as the same mousy brunette we all know and love.

J.K. Rowling (I know, I know) had no problem retroactively racebending Hermione. She’s still the nerdy girl we all know and love. Being black also adds another layer of allegory to her subplot involving being a muggleborn and overcoming racism in the wizarding world.

Creating an original non-white character and then slapping an established white character’s name on them for ham-fisted name recognition is obviously lazy and obtuse. But that’s different from carefully working racebending into the character’s backstory the same way that you work other traits into a rebooted incarnation of a character.

I found a list for reference:

Changing the Majority / Race Lift - TV Tropes

Health Hotline: There's another version of the commercial where Ellie and her grandma are African-Americans. They have the same voices, so they aren't really different characters. In or around 2020, State Farm began airing a new version of its …

tvtropes.org

The key difference on race bending 10 or 20 years ago was that it wasn't ideologically driven. Back then was to attach some talent to the film/show or just to do something different. It wasn't done out of spite.

Morgan Freeman was cast as Red in the Shawshank Redemption because he's a great actor, and Darabont liked him in Brubaker. He wasn't cast to make a political statement and to own Stephen King fans.

 

[FreedomMussel]

The key difference on race bending 10 or 20 years ago was that it wasn't ideologically driven. Back then was to attach some talent to the film/show or just to do something different. It wasn't done out of spite.

Morgan Freeman was cast as Red in the Shawshank Redemption because he's a great actor, and Darabont liked him in Brubaker. He wasn't cast to make a political statement and to own Stephen King fans.

Indeed.

I’m not motivated by spite. I’m extremely disappointed that discourse has become so poisoned that people assume all racebending is now always motivated by spite.

My suggestion for (partly) racebending Snake-Eyes to mixed race white/asian is more because I think it organically fits with a Renegades-style backstory (btw there’s no reason we can’t have multiple continuities), and because I think it would be cool to have an East Asian character who naturally has blond hair and blue eyes. Like an anime character.

 

[Fag Albert]

They could’ve just fleshed out Clamp Champ. They didn’t because they’re lazy. Usually, I wouldn’t assume this, but Ted from Netflix basically confirmed it himself.

I still don't get this part. Make two characters black to try and diversify the cast. But also relegate the original black hero to 3 second bit. It seems like giving him more of a leading role could've been a slam dunk to appease both parties. Or is it because he has a dick?

 

[Cyril Sneer]

I think racebending is a much more nuanced concept than it gets credit for.

I’ve noticed that racebending has become much more controversial in the last several years compared to how it was perceived in prior decades. There are examples of well known characters being racebent from white to non-white and not inspiring the controversy we see now.

It would have been because those unidentified examples of yours occurred, as you claim, "in prior decades," before the Left began openly proclaiming a full-spectrum war on whites in every arena of popular culture and public life. Whites could then still convincingly delude themselves into thinking that instances of established fictional white characters being blackwashed (as was mostly the case) was simply an effort to throw the poor, downtrodden dears a bone, so to speak, rather than part of a steadily-advancing drive towards complete white erasure.

I think that it’s possible to racebend a fictional character and still be respectful of their history. A key problem with many of these recent racebendings is that they make tons of other mistakes that end up sabotaging any attempts at genuinely non-vengeful representation. Then the creators blame racism when that has nothing to do with it.

I don't believe that there are any modern attempts at race-replacing white characters that are "respectful of their history."

It’s normal for reboots to explore new incarnations of characters in different but similar ways. Such as Renegades Snake-Eyes being raised by the Arashikage as a child. Does the show ruin his character by doing that instead of replacing him with a new character?

That's pushing the goalpost rather conveniently far away. How about asking, instead, if it weakened his character. That would be a more honest gambit.

There’s the issue of hard limits on how many characters you can adequately explore at a time. Do you want a cast of entirely new characters a la Beast Wars to be the norm for new entries long-running franchises just to avoid racebending white characters?

You're presenting a false dichotomy here. Not every franchise needs to have a racially "diverse" cast, and many are completely inimical to such a thing (if you care about preserving verisimilitude at all) simply by virtue of the setting.

Racebending Velma to Asian-American in Scooby-Doo didn’t ruin her character. (Unless you count making her an Asian nerd stereotype. But I digress.) She’s still recognizable as the same mousy brunette we all know and love.

This is pretty much begging the question "why have white characters at all?" Apparently, to your mind, there's no inherent value to their existing as such, unlike that which you assign to Play!Hermione below.

J.K. Rowling (I know, I know) had no problem retroactively racebending Hermione. She’s still the nerdy girl we all know and love. Being black also adds another layer of allegory to her subplot involving being a muggleborn and overcoming racism in the wizarding world.

No, actually. Making Hermione black, much like casting black actors as elves in the Netflix version of The Witcher, has the effect of reducing the real-world resonance of the character's trials and tribulations to something extremely trite and narrow. Book!Hermione's struggle with prejudice from other wizards can resonate quite broadly over a wide range of potential parallels in the real world, because her situation isn't exactly comparable to anything in the real world, but make her (or The Witcher's elves) black, and you've inextricably pigeonholed them into the incredibly over-exposed and threadbare dialectic of black oppression.

Creating an original non-white character and then slapping an established white character’s name on them for ham-fisted name recognition is obviously lazy and obtuse. But that’s different from carefully working racebending into the character’s backstory the same way that you work other traits into a rebooted incarnation of a character.

Writing with an axe to grind, in other words.

They could’ve just fleshed out Clamp Champ. They didn’t because they’re lazy. Usually, I wouldn’t assume this, but Ted from Netflix basically confirmed it himself.

Remember when the 2002 Masters of the Universe cartoon introduced a new character in the form of Man-at-Arms' predecessor and mentor, who was a gruff old black man, and everyone thought that this was cool and interesting and not controversial at all?

What about Miles Morales being Spider-Man, Calvin Ellis being Superman, or Eartha Kitt playing Catwoman? I don’t see why an Asian man can’t take up the mantle of Snake-Eyes in similar fashion.

Because the whole point of Snake Eyes is that he's not Asian.

My suggestion for (partly) racebending Snake-Eyes to mixed race white/asian is more because I think it organically fits with a Renegades-style backstory (btw there’s no reason we can’t have multiple continuities), and because I think it would be cool to have an East Asian character who naturally has blond hair and blue eyes.

You wouldn't have an East Asian character, then. You'd have, rather, a mixed Asian/European character (who probably wouldn't look too much different than the average blond white person without recent East Asian genetic admixture).

Again, just make your own damn character.

Like an anime character.

Son, I don't know how to say this, but I don't think G.I. Joe is the franchise you're looking for.

 

[RumblyTumbly]

This has nothing to do with He-Man, but I gotta go on a rant about the Snake Eyes thing.

We have this debate going about Snake Eyes' race while I'm sitting here wondering why the movie shows me his face at all.

I mean the whole appeal is that he never talks and never shows his face (and yes I know the comics EVENTUALLY did, but again, that was after a long build up and maintaining the mystery)

 

[verissimus]

 

[Anonymus Fluhre]

Sad to see what they did to a 40 year old IP but it's to be expected. So I take it in two more episodes Teela will be dating Andra since they want to make "her" a lesbian.

 

[Fluoxetine Man]

So I take it in two more episodes Teela will be dating Andra since they want to make "her" a lesbian.

It'll be fucking hilarious if Andra hooked up with Adam. Can you imagine the seething from SJW's as they try and bitch about it without sounding racist, not to mention the memes from the Doe Dicking/Buck Breaking enjoyers.

 

[Anonymus Fluhre]

It'll be fucking hilarious if Andra hooked up with Adam. Can you imagine the seething from SJW's as they try and bitch about it without sounding racist, not to mention the memes from the Doe Dicking/Buck Breaking enjoyers.

Well first Adam has to come back from the dead. This show isn't about Adam/ He-Man. It's about the trans Teela.

Also, Adam is like 8% black as he's the distant relative to King Grayskull, who Kevin Smith made black.

I hope with this people can stop saying Kevin Smith is a good writer. He's done one good thing in media and that was make Aquaman readable and that was in the mid 90s. He's done shit all else for nearly 30 years.

This has nothing to do with He-Man, but I gotta go on a rant about the Snake Eyes thing.

We have this debate going about Snake Eyes' race while I'm sitting here wondering why the movie shows me his face at all.

I mean the whole appeal is that he never talks and never shows his face (and yes I know the comics EVENTUALLY did, but again, that was after a long build up and maintaining the mystery)

Larry Hama recently said that Snake-Eyes race shouldn't matter. Sounds like a guy who doesn't want to get canceled this late in his life.


Current Year
Toe the line or watch your career die.

 

[Berrakh]

It's kind of amazing to me because I can name some totally boring female characters that people love because they claim they balanced strong and sweet really well. I won't name them because the thread will derail as they'll be someone's waifu. But it's just amazing how they could slam dunk the haters forever just by not making characters like Teela into cunts.
This is why political messages belong more in the background or the periphery. They want to make the idea of the overlooked female character reclaiming her place in the story really obvious so she has to take offense at people for not including her when it's not her business.

 

[Fluoxetine Man]

Larry Hama recently said that Snake-Eyes race shouldn't matter. Sounds like a guy who doesn't want to get canceled this late in his life.

Makes me wonder how many creatives are virtue signaling out of fear compared to the true believers?

 

[Giga_Nigga_28]

Can I just sperg about Skeletors plan for a second?
Its fucking ridiculous, Skeletors entire plan hinges around He-Man hitting him in the exact position so that the sword fits through the lock then somehow having enough strength to break the orb. What if He-Man stabbed him in the head? Or sliced him in half? Or JUST HELD THE SWORD HORIZONTALLY SO IT WOULDN'T FIT?

Then everyone just stands around so he can exposit for a full minute instead of finishing off the man with the hole through his chest.

Also Skeletor's only able to stab Adam in the finale because again even though he fully materialised not a soul caught the 6ft skeleton popping up behind Adam. Also also, Evelynn and Skeletor clearly have a thing going on so how could he be an incel?

This has nothing to do with He-Man, but I gotta go on a rant about the Snake Eyes thing.

We have this debate going about Snake Eyes' race while I'm sitting here wondering why the movie shows me his face at all.

I mean the whole appeal is that he never talks and never shows his face (and yes I know the comics EVENTUALLY did, but again, that was after a long build up and maintaining the mystery)

Actors don't want to star in a movie where no one knows who they are.

 

[Oats12345]

Can I just sperg about Skeletors plan for a second?
Its fucking ridiculous, Skeletors entire plan hinges around He-Man hitting him in the exact position so that the sword fits through the lock then somehow having enough strength to break the orb. What if He-Man stabbed him in the head? Or sliced him in half? Or JUST HELD THE SWORD HORIZONTALLY SO IT WOULDN'T FIT?

Then everyone just stands around so he can exposit for a full minute instead of finishing off the man with the hole through his chest.

Also Skeletor's only able to stab Adam in the finale because again even though he fully materialised not a soul caught the 6ft skeleton popping up behind Adam. Also also, Evelynn and Skeletor clearly have a thing going on so how could he be an incel?

Actors don't want to star in a movie where no one knows who they are.

That's why people like Ray Parker exist

 

[Sinner's Sandwich]

Also, Adam is like 8% black as he's the distant relative to King Grayskull, who Kevin Smith made black.

Reeee He man is 92% white that means he his black!!1

That means all people who have dark skinned ancestors (which is literally everyone if you go back in time far enough) are now darkies.

 

[Anonymus Fluhre]

Makes me wonder how many creatives are virtue signaling out of fear compared to the true believers?

It's happening with tabletop games with RA Salvatore changing Drow lore.

Reeee He man is 92% white that means he his black!!1

That means all people who have dark skinned ancestors (which is literally everyone if you go back in time far enough) is now a darkie.

What if King Grayskull is 8% white?

White washing doesn't exist so somewhere down the line the family would have had to use magic to make themselves white. Otherwise he'd still be a light brown colour. Unless king Grayskulls son dies and Ro takes over as King Grayskull which just ruins the franchise even more. It's Kevin Smith, so I expect that to happen. He's a shit writer.

 

[Next Task]

There were also a number of poorly edited scenes, lines seemingly mouthed in the animation but the actors failed to provide...basically critics giving it so high a rating is a sign of paid for reviews.

I rated this optimistic because I don't think the reviews need to be paid for - critics consistently give higher scores for things that are 'important' rather than good and bump them up a few grades if they 'own the alt-right'. No incentive other than their own pettiness needed.

I don't believe that there are any modern attempts at race-replacing white characters that are "respectful of their history."

I think the MCU did a fine enough job with it. Heimdall, that one of Thor's buddies that became Asian, and Mordo all worked fine switched. But of course all the SJWs ignored that and bitched about The Ancient One becoming Tilda Swinton rather than an old Asian man, all while conveniently ignoring that the only reason that happened was because of China. I think it helped there that a) these were secondary characters that weren't fan favourites, b) they made sure to get actors people really like (in the case of Heimdall and Mordo at least) so it wasn't a big deal, and c) they didn't suddenly give them plot armour or change them significantly other than that. Spoiler: Heimdall dies, and Mordo turns against Dr. Strange at the end - that doesn't change just because they're black.

Everywhere else, though, especially the way it's so often happening to redheads, feels targeted.

Making Hermione black,

I was under the impression Rowling merely said Hermione could be black, as in could be played by a black actress in the play, rather than she canonically was black. As written in the books I know there's at least one reference that explicitly describes her as white, so technically she is definitively white, but I can see her being played by a black actress and it not being that big a deal. But only if they kept her negative characteristics along with the positive ones.

Of course, when they remake the Harry Potter franchise, expect the Weasleys to all be black.

Actors don't want to star in a movie where no one knows who they are.

That's why you don't get a big-name actor to do it - see Sylvester Stallone as Judge Dredd and them having to remove his helmet to accommodate such a big star at the time playing the role. No, considering they cast Henry Golding (probably the biggest non-martial arts-based Asian actor currently going) in the role, it's clear the whole point was to cast an Asian (but not too Asian). That way they can pander to the Asian markets still while hoping to get diversity brownie points that they wouldn't get from the SJWs on Twitter who'd REEEEEEEE at any sign of a white actor being a ninja, no matter what the character's actual background or purpose is. They did the same with Iron Fist, whining about cultural appropriation and the white guy knowing martial arts because they don't give a shit about the characters, they only see things through their extremely limited worldview.

I think the post from a few pages back about the proper response being apathy and ignoring it is the right one. It's like the internet has infected popular media so that they all think hate-clicks are the same as clicks, not realising that people might hate-read an article or hate-watch an episode, but they don't hate-buy tickets to a film or hate-subscribe to a service, and they definitely don't hate-support anything.

I do feel like the swing towards SJWs is nearing its peak, and we're going to see it start to come back the other way. But it's not going to be quick, and we've got years if not at least a decade of this bullshit to deal with first.

 

[starborn427614]

I still don't get this part. Make two characters black to try and diversify the cast. But also relegate the original black hero to 3 second bit. It seems like giving him more of a leading role could've been a slam dunk to appease both parties. Or is it because he has a dick?

Say what you will about Netflixvania, but at least its most prominent black male character was fucking based.

 

[OldManBoomer]

I still don't get this part. Make two characters black to try and diversify the cast. But also relegate the original black hero to 3 second bit. It seems like giving him more of a leading role could've been a slam dunk to appease both parties. Or is it because he has a dick?

I can answer this. And in the most direct way possible:


Because they neither know, nor care, about this franchise.

 

[RumblyTumbly]

And by the way, Clamp Champ was never a major character.

He came around at the tail end of the toyline, was never very popular, and never made it into any animated incarnation prior to this point.

BUT, if you want to enhance the diversity of MOTU, he was a preestablished opportunity to do that. The character is basically a blank slate so there was almost no wrong way to tackle it. Prior to its cancellation, the 2002 reboot had planned on having him replace Man-At-Arms at his position after Duncan was kidnapped and transformed into a Snake Man by King Hiss. So there were ways to handle his character to give him a greater recognition BUT he's a male, so no dice.