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Shining Wit said:
Japan/the world was only at risk because NR sabotaged him and the whole concert mess
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NR quite literally wouldn't have been in a position to sabotage the old dick bag if the old bastard hadn't blackmailed them into helping him with his insane plan in the first place. He is quite literally the only reason anything in the final season happens, including the concert massacre that he staged and ordered and killed OVER 70000 PEOPLE. The old bastard's entire plan was him trying to arrogantly take the power of the gods, a plan he himself derailed by betraying the people he was coercing to help him in the first place.

Seriously dude, the series makes it painfully clear that Fudo is the main villain and we are supposed to find him a despicable asshat. I don't know why you are trying to so hard to defend a character the show itself never pretends is the least bit redeemable.

Shining Wit said:
You're forgetting SONG are not under Japanese control. Exercising extreme caution and suspicion over the UN Peacekeepers running around with mountain-levelling weapons is just common sense.
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SONG not being under Japanese control is literally the best thing to happen to them because it places them outside of Fudo's authority. You know, the asshat we've been talking about who becomes the main villain. Trying to paint SONG as some kind of threat is stupid when they are literally the only ones who save the world on a consistent basis. Seriously, did you watch the show?

Shining Wit said:
That firing/rehiring never happened btw.
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Firing was the wrong word. What he did was cut all of SONG's funding so they couldn't operate, which is basically the same as firing. Then, when he realizes how fucked he is without them, he immediately pressed them all back into service without so much as an apology or update on the situation.
 
The Demon Pimp of Razgriz said:
NR quite literally wouldn't have been in a position to sabotage the old dick bag if the old bastard hadn't blackmailed them into helping him with his insane plan in the first place. He is quite literally the only reason anything in the final season happens, including the concert massacre that he staged and ordered and killed OVER 70000 PEOPLE. The old bastard's entire plan was him trying to arrogantly take the power of the gods, a plan he himself derailed by betraying the people he was coercing to help him in the first place.

Seriously dude, the series makes it painfully clear that Fudo is the main villain and we are supposed to find him a despicable asshat. I don't know why you are trying to so hard to defend a character the show itself never pretends is the least bit redeemable.


SONG not being under Japanese control is literally the best thing to happen to them because it places them outside of Fudo's authority. You know, the asshat we've been talking about who becomes the main villain. Trying to paint SONG as some kind of threat is stupid when they are literally the only ones who save the world on a consistent basis. Seriously, did you watch the show?


Firing was the wrong word. What he did was cut all of SONG's funding so they couldn't operate, which is basically the same as firing. Then, when he realizes how fucked he is without them, he immediately pressed them all back into service without so much as an apology or update on the situation.
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Cool it on the uncensored spoilers friendo
- Correct. His mistake was not being more thorough with burning that asset, which bit him in the ass and destroyed the project. You're misunderstanding his mindset though, Japan has lost all of its deterrents and is at thr mercy of other nations. He's going to want a weapon that can push back against the Americans (who repeatedly proved they wouldn't leave alone). Also, Shem-Ha's Vambrace was in the hands of America, stealing it and weaponising it himself is a twofer.
- Of XV he is the primary antagonist. As a villain his actions are all of ruthless pragmatism (with a bit of saviour complex as said before). Compare to the rest of the rogues gallery, who all have genocide and summoning aliens as their MO, national defence is fairly noble comparatively. Obviously when i say he 'did nothing wrong' im being somewhat facetious but he's simply a ruthless pragmatist

- I don't think you're understanding what I'm saying. We know SONG is harmless currently (their designation is a disaster relief organisation). But he knows trusting the UN with weapons like that is dangerous (the same reason everywhere forced them to give up the Gears once they became public knowledge in the first place). Wouldn't be outside the realm of possibility for them to fall into hostile hands, or the UN turning them to an actual military force. Having a countermeasure is his main priority for Japan's safety, be it a god under his control or Tsubasa

-He didnt pull funding either because he doesnt fund them. He revoked their ability to operate in Japan with the guise of investigating Amalgam, which is a reasonable excuse (letting a foreign organisation run around with a new, untested WMD is insanity). It was cover for him stealing data and leading him to discovering Miku was clear of the curse of Balal and a much easier candidate for Shem-Ha than Hibiki. As soon as he gets what he needs, he removes the suppression so he doesn't blow the cover of his 'inspection'. Everyone at SONG knew it was bullshit but officially to everyone outside it was something mundane.
 
Enjoyed reading Happiness esp after the constant gut punch that was blood on the tracks though the ending felt more sad despite being more on the sweeter side of bittersweet, however one thing i wasn't a big fan of was the change of pov from makoto to gosho. Really craving to read hellsing now though
 
You ever pick a anime back up after dumping 3 seasons in, and it actually manages to improve enough that you're back into it? That's me with Raildex, Railgun S
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It takes place during Index 1, and honestly, is the remaster I never knew I needed. It slowed the fuck down, toned down the fanservice from Index 2 so I wasn't cringing my entire way through, and brings a new layer of depth to the Misaka clone plot you didn't really get in Index 1.

The cast Is also smaller, which has been a major problem with raildex since day one: too many characters and too many threads forced way too fast. It allows the story to focus on Misaka and her circle, and makes them feel like people.

Also the remastered Toma verses Accelerator fight. My gosh, J.C. staff improved immensely since 2008. Nor to mention, Accelerator of all people, gets a sliver of depth! I didn't think i5 was possible, but they did it!

In the end, raildex is filled with seasons of filler mixed in with good shit. Railgun S throws out that formula and makes a fucking good show. It's a hard thing to recommend to someone, but if you can push through, it's actually worth it. I'm working on Railgun T rn, going great, and then I'll hit the Index portions, and have dedicated way too much time to a series that I love and hate.
 
wtfNeedSignUp said:
My issue with Index was always how autistic the setting got. Unless there will be an anime for the entire LN run (unlikely) then nothing will ever be resolved.
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I mean if you look at how it's been released, it takes multi year pauses, then just comes back from the gas station at random. There probably will be more, just in a long while.
 
Shining Wit said:
Correct. His mistake was not being more thorough with burning that asset, which bit him in the ass and destroyed the project. You're misunderstanding his mindset though, Japan has lost all of its deterrents and is at thr mercy of other nations. He's going to want a weapon that can push back against the Americans (who repeatedly proved they wouldn't leave alone). Also, Shem-Ha's Vambrace was in the hands of America, stealing it and weaponising it himself is a twofer.
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The dude was trying to weaponise the very powers that nearly got Japan nuked in the first place. Powers he had no business trying to control because of how dangerous they were. Japan wasn't at "the mercy" of other nations. The only reason Japan almost got nuked is because Fudo's actions in stupidly ordering the JSDF to attack an energy barrier that the main character was cocooned in, that he didn't understand nor know the purpose of, and SONG were desperately trying to figure out. This set off the chain of events that led to the U.S. president ordering Japan to be nuked. Once again, FUDO is the greatest threat to Japan, not other nations. His actions scared the rest of the world into getting spooked enough that they even considered nuking to be an appropriate response. And Fudo ended up awakening the greatest threat that the WORLD, not just Japan, had ever seen.

Shining Wit said:
Of XV he is the primary antagonist. As a villain his actions are all of ruthless pragmatism (with a bit of saviour complex as said before). Compare to the rest of the rogues gallery, who all have genocide and summoning aliens as their MO, national defence is fairly noble comparatively. Obviously when i say he 'did nothing wrong' im being somewhat facetious but he's simply a ruthless pragmatist
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Being a ruthless pragmatist doesn't justify anything he did. He's an asshole with a savior complex. That's all. And the series never pretended he was anything else. Keep in mind, this is a series that has generally done its best to make its villains sympathetic, even when they do horrible, horrible things. Even NR were portrayed somewhat sympathetically due to their motives and the fact that they saw each other as family. Fudo is never given such a benefit of the doubt. He's literally an asshole from beginning to end and the series never pretends otherwise. He's a rapist, terrorist, and mass murderer. Period.

Shining Wit said:
I don't think you're understanding what I'm saying. We know SONG is harmless currently (their designation is a disaster relief organisation). But he knows trusting the UN with weapons like that is dangerous (the same reason everywhere forced them to give up the Gears once they became public knowledge in the first place). Wouldn't be outside the realm of possibility for them to fall into hostile hands, or the UN turning them to an actual military force. Having a countermeasure is his main priority for Japan's safety, be it a god under his control or Tsubasa
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You are giving Fudo way too much credit, credit the show never gives him. Fudo is an irrational asshole who believes its his personal divine appointed mission to protect Japan. That's it. That's all there is to his character. He's obsessed with protecting Japan, even when there are others that are fully capable, and in fact, MORE CAPABLE, of doing it. SONG have protected Japan, not him. He's only ever interfered with their mission and berated them. He wanted power for his own control because he never had faith in SONG or the symphogears, only in raw power.

Shining Wit said:
He didnt pull funding either because he doesnt fund them. He revoked their ability to operate in Japan with the guise of investigating Amalgam, which is a reasonable excuse (letting a foreign organisation run around with a new, untested WMD is insanity). It was cover for him stealing data and leading him to discovering Miku was clear of the curse of Balal and a much easier candidate for Shem-Ha than Hibiki. As soon as he gets what he needs, he removes the suppression so he doesn't blow the cover of his 'inspection'. Everyone at SONG knew it was bullshit but officially to everyone outside it was something mundane.
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Wrong. FUDO is SONG's main funder, through the fact that he basically controls the Japanese economy and can get the Japanese Diet to do whatever he wants. Its why SONG puts up with him even though he literally only ever hinders their mission and does nothing to help them. He pulled their funding and left them unable to operate. He's a duplicitous, disrespectful asshole, who never really believed in SONG and has only manipulated them and everyone else.

Once again, you are taking an opinion that the show itself never supports. He's a villain. He's only ever been a villain. He's never been portrayed sympathetically. He's an old style Japanese nationalist of the Japanese Imperialist strain and the show has never portrayed his position sympathetically or attempted to justify it.
 
wtfNeedSignUp said:
My issue with Index was always how autistic the setting got. Unless there will be an anime for the entire LN run (unlikely) then nothing will ever be resolved.
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Maybe the other seasons expand on it, but I'm still a bit mad we don't see more of Index being a creepy encyclopedia computer being or whatever was going on in those first five episodes. I kinda like Index, and yet she got shoved to the sidelines so fast.

The show's pacing also fucking sucked, I could only tolerate watching it one episode a day. It's not Toei-levels of shit pacing, it's just very info-heavy and tends to be characters just standing around explaining shit that doesn't get elaborated on again anyway.

Knowing Railgun S takes place during that helps me to make up my mind where to start next. I have no idea why Hulu doesn't have more Index seasons, though, but whatever. First Railgun was more tight about its pacing and knew how to tease a mystery for a good cour-length.
 
Railgun S had very enjoyable characters, all with their own strong personalities. There's a distinct difference between Misaka, the Mikoto clones, and even little Misaka Misaka.

Also I think the argument about Fudo should be its own thread now.
 
Betonhaus said:
Also I think the argument about Fudo should be its own thread now.
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Blame the guy refusing to put spoilers behind spoiler tags (despite the convo starting from someone only on s3 when the discussion relates to s5)

Cant quote anymore so i'll just finish it on this: never support the endstate of entrusting national security to the UN
 
Kari Kamiya said:
Maybe the other seasons expand on it, but I'm still a bit mad we don't see more of Index being a creepy encyclopedia computer being or whatever was going on in those first five episodes. I kinda like Index, and yet she got shoved to the sidelines so fast.

The show's pacing also fucking sucked, I could only tolerate watching it one episode a day. It's not Toei-levels of shit pacing, it's just very info-heavy and tends to be characters just standing around explaining shit that doesn't get elaborated on again anyway.

Knowing Railgun S takes place during that helps me to make up my mind where to start next. I have no idea why Hulu doesn't have more Index seasons, though, but whatever. First Railgun was more tight about its pacing and knew how to tease a mystery for a good cour-length.
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If you already watched Index 1 and Railgun 1, you owe yourself a reward. This is a legitimately good show that makes good use of that full 24 episode run. It expects you to have watched all the bullshit before (not index II), and takes off running. The overexplaning autism is toned way down, and I think honestly it's because the author... just got good. It's hard to explain other than he made enough mistakes before that he figured his shit out.
 
Shining Wit said:
Cant quote anymore so i'll just finish it on this: never support the endstate of entrusting national security to the UN
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I'll just say my last word on this: Symphogear isn't trying to make some grand statement on the U.N. It spends more than enough of its run time shitting on the U.S., but it doesn't overlook the insanity of crazy nationalist figures in Japan. In a sense, its balanced in it perspective. Completely ignoring that to go on an anti-UN tangent, though, is missing the forest for the trees.

Shining Wit said:
Blame the guy refusing to put spoilers behind spoiler tags (despite the convo starting from someone only on s3 when the discussion relates to s5)
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At some point, its just not worth it to put nested quotes within quotes. Just looks messy.

Betonhaus said:
Also I think the argument about Fudo should be its own thread now.
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No need. There's not really enough going on to support an entire thread, especially when its just two guys going back and forth. And it is, in fact, a discussion about anime, so it isn't, strictly speaking, off topic.
 
Kari Kamiya said:
Maybe the other seasons expand on it, but I'm still a bit mad we don't see more of Index being a creepy encyclopedia computer being or whatever was going on in those first five episodes. I kinda like Index, and yet she got shoved to the sidelines so fast.

The show's pacing also fucking sucked, I could only tolerate watching it one episode a day. It's not Toei-levels of shit pacing, it's just very info-heavy and tends to be characters just standing around explaining shit that doesn't get elaborated on again anyway.

Knowing Railgun S takes place during that helps me to make up my mind where to start next. I have no idea why Hulu doesn't have more Index seasons, though, but whatever. First Railgun was more tight about its pacing and knew how to tease a mystery for a good cour-length.
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I tried to watch Railgun but too much yuri baiting
 
The mecha race episode in Gaiking is pretty cool. It has lots of neat obstacles, and the first little bit of the race reminded me of Mario Kart. It also had a nice Captain Avatar reference. Here's some other funny racing anime I like:

The CGI actually works very well in this since it makes it feel like a racing game.

I really like the vehicle designs in this. The soundtrack complements it well too, and of course the animation is excellent. Plus it's a funny, cutesy mashup of several old Artmic OVAs like Gaiarth, Gall Force, AD Police, Megazone 23, and Bubblegum Crisis!
 
Myles the Potatophile said:
I first saw FLCL 20 years ago on Adult Swim. Never paid attention to Alt and Prog because they were so far off base, and after seeing them marathoned for the premier of Grunge, I have survivors guilt.
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FLCL is definitely lightning caught in a bottle type situation: it came out right after Gainax finished EoE and everyone was super depressed. The whole point of it was to make a short, balls to the wall insane anime that got rid of all those negative feelings and it definitely worked. I don't see how Prog or Alt or Grunge are even things. FLCL was always meant to be one and done and it's stronger for it. The only other time I've seen a 20+ year old anime resurrected well was Gunbuster and that was set in the far far future in order to tell a different story in the same setting, but it worked and it was a good finish to the Gunbuster series. Sometimes sleeping dogs should just lie and the modern need to remake/remaster already perfectly good pieces of media is not only annoying but detrimental to the source material as well.
 
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