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Duke Nukem said:
I've read a little bit of a comic called Shark instead, and it's actually much better in storytelling, and even treats the antagonist like an actual character than a human tatami mat. The physical training goals are also a bit more grounded in reality as well.
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Funny that you mention rooftop swordsman and Shark in the same post. There's a youtuber who covered both:


I was looking for this thread to bitch about Dandadan. I finally caught up with the latest arc and my reaction was the same as with the Alien invaders one:

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Again, at the lowest point of the characters...the situation sort of resolves itself.

To recap, after the Cursed Trunk adventure, Momo has been left as a liliputienne and the gang needs to figure out a way to bring her back to full size. Let's go over the plot points:
A) First they discover gnomes in their school, plot twist, they are actually the familiar of another girl in school that wants to kill the gang.
B) Plot twist she was being blackmailed and given the power through a mcguffin.
C) New problem on top of the one they already had: solve the mistery of who is giving out powers left and right.
D) New new problem: if Momo is not brought back to normal size she will stay as a liliputienne forever and people will simply forget about her
E) The gang splits up and and have their respective fights at school: one with the Aliens (who are observing them) and another with the gym teacher who is being manipulated by another group - they win both fights so problem C is partially resolved but apparently the sorcerer that gives out powers can mindwipe his subcontractors.

Nothing from points A-E did anything to solve the problem at hand and was just white noise for fights to happen. But at the same time another set of plotlines is happening:

F) New new problem: The sorcerer from point E has subcontracted another set of goons to beat up Grandma. He succeeded so Grandma now is not at 100% capacity.
G) Grandma realizes that there is a ritual that they can perform outside of her sphere of influence with a Chibikko hammer (I miss Seiken Densetsu 3) that can bring Momo back to full size.
H) While half of the gang is doing the stuff in B-E, the other half is boarding a plane to the north of the country to get to the temple in time for the blood moon to happen and perform the ritual.
I) NEW PROBLEM: the plane was also boarded by the subterraneans that appeared in the Jiji arc for revenge so half the gang are in a fight the Kita Family/subterraneans in the plant
J) ANOTHER PROBLEM: The seropians were monitoring the plane and wanted to disturb the ritual so they teleport a tornado from the phillipines, which at the same time is a Yokai to stop the plane fromlanding. So the Kita family, half of the gang have to fight a tornado in negative space so that the plane can land safely and they can reach their destination. Spoilers: the plane lands succesfully
K)....and then it turns out that the hammer was stolen and they have to rush to another temple to get it back.

At this point I gave up reading the plot and just skimmed the pages: aha, jiji fight where he becomes BFF's with the evil eye and beats a smoke monster, Grandma gets beaten up even more, the castle/temple is actually an Alien Kaiju and they win the fight.

FINALLY we get to the lowest point: grandma has to be rushed to the ER, Momo is left gnome sized, alone, in negative space, no one to come for her, no one to remember her......and then some priests in robes and face masks, pick her up, bring her to a temple and perform the ritual. She is back. No explanation, no idea where they came from, who sent them, just a fucking Desu Ex Machina to start the next 2 year arc that will resolve in another Deus Ex Machina. I give up on the series at this point. This is another Bleach situation where the author just wants to draw cool fights and his editor has to put a gun to his head to move the story along.

I didn't give up on it when the resolution to the Alien Fleet Armada was having a Yokai have flashbacks of the Nagasaki bombing and going super sayan on them when it was such a massive ass-pull I stopped reading the thing for a year or so but I just can't care about a supposed "thinking-man's shonen" when the author only wants to draw punch-punch-punch and kind of move the plot when he's backed into a corner.
 
God of Nothing said:
plenty of cows are unfortunately married with kids
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There's a lot I could say about that, but that's a thread for a different day. But I suppose even the milkiest of cows deserves a fair shot at happiness. Unless your name rhymes with "Dick Rate."

The actual fans of that particular one are even worse, but again, a story for another day.
vern said:
I kind of want to make the joke that most manhwa authors where probably on the receiving end and are just doing the same thing chris did with his a-logs when he drew his comics, but it might be more an issue with web comics overall.
There are two issues with web comics, one is the fans can have more of an influence over the author and the story through comments ratings, etc, and I've heard some cases of this actually changing the story. This is also true with Jap WNs since I think it was apothecary dairies that because of consistent comments on the website it was originally written on the author had to age down the main character from a middle aged adult to the late teen in the series and add a romance plot with a character who was meant to die after a few chapters.
Second issue is because there's no physical magazine or volumes for manhwa aside from a few rare exceptions, you can be even more of a hikikimori NEET and read just as much. With manga you at least as to be adjusted enough to be able to enter a store and buy what ever shit your in to, manhwa its just a few taps on your phone to start doom scrolling the latest bully revenge story that you may or may not be self inserting into. And depending on the service they might not be fully buying it, I think it was naviar or tapas where you'd buy coins that would unlock a chapter for about a week or two,
ever want to reread it well you have to just buy it again
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Fair enough, the Rooftop Sword Master comic did remind me of Sonichu if it were written by an edgelord with no sense of actual storytelling. Now don't get me wrong, I supremely enjoy edgelord characters, if they're done right.

@TopTierHealer I like a lot of comics, both good and bad. I enjoy both RSM and Shark for different reasons, but it depends on what I'm actually in the mood for. I believe it's possible to enjoy a comic that isn't very good if it offers some sort of unintentional amusement, but we should also look to them as examples of how not to write a story.

I think Lookism had an interesting premise but it eventually turned into something entirely else and I lost interest. Sure, the bullying trope and the school life stuff played a part but it was honestly interesting to see a character who was mistreated for his appearance and lineage get to see things from the perspective of someone who wasn't so much, even if he was the same guy inside. And the characters were distinct and memorable compared to some of the other comics I've read.

If one is to shift focus, it needs to be done with care and above all else it needs to make sense for the story.
 
TopTierHealer said:
At this point I gave up reading the plot and just skimmed the pages
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TopTierHealer said:
Momo is left gnome sized, alone, in negative space, no one to come for her, no one to remember her......and then some priests in robes and face masks, pick her up, bring her to a temple and perform the ritual. She is back. No explanation
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They were Momo's Grandma's students/acquaintances (can't remember which because I didn't care but their relationship is set up) from the temple they were going to fit the ritual, who told them the hammer was missing in the first place. They knew where the gang was going to get the hammer and stayed back to prep for when they got the hammer. You're bitching about the plot but admit to skimming shit and then get annoyed and things that are clearly explained.
 
You guys know any chill mangas? I need some stuff to read when travelling to work. Ideally nothing echii or wierd cuz I'm gunna read this shit in public.
 
TopTierHealer said:
FINALLY we get to the lowest point: grandma has to be rushed to the ER, Momo is left gnome sized, alone, in negative space, no one to come for her, no one to remember her......and then some priests in robes and face masks, pick her up, bring her to a temple and perform the ritual. She is back. No explanation, no idea where they came from, who sent them, just a fucking Desu Ex Machina to start the next 2 year arc that will resolve in another Deus Ex Machina. I give up on the series at this point. This is another Bleach situation where the author just wants to draw cool fights and his editor has to put a gun to his head to move the story along.
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I was also semi-skimming at this point (mainly just because the SHARKS ON A PLANE spaceship to namek felt a little needless and wore me out) but c'mon man, the monks said who they were.

I really don't know what you're complaining about, the mini-momo thing felt like it had actual stakes and the outcome (post where you apparently stopped) has let the series revisit some of the best stuff and feels like it's set up as deliberate refocusing of all the stuff going on.
And also a really cool and fun fight we just had. Imagine wanting to include those in a fun and cool fight manga.

This ain't Bleach. Nothing outstays a few chapters. It's not one thousand endless years of flying around the soul society pulling transformations out of an ass. Characters are constantly changing. The love interest hasn't cucked off to outer space. How dare you. How rude.

Imam Shamil said:
You guys know any chill mangas? I need some stuff to read when travelling to work. Ideally nothing echii or wierd cuz I'm gunna read this shit in public.
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20th century boys
akira
pluto
one outs
one punch man
one piece
kaiji
i thought this would be easier but everything good is weird or ecchi
 
Imam Shamil said:
You guys know any chill mangas? I need some stuff to read when travelling to work. Ideally nothing echii or wierd cuz I'm gunna read this shit in public.
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I enjoyed Kuro. It's an earlier manga by the guy who did Shadows House. It's cute, creepy, and mysterious, and from what I recall doesn't have anything weird beyond the monsters, and nothing sexual. The mangaka is Somato.
Gimmick Account said:
one punch man
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If you mean the original by ONE, then yes. If you mean the one by Murata, then I would say maybe not so much. Some of those full page spreads of Tatsumaki and Fubuki are things I wouldn't want to be seen looking at in public.
 
Fount of BadSpeak said:
If you mean the original by ONE, then yes. If you mean the one by Murata, then I would say maybe not so much. Some of those full page spreads of Tatsumaki and Fubuki are things I wouldn't want to be seen looking at in public.
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Eh, they're fairly rare and it's about the same level of cheesecake as a marvel comic. I wouldn't worry about it unless you're on the little bitch train to the mormon factory or something.
I included that because it's pretty conventional (and rad); there was actually some other doodle-ish style stuff I omitted because I thought they'd fall under "weird".
 
Duke Nukem said:
the MC goes from skinny middle schooler in a coma to WWE wrestler in a manner of weeks or months
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I find it funny how much this feels like an overcorrection compared to japanese manga. Because almost all manga take joy in having some faggy middle schooler remain a faggy middle schooler but Korea said fuck that, Big Mclargehuge all the way and it's hilarious.
Honestly I'd like to read more manhwa just to judge them for myself but I hate long strips and webtoons. I don't read on a phone so they're just some of the weakest art I've seen in a while.
 
Newcomer 42 said:
Aren't modern shonen way less silly regarding that, though? For better or worse Bleach reaches stupid VN levels of scaling, which makes fights spectacular.
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I feel like today it's either the protagonist is so overpowered that there is no scaling, or it's all Jojo bullshit that every fight need a page to describe what happens every panel.

Powerscaling is retarded but is still the ultimate male pastime. And having a character go through a power boost mid fight is still on of the most satisfying things ever.
 
TopTierHealer said:
Funny that you mention rooftop swordsman and Shark in the same post. There's a youtuber who covered both:
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I've just watched a bit of his Rooftop video(this is pretty entertaining so thank you by the way).

The level of edge with the comically evil classmates here reminds me of some isekai manga, I forgot the name but it had pig and revenge in the name

Basically an entire class gets isekai'd. Main character was the ugly loner who got bullied by everyone, who happened to be sons and daughters of influential japanese companies/government/etc.

But it got REALLY god damn edgy.
So MC got reincarnated without powers. He was ugly, was stumbled upon by an orc villager, who seeing how ugly he is assumed he's also an orc which lead to him living a happy life for a while.
A delinquent trio from the class show up, with busted powers, kill everyone while making sure MC's helpless to do anything but watch and then toss him off a cliff. I forget how he gets back at them but he does so in gruesome detail and the isekai plot is revealed. The class absolutely shat all over the demon lord with their busted powers, imprisoned the goddess or something and became the demon lords themselves, each one putting the residents of the new world through some horrific shit because they think it's entertaining. Taking over a monastery and forcing the monks to dance to improptu idol concerts else they get their heads popped by sound powers, brainwashing with all of its rapey implications, forcing nuns to be some guy's personal harem, there was a plot with dwarven miners that had some particularly gruesome deaths ,etc. They all get gruesome deaths too. If you've ever read the manga Brutal(I was curious when I shouldn't be kind of like with this manga now that I think about it), it's like that.

But that's not all. Back in the real world before the events of the manga, the MC was RELENTLESSLY bullied by his entire class. Beatings, harassment, pissing on him, making him eat dirt and trash, putting out cigs on him, false rape allegations by a particularly psycho feminist classmate, so on and so on.

BUT THERE'S EVEN MORE. The main head of the bully squad was some psycho son of one of Japan's top government officials. His driver accidentally hit MC's sister, who was very frail to begin with. MC tried to ask the guy about him and that was apparently the trigger for all the bullying.
At some point the entire class decided to work on this convoluted multi step plan to make MC and his sister's life hell and then kill the sister by burning their house down. Such wonderful planning such as:
  • constantly raising a fuss in the neighborhood that the brother is abusing his sister so that no one in the neighbourhood would help him out.
  • attacking the sister because some idol scout thought she was cute and #justpsychostuff
  • sending fake health guru stuff to the house to squeeze money out of the family, naturally said fake health guru wanted to molest the sister and also snuck in spycams in some of the stuff. When discovered the guru made it a habit to constantly harass the sister by banging on the doors and keeping her awake when she was home alone
  • One of the guys was a psycho who went around assaulting anyone he deemed as ugly, mainly the homeless. The sister may have witnessed him beating a man nearly to death and as such went to beat her as well but was stopped by MC. Naturally nothing came of this and fake rumors about MC/the psycho's dad and his influence made everyone dismiss everything
  • A plan involving burning down the house required:
    • two different people who, in a perpetual game of one-up manship in who could make MC's life more miserable, had them pour gasoline onto the house FOR WEEKS.
    • a group of people making fake calls to fire departments leading them to the house for weeks so that the department wouldn't take further threats seriously
    • someone putting a sleep drug somewhere to ensure the sister couldn't get out
    • someone else I think barring the doors?
    • and a bunch of fake calls to fire departments leading them elsewhere on the day of the event

Thing is before he went full murderhobo I don't even recall MC being that bad, every time one of his classmates decided to fuck his shit up it involved him accidentally being present when they were making someone else's life miserable(like someone claiming a rando on the train was molesting them but him proving it wasn't the case).

All I could think of when reading that manga is man, what did he do to make them niggas that mad?
 
Imam Shamil said:
You guys know any chill mangas? I need some stuff to read when travelling to work. Ideally nothing echii or wierd cuz I'm gunna read this shit in public.
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Yokohama Kaidashi Kikou, Omoide Emanon, My Girl, Aria.
The first one has a character which walks around butt ass naked, but the author doesn't treat her in a weird way. She also doesn't show up that often. Great manga, but I'm biased since it's my favourite.
 
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