Can oligarchy, autocracy or anarchy work?

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undermine

undermine

kiwifarms.net
Joined
Sep 11, 2025
I just feel frustrated by democracy since all the time, the incompetent are ones the getting elected, so was wondering maybe the other ruling (or lack thereof) systems can work. I don't know much about politics, but I do have a will to study
 
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I spent my whole life believing in democracy, to the point I tried to be politically active in it. Seeing it from the perspective of "the trenches" made me question it a lot. I think it's only normal to question it. The best democracy can never hold a candle to best autocracy, but the worst democracy will always be better than the worst autocracy. Something to consider, but that statement doesn't consider the harm any of those states can will upon it's people. The more apt question is: Do we live in a democracy or a plutocracy?
 
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Eric Blair's Footnote said:
I spent my whole life believing in democracy, to the point I tried to be politically active in it. Seeing it from the perspective of "the trenches" made me question it a lot. I think it's only normal to question it. The best democracy can never hold a candle to best autocracy, but the worst democracy will always be better than the worst autocracy. Something to consider, but that statement doesn't consider the harm any of those states can will upon it's people. The more apt question is: Do we live in a democracy or a plutocracy?
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Couldn't have said it better. I think at least my country, is very likely a plutocracy because the ones ruling aren't the common people but rather the rich elite, but maybe it's different in other countries. It's also idiocracy because of people voting and electing over and over again to the same politician over and over again despite him being a criminal in so many ways. Is it like that in the US though? Curious to hear, I don't know much about the Anglosphere, so if you have any info, provide it here
 
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You can have the best ideology type on paper. Infinite resources and eternal peace. But pick a bad leader and he will turn it to shite.
Picking a good leader is just as important.
 
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I think nothing is perfect. A system can only work in circumstances that are compatible with it. Time marches on and circumstances change. I think something like democracy can work if a populace all has skin in the game (kids, property, etc), if they're all roughly past a certain intelligence point, and not low info voters. There's also something to said about human nature. Influence can't just be equally distributed, some people will just have an outsized influence on political systems due to either money, regulatory capture, whatever. If a system exists some people will just do their damndest to find holes and manipulate it to their advantage. The main check against something like that is your populace being aware of said manipulations and punishing those people.

Things like communism always sound great on paper but then human nature rears it's head and next thing you know people are being shot for rationing. Same thing with something like anarcho-capitalism/syndicalism/communism, in any given group a small number of people just rise to the top, gain power, and things just snowball from there into nation states. There's a reason why basically any civilization worth a damn historically all look very similar with respect to governance.

All that to say, no such thing as a magic bullet of governance exists because people are imperfect and anything we build will degrade over time for any number of reasons. That said I think for a system to last longer than a generation without oppressing the people in it, it needs to be in accordance with human nature, allow for productivity, punish people breaking the social norms, see a future in which their kids can grow and succeed, etc.
 
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undermine said:
I just feel frustrated by democracy since all the time, the incompetent are ones the getting elected, so was wondering maybe the other ruling (or lack thereof) systems can work.
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Define "work". What exactly do you expect out of a human system of government?
 
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Unarmed Gunman said:
Define "work". What exactly do you expect out of a human system of government?
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That most people will have a way to get a sustainable life (food, water, residence and the rest is left for more advanced countries which includes things like electricity for example) by working a job that has acceptable conditions (the hours are worth the salary, not over a certain amount of hours unless there's extra payment, no life endangering situations without safety measures and ensuring the employees are aware of the dangers, no crimes committed at work (or at the very least that there will be a way to figure out if a crime has been committed at the workplace), no scamming of anyone although it should be obvious by my previous point etc...) and that products, goods, services, commodity, raw materials and so on will be at a reasonable price for their value and usage, and last but not least: that there's at least certain amount of freedom while not too much since you gotta prevent crimes from happening. There's probably more things I forgot and I definitely oversimplified but you get the point
 
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undermine said:
That most people will have a way to get a sustainable life (food, water, residence and the rest is left for more advanced countries which includes things like electricity for example) by working a job that has acceptable conditions (the hours are worth the salary, not over a certain amount of hours unless there's extra payment, no life endangering situations without safety measures and ensuring the employees are aware of the dangers, no crimes committed at work (or at the very least that there will be a way to figure out if a crime has been committed at the workplace), no scamming of anyone although it should be obvious by my previous point etc...) and that products, goods, services, commodity, raw materials and so on will be at a reasonable price for their value and usage, and last but not least: that there's at least certain amount of freedom while not too much since you gotta prevent crimes from happening. There's probably more things I forgot and I definitely oversimplified but you get the point
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Right, so you have an unrealistic view of human nature. You'll want to start there.
 
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undermine said:
Couldn't have said it better. I think at least my country, is very likely a plutocracy because the ones ruling aren't the common people but rather the rich elite
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Theres a strong case that even the US and most of the western democracies that espouse freedom, are in fact plutocracies. The wealthy people tend to hedge their bets on both parties, so they always get what they want. I think it's why so many people think democracy is so corrupt. Politicians are hamstrung by the wills of their biggest donors, who aren't normal people.
Unarmed Gunman said:
Right, so you have an unrealistic view of human nature. You'll want to start there.
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Idk it comes off as idealistic, which is endearing in such a dark world. I remember being there.
 
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The problem with Anarchy is that you toppled down the "Kings" just to be replaced by new "Kings". I think the real question we should be asking is: how to stop the social ladder from being pulled, what responsibilities should there be for the Aristocrat if at all, Is there an answer to the Zero sum ? I would also encourage people to read the Eternal Revolution by G.K Chesterton, it is pretty good.
 
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Democracy is cringe and gay though, this is true.

Hierarchies naturally form so a state of anarchy is impossible to maintain for a long time. It's also a bad thing, think Haiti after the tsunami, there were regions of that country that existed in what was essentially a state of lawlessness and anarchy for an extended period of time and all you ever hear about it in retrospect is all the horrible shit people did not singing kumbaya.

Autocracy, Oligarchy, etc. can all work, provided the people in the lead are good people of strong moral character who are skilled at handling everyone else. It's also helpful if there's a shared cultural identity that everyone collectively agrees to play along with and pretend that the people in power are in some way special; monarchy ordained by God is always a good start.

This is one of the reasons people have suggested Trump just declare himself Emperor and choose his successor so we don't have to waste time voting. Whether you like Trump or hate him, it would be nice to not have to deal with yet another election cycle.
 
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Unarmed Gunman said:
Right, so you have an unrealistic view of human nature. You'll want to start there.
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What's unrealistic about it? I don't get it
Eric Blair's Footnote said:
Theres a strong case that even the US and most of the western democracies that espouse freedom, are in fact plutocracies. The wealthy people tend to hedge their bets on both parties, so they always get what they want. I think it's why so many people think democracy is so corrupt. Politicians are hamstrung by the wills of their biggest donors, who aren't normal people.

Idk it comes off as idealistic, which is endearing in such a dark world. I remember being there.
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Ok maybe I'm being too idealistic. Sorry for that
Sacrarium Spiritus lumine said:
The problem with Anarchy is that you toppled down the "Kings" just to be replaced by new "Kings". I think the real question we should be asking is: how is the to stop the social ladder from being pulled, what responsibilities should there be for the Aristocrat if at all, Is there an answer to the Zero sum ? I would also encourage people to read the Eternal Revolution by G.K Chesterton, it is pretty good.
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Can I find a pirated copy of that book or should I support the author?
Gangstalker #32194 said:
are niggers/jews involved?
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Let's assume that not
urr13 account said:
Democracy is cringe and gay though, this is true.

Hierarchies naturally form so a state of anarchy is impossible to maintain for a long time. It's also a bad thing, think Haiti after the tsunami, there were regions of that country that existed in what was essentially a state of lawlessness and anarchy for an extended period of time and all you ever hear about it in retrospect is all the horrible shit people did not singing kumbaya.

Autocracy, Oligarchy, etc. can all work, provided the people in the lead are good people of strong moral character who are skilled at handling everyone else. It's also helpful if there's a shared cultural identity that everyone collectively agrees to play along with and pretend that the people in power are in some way special; monarchy ordained by God is always a good start.

This is one of the reasons people have suggested Trump just declare himself Emperor and choose his successor so we don't have to waste time voting. Whether you like Trump or hate him, it would be nice to not have to deal with yet another election cycle.
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I agree with Trump about making illegals fuck off from America but I'm afraid that the allegations against him, that he apparently has committed sexual assault, will make not want to support him. But again I don't believe every single allegation and accusation, I'm just afraid it's indeed true. But in the end, it doesn't matter since I'm not even American or even from the English speaking realm for that matter
Local Farmer said:
Only if it’s white people
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Like anyone white skinned, or only the white race? Be more specific.
 
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