Culture Wars General - KiA Diet Coke Edition

  • 🏰 The Fediverse is up. If you know, you know.
  • Want to keep track of this thread?
    Accounts can bookmark posts, watch threads for updates, and jump back to where you stopped reading.
    Create account
I've seen people talking about this in the WoW thread (Among a lot of WoW lore I really don't understand).

My hot take/conspiracy theory is that this is a combined effort to try and unionize a major game studio after someone or some people tried to get their way and were repelled by management; my main reason for believing this is because most of the information has come from Jason Schrier and his "anonymous insiders" (Aka his personal friends). The lawsuit itself comes from a department that seems to live by making slap suits, they just fill in these reports with little evidence, file a lawsuit and later reach a settlement in court because companies just want them to go away.

Do I believe there's some harrassment going on? Yes. Is it to the level of the reports? Hell no, most of it has likely been fabricated or taken out of context (The Cosby picture for instance just screams to me men hanging out and making jokes). Either way this is Activision Blizzard, if Bobby decides to just nuke them out of existance I can't say I will be very sad about it
As I've said in the other thread, game journos will straight up ignore testimony from people in these game companies. They've done it to Riot people for years until either their privileges were reduced, or they saw an opportunity (IE Kotaku's personal friends). If you work in the industry, these people are not your friends. Unless they already are your friends.

One thing I've noticed over the years is that women in the games industry keep working willingly under these conditions, sometimes trying to get their way with their so-called abusers by titillating them. Then as soon as they have a way to grab the pie, they'll go for it and claim that this is unilaterally and entirely the fault of the other party. In the case of the Sky Williams Super Smash Bros house, you had a bunch of female artists involved with Californian game companies. These people all knew Sky Williams was housing sex pests who lusted after minors in their own living space. They kept mooching off of Sky Williams until they could get some serious public clout and be heralded as progressive heroes.

I have seen plenty instances of men acting exactly like the Cosby suite people at Blizzard in entertainment conventions, such as Pax West and Pax East, Dragoncon, and Anime Expo. Kotaku is slanting it as if it's this horrible thing and awful sex dungeon. You see, this behavior is unacceptable in 2021. Socially awkward men that don't get any should politely ask women to have sex with them. We should make all those spaces that are sausage fests into a space women are more appreciative of.

You fool, this is what Feminism was invented to stop.

Why do you think prohibition was considered a dry run? They went after the bars, the life source from which all fat jokes and bathroom humor came from.
Sorry Marissa, no more jokes are allowed.
 
Sony is the main worldwide distributor pretty much now and forever
That's very optimistic.

I don't consider myself old, but I've been around long enough to know that "too big to fail" means "going to crash and burn suddenly", and when it happens, the media will be saying "What happened? Nobody saw this coming!" when everybody who was paying attention saw it coming and jumped ship. It happened to MySpace, Napster, Tumblr, Wikipedia, and is currently happening to Facebook, Patreon, PayPal, and Sony.

When I was into anime, everything was either 4Kids, Manga Video, and ADV. Only one of those is still around today.

The main guy who left Marvelous really wasn't some kind of visionary either
What are you talking about? The only guy I know of that left Marvelous was known as the guy that pushed for faithful translations and artistic integrity whenever management thought they could make a few extra dollars by censoring things.

My hot take/conspiracy theory is that this is a combined effort to try and unionize a major game studio after someone or some people tried to get their way and were repelled by management
My counter conspiracy take. There have been several attempts to a create a gaming MeToo, but they keep failing. Most notably when Anita Sarkeesian and Zoe Quinn tried to kick off gaming MeToo, and it felt like there was an organised narrative ready to go, but then Alec Holowka killed himself.

Activision Blizzard is their latest (and probably last) big push to get there to be a gaming MeToo so the usual suspects can keep their grift going for another 5 years.
 
I like how I go to bloody place daily and it is FULL of people, and yet everybody talks of it as if everyone just up and left.
Yes, there are memes about it.
dead in this case doesn't mean no one is using it, even myspace still has users. but the main reason lot of people went to tumblr for, what made it notorious to the point everybody knew about it, got neutered for the sake of apple and advertisers. 3 months after the porn ban tumblr had lost 30% of traffic.

or in numbers, yahoo bought tumblr for 1.1 billion dollars. then verizon bought yahoo, and later sold tumblr - for less then 3 million dollars.
 
In a shocking twist, the Gone Home twink ends up being a piece of shit.


Fullbright co-founder Steve Gaynor, known for his work on Gone Home and Tacoma, has stepped down from his role as creative lead on Open Roads following multiple allegations regarding his treatment of Fullbright staff.

Development on Open Roads, which was announced in December 2020 and expected to star Keri Russell (The Americans) and Kaitlyn Dever (Booksmart), is behind schedule. Fifteen employees left the studio since development on Open Roads began in 2019; around six staff members remain. Speaking with Polygon, 12 former employees said their departure was at least in part due to Gaynor’s behavior toward workers, specifically women on the team. At least 10 of the employees who left since Open Roads production began were women.

Multiple former employees, who spoke with Polygon anonymously out of fear of retaliation, described the Fullbright work environment as “controlling,” a place in which staffers felt undermined and demeaned by Gaynor. Because of Gaynor’s status as the co-founder of a beloved indie darling, some former employees say they were worried about being blacklisted from the industry — though some ended up leaving the industry entirely, anyway. These former employees said they did not experience or witness sexual harassment or explicit sexism; instead, they said, the studio’s toxic culture hid behind the veneer of inclusivity, as women were allegedly repeatedly broken down by microaggressions.



A Fullbright representative confirmed to Polygon that Gaynor stepped down in March due to the “pattern of women leaving” the company. “Steve stepped down in March 2021 after it became clear that the steps that were already being taken to improve his interactions with the team were only yielding temporary results,” the representative said. “More drastic action was needed for the health of the team.”

The representative also noted that “Annapurna is aware of the situation at Fullbright and has been instrumental in helping the Open Roads team make changes to its structure.” A representative for Annapurna told Polygon it supports the Open Roads team. Following the publication of this story, Gaynor issued a statement to Polygon.

Hi all. I have a statement to share about my role at Fullbright.
Earlier this year, I stepped back from my role as creative lead on Open Roads. My leadership style was hurtful to people that worked at Fullbright, and for that I truly apologize.
Stepping back has given me space and perspective to see how my role needs to change and how I need to learn and improve as part of a team, including working with an expert management consultant, and rethinking my relationship to the work at Fullbright.
I care deeply about Open Roads and the Fullbright team. I’m sad to have stepped back from day-to-day development of Open Roads, but it’s been the right thing to do. The Open Roads team has my full faith and support as they bring the game to completion.
Fulbright has always been a small independent studio. Just four people — three of which were studio co-founders — created Gone Home (2013), a BAFTA award-winning narrative game that influenced the industry. For the studio’s next game, Tacoma (2017), the number of staffers increased by more than double. Following the success of these two games, Fullbright continued to grow, taking on more employees and contractors.

In the development of Open Roads, Fullbright partnered with publisher Annapurna Interactive, which provided full funding and additional support staff. The number of core Fullbright employees remained under 20 at any given time. Former employees described the studio at that time as close-knit and supportive of each other. They took pride in creating games that resonated with marginalized people, like Gone Home, a coming-of-age story about a teenage lesbian. But at the same time, former employees say they also felt stifled by Gaynor’s “controlling” and “demeaning presence” — someone who allegedly saw Open Roads not as the team’s game, but as his game. That Gaynor, himself, was Fullbright.


On Twitter, at least, Gaynor “was” Fullbright for quite some time: He held the @Fullbright Twitter account as his personal handle for over a decade. When he stepped down from his position as creative lead, sources said he was required to change his Twitter account to @SteveGaynorPDX. The @Fullbright account now serves as a placeholder, and the studio now uses @FullbrightGames for official updates. A Fullbright representative confirmed to Polygon that “employees were uncomfortable with the official Fullbright account doubling as Steve’s personal Twitter account.”


Women in leadership positions told Polygon that they experienced constant micromanagement that made it difficult for them to do their jobs, having to get even the smallest details approved by Gaynor. This was compounded, they said, by Gaynor’s tendency to disparage and discredit the contributions of female staffers in particular, oftentimes directly to leadership. Some of the former female staffers said they often worried about how Gaynor characterized them to other employees.

“This is going to sound like a joke, but I’m completely serious: Working for him often felt like working for a high school mean girl,” one former employee in a leadership position told Polygon. “His go-to weapon was to laugh at people’s opinions and embarrass them in front of other people.”

Six other former employees corroborated this characterization.

Employees told Polygon that they had wanted to report Gaynor’s behavior but had no actual process to do so. The company had no dedicated human resource employees, other than the occasional third-party consultant. “There’s no infrastructure to escalate,” a former employee said. Several former employees said they confronted Gaynor directly while they were still employed at Fullbright, telling him their concerns about how they believe his behavior negatively impacted the staff.

“HOW DO WE ENSURE WE ARE CREATING AN ENVIRONMENT THAT RESULTS IN WOMEN FEELING RESPECTED. HR, ACCOUNTABILITY, TRAINING, SOMETHING NEEDS TO CHANGE?”
One former employee said she approached Gaynor after reading a GamesIndustry.biz report regarding Season developer Scavengers Studio. She told Polygon she saw similarities between Scavenger Studio creative director Simon Darveau and Gaynor. (While the allegations regarding Darveau include sexual harassment and groping, no claims of physical conduct have been made against Gaynor.) The former employee said she warned Gaynor that a similar report could eventually surface about him.

“[The team was] already in consultation training for communication for the team due to [another former employee] quitting because of him,” she said. “And I told him, I have these concerns. When I read this article, I saw a lot of parallels. Not one-to-one, but a lot of parallels.”

She said she told Gaynor that she was struggling to commit to Open Roads because she was worried the game would be canceled if an article came out about him. “I did expect it to be an emotional discussion,” she told Polygon. “I don’t think that’s something anyone ever wants to hear.”

Gaynor told her that publisher Annapurna came to him to ask about Fullbright’s attrition problem — particularly, that women were leaving the company on what seemed like a monthly basis. The next day, the employee who had approached Gaynor said he sent her with a link to a Wikipedia article on “availability heuristics.” On Wikipedia, availability heuristics is described as “a mental shortcut that relies on immediate examples that come to mind when evaluating a specific topic, concept, method or decision.”


“He sent me the link [...] to explain to me that when there’s a shark attack on the news, people start to get more scared that they might get attacked by a shark,” she said. “So I wasn’t actually valid in worrying that we could have an article about his behavior.” She reported this interaction to the consultant, who reportedly said that Steve’s impact did not match his intent.

Gone Home


Employees found other ways to raise these concerns. Several left anonymous digital Post-It notes on the company server as part of a “team building exercise” in late 2020, helmed by a third-party consultant to help communication on the team. “This sprint marks the 4th woman to leave Fullbright in the last year,” one employee wrote. “How do we ensure we are creating an environment that results in women feeling respected. HR, accountability, training, something needs to change. We all have a part to play in creating a safe working environment, change doesn’t happen without discomfort.”

Other employees used exit interviews to report the studio culture that they said Gaynor perpetuated. (Exit interviews were conducted as a series of questions sent to departing staff, reviewed by department leads.) At least two employees reached out to Annapurna directly. “My personal experience of having Steve as my manager was a toxic and unhealthy dynamic,” this former employee wrote in a correspondence to Annapurna that was reviewed by Polygon. “I can confidently say that I do not want my career to be associated with him.”

Another employee, in a letter to Annapurna, described it as “the worst professional experience [she’d] had in games.”

D.I.C.E 2014 Awards

Other former employees spoke about how they felt the behavior at Fullbright was dangerous. Fullbright, with games like Gone Home and Tacoma that focus on female characters, tends to attract women as prospective employees. It’s a studio that’s perceived to be inclusive and friendly to groups of people who have historically been marginalized. It’s a studio that amplifies these voices rather than stifling them — at least when it comes to its games and the stories they tell. People might expect a toxic culture at triple-A studios, but not at a studio like Fullbright, former employees recalled. Yet these allegations were reported consistently, and, because of it, the studio has lost a large portion of its staff over the years, they said.

Following the mass exodus of Fullbright employees in 2020 and 2021, the leads remaining at the company were tasked with hiring new employees. Two sources told Polygon that they were hesitant to hire the qualified, talented women who applied for the roles out of fear of how they’d be treated by Gaynor. Former employees had seen what they perceived as a pattern of young women, early in their careers, being broken down by their time under Gaynor at Fullbright. Multiple sources told Polygon they feared that even more promising talent would be driven out of the industry, like the others.


Some former employees described themselves as “changed” following their time at Fullbright. Many have questioned their abilities, describing their experience with Gaynor as having been “gaslit,” and have sought out therapy to deal with the trauma associated with development on Open Roads and company culture. Former employees in leadership described “intense guilt” in leaving the company, “leaving [the] team to fend for themselves.”

“I WANT WOMEN TO NOT HAVE TO FEAR RETALIATION FROM A POWERFUL ‘AUTEUR’ FIGURE FOR SPEAKING UP.”
“[We] were constantly acting as a buffer between Steve and the rest of the team just so they could actually get any sort of work done without being pulled into hours of meetings where everything was nitpicked to death or ultimately reversed.”

With so few employees left at Fullbright, the state of Open Roads now looks challenged. In January, Gaynor told Polygon that Open Roads was expected out in 2021. Several former employees told Polygon they believe there’s no way that will happen, noting that production timelines had been disrupted by convoluted decision-making processes and the constant state of flux within Fullbright’s staff. A Fullbright representative told Polygon that the game will not be out in 2021.

Although Gaynor is no longer a creative lead on Open Roads, he is still working on the game as a writer. He currently has no day-to-day collaboration with the rest of the team. Instead, Annapurna Interactive is operating as a mediator between the studio developers and Gaynor, as development continues with a fraction of the company. Multiple former employees expressed concern that Gaynor was even operating in this capacity — that it was weird for a man to be writing a story about a mother and daughter, particularly a man that has allegedly demeaned several female employees.

Despite the bad experiences that multiple former employees described to Polygon, many also said they still felt passionate about the stories Fullbright has been able to tell when other major studios weren’t doing so. But they often felt conflicted given the low morale at the studio and the effect it had on developers who worked on these games.

“It turns my stomach to think that he still gets to write these games about women’s stories when this is how he treats them in real life, with presumably no sign of stopping,” one former employee said. “I want women in the industry and this studio to feel valued. I want vulnerable young women who are new to the industry to be supported, not preyed upon. I want women to not have to fear retaliation from a powerful ‘auteur’ figure for speaking up. I want women to feel safe here. I want women to know that this is not normal. More than anything, I just want him to stop. He shouldn’t be allowed to keep getting away with this.”
 
In a shocking twist, the Gone Home twink ends up being a piece of shit.
Always. ALWAYS with these woketard soyboys. At first they're all I NOD REPECTFULLY TOWARD M'LADIES!, but the second they get a taste of power, it's suddenly I OWN YOU BITCHES AND YOUR PUSSIES ARE MINE!

On the other hand, this looks like another Blizzard, where these women think that being told NO by their boss is akin to gang rape and now are trying to push THE EVIL WHITE MEN out so they can install their no-talent friends.
 
In a shocking twist, the Gone Home twink ends up being a piece of shit.

Imagine being one of the saps who bought a game that can be beaten faster than a bathroom break.

Most gamers don’t know nor care who makes video games. All of our favorite games probably had people in the studio that sucked dick (both figuratively and literally).
 
Always. ALWAYS with these woketard soyboys. At first they're all I NOD REPECTFULLY TOWARD M'LADIES!, but the second they get a taste of power, it's suddenly I OWN YOU BITCHES AND YOUR PUSSIES ARE MINE!


I wonder if this will get Limited Run Games to cancel "Where The Water Tastes Like Wine" since that was made by former Fullbright staff.

It's also not a game but a series of awful stories written by libtards who try to sound folksy and salt of the earth.,
 
https://youtube.com/watch?v=3Qx-KBDi9Ic
I wonder if this will get Limited Run Games to cancel "Where The Water Tastes Like Wine" since that was made by former Fullbright staff.

It's also not a game but a series of awful stories written by libtards who try to sound folksy and salt of the earth.,
Limited Run Games is too woke to backstab. So long as it had nothing to do with Gaynor, they probably aren't touching it.
 
Always. ALWAYS with these woketard soyboys. At first they're all I NOD REPECTFULLY TOWARD M'LADIES!, but the second they get a taste of power, it's suddenly I OWN YOU BITCHES AND YOUR PUSSIES ARE MINE!

On the other hand, this looks like another Blizzard, where these women think that being told NO by their boss is akin to gang rape and now are trying to push THE EVIL WHITE MEN out so they can install their no-talent friends.
Part of it is that it's always easier to attack their own for a very simple reason that I will explain. Look at Warhorse(Kingdom Come Deliverance). They're not even close to being a super edgy alt-right studio or anything like that, but a dangerhair or soyboy would never apply for a job there, it would he herecy. Instead they get hired at Blizzard, Fullbright or other woke/corporate-woke studios, then they start to go at their employers and workplace like termites on a house.
 
Part of it is that it's always easier to attack their own for a very simple reason that I will explain. Look at Warhorse(Kingdom Come Deliverance). They're not even close to being a super edgy alt-right studio or anything like that, but a dangerhair or soyboy would never apply for a job there, it would he herecy. Instead they get hired at Blizzard, Fullbright or other woke/corporate-woke studios, then they start to go at their employers and workplace like termites on a house.
There is a certain amount of self-selection happening, and it's only going to get worse. Smaller studios are going to look at this shit and go "shit, guess we're not hiring women, ever, and just take the twitter storm when a journalist talks about our studio being 'oh so white and male'. At least we won't be eating any lawsuits". This shit is going to eventually reduce opportunities for women in games development outside of triple-A studios that have awful corporate cultures to begin with.
 
In a shocking twist, the Gone Home twink ends up being a piece of shit.

Like fucking pottery. Two immediate thoughts: First and foremost, fuck Steve GAYnor for being perhaps one of the biggest fags in the indie scene (which is saying something) and sucking all the air out of the room for about five years thanks to that piece of shit astro-turfed Gone Homo shit. I think that marked one of the first times that calling a "game" shit got you labelled as a misogynist and/or homophobe.

Second: play stupid games win stupid prizes. I'd love to see the credentials and the taste-the-rainbow hair colours of the femoids he hired in an attempt to build his cyber-soy harem. I can with little doubt guarantee that vast majority of the women brought on were in creative roles or had a Twine game on their resume causing the hiring director or whoever to just tick off the right boxes. Lo and behold, it's tough to make a fucking game when you've got people taking personal days out the ass, crying in the bathroom because xhe saw something mean on twitter, and starting a whisper network because you smiled at her the wrong way four months ago.

He hired most likely emotionally fragile underqualified dummies that cannot handle anything remotely close to criticism, conflict, or banter and because of a mix between his own autism and a strong inclination to be "one of the good guys" in order to get closer to women, it ended up biting him so hard in the ass his reputation is forever ruined. Only a troon out can save him now. Either way, get fucked.

Live by the sword, die by it.
Instead they get hired at Blizzard, Fullbright or other woke/corporate-woke studios, then they start to go at their employers and workplace like termites on a house.
Termites is a perfect word. Anyone who willingly hires these people is basically an undercover sapper because they can and will destroy your companies.
 
Live by the sword, die by it.
By pushing the narrative of "listen and believe", they have undercut all their defences.

Always. ALWAYS with these woketard soyboys. At first they're all I NOD REPECTFULLY TOWARD M'LADIES!, but the second they get a taste of power, it's suddenly I OWN YOU BITCHES AND YOUR PUSSIES ARE MINE!
After years of failing to get a gaming MeToo off the ground, now they have, but it's all their own allies.


created Gone Home (2013), a BAFTA award-winning narrative game that influenced the industry.
Says Polygon.

Tell me Polygon, how is the walking simulator genre doing?

On Twitter, at least, Gaynor “was” Fullbright for quite some time
“employees were uncomfortable with the official Fullbright account doubling as Steve’s personal Twitter account.”
Imagine being this mad over "who holds the keys to the Twitter account".

The company had no dedicated human resource employees,
And that's the real problem here, isn't it? A woman isn't in charge, and there isn't a HR department to oust him.
 
There is a certain amount of self-selection happening, and it's only going to get worse. Smaller studios are going to look at this shit and go "shit, guess we're not hiring women, ever, and just take the twitter storm when a journalist talks about our studio being 'oh so white and male'. At least we won't be eating any lawsuits". This shit is going to eventually reduce opportunities for women in games development outside of triple-A studios that have awful corporate cultures to begin with.
It's already happening. The Ascent was made by 11 white boys with only one if them looking soy and it's the best Cyperpunk game in the last 4 years. Like one screen shot has more detail then a single area of CP 2077.

God willing this bring back the small, focused AA games system once Blizzard, Riot, etc get sued into the ground.
 
Watching all of these people turn on each other will never get old.

Most people are mediocre and are not worth listening to. The rainbow hair employees speaking out have lived their whole lives being told their ideas are special.

I’m glad they got a taste of reality and are taking an ally down with them.
 
Honestly, anyone would have quit dealing with micromanaging shitheads who in this case had no leadership skills to keep all but the most desperate employees around. And often the desperate employees are either a)Unskilled but friendly enough to keep around or b) Insufferable competent types who will pick day to day fights with both staff and boss who will fight tooth and nail to keep their position despite hating it so much
 
Like fucking pottery. Two immediate thoughts: First and foremost, fuck Steve GAYnor for being perhaps one of the biggest fags in the indie scene (which is saying something) and sucking all the air out of the room for about five years thanks to that piece of shit astro-turfed Gone Homo shit. I think that marked one of the first times that calling a "game" shit got you labelled as a misogynist and/or homophobe.

Second: play stupid games win stupid prizes. I'd love to see the credentials and the taste-the-rainbow hair colours of the femoids he hired in an attempt to build his cyber-soy harem. I can with little doubt guarantee that vast majority of the women brought on were in creative roles or had a Twine game on their resume causing the hiring director or whoever to just tick off the right boxes. Lo and behold, it's tough to make a fucking game when you've got people taking personal days out the ass, crying in the bathroom because xhe saw something mean on twitter, and starting a whisper network because you smiled at her the wrong way four months ago.

He hired most likely emotionally fragile underqualified dummies that cannot handle anything remotely close to criticism, conflict, or banter and because of a mix between his own autism and a strong inclination to be "one of the good guys" in order to get closer to women, it ended up biting him so hard in the ass his reputation is forever ruined. Only a troon out can save him now. Either way, get fucked.

Live by the sword, die by it.

Termites is a perfect word. Anyone who willingly hires these people is basically an undercover sapper because they can and will destroy your companies.
This is a good assessment of how things probably went down at Fullbright with Steve Gaynor surrounding himself with the most fragile employees imaginable in the name of Diversity & Inclusion.

The Polygon article has a lot of funny little bits that are worth highlighting:

These former employees said they did not experience or witness sexual harassment or explicit sexism; instead, they said, the studio’s toxic culture hid behind the veneer of inclusivity, as women were allegedly repeatedly broken down by microaggressions.
Microaggressions. That's apparently what this is all about.

But at the same time, former employees say they also felt stifled by Gaynor’s “controlling” and “demeaning presence” — someone who allegedly saw Open Roads not as the team’s game, but as his game. That Gaynor, himself, was Fullbright.

On Twitter, at least, Gaynor “was” Fullbright for quite some time: He held the @Fullbright Twitter account as his personal handle for over a decade. When he stepped down from his position as creative lead, sources said he was required to change his Twitter account to @SteveGaynorPDX. The @Fullbright account now serves as a placeholder, and the studio now uses @FullbrightGames for official updates. A Fullbright representative confirmed to Polygon that “employees were uncomfortable with the official Fullbright account doubling as Steve’s personal Twitter account.”
I read elsewhere that the story behind the @Fullbright Twitter handle is that it was always Gaynor's personal's account while the company came later and was named after it. It really goes to show that, yes, Fullbright is Gaynor's company, and Open Roads is his game.

Because of Gaynor’s status as the co-founder of a beloved indie darling, some former employees say they were worried about being blacklisted from the industry — though some ended up leaving the industry entirely, anyway.
...
She told Polygon she saw similarities between Scavenger Studio creative director Simon Darveau and Gaynor. (While the allegations regarding Darveau include sexual harassment and groping, no claims of physical conduct have been made against Gaynor.) The former employee said she warned Gaynor that a similar report could eventually surface about him.
...
Two sources told Polygon that they were hesitant to hire the qualified, talented women who applied for the roles out of fear of how they’d be treated by Gaynor.
Several accusations of what employees assumed Gaynor would do, not what he actually did.

Multiple former employees expressed concern that Gaynor was even operating in this capacity — that it was weird for a man to be writing a story about a mother and daughter, particularly a man that has allegedly demeaned several female employees.
Lol, it's the "you can't write about X unless you're X" bullshit from YA fiction.
 
Back
Top Bottom