Destiny 2 - Place your bets on how many $40 DLC packs we'll get this time.

[King Dead]

Someone linked a new Destiny data site on the subreddit, popularity.report, and aside from a variety of stats about D2 players and how they spend their time in game, it gives us probably the clearest picture yet of how fucked the game is now:

The biggest takeaway is that Edge of Fate is officially doing worse numbers than even Curse of Osiris was, and there is no indication that the trend is leveling off anytime soon, to say nothing of turning around. Ash and Iron gave only the tiniest of spikes before the plunge resumed. But there are other interesting things to look at:

• CoO was indeed the worst point in the game's history before now, and if they hadn't started course correcting when they did with things like the Go Fast update, there would have been hell to pay with Activision. Why they took so long to do anything about the state of the current game when they had this as an example is beyond me.
• Sunsetting and content vaulting did an untold amount of damage to the playerbase numbers. Despite the peaks getting lower with each subsequent expansion release, there were still strong numbers of players who showed up to play through the new content at least. As soon as they started cutting out chunks of the game with Beyond Light, they lost a huge amount of those players, and they never came back. Not even the better received expansions like WQ and TFS managed even Shadowkeep numbers.
• Despite the valid complaints about the staleness of the seasonal model, it still managed to get players to come back again and again, and numbers generally held steady at their post-Beyond Light level for years afterwards, following a general trend of spiking on season launches and slowly tapering to the diehards as the season progressed. Yes, even Beyond Light did adequately, though probably because the full ramifications of vaulting hadn't set in yet.
• Lightfall really was a catastrophe of an expansion, and the feeling of it being filler content really managed to ruin a lot of the momentum that Bungie was getting back with WQ (although man, people really did not like Plunder by the end). The spikes and dips got lower and lower, and it seems even the positive sentiment over the seasons that followed didn't really translate to more player numbers. It was only when Into the Light and especially Pantheon released in the buildup to TFS that numbers started to recover.
• TFS was definitely a jumping off point for a lot of the playerbase, and it shows. The numbers hit a significantly lower baseline, the episodes didn't bring many people back, and Rite of the Nine barely moved the needle at all. They really needed to do something big to get people interested again if they wanted to get back to the glory days; now was not the time to underdeliver.
• But underdeliver they did, dropping an expansion that feels not even half-baked, upending systems that players had gotten used to, and doing absolutely nothing to help new players get into the game. It seems that only people who were still playing during the episodes were willing to give Edge of Fate a shot, and not for long after.

I think we all knew it was dire, but this really shows just how bad. It's nowhere near as severe as some of their other stupid decisions, but I don't think the bait and switch with SIVA is really helping matters at all, and it would certainly explain why Ash and Iron did nothing. Bungie knew that players were fond of that story and wanted to explore more of it, so they deliberately dangled the Plaguelands in their faces to entice them to come back, only to have characters state explicitly in no uncertain terms that SIVA is dead and it can never ever return. This is despite the fact that the season's story literally shows Vex alternate reality shenanigans dragging things from other timelines into the main one, not to mention that's the crux of the exotic mission where the Guardian yanks the axe into their timeline. That sentiment of "we know what you want but fuck you you're never getting it" certainly left a bad taste in players' mouths. No Devil Splicers, no SIVA, no classic Rise of Iron strikes, no Wrath of the Machine, just a boring romp around small chunks of the Plaguelands killing Red Legion for the umpteenth time. Whoopee.

At this point, I hope Marathon crashes and burns and Bungie ceases to exist. Those fags have no idea what they're doing, and they squandered a truly interesting universe thanks to their retardation. If you told me a couple years ago I'd be holding those sentiments, I'd have thought you were crazy, but here we are.

 

[Zenos Yae Viator]

omeone linked a new Destiny data site on the subreddit, popularity.report, and aside from a variety of stats about D2 players and how they spend their time in game, it gives us probably the clearest picture yet of how fucked the game is now:

This chart is wild, players had such high standards during Forsaken with that massive dip during, if they only knew they were in literally the best content the game would ever have lol.
I think I found the "for want of a nail" though, and its Shadow Keep, look at that massive player starting spike.. for THAT expansion, all those people got on and it was such a fucking bust sure it didn't have a massive drop, but the parabolic arc into the void starts there.

I have over 2,200 hours in Destiny 2, and I quit midway through Lightfall, my best friend also quit, it just wasn't good, it wasn't fun, and they weren't ever going to change, we accepted that by the end of fuckin Witchqueen, but still, sunk cost and all that.
the problem is they have a good setting, it draws people in, the aesthetics are good, but they just can't deliver content, they can't deliver areas, for whatever reason an area the size of two football fields is years of work for them, YEARS, but they set out to make a fuckin Pseudo-MMO! the only time they ever delivered a good amount was Forsaken, and that was a fluke.

 

[The Doom Slayer]

Sunsetting and content vaulting did an untold amount of damage to the playerbase numbers.

Good. Honestly this deserved 100x the backlash it got. Some of the most disgusting shit I've ever seen a game company do. And it still has lasting effects to this day (such as the new player experience being god awful garbage). The fact I saw so many just bending over and taking it back then truly was blackpilling. So I'm glad to see a lot of people did in fact say fuck this and walked away.

 

[King Dead]

Welp, it was probably going to happen sooner or later unless the entire studio had gone full retard, but after stating that unstable cores won't be resetting in Renegades, they confirmed that they're in the process of getting rid of them entirely. No timeframe for when, but in the meantime, they're dropping nearly a million in the catch-up chest coming with today's update, as well as lowering the cost of infusion substantially until they can be removed for good.

I know we won't get it, but I really want to hear the thought process behind why this was considered a good idea in the first place. It seemed like they were trying to avoid another legendary shard situation by preventing dedicated players from keeping a permanent stockpile and then having to balance around that, but why introduce yet another currency to solve something that wasn't really a problem? Why put such enormous limits on infusion so that players would be forced to dismantle a dozen pieces of high-level gear just to get a single item to their current level? The real answer is that obviously they were trying to pump playtime metrics, but that clearly backfired with everyone choosing to jump ship instead of playing a game that didn't respect their time.

It's a sad state of affairs when the best news to come out about D2 these days is that Bungie is backtracking on a fuckup.

 

[The Doom Slayer]

Welp, it was probably going to happen sooner or later unless the entire studio had gone full retard, but after stating that unstable cores won't be resetting in Renegades, they confirmed that they're in the process of getting rid of them entirely. No timeframe for when, but in the meantime, they're dropping nearly a million in the catch-up chest coming with today's update, as well as lowering the cost of infusion substantially until they can be removed for good.

I know we won't get it, but I really want to hear the thought process behind why this was considered a good idea in the first place. It seemed like they were trying to avoid another legendary shard situation by preventing dedicated players from keeping a permanent stockpile and then having to balance around that, but why introduce yet another currency to solve something that wasn't really a problem? Why put such enormous limits on infusion so that players would be forced to dismantle a dozen pieces of high-level gear just to get a single item to their current level? The real answer is that obviously they were trying to pump playtime metrics, but that clearly backfired with everyone choosing to jump ship instead of playing a game that didn't respect their time.

It's a sad state of affairs when the best news to come out about D2 these days is that Bungie is backtracking on a fuckup.

The entire thing is/was just sunsetting in disguise (again). Resetting you every season and forcing you to grind your ass off to increase "engagement". But like every time they've done something like this, it backfired and caused people to leave the game instead.

 

[StacticShock]

Resetting you every season and forcing you to grind your ass off to increase "engagement". But like every time they've done something like this, it backfired and caused people to leave the game instead.

about right yeah, i still remember that during the introduction of battle passes you could grind shit easily and whatnot, only for them to fuck up the free tier by changing the max level engram to some cosmetic shit instead of thematic armor pieces, that was right before they introduced sunsetting and then i just felt that there was no need to keep playing that shit.
i've read that they changed it again to allow you to pick older free tier BP items but i ain't touching that shit, my guns still stuck at 1500 light level because they were sunsetted, eat shit and die, bungo.
-'dit, jeettube redeemed a video about the declining D2 population.

 

[Asian tech support]

The entire thing is/was just sunsetting in disguise (again). Resetting you every season and forcing you to grind your ass off to increase "engagement". But like every time they've done something like this, it backfired and caused people to leave the game instead.

I'd be curious if there was ever a documented case of kneecapping the player in order to increase engagement that didn't have the opposite effect, because here we are and "engagement" has never been lower.

 

[Kane Lives]

So has Bungo actually ever addressed the abysmal new player experience? How do you run a basic bitch live service game without a plan to get new marks blood in?

 

[King Dead]

So has Bungo actually ever addressed the abysmal new player experience? How do you run a basic bitch live service game without a plan to get new marks blood in?

Their latest update was letting you skip the entire New Light campaign after doing the intro because they know it sucks ass. That should about sum up how they feel about doing anything to attract new players. If it weren't for it being a very retarded business move, I almost couldn't blame them since I'll bet everyone who has wanted to try the game probably has by now, so it's not like they'd even be able to get anyone new if they tried.

I'd be curious if there was ever a documented case of kneecapping the player in order to increase engagement that didn't have the opposite effect, because here we are and "engagement" has never been lower.

Turns out that designing your game around what streamers want (an endless grind that's only rewarding to people who can afford to play for hours a day) turns off the vast majority of players who don't want to make the game a second job. Who cares if people who no-life the game get bored after a week? That's their problem. Toss in a new activity or two, throw in some cool new guns, and make a game that's fulfilling for everyone. It shouldn't be hard, yet here we are.

 

[StacticShock]

Turns out that designing your game around what streamers want (an endless grind that's only rewarding to people who can afford to play for hours a day) turns off the vast majority of players who don't want to make the game a second job. Who cares if people who no-life the game get bored after a week? That's their problem. Toss in a new activity or two, throw in some cool new guns, and make a game that's fulfilling for everyone. It shouldn't be hard, yet here we are.

4trannies when it was known as 4chan back then said that on overwatch, even calling tigole for the fucking jew that he is.
i still remember some bungie fans praising how "the scarab lord" was part of destiny 2's dev team... huh.

 

[Based Yuu Narukami]

So has Bungo actually ever addressed the abysmal new player experience? How do you run a basic bitch live service game without a plan to get new marks blood in?

They haven't because the streamers haven't complained enough about it. Those guys are too busy making videos about how the game is getting worse while still playing and milking it like the good little shills they are.

 

[The Doom Slayer]

 

[StacticShock]

<bungo is draining sony>

so it took journoscum to tell people the obvious?

 

[The Doom Slayer]

The backpedaling and damage control begins, but it's too late and nobody gives a shit.

https://www.bungie.net/7/en/News/Article/d2renegades_contentcalendar

With Edge of Fate, we presented a different vision for the future of Destiny 2’s core game. One intended to refocus our releases and player call-to-action on a familiar but deeper pursuit of Power and ascending to higher Tiers of gear across a wider range of activities supporting customizable challenge and commensurate rewards.

Very quickly, the feedback made it clear that this was the wrong path for Destiny.

Even if our execution had been perfect, and we see plainly that it was not, it is clear that grinding Power will never be a substitute for earning a trophy. Climbing though throwaway tiers en-route to the gear you want to build around isn’t aspirational. And the Portal itself surrenders too much of Destiny’s feeling of place and exploration. These lessons, and many others besides them, have been taken to heart by our team over the last three months.

From 9.0.0 on through 9.1.5, our focus across the entire team has been response to player feedback, starting with the fastest changes and working through the more challenging ones. Our focus was on faster, better Rewards, more player agency in activity choice, and removing barriers to playing with friends.

 

[WULULULULU]

lol. They got nowhere to go. They've alienated 90% of their players. And with Marathon being a Concord-tier flop, thanks to Arc Raiders and Escape From Tarkov entering Steam and taking (or in Tarkov's case, retaking) the extraction shooter crowd, Bungie is now fucked beyond saving.

I guess now they and 343i share the same fate: loved by no one, hated by everybody.

 

[StacticShock]

lol. They got nowhere to go. They've alienated 90% of their players. And with Marathon being a Concord-tier flop, thanks to Arc Raiders and Escape From Tarkov entering Steam and taking (or in Tarkov's case, retaking) the extraction shooter crowd, Bungie is now fucked beyond saving.

I guess now they and 343i share the same fate: loved by no one, hated by everybody.

the funny thing is that tarkov generates PVP salt by simplying giving updates to the pve crowd.
the exact same shit that happened with bungo and destiny 2, every time they introduced a gimmicky pve weapon it always fucked pvp subhumans and generated salt

 

[WULULULULU]

the funny thing is that tarkov generates PVP salt by simplying giving updates to the pve crowd.
the exact same shit that happened with bungo and destiny 2, every time they introduced a gimmicky pve weapon it always fucked pvp subhumans and generated salt

You can still play offline Tarkov using SPT and mods. What does Destiny have? A story with gay space AIDS.

 

[King Dead]

On the positive side, admitting they totally fucked up on the Portal and loot tiers is hardly something I thought I'd see. Not a "we think this needs more work," straight-up "even if we had gotten it perfect the first time, nobody wanted this." They put an end to people claiming that loot tiers were okay because lesser-skilled players (read: people who didn't slave away at power grinding) could be satisfied with a totally usable lower tier; Bungie literally called them throwaway tiers in this post. It would probably have carried a wee bit more meaning if Tyson Green himself came out and said it, but he continues to be completely MIA, unsurprisingly. And the QoL updates are nice, like more vault space and filtering (finally), tiers not mattering for new gear bonuses (would prefer a removal, but baby steps), and all exotics being featured gear. Hell, I didn't expect them to let you use any exotic armor ornament on any exotic piece, that wasn't on my bingo card at all.

That said, the game is still in dire straits, and that's putting it lightly. Population is still at an all-time low, most of the game is still irrelevant outside of exotic chasing, and a lot of the stupid additions with EoF are likely still months away from being removed or replaced. They dug themselves into a gigantic hole pursuing Tyson Green's grand new vision for Destiny (read: copying Diablo and not understanding why that doesn't fit), and it'll take just as much work to get back out of it again, if not more. Maybe they can pull it off, maybe not. Nothing short of overdelivering the fuck out of the next few updates will turn things around.

I'd honestly laugh if they ended up making T5 the new baseline for everything. Yeah, everything would get powercrept to hell, but who cares? They let that genie out of the bottle, either they roll with it or attempt to re-cork it (set everyone's gear back to T1 and watch the riots).

 

[The Bogwater Flows On]

You can still play offline Tarkov using SPT and mods. What does Destiny have? A story with gay space AIDS.

If destiny never made me play their dogshit PVP gamemodes I would have been a happier man. They also could have had a larger repeat playerbase, but they would also make dogshit nerfs to block speedrunners that make all gamemodes play like dogshit.

 

[Lord Nelson]

If destiny never made me play their dogshit PVP gamemodes I would have been a happier man. They also could have had a larger repeat playerbase, but they would also make dogshit nerfs to block speedrunners that make all gamemodes play like dogshit.

Grinding PvP kills for the Witherhoard catalyst is still one of the worst grinds I have ever endured in any game.