General transgender discussion thread - Take the tranny related debates here.

[Michellandin']

The extreme SJWs are generally beyond any sort of viewing their "cishet oppressors" as human. There are both followers, and feeders who contribute to the rise of the social justice extremism issue.

These extremists were lost before "woke SJW" culture was something on their radar. The people who underplay this sort of behavior are the real issue.

 

[Travis Touchdown Cumsock]

These extremists were lost before "woke SJW" culture was something on their radar. The people who underplay this sort of behavior are the real issue.

Definitely, at its roots there is a deeper underlying cause of this social cancer. One example is, the original of the whole "tucute vs truscum" idiocy can be traced back to one person, IDCP. And this one moron caused so much trouble.

What is it about lying idiots with loud mouths that makes hoards of sheep want to believe them, anyway? Never did get that one, human race.

 

[Michellandin']

One example is, the original of the whole "tucute vs truscum" idiocy can be traced back to one person, IDCP. And this one moron caused so much trouble.

I disagree, children have always had these feelings, every child independent of each other.

Definitely, at its roots there is a deeper underlying cause of this social cancer.

I have to disagree, this "cancer" is merely the logical conclusion of progressive though. It's rational, but very difficult unlikely to lead to a society these progressives would want.

What is it about lying idiots with loud mouths that makes hoards of sheep want to believe them, anyway?

Fascism. It's wonderful and probably one of the best and most misunderstood political philosophies.

 

[Travis Touchdown Cumsock]

The thoughts can happen multiple times in individuals, but it's oftentimes a single person who gives a name and face to the movement that was already there all along.

You are correct in that this is not a new issue, though. Humanity has always been like this, so we have to deal with this social issue just as we did with prior ones, with spreading correct information and trying to debunk lies. Over time, society seems to mature about things organically provided the right information is being provided to the people.

People who get fed into bigotry are oftentimes misguided and it's possible to set them right. It's usually the ones who create and perpetuate the misinformation who are beyond repair. But while the followers are victims too, they are still dangerous while they are being misled.

 

[Michellandin']

Humanity has always been like this, so we have to deal with this social issue just as we did with prior ones, with spreading correct information and trying to debunk lies.

Unfortunately, I can assure you that the progressive view on this issue is rock solid. Don't discount what they say, listen to an intellectual who breaks down these ideas. Contrapoints actually gives a good breakdown on this area of thought. At least know your enemy.

People who get fed into bigotry are oftentimes misguided and it's possible to set them right. It's usually the ones who create and perpetuate the misinformation who are beyond repair. But while the followers are victims too, they are still dangerous while they are being misled.

Misinformation is powerful, and in many ways genius. The truth is difficult for most people to understand, many times a falsehood is easier to sell than reality.

Over time, society seems to mature about things organically provided the right information is being provided to the people.

Yes but it takes centuries for society to form a culture around these things. Simplistic and false understandings of the world are easier to believe, this is why religion exists. Tradition that had a deeper meaning is now being discounted because it was sold to people using fiction as opposed to fact.

 

[Travis Touchdown Cumsock]

Unfortunately, I can assure you that the progressive view on this issue is rock solid. Don't discount what they say, listen to an intellectual who breaks down these ideas. Contrapoints actually gives a good breakdown on this area of thought. At least know your enemy.

The progressive view on transgenderism overall is correct, in that transitioning must be accepted since the brain cannot be made to match the body. What is misguided, are people who are not trans, who got groomed into thinking they are trans, so they spread incorrect "PSAs" which cause unnecessary strife. It's spreading unintentional lies with the best of intentions. This of course is not new to the human race either.

 

[Michellandin']

What is misguided, are people who are not trans, who got groomed into thinking they are trans, so they spread incorrect "PSAs" which cause unnecessary strife. It's spreading unintentional lies with the best of intentions.

The best thing to do is ignore them. It's unfortunate to the innocent that are affected by it, but we cannot give these people the power they desire directly or indirectly. Some crazy things will need to be tolerated to be defeated.

 

[Travis Touchdown Cumsock]

The best thing to do is ignore them. It's unfortunate to the innocent that are affected by it, but we cannot give these people the power they desire directly or indirectly. Some crazy things will need to be tolerated to be defeated.

I think it's better to protest in a peaceful fashion than to simply take it. Peaceful protesting by education is a powerful means of dissolving ignorance-brewed hate.

When people are so deep in their own shit that they are beyond any redemption though, then I agree. Ignoring them is best way to take power away from them. There are people who just really are beyond help and are not worth the energy.

Some are more nihilistic, less optimistic than I. I think small, but not drastic, change can be made with some effort and small change is better than no change. So I personally don't see it as being pointless, to resist harmful, deluded social movements which appropriate medical conditions. Feel free to agree to disagree, this is just my stance, I am moderately progressive and aim my endeavors primarily towards the small victories. Those are realistically achievable, and in time, they add up.

 

[qt farmer :)]

TIL there used to be a British reality TV show back in 2003 called There's Something About Miriam. the premise of this reality show was centered around Miriam Rivera, a MTF transsexual, being courted by six men for her affection, unknowing of her transsexualism. the big "twist" at the end of the show was to reveal that the object of desire for these men was, in fact, a transsexual woman. after the contestants found out about this after the last episode, all six contestants sued for sexual assault and psychological damages.

Miriam then did a stint on Big Brother Australia in 2004 before retreating from the spotlight and into obscurity. then, early last year, it was found that she joined the 41% Club.
her husband claims it wasn't a suicide, however the police ruled it a suicide by hanging. the news of her death was not released to the public until six months after the fact, and there were a few different and ultimately conflicting reports of her death that tried to rule out suicide. reading between the lines of the details surrounding the announcement of her death (the news wasn't publicly released until 6 months AFTER her death, with the husband claiming she died to 'health issues' as well as transphobic death threats) seem to all point towards the modern media trying to desperately spin the suicide of an irrelevant but pioneering transwoman reality show star as something other than the most common cause of death transsexual people experience.

also, in standard tranny fashion, she did porn as well.

I recently saw this on twitter and I'm wondering if/when either the trannies or the terfs will latch onto this compelling slice of history, as either can twist their interpretation and push their respective narratives.

 

[Diana Moon Glampers]

Trans people: "A woman is anyone who identifies as a woman!"

Sane people: (showing photos of Yaniv, Muscato, and the population of /r/transpassing) "Behold, a woman!"

How is using the Diogenes comparison going to help their cause, exactly? Their specious definitions of woman as being related to feelings and stereotypes leave a lot more room for plucked chickens than the definition they deride as "third grade biology."

The only difference is that the trans people in this scenario are looking at the plucked chicken, thinking about the definition they just said, and deciding that the chicken really is a man after all, and making him a philosophy professor.

 

[ScatmansWorld]

Alright, I really just have one question about this.

What is gender?

No, seriously, what the fuck is "gender"? What is the "right" definition? What does it mean to BE a gender or "identify" as a gender?

If you asked me this 6-7 years ago I and most people would say it's just a synonym for your biological sex, but apparently that's no longer the case, and I've yet to have anyone give me an answer that makes sense or is consistent across multiple people. It's just so tiring to hear gender bullshit invade so many online spaces and places of discussion while people CAN'T EVEN AGREE WHAT IT ACTUALLY MEANS.

 

[PBJ Sucks]

Alright, I really just have one question about this.

What is gender?

No, seriously, what the fuck is "gender"? What is the "right" definition? What does it mean to BE a gender or "identify" as a gender?

If you asked me this 6-7 years ago I and most people would say it's just a synonym for your biological sex, but apparently that's no longer the case, and I've yet to have anyone give me an answer that makes sense or is consistent across multiple people. It's just so tiring to hear gender bullshit invade so many online spaces and places of discussion while people CAN'T EVEN AGREE WHAT IT ACTUALLY MEANS.

This, but more importantly why do we need more definition. Nothing was not working before for the lack of it. We literally broke things by creating a problem where none was.

And no, trannyism is not a case of the system not working. It's a case of you not working and should have always been treated as such.

 

[qt farmer :)]

Alright, I really just have one question about this.

What is gender?

No, seriously, what the fuck is "gender"? What is the "right" definition? What does it mean to BE a gender or "identify" as a gender?

If you asked me this 6-7 years ago I and most people would say it's just a synonym for your biological sex, but apparently that's no longer the case, and I've yet to have anyone give me an answer that makes sense or is consistent across multiple people. It's just so tiring to hear gender bullshit invade so many online spaces and places of discussion while people CAN'T EVEN AGREE WHAT IT ACTUALLY MEANS.

I've always thought 'sex' was used more frequently in science/health-related fields, data collecting, etc. and 'gender' used more when talking about social and/or cultural interactions. essentially, they're the same thing, just different implications behind both words.

 

[Rekkington]

The progressive view on transgenderism overall is correct, in that transitioning must be accepted since the brain cannot be made to match the body. What is misguided, are people who are not trans, who got groomed into thinking they are trans, so they spread incorrect "PSAs" which cause unnecessary strife. It's spreading unintentional lies with the best of intentions. This of course is not new to the human race either.

Of course the brain can be made to match the body, it's that nobody ever tries.

 

[PBJ Sucks]

Of course the brain can be made to match the body, it's that nobody ever tries.

I can personally grant that it is very difficult. This doesn't mean that transitioning is a better option though. That much difficulty and fighting to maintain such a poor result is a huuuuge negative even if it actually worked to otherwise fix you. More importantly given the burdens they are trying to place on society (legal shit, taxpayer funded transitioning, bullying the rest of the population etc) it is not worth normalizing it or creating more.

 

[Rekkington]

I can personally grant that it is very difficult. This doesn't mean that transitioning is a better option though. That much difficulty and fighting to maintain such a poor result is a huuuuge negative even if it actually worked to otherwise fix you. More importantly given the burdens they are trying to place on society (legal shit, taxpayer funded transitioning, bullying the rest of the population etc) it is not worth normalizing it or creating more.

I've spoken to many trannies online and presented the question: if there was a magic pill you could take to make it so you felt at ease in your body would you take it? All of them said no, which shows this identity shit is deeply psychological and not, say, a genetic defect in their brain. They don't see gender dysphoria as a problem, its "being in this body" as a problem, and as we all know transitioning never actually fixes that.

And at the end of the day, all we really care about is their intentions. Nobody cares about mentally ill cretins, what we care about is them setting their entire existence to normalizing it and pitching it to children. The sheer amount of tranny advocates is staggering. Watch "I Am Jazz" to see how their entire lives are built around people praising them and talking about their fucked up bodies 24/7.

 

[BroccoliBrain]

I have a MtF friend into sports who openly admits there's an even larger (over 6 ft), not-very-passing MtF in one of the neighbouring teams who wrecks all the women and they "don't stand a chance" unless she's also playing. She has gender dysphoria and said yes to the 'magic pill' question when I asked her but before anyone calls me a handmaiden I don't think of her as 'one of the sane good trannies', I take it as proof that you can have a mental illness that drives a person to seek transitioning (not that it's the best method imo). She gets to travel and be coached by top professionals and I think of it as an opportunity that's been taken from, you know, a real woman. It causes me such a dissonance when we have these discussions and I compartmentalize it in front of her, while she has XY chromosomes and avoids that she probably beats the shit out all the girls during practice. According to her they're all woke lefty types who do nothing but praise her and roll over and take it.

I've always thought 'sex' was used more frequently in science/health-related fields, data collecting, etc. and 'gender' used more when talking about social and/or cultural interactions. essentially, they're the same thing, just different implications behind both words.

You finally reminded me about something I've long forgotten, I rarely got my words wrong as a kid and knew gender to mean "a polite word for sex" and you can't put "sex" in a Pokemon game
The meanings of words are always changing but what I'm saying is that this is what it meant before all the trans bs from the 2010's eroded the definition. So basically I agree with you.

 

[BeboRefugee]

Where do people stand on non-binary?

Personally I don't buy it. You're not non-binary, you're just a guy or girl that isn't in touch with conventionally male or female activities/priorities. Drag race is back and I've noticed quite a few very successful drag queens now identify as non-binary and when asked, they flat out say its because they've never felt in touch with their masculine side.

It's a pity that the gay rights movement for 50 years was all about how being into dudes doesn't make a gay person any less of a man, but now saying you inhabit some nightmare zone that is neither male nor female is met with praise.

 

[spencer reid]

funny seeing a post on tumblr that's like "transfems on reddit are self hating and also transpassing is problematic" but then going on reddit and seeing them saying "trans people on 4chan, wow much self hate"

lol weird thing but is there some sort of social media hierarchy with them?

 

[BeboRefugee]

funny seeing a post on tumblr that's like "transfems on reddit are self hating and also transpassing is problematic" but then going on reddit and seeing them saying "trans people on 4chan, wow much self hate"

lol weird thing but is there some sort of social media hierarchy with them?

Uh yeah, right from the start. The act of visiting 4chan is worse than admitting to going to a Trump rally. White nationalists are all over /pol/, but you are complicit in their actions for using the other boards for any reason. It's a scary place full of racists and dark web denizens that will ruin your life for no reason.

Those dark web folks have been a myth since, like 2005, but in a twist of irony, the fact of it being anonymous immunises users from being policed like reddit and tumblr. Having the wrong opinions will be met with ridicule, but crazy goons can't hack your profile and blackmail you with your address and place of work. This is probably the real reason they hate it so much.

Imagine being, well, really anybody with a fragile ego who wants to use the levers of both the state and corporations to make people play by your rules. Either your personality or appearance repulses others, so the only recourse is to take pre-emptive hostile action. Now imagine one of the internet's most famous websites are populated by people that take joy in making fun of you, and there's nothing you can do about it? 4chan doesn't make a mission to upset neurotic basket cases, its just the unforgiving nature of the place.