Battle for Section 230 - The Situation Monitoring Thread for Monitoring the Situation of the Situation Monitor's Situation Monitoring

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The only apps most agencies allowed was doxy and when the courts took up zoom some were allowed to use that.
It's absolutely ludicrous the primary app for all this bullshit is blatant Chinese spyware. Even their so-called encrypted software uses keys generated in China and routes through Chinese servers (even when it claims it isn't). Even if it is somehow amazingly not literal spyware (which would shock me), it's so brazenly insecure it should be illegal to use it for anything involving PII.
 
It's absolutely ludicrous the primary app for all this bullshit is blatant Chinese spyware. Even their so-called encrypted software uses keys generated in China and routes through Chinese servers (even when it claims it isn't). Even if it is somehow amazingly not literal spyware (which would shock me), it's so brazenly insecure it should be illegal to use it for anything involving PII.
Sadly parents would rather use zoom since its easier to use then opening your web browser and having to click "allow camera and allow mic" every time since doxy wipes itself out after you close the session. My agency wanted to go full doxy since it at least had been used in the medical fields before.

Though reading this again I gather you meant TikTok.
 
I think at least Tier-1 ISPs that provide nothing but connectivity should be treated as utilities. They're used to engage in speech but have no business regulating it, any more than telephone companies or banks have the right to deny service based on political disagreements.

If there are ever limitations on access to basic communications, it should only be after actual criminal proceedings.
Should being the operative word. I think we both know Congress would inevitably try to use the fact those ISPs have no constitutionally protected rights (in the scenario corporations didn't have rights) to assert otherwise. IIRC 1A is what allows ISPs to operate without the US Government being able to censor via that route, since without 1A Government could regulate what traffic ISPs are allowed to handle and could prohibit them from passing along "censored" data.
As for things like Facebook and Twitter, the government shouldn't be allowed to use those as a default way of communicating with government agencies. There are plenty of things from the federal to the local level that are now virtually impossible to access in any reasonable way without some kind of social media bullshit. And then you have incredibly problematic like Twitter deciding they get to forbid the literal fucking President from using a communications medium.
I'm not sure this one was relevant to what I was saying since it doesn't sound like a "corporate rights" issue, but that aside...

Government is more or less reliant on third parties for its communications to the people since it has no real way to communicate directly to people. The default has been via press conferences to mainstream news media/reliance on news media to report what government is doing, but social media itself is semi-replacing old news media already. So it does kind of make sense for it to eventually swap to that medium.

As for government to government, yeah that should be only done via memorandums and such, but the Constitution didn't dictate how government communicates with itself, so it's more or less up to each branch to decide for themselves. I'm not sure Congress could even pass a law to dictate how the Executive branch communicates without tripping all over a big heaping pile of Separation of Powers, and can't tell POTUS to do fuck all.

POTUS could make pissing in the snow the official communication method he employs if he so chooses.
And then you have incredibly problematic like Twitter deciding they get to forbid the literal fucking President from using a communications medium.
🤷‍♂️ They're as of now still a private company. Until/unless social media is deemed a public utility not much to do about that, and even then it's pretty damn iffy if government could force them to accept government officials as clients, at least without invoking National Security voodoo.

I'm not so much pissed with them over booting the former POTUS as I am that it was overtly politically one sided. Banning Trump while letting, say, Iran's assholes in charge openly inciting violence is a double standard that should land them in hot fucking water just with their own terms of service.

I'm a bit surprised they haven't been sued for breech of contract, since it'd be pretty easy to convince a jury that Twitter (and other social media) are using a double standard for enforcement of their ToS, especially since they've slapped enough mainstream conservatives with money to burn on such a lawsuit.
 
I'm a bit surprised they haven't been sued for breech of contract, since it'd be pretty easy to convince a jury that Twitter (and other social media) are using a double standard for enforcement of their ToS, especially since they've slapped enough mainstream conservatives with money to burn on such a lawsuit.
Unfortunately with how TOS type shit is adjudicated these days, you'd be forced into arbitration that doesn't give a shit about constitutional issues and the arbitrators were handpicked by the corporation anyway.
 
Unfortunately with how TOS type shit is adjudicated these days, you'd be forced into arbitration that doesn't give a shit about constitutional issues and the arbitrators were handpicked by the corporation anyway.
Facebook has an arbitration and class action waiver in their ToS, Twitter doesn't.

But yeah, forced arbitration needs to be ended. I wouldn't be opposed to "try arbitration first" type clauses, since the ability to sue is ultimately maintained. Class action waivers just shouldn't even exist.

But neither of those things are going to end up being prohibited in our lifetime.
 
Facebook has an arbitration and class action waiver in their ToS, Twitter doesn't.
Instead they just outright limit liability entirely to $100.

Limitation of Liability​



TO THE MAXIMUM EXTENT PERMITTED BY APPLICABLE LAW, THE TWITTER ENTITIES SHALL NOT BE LIABLE FOR ANY INDIRECT, INCIDENTAL, SPECIAL, CONSEQUENTIAL OR PUNITIVE DAMAGES, OR ANY LOSS OF PROFITS OR REVENUES, WHETHER INCURRED DIRECTLY OR INDIRECTLY, OR ANY LOSS OF DATA, USE, GOODWILL, OR OTHER INTANGIBLE LOSSES, RESULTING FROM (i) YOUR ACCESS TO OR USE OF OR INABILITY TO ACCESS OR USE THE SERVICES; (ii) ANY CONDUCT OR CONTENT OF ANY THIRD PARTY ON THE SERVICES, INCLUDING WITHOUT LIMITATION, ANY DEFAMATORY, OFFENSIVE OR ILLEGAL CONDUCT OF OTHER USERS OR THIRD PARTIES; (iii) ANY CONTENT OBTAINED FROM THE SERVICES; OR (iv) UNAUTHORIZED ACCESS, USE OR ALTERATION OF YOUR TRANSMISSIONS OR CONTENT. IN NO EVENT SHALL THE AGGREGATE LIABILITY OF THE TWITTER ENTITIES EXCEED THE GREATER OF ONE HUNDRED U.S. DOLLARS (U.S. $100.00) OR THE AMOUNT YOU PAID TWITTER, IF ANY, IN THE PAST SIX MONTHS FOR THE SERVICES GIVING RISE TO THE CLAIM. THE LIMITATIONS OF THIS SUBSECTION SHALL APPLY TO ANY THEORY OF LIABILITY, WHETHER BASED ON WARRANTY, CONTRACT, STATUTE, TORT (INCLUDING NEGLIGENCE) OR OTHERWISE, AND WHETHER OR NOT THE TWITTER ENTITIES HAVE BEEN INFORMED OF THE POSSIBILITY OF ANY SUCH DAMAGE, AND EVEN IF A REMEDY SET FORTH HEREIN IS FOUND TO HAVE FAILED OF ITS ESSENTIAL PURPOSE.
Unless I suppose you're some kind of business client who pays more.

Not that a Twitter account is actually likely to be worth more than $100 anyway.
 
Instead they just outright limit liability entirely to $100.

Unless I suppose you're some kind of business client who pays more.

Not that a Twitter account is actually likely to be worth more than $100 anyway.
Business clients are about the only ones who'd have enough money on the line to make suing worth it.

But if Twitter itself breeches the terms (say by intentionally banning an account specifically to cause financial harm to the client who has otherwise not clearly violated rules) the limitation of liability might not hold up.

And that's before getting into the topic of unconscionable terms of service (which state courts have been finding in regards to e-contracts more and more).
 
https://youtube.com/watch?v=gbRHT-1eI1E
Republicans/The Right/whatever should abandon any Section 230 reform, buy and build their own Internet infrastructure, and migrate their people onto it.
Section 230 could definitely be improved but not by the people (left or right) who want to do it. They'd just completely fuck it up because they have no clue what they're doing. They think the Internet is a big truck.

It's one of the rare examples where Congress got something almost right by pure accident and needs to be left alone.
 
They think the Internet is a big truck.
Jokes on them! It's actually a series of tubes!

I'll never get over the fact that it's American law that protected the web for the entire western world. British scientists were involved in developing tcp right from its earliest days, but our government would have strangled its development in the crib if they'd had even the slightest inkling of what it would become.
 
I'm a bit confused why everyone is so concerned about spying. Snowden and wikileaks told you Five Eyes was spying on you through everything like 10 years ago and nobody gave a fuck.

Now China knows what porn you look at and people are losing their shit? What's the difference here?
 
I'm a bit confused why everyone is so concerned about spying. Snowden and wikileaks told you Five Eyes was spying on you through everything like 10 years ago and nobody gave a fuck.

Now China knows what porn you look at and people are losing their shit? What's the difference here?
The feds will kick in your door if you say you're going to shoot a senator on the clearnet, but everyone is worried they'll pass a law and start doing it if you call someone a nigger.

Plus, this is actually a thread about section 230 which has nothing to do with spying. Section 230 absolves websites of liability for content generated by users. For example, if I call someone a nigger on Kiwifarms, I am responsible for it, not Null. Without section 230 it is possible Null would be responsible for the things I do on his website. It is essentially the piece of legislation that allows sites with user generated content like forums, Reddit, Youtube, Discord and social media to exist without getting sued into oblivion.
 
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Jokes on them! It's actually a series of tubes!

I'll never get over the fact that it's American law that protected the web for the entire western world. British scientists were involved in developing tcp right from its earliest days, but our government would have strangled its development in the crib if they'd had even the slightest inkling of what it would become.
Unsurprising, look at how the British government treated radio and television when those things came out. The British gov has always had a bad case of “sorry sir, looks like you’ve had a bit too much to think!”.
 
Unsurprising, look at how the British government treated radio and television when those things came out. The British gov has always had a bad case of “sorry sir, looks like you’ve had a bit too much to think!”.
Aye, there's a reason people risked coming here on leaky wooden tubs with, for most of the US's history, a fair chance of being bear chow or Indian target practice.
 

Are they fucking insane?! Wait, OC they aren't.. just remembered who their masters/co-conspirators are. The perfect description of this idea is "the internet to cable 2.0 transformation act" Because self hosted sites will be the closest any normal person gets to airing their voice or opinion. (assuming these same ghouls don't target infrastructure next/too with this) Best case for the net is that the super size tech and net companies offer the (only) means for such content, filtered through multiple layers of thought and speech protection. (censorship)

No hyperbole or overstating... This would be the END of the internet as anything other than an semi-interactive content delivery service for BIG ($$$) media.

Conservatives watching the current courts really want to put the future of speech in the hands of the civil law system?! The same system that has been targeting and ruining people with 10 digit $ penalties for rallies/protests the media doesn't like, having the wrong opinions or saying stupid shit of the wrong kind?

Of course they are going with "won't somebody please think of the children?" angle.. No, we won't! You can't use hopeful "safety" as an excuse to restrict rights.


You know things are bad when partisan politics are terrible, but bipartisan politics somehow manage to be worse.
 
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Trump recently announced his day 1 plan of action and it includes revision of section 230. He says, from now on digital platforms should qualify for immunity protection if they meet high standards of neutrality, transparency, fairness and non-discrimination.
So what's the game plan for this site on January 20?
 
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