Hazbin Hotel / Helluva Boss Thread - Now a Griefing Thread

[AFAB]

After reading all the other critiques as well as my gripes with him, here's my rework of Angel Dust's character. He'll be a mobster, and it'll be clear his path to redemption is a long and rough process

• Have him be a made member of the mafia. A soldier or a capo within one of the Five Families of New York, getting involved in whatever rackets possible to make as much money as possible (smuggling, prostitution, whatever the mob has done)
• At some point he gets more involved in drugs during the 50s and 60s (dealing and using). The other families think he could be a liability (not helped by his behavior getting more erratic) but since he continues to bring in money they turn a blind eye. Now admittedly this is veering into a little light alternate history (generally mobsters don't kill law enforcement in America), but what causes Angel Dust to be marked for death is him deciding to shoot a cop in a drug fueled haze.
  • Killing cops is a massive no-no for the mob, and to make sure the Feds don't crucify them they kill him to get the heat off their backs.
• Because I found out about the idea from way back in this thread - instead of Angel Dust being a pornstar, he's instead reduced to a stand up comedian telling anecdotes and jokes about his past life (especially when he was in the mob).
• He can't join the sinner version of the American Mafia (because he's a liability to them), so eventually he winds up working for the criminal overlord Valentino (who I plan to elaborate on later). Instead of trying to make Valentino Angel Dust's pimp - he's making him using his criminal skills to reclaim his lost "merchandise", in exchange for some money and maybe a go with some of his prostitutes. While Angel Dust doesn't care one way or another (again - made man in the mafia - he's done worse), he doesn't like the fact that he's been reduced to an errand boy doing low level grunt work for some rando pimp.
• On some level he realizes that his life is in the gutter - he used to be a feared member of the mafia, only to turn into an unreliable junkie that got clipped after the mob decided he wasn't worth the effort. And now in hell: he's not respected, he's stuck doing comedy routines to an audience that finds him kinda pathetic, he can never get back into the organization that he was in when alive, and now he's stuck doing retrieval for the moth pimp. And on some level, he realizes that he's hit rock bottom but he's too prideful to admit it.
• And this is the point where eventually he stumbles into Charlie's Hotel and decides to stay there - not for any chance at redemption mind you at first, but just to get a consistent source of shelter and food. And that is where we'll see him grow and change - eventually realizing that he fucked up royally and now wants to atone for his mistakes.

He might seem a bit too unsympathetic, but I think it looks like a strong starting point, since this where he'll eventually grow as a person. Feel free to give your thoughts on this rewrite.

 

[Hood-ass Mulatto]

tbh, for Barbie, I liked to imagine that she just... leaves Hell. Fucks off to Earth, tosses the asmodeus device away, and lives disguised among humans until she meets a state fair cook and hits it off with him to the point she had three children and another on the way with him, traveling from fair to fair, cooking his trademark gumbo and becoming very good at it.

And then Blitzo finds her during a "job" and she just wants him to go away and never come back.

Yeah. It shouldn't have been a drug job. It should've just been a real normal job that Blitzo just comes in to wreck not because he had to kill someone there, but because he wanted to see her, so he gets reckless and fucks her life over by overstepping her boundaries and she decides to make it clear and is never seen again within his vicinity, but is also shown having a great life.

So, it's this:

- Fizz is the friend who still cares for Blitzo but wants to keep his distance because of what he did (set the circus on fire when angry and leading to Fizz's injuries)

- Verosika is the ex who broke up but is petty and btichy about it, always trying to one-up him.


- Stolas is the boss/fuck-buddy with a big ego and no balls and Blitzo was right to leave him crying with bird affluence and maybe HIV.


- Barbie is the sister who broke off and hates Blitzo but actually does it right - leave, set boundaries, start a new life and change, don't think about him anymore. Blitzo decides to make her even angrier and so, it's his fault and he has to stop that shit.

 

[Saxxon]

I genuinely like Charlastor and I'm not just saying that because Viv getting so damn mad about it is funny.

Even if you dislike shipping shit, this pairing does create interesting situations for the characters: in one hand you have Alastor, a cold and ruthless serial killer with a huge ego and no love to anyone but himself, and then there's Charlie the daughter of Lucifer, someone that under any logic you would think is way worse than Al but somehow manages to be kind, humble, a little naive and caring towards the fate of all sinners including Al.

They are very different but also similar in their tastes for music, singing and in the general idea of wanting to have a good time, because of their background (killer and princess of hell) both have a hard time connecting with people but benefit from their mutual relation (Al amuses himself with Charlie's idea and Charlie is happy to have someone that supports her idea) and they also share an optimist attitude towards challenges.

Obviously, the two have different goals in mind but are in the same playing field when it comes to how to achieve them, that is the Hotel. Alastor brings the respect or did before he jobbed lmao and Charlie brings this welcoming sense that allows other characters like AD, Husk, Sir Pentious to stay and create this aura of liveness almost like a party that both of them seem to enjoy, futher cementing their status as a team until their personal goals start conflicting with each other and now must choose if they will sacrifice their only source of happyness in hell over personal ambitions

What does Chaggie even has to compare? On top that Vaggie barely has a character, her reasons to like Charlie are completely shallow and read almost like stockholm syndrome. The way is presented Vag only loves Charlie because the latter saved her after her ass got fired, meaning that she would have fallen in love with anyone regarless if it was Charlie or not.

 

[Strawberry Kiwi Propel]

But even without Stolitz, it really dawns on me that Helluva Boss just became the dumping ground for all the lore that Viv couldn't have the time to put in Hazbin given the 8 episode limit put on by Amazon or A24.

Seeing how one of the Overlords got reworked into a Goetia (Vassago), if worst came to worst and Hazbin got cancelled, Viv could just repurpose characters that didn't make an appearance yet into Helluva Boss characters, like Crymini, Henroin, etc.

And if she really wanted to, if Hazbin got cancelled, I deadass see Viv exploiting any loophole she can find and crowdfund more Hazbin, as long as she changes names and designs.

 

[Smity Werbenjagermanjensen]

What does Chaggie even has to compare? On top that Vaggie barely has a character, her reasons to like Charlie are complely shallow and read almost like stockholm syndrome. The way is presented Vag only loves Charlie because the latter saved her after her ass got fired, meaning that she would have fallen in love with anyone regarless if it was Charlie or not.

It's hilarious that Chaggie was somehow better in the pilot (When them being a couple was only made a thing halfway into it's production), because Vaggie was sort of the realist to Charlie's more idealist side. In the show Vaggie is extremely codependent on Charlie and since the show never does anything to really point this out, not even the writers seem to realize it.

 

[Rakdos92]

Helluva Boss just became the dumping ground for all the lore that Viv couldn't have the time to put in Hazbin given the 8 episode limit put on by Amazon or A24.

Does the lore in HB even matter for HH? Nothing indicates so aside from the one episode where Lucifer is shown (again) to be an absentee king.

 

[Doctor of Autism]

Does the lore in HB even matter for HH? Nothing indicates so aside from the one episode where Lucifer is shown (again) to be an absentee king.

Its really all the stuff expanding the worldbuilding like the sins and such

 

[InJailOutSoon]

tbh, for Barbie, I liked to imagine that she just... leaves Hell. Fucks off to Earth, tosses the asmodeus device away, and lives disguised among humans until she meets a state fair cook and hits it off with him to the point she had three children and another on the way with him, traveling from fair to fair, cooking his trademark gumbo and becoming very good at it.

And then Blitzo finds her during a "job" and she just wants him to go away and never come back.

Yeah. It shouldn't have been a drug job. It should've just been a real normal job that Blitzo just comes in to wreck not because he had to kill someone there, but because he wanted to see her, so he gets reckless and fucks her life over by overstepping her boundaries and she decides to make it clear and is never seen again within his vicinity, but is also shown having a great life.

A lot of people theorized back then when it was just teasers of rough animation that Barbie was dating the human they were trying to kill. Which I agree, because her dealing drugs makes it that she hasn't gotten any better from rehab.

But maybe she has because the way they describe heroin makes it seem like it's not a very strong drug in Hell. And Barbie mentions this being honest work so what she's doing is legal for Hell. But then you wonder, who gave her the Asmodeun crystal to do this work? Was it Asmodeus? He appears to be the only one who can give out these crystals. Wouldn't he be a bit upset that Blitzø is messing up jobs that are under his jurisdiction? And then you also wonder...there are drugs that Hell itself can't make? The world-building here...

But anyway, it should have been that Barbie fucked off from Hell so she could avoid the the people that have screwed her life over, and her getting better and living a much happier life because of doing so. Her getting upset at Blitzø would be even more impactful because we as the audience would see firsthand of him ruining something genuinly good going on in her life. And it would have also been a good stepping stone for Blitzø to not do the job in the season finale. Because he himself has seen the effects of what this kind of job has on the people around the target. Cause it happened to someone he cares for.

 

[Strawberry Kiwi Propel]

It's hilarious that Chaggie was somehow better in the pilot (When them being a couple was only made a thing halfway into it's production), because Vaggie was sort of the realist to Charlie's more idealist side. In the show Vaggie is extremely codependent on Charlie and since the show never does anything to really point this out, not even the writers seem to realize it.

Chaggie in the pilot balance each other out without it feeling one sided. Charlie's warm, calm-collected, reassuring nature complements Vaggie's hot headed aggressive impulse, with Vaggie's level headed orderly outlook complements Charlie's hope-ridden optimism.

Series Charlie is all the emotion in the relationship, and Vaggie's a straight man.


Pilot Vaggie not sharing Charlie's musical fantasy might be because she herself isn't much of a singer, but rather, have dancing as her forte. The comics from the original episode list has Vaggie impress CarMax with her dancing skills, earning her respect.

Not only is Series Vaggie a dancer (well according to her audition sheet/Playbill section), it turns out she sings too! So while Charlie's a singer, Vaggie's a singer AND a dancer.


To reiterate Chaggie worked better in the pilot because the two were more multidimensional in terms of surface level characterization and had traits that were unique to them, which in turn, could venture in dynamics with others, partially resulting people pairing them in different ships. Their personalities in the Series were limited severely, so they come off as dull as it seems like they were only made for each other, so people are hyper focused on the relationship as it seems like that's all they have.

 

[InJailOutSoon]

Chaggie in the pilot balance each other out without it feeling one sided. Charlie's warm, calm-collected, reassuring nature complements Vaggie's hot headed aggressive impulse, with Vaggie's level headed orderly outlook complements Charlie's hope-ridden optimism.

Series Charlie is all the emotion in the relationship, and Vaggie's a straight man.


Pilot Vaggie not sharing Charlie's musical fantasy might be because she herself isn't much of a singer, but rather, have dancing as her forte. The comics from the original episode list has Vaggie impress CarMax with her dancing skills, earning her respect.

Not only is Series Vaggie a dancer (well according to her audition sheet/Playbill section), it turns out she sings too! So while Charlie's a singer, Vaggie's a singer AND a dancer.


To reiterate Chaggie worked better in the pilot because the two were more multidimensional in terms of surface level characterization and had traits that were unique to them, which in turn, could venture in dynamics with others, partially resulting people pairing them in different ships. Their personalities in the Series were limited severely, so they come off as dull as it seems like they were only made for each other, so people are hyper focused on the relationship as it seems like that's all they have.

I saw this little animatic a while ago back, and it's a shame that we won't get something similar in the show because there's just way too much going on. If season 1 had just stayed focused on the hotel and the members in there, we probably could get these little moment that would build on the characters and their relationships with each other. But because everything had to start our big and we have to one-up the grandness, we can't get anything like that. We don't have the time to. We'll have to speed run through it all because we're still only getting eight 22-minute episodes for the second season; with more characters, more songs, and more plotlines. Even people who liked the first season of Hazbin said that the pacing was way too fast. It's just going to get worse.

 

[Gondolindrim]

This thread just goes to prove that in their current states, HH and HB should have stayed as pilots. Fans are doing much better jobs for free while the one getting paid to do it wasted that potential for fujo pandering.

It's a bad sign that actual fanfics on Archive have more consistency than the actual show.

 

[The tired cat]

It's a bad sign that actual fanfics on Archive have more consistency than the actual show.

Or that the fans try to utilize the characters and setting way more, some even trying to explore the stuff Viv tossed around here and there.

 

[Re(Runner)48]

Redo

Moxxie and Millie

Where do I begin. Design wise pretty bad on both ends, I get the Mickey and Minnie look. But for me it doesn't really work. The amount of black on both ends makes them really hard to get personality wise, I honestly thought Moxxie would be a orchestra conductor with that outfit, and Millie just looks like a goth punk and not muscular at all. Moxxies face his freckles confused me as aren't those suppose to be scars? And Millies scars make little to no sense on how thwy are put together. And they are both Wrathians..?Also she's black what the fuck..? Really bad designs.

So to clean it up and change some stuff.

Millie
Used desert lizards for her design (Wrathians would be desert creatures to differentiate larger claws, double horns, scales)
Scars that look like cow spots from all the bruises to add to a "cowgirl" look
Farm girl esthetic with plaid.
A larger tail as most lizards muscles are actually in their tails, hers would be huge and beefy she would use it at a huge brick whip to straight up kill people.
Gave her a thicker more muscular body.
Textured black hair.

Moxxie
Changed his horns and hair. His horns are larger more sleek.
Greed Imps tails would be smaller, thinner and more slender and can be trained to use their tails to pick locks as their tails have small traces of metal in them.
His freckles are scars and are Cigar burns from his father as a child.
He tried to cover all his body (uses black gloves and long turtle necks.
His father gave him a golden pistol (he always seems to have small fire arms in the show)
Gave him a hat cus why not.
His tail scars are from his father's punishment where he tries him up by his tail and hangs him over the loan sharks who want to devour him, if he messes up.
Rolls a golden coin in his hand to calm himself down.
Huge bags under his eyes.

Story Wise

Adding onto the last Kiwi farmers input
Moxxie is a colder, quiet imp. Who's main job was exporting weapons throughout the ring.

Hes born in Greed but his mother his a Wrathian/ Father is a Greed imp so it makes him mixed.

Still abused by his father who kills his mother.

His father gave him this job as it makes the most money, and he fears disappointing his father (as hes threating to kill him if he fucks up.) While working with Chaz they were importing holy weapons which would be the most expensive haul.

Chaz however betrays him and rats him out takes all the money for himself on top of the tip money, and frames Moxxie for actually selling the weapons.

Chaz becomes a rival of Moxxies father where he hires his own kind (the loansharks his dad hires) leaving his family name/dad in ruins.

Moxxie is on the run and looking for a place to hide/live, and try to clear his name. Striker seeing himself in him takes him under his wing and trains him to be a part of Imp.

He still has a soft spot for children, women and families, as it's something he never had himself (loving family/a mother/happy childhood)

Has a love for Jazz Mafia and sings Jazz and Soul.

Millie is a Wrathian who is bubbly and naive. She is sheltered on her small farm.

Millie is still racist to Hellhounds and unintentionally racist to other Imps.

Finds Moxxie funny as there's only pureblood Wrathians in her ring. She always tries to fight him and pokes him to fight her and prove his Wrathian blood. She always wins.

She's a prankster , but she goes a little hard on her pranks. Which can lead some to be deadly.

Moxxie and Millie get captured by the Murder Family. And from that when they fight they grow an appreciation for eachother. Moxxie using his intelligence from playing them, and Millies from protecting the gang.

Moxxie asks for her to train him in hand to hand combat while Millie is trained in guns and firearms. And through Moxxies training she can see the Wrathian side of him, and she finally accepts that.

They eventually get together, and at Ozzies is when Moxxie works up the courage to sing his love for her. Ozzie hears him reversing screams at him to get out and that they both have to leave as their feelings sicken him and aren't allowed in his orgy club.

They both wonder around the Lust ring and wonder if what their feeling is normal, and perhaps its something wrong and degenerate. Millie comforts him and in a lust alley Moxxie tries again to sing the song. And with that they share a moment where Mille and Moxxie are able to understand that the feelings are valid.

They date and eventually marry in the show, then go on dates which Blitzo then gets interested in because he was a sex slave so this is foreign to him.

Millie then shows him to her family and they are also racist to him being mixed. And that's the episode where she realizes that her world was so much smaller then it was now that she experienced all these events on the job. And that shes changed, she treats hellhounds with respect and calls Loona by her real name and treating the hllhounds in the Wrath ring with respect. And learns more about other imps cultures, her family call her soft and a weak for showing so much kindness to the help and foreign Imps.

She denounces them and tells them off saying if they don't like her or her husband.Her family don't want to see her, she is disowned.

Her father calls her and says that he misses her and wants to see his baby again, as well as her brothers. Her mother (does she even have a fucking name?) still doesn't want to see her. And when The yearly Harvest festival she chooses to participate realizing shes going against her mother, she wins and her mother remembers all the times they had together and all of her awards that she pushed her to do trying to make her strong she thought that Millie marrying Moxxie would make her weak. Realizing she wasn't giving her or Moxxie a chance she lets her live her own life outside of their Wrathian values, she accepts that she's married to Moxxie.

Feel free to give your thoughts as usual.

 

[The tired cat]

Alright, I really love these redesigns and backstory. Moxxie specially, as it gives a very strong Leon the Professional vibe. Plus, I do like the usage of the colors in their clothes, kinda shows the rings they both come from.

 

[Vyse Inglebard]

Season....3? Season 2 isn't even out yet, and you're telling me we have to wait one more season to get to "the story you've wanted to tell for years"? THE WHOLE SHOW SHOULD BE "THE STORY YOU'VE WANTED TO TELL FOR YEARS"!

 

[FK009]

View attachment 7037348
Season....3? Season 2 isn't even out yet, and you're telling me we have to wait one more season to get to "the story you've wanted to tell for years"? THE WHOLE SHOW SHOULD BE "THE STORY YOU'VE WANTED TO TELL FOR YEARS"!

She could have easily said that season 3 would be her favorite arc, or in this case arcs considering how much they shove into one season, but no, it’s the story she’s been waiting to tell. Guess she had to do all that stupid set up that other writers need to do.

 

[The Nothingness]

@Re(Runner)48 I take it the lovemaking with your versions of Millie and Moxxie is healthy, none of that pegging shit.

 

[Outer Space Traveller]

View attachment 7037348
Season....3? Season 2 isn't even out yet, and you're telling me we have to wait one more season to get to "the story you've wanted to tell for years"? THE WHOLE SHOW SHOULD BE "THE STORY YOU'VE WANTED TO TELL FOR YEARS"!

Guise, Season 5 will be awesome, we'll have Arya learning to be an assassin, Jon Snow being a lord commander, Daenerys doing whatever in Mereen, Tyrion fucking about in Essos.

Sorry, wrong show.

 

[Kenny Blankenship]

Don't care if this is a repost or not, because I think of this constantly.

 

[Kenny Blankenship]

It's Kenny Blankenship's painful eliminations of the day! Number 10 goes to Sassy the Gay Spider, who takes one too many loads in the face!

He's addicted to pain!