Formula 1 Discussion - And favourite driver?

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A couple of triple headers. It kills me to see them fly across the Atlantic to Canada for one race and then go back again. They really need to get a second race in northern US and make that a double-header.

Never heard that about Viet, hilarious! Too bad, the track looked kind of neat. Is it officially off calendar? If so, what country is TBC for Race 4? I think the 'nam race was supposed to be early season this year.

I hope the race in Turkey is a good one. I am hoping for at least one more oddball race that sees a new winner or at least a non-Top 3 teams winner (Yes, I still count Ferrari as top 3 when it comes to usual winners). A Renault or McL win would be nice.
 
'nam was supposed to be race 4 but is definitely off for 2021 so they're trying to find a stand in from among the current options hence my vote (all be it unlikely) for Murgello again.

I don't know what they could do next to Canada unless they finally forced that awful plan they keep resurrecting then killing for a NYC street track. The sponsors keep pushing for it and I can see liberty going for it at some point (no doubt at the expense of a classic European circuit). I suppose they could try and sell the idea of a track to one of the Central American nations but those places tend to be shit holes and the sponsors aren't bothered about selling anything there.

Other than moving Austin or the Canadian GP (I imagine an October date would require studded tyres though so not practical) I don't see how they can sort it. Well they could drop the Canadian GP all together, I hear the middle East has plenty of rich princes who would love a tack to go next to their premier League football team. God damn money is ruining this sport (like pretty much all sports).

To avoid double posting I'll edit this one.

So he asked Prost who said don't play favourites, don't get bogged down in interteam politics and give drivers equal treatment to which he took away to pick a favourite, get bogged down in interteam politics and fuck one of your drivers. Merc constantly playing the "equal treatment, no politics" nonsense is ridiculous at least Ferrari out and out admitted they had a number 1 driver. Why do their strategies always favour Hamilton and if Bottas wants to change it he gets told to get fucked?

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Edit again

Apparently Grosjean missed his flight to Turkey, one less day prep.

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So, I see that Sao Paolo is confirmed til 2025 so that worked out alright!

Also, check this article I just came across (trans from Spanish):

Mazepin and Stroll, on trial for the purchase of Force India​

Russian billionaire considers Stroll transaction wrong​

The Supreme Court of England will decide the 2018 case​

5SERGI ALEJANDRO | 12 NOV 2020 - 18:04​

Dmitry Mazepin, a Russian billionaire and businessman, is going to sue Lawrence Stroll for the purchase of Force India. According to the Russian, the purchase of Stroll was "illegal and rigged" as it was a much smaller sum than what he offered at the time.​

Two years after the bankruptcy and sale of Force India, the matter is back in court. Dmitry Mazepin, father of Nikita Mazepin and Russian businessman, is willing to sue Lawrence Stroll, current owner of the team renamed Racing Point, before the UK Supreme Court. The reason Mazepin gives is that this purchase was rigged and illegal.

Stroll, together with Toto Wolff, took control of a Force India in bankruptcy in the summer of 2018 after a bid of 101 million euros. A sum much lower than the one theoretically offered by Mazepin, which was between 113.8 and 136.7 million euros, according to the British newspaper The Times.

However, Force India's management, FRP Advisory, opted for the Stroll consortium's bid over the Russian's because it was an operational bid, not just for acquisition. In fact, the Canadian has completely transformed the team, has plans to expand its headquarters and next year will be renamed Aston Martin Racing, which will have Sebastian Vettel in its ranks.

Mazepin made the bid through his company Uralkali, a specialist in chemical products, to be his son Nikita's entry point into Formula 1, something that ultimately did not happen. According to the same British newspaper, the Supreme Court of the United Kingdom will rule in favor of one or the other if it determines that Uralkali suffered financial damages when the purchase of Force India could not be made or not.
SOURCE: https://soymotor.com/noticias/mazepin-y-stroll-juicio-por-la-compra-de-force-india-982221
 
LiveFromNS said:
So, I see that Sao Paolo is confirmed til 2025 so that worked out alright!

Also, check this article I just came across (trans from Spanish):

Mazepin and Stroll, on trial for the purchase of Force India​

Russian billionaire considers Stroll transaction wrong​

The Supreme Court of England will decide the 2018 case​

5SERGI ALEJANDRO | 12 NOV 2020 - 18:04​

Dmitry Mazepin, a Russian billionaire and businessman, is going to sue Lawrence Stroll for the purchase of Force India. According to the Russian, the purchase of Stroll was "illegal and rigged" as it was a much smaller sum than what he offered at the time.​

Two years after the bankruptcy and sale of Force India, the matter is back in court. Dmitry Mazepin, father of Nikita Mazepin and Russian businessman, is willing to sue Lawrence Stroll, current owner of the team renamed Racing Point, before the UK Supreme Court. The reason Mazepin gives is that this purchase was rigged and illegal.

Stroll, together with Toto Wolff, took control of a Force India in bankruptcy in the summer of 2018 after a bid of 101 million euros. A sum much lower than the one theoretically offered by Mazepin, which was between 113.8 and 136.7 million euros, according to the British newspaper The Times.

However, Force India's management, FRP Advisory, opted for the Stroll consortium's bid over the Russian's because it was an operational bid, not just for acquisition. In fact, the Canadian has completely transformed the team, has plans to expand its headquarters and next year will be renamed Aston Martin Racing, which will have Sebastian Vettel in its ranks.

Mazepin made the bid through his company Uralkali, a specialist in chemical products, to be his son Nikita's entry point into Formula 1, something that ultimately did not happen. According to the same British newspaper, the Supreme Court of the United Kingdom will rule in favor of one or the other if it determines that Uralkali suffered financial damages when the purchase of Force India could not be made or not.
SOURCE: https://soymotor.com/noticias/mazepin-y-stroll-juicio-por-la-compra-de-force-india-982221
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Maybe it's just me being unfamiliar with specific laws that relate to this case, but isn't Force India pretty much free to sell their assets to whoever they want? I mean, they don't have to take the highest bidder, they can sell for less money to someone else if they want to... and this sort of reads like Stroll's bid was of a different, more reliable nature.

Either way, it's gonna be two billionaires going to court, cause both wanted to buy a seat for their sons to play pretend F1 champion. Just let sink in how utterly absurd that is.
 
I agree surely they can sell to whoever they want. If I was selling a business and got offered £100k then someone came along and offered 1p it wouldn't be actionable for me to sell for 1p. What harm as Mazepin suffered by not been able to buy the team? If the value of the asset has increased then it's an easy argument to say that's due to the investment and hard work if the new owners and not an organic benefit. Sounds like he's just salty Lawrence bought a car for his son but he hasn't been able to do the same for his.

Edit: ok having looked into it further there could be a case. Mazepin's point is the team was in administration meaning they have to seek the best price for the assets meaning Mazepin's bid should have been accepted by administrators. Stroll's argument is they were bids for different things and his bid represented a better value proposition. It going to come down to how well the administrators did their due diligence and assessed the bids.
 
Pretty much every interview that I can find on Youtube has the drivers remark on the insanely slippery tarmac of this grand prix...

The way I see it, we either get a race where barely anyone dares to overtake, cause driving anywhere off the ideal race line means driving on slippery tarmac or it causes a few surprises and shakes up things a little. Hell, maybe Raikkönen repeats his amazing start again? He seems to be pretty good, when it comes to driving under slippery conditions.

Edit:
Looks like they found a ... well... "solution" to improve grip.

Coccxys said:
What harm as Mazepin suffered by not been able to buy the team?
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He had to endure his son's incessant whining.
 
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I could see that Mazepin could possibly have a case to sue the administrators of Force India, but against Stroll just because he submitted a bid and had it accepted? That doesn't sound right, although I am not a lawyer.
 
I am involved in law and have been for 30+ years. Yes, Stroll wouldn't be in any trouble, UNLESS there was some collusion or backroom shit going down which got him the bid. Toto was involved in some form so perhaps that "power" being connected with or backing Stroll is what got his bid accepted.

Having dealt with receivership and bankruptcy litigation before, I presume that this FI affair wasn't like going to a local auction, but rather I would assume that detailed plans accompanied the bid to indicate what would be done with the team/assets by the winning bidder. It could be that Stroll's plan was better or more comprehensive than the Commie's. It would depend on exactly what the receiver's mandate was. If it was solely get the most money possible and no shit was given as to what happened with the team/assets after the receiver was paid, then Mazepin certainly could have a compelling argument if his bid would have garnered more money than Stroll's. He appears to be saying that is the case. So, really the question is on the receiver and did they fuck up by not taking the highest bid. If that was what they were primarily supposed to do, then there is certainly a question as to why they went with a lower bid.

If anything does come of this, I'd be happy to analyze any legal filings if they become available.

As for the race, or track situation, yes, I think if the track doesn't majorly evolve, there is potential for an odd ball race. Not necessarily that Mercedes won't be 1-2, but could see some teams be better off than others or a couple of drivers' talents showing through big time. Prayers again for an 8+ out of 10 race!
 
Running road cars around the track is exceptional even by Turkish standard. Road cars have a totally different rubber compound and will reset the track by pulling all the F1 rubber from today's running. You see it when they run the Porsche super cup on race weekends, they pull up the Pirelli rubber and lay their own which the F3/2/1 cars then have to reclean the circuit before laying new rubber of their own. There is no way to make the surface more rubbered in for F1 than to run F3/2/1 cars around the circuit.

Here's a decent article about the "rubbering in" of a track, obviously it misses a lot out because my god is non-metalic materials science a deep ocean to jump into but it's a pretty good summary. The much colder operating road tyres on those cars are going to wreck the nice rubber layers from today. They've had a decent rain though so probably already done.
 
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Coccxys said:
You see it when they run the Porsche super cup on race weekends, they pull up the Pirelli rubber and lay their own which the F3/2/1 cars then have to reclean the circuit before laying new rubber of their own.
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Because I'm an autism and it may be of interest to people, the Porsche Supercup run Michelin tyres. I think at the moment in (4 wheel) motorsports, Michelin is the tyre of choice or at least they pay for the franchise to make tyres for more series and don't probably commit them good good backroom deals like Pirelli do all the time
 
Re: Mazepin, I think he and a few other Russian oligarchs should attempt forming a Russian F1 team instead of trying to buy their own outfit. They most certainly have money for it and Russia's not short on STEM talent.
 
So that overtakefans live stream I mentioned few posts back is great. I am watching the F1TVPro AceStream feed and it looks fantastic and no buffering issues whatsoever. Track looks a little better. Fucking dog on the track!
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🇨🇦
 
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Today's qualifying was more interesting to watch than any race in Socchi ever.

Have to hand it to Stroll, that was a mighty fine performance, let's just hope he wasn't involved in any yellow-flag shenanigans during Q1, apparently, the stewards are going to look at every single lap by every single driver that was out during the yellow flag situation, to figure out whether they ignored them or not. Btw, this prevented Mercs from getting another record this season, and anything that cockblocks mercs is a good thing. Hamilton and Bottas were slow as fuck, compared to their usual performance.
Honorable mention: Raikkönen and Giovinazzi both reaching top 10 is easily one of the best things to happen this season. They earned it, they really did.

The start will be a clusterfuck with so many drivers in relatively slow cars in top positions, I just hope they'll manage to get through the first couple corners without incident.
 
Let's hope for a decent shower before the race to spice it up even more. Hamilton's (deleted) fastes Q1 time was while there was double yellows so let's hope he forgot to slow properly through that marshalling sector.

EDIT: Stroll under Investigation for his Q3 lap and yellow flags brought out by Perez going off.

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Coccxys said:
Let's hope for a decent shower before the race to spice it up even more. Hamilton's (deleted) fastes Q1 time was while there was double yellows so let's hope he forgot to slow properly through that marshalling sector.

EDIT: Stroll under Investigation for his Q3 lap and yellow flags brought out by Perez going off.

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Aw man. I'm not a huge fan of Stroll, but I'd like to see him keep his pole. His performance was pretty good under these terrible conditions.
 
Possibly not looking good for Stroll. Though they could say the track had improved that much he did purples despite actually slowing compared to what he could have done.

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Edit: Sainz given 3 place penalty for blocking.

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Edit 2: Stroll on pole, no further action. Reasoning as I predicted it could be above.

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Saw you guys talking about Hamilton’s contract a few pages ago. Both Hamilton and Mercedes need each other because each party is worried about hurting their image if Hamilton goes to a worse team or Mercedes has a worse driver. Remember in Abu Dhabi 2016 when Hamilton was a total bitch slowing down the pack, and Mercedes was ordering him to pick up the pace. But he didn’t, and he didn’t get any contracts. It’s definitely Lewis’s team right now
 
As far as Lewis unconfirmed contact rumours I have heard it's down to length of contract. Merc want to nail him on for multiple years to give stability during the rules change and avoid having to do this whole negotiation nonsense again next year. While Hamilton wants a single year contract to give flexibility, the ability to threaten to walk every time he doesn't get his way and I suppose can avoid 2022 if the development programme is looking shaky.

Personally I think Hamilton might retire at the end of 2022. He'll (probably) have beaten Schumacher's world championship record, he's financially on easy street and is probably not going to risk proving it's all the car if he ends up in the wrong seat when the rules change.
 
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