Anime/Manga - Discuss Japanese cartoons and comics here; NO CULTURE WAR DOOMPOSTING!

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Kari Kamiya said:
Saw episode four, am still not impressed. I think it's a huuuuge stretch for us to suspend our disbelief that these high school students who have never once attempted animation before and had to time crunch could make something so mind-blowing to the student body. And then they still ended up critiquing nitpicks over their own work when they're just a bunch of amateurs.

Gag me with a fucking spoon.

I also still think the anime keeps like skipping steps to get from point A to point C. I still seriously believe the general audience doesn't have a clue what they're talking about half the time because they don't always show everything to take advantage of the medium (like the imagine spots I think should be more like storyboards or an animatic than just rough sketchbook sketches/watercolors that all three girls can see through their mind's eye). I know what's going on and it's still making me go "Why'd you skip this part?? Or gloss over this detail?" at times. I think if it wasn't for the fact this was directed by Yuasa Masaaki that it'd get critiqued harder in how it speeds through terminology than it already is. And mind you, I don't think he's a bad director at all, I prefer him over Makoto Shinkai's work any day, but Eizouken is bugging the hell out of me with its "tell, don't show" attitude.
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I had a lot of the same issues with it as you did ngl. I mentioned it pages back, but it just felt a bit off, a bit too PR. Shirobako did it better which sucks since it was looked over a lot because of it's art style, but I found it to be much more grounded than Eizouken.
 
Kari Kamiya said:
Like they didn't namedrop the multiplane camera, they just say it's a "camera stand" and then explain how the contraption works, but it's only shown in action once for one part (the background scroll).
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I have to wonder if it was lost in translation. Translators frequently screw up when they're doing something that isn't common knowledge.

The translation on my copy of a Soviet film, Dream Come True (1963) has the line "Only emergency block are working." "Block" in Russian space means "functional block", what we in the West would call a "stage", or "module", or possibly "system." The translation should be "Only the emergency systems are working."
 
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Funimation is going to make some shit.
 
Kari Kamiya said:
Saw episode four, am still not impressed. I think it's a huuuuge stretch for us to suspend our disbelief that these high school students who have never once attempted animation before and had to time crunch could make something so mind-blowing to the student body. And then they still ended up critiquing nitpicks over their own work when they're just a bunch of amateurs.

Gag me with a fucking spoon.

I also still think the anime keeps like skipping steps to get from point A to point C. I still seriously believe the general audience doesn't have a clue what they're talking about half the time because they don't always show everything to take advantage of the medium (like the imagine spots I think should be more like storyboards or an animatic than just rough sketchbook sketches/watercolors that all three girls can see through their mind's eye). I know what's going on and it's still making me go "Why'd you skip this part?? Or gloss over this detail?" at times. I think if it wasn't for the fact this was directed by Yuasa Masaaki that it'd get critiqued harder in how it speeds through terminology than it already is. And mind you, I don't think he's a bad director at all, I prefer him over Makoto Shinkai's work any day, but Eizouken is bugging the hell out of me with its "tell, don't show" attitude.
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How is it unrealistic for amateurs to nitpick their own works? Artists of all skill levels harshly critique themselves all the time.
 
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When will the SJW infestation start? Funimation should work on ruining some shows and pissing off the fans and having the companies be told to act like arrogant complacent douches while they live off dwindling popularity and gaslight people who point this out?

Seriously I'm sick of the faggots constantly claiming Anime is going to get ruined by SJWs, when the FUCK will it happen so I can immediately lose interest in anime?

twitter.com

Kat. on Twitter

“Funimation will now have direct input on the anime industry at its source. How to make their shows more palatable for foreign consumption. With Japanese creators having only their word on what westerners want to see in their anime.”
twitter.com twitter.com
 
InsolentGaylord said:
When will the SJW infestation start? Funimation should work on ruining some shows and pissing off the fans and having the companies be told to act like arrogant complacent douches while they live off dwindling popularity and gaslight people who point this out?

Seriously I'm sick of the faggots constantly claiming Anime is going to get ruined by SJWs, when the FUCK will it happen so I can immediately lose interest in anime?

twitter.com

Kat. on Twitter

“Funimation will now have direct input on the anime industry at its source. How to make their shows more palatable for foreign consumption. With Japanese creators having only their word on what westerners want to see in their anime.”
twitter.com twitter.com
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twitter.com

Funimation on Twitter

“What does it mean to be on an anime production committee, and how does it benefit you as an anime fan? ✨ Read on: https://t.co/ojenNEXS6z”
twitter.com twitter.com
 
Jewelsmakerguy said:
You're probably going to really hate the Manga then, because it's even more of a "Tell, don't show" fest going on (and keep in mind, there's no proper translation for that if you actually try to look for it).
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Oh yeah, that's right it's based off an actual manga. I thought this was an actual original concept by Masaaki. That makes it even worse, then, having to squish all that information into 12 episodes. They should've just gone the creative liberty route to make it work better.

I mean I get the idea they're going for with it, but neither the anime or Manga execute it all that well in the grand scheme of things. So in a sense, they botch it both ways- They over complicate the "Tell" part and make the "show" part extremely mindboggling at the best of times.
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Damn. The idea isn't bad at all, too, and I guess that's why it's so frustrating to me that it feels like they're skipping things. I get it if they expect their audience to actually look into the process themselves, but the average viewer rarely ever does that unless they were already interested in animation themselves. I have learned about animation and its history since high school, the same age as these girls, I never once felt like my instructor had skipped around to get to such-and-such project or to such-and-such point.

Atatata said:
I had a lot of the same issues with it as you did ngl. I mentioned it pages back, but it just felt a bit off, a bit too PR. Shirobako did it better which sucks since it was looked over a lot because of it's art style, but I found it to be much more grounded than Eizouken.
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I need to get around to Shirobako, but my understanding was it was more about the industry itself than the art/science (as someone once described it) of animation.

BScCollateral said:
I have to wonder if it was lost in translation. Translators frequently screw up when they're doing something that isn't common knowledge.
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I checked because it was possible Crunchyroll of course fucked it up, but it actually IS: "マルチプレーン・カメラ" (maruchipureen kamera), which they didn't say at all in the episode. These aspiring animators didn't even know it's called a multiplane camera.

SnowBall said:
How is it unrealistic for amateurs to nitpick their own works? Artists of all skill levels harshly critique themselves all the time.
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It's not unrealistic at all since you're your own worst critic, but there's no fucking way amateur animators can make an animation that's on the same level as a first-year CalArt student's animation project--were those same issues they pointed out even in the actual short itself as literal Easter eggs for the viewer to get on the same page as them, or is that still a negative because of fucking course this short wasn't animated IRL by high school students? I get it, they didn't have the time to look at it all the way through which they mentioned in passing, but they still act like they're actual fucking professionals when they were whining about shit/getting in an argument with Kanamori earlier despite having never touched an algorithm program in their lives. It's not like they're prodigies, nothing was ever established that was ever the case for them. Self-taught animators still take years/hundreds of hours if they're animating every day to be able to properly animate something coherent.

EDIT: oops, fixed a word
 
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Kari Kamiya said:
Oh yeah, that's right it's based off an actual manga. I thought this was an actual original concept by Masaaki. That makes it even worse, then, having to squish all that information into 12 episodes. They should've just gone the creative liberty route to make it work better.

Damn. The idea isn't bad at all, too, and I guess that's why it's so frustrating to me that it feels like they're skipping things. I get it if they expect their audience to actually look into the process themselves, but the average viewer rarely ever does that unless they were already interested in animation themselves. I have learned about animation and its history since high school, the same age as these girls, I never once felt like my instructor had skipped around to get to such-and-such project or to such-and-such point.
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Again, the manga's not much better, even with the lack of a translation, it still feels not so comprehensive and the lack of movement makes the whole thing feel pointless in the long run. 7 chapters a volume is not really a good length either considering that manga volumes are almost never consistent in their length.
 
Dom Cruise said:
Just because Funimation may try to make anime woke, doesn't mean they'll succeed.
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Wouldn't Sony have the final say for the most part, anyway, since Sony now owns/oversees Funimation? So far it doesn't sound like they're making their own anime, they're just one amongst others in a committee, they can easily be ignored/overwritten during production. If they do ever start producing anime like what Crunchyroll's doing, then this sounds like a financial disaster waiting to happen because if they can't pay off the costs by getting people to support their anime and buy it and the merchandising, they're going to go bankrupt. They're already going through a nasty lawsuit, are they going to be able to handle anime production?

Real question: What's the last American (animesque or otherwise) cartoon not based on an existing decades-long property to have been successful in Japan? What makes them think a Japanese audience will flock to their American cartoons even if it's adapting a manga? When was the last time an American committee even had an inkling of power amongst a Japanese committee?
 
Kari Kamiya said:
Wouldn't Sony have the final say for the most part, anyway, since Sony now owns/oversees Funimation? So far it doesn't sound like they're making their own anime, they're just one amongst others in a committee, they can easily be ignored/overwritten during production. If they do ever start producing anime like what Crunchyroll's doing, then this sounds like a financial disaster waiting to happen because if they can't pay off the costs by getting people to support their anime and buy it and the merchandising, they're going to go bankrupt. They're already going through a nasty lawsuit, are they going to be able to handle anime production?

Real question: What's the last American (animesque or otherwise) cartoon not based on an existing decades-long property to have been successful in Japan? What makes them think a Japanese audience will flock to their American cartoons even if it's adapting a manga? When was the last time an American committee even had an inkling of power amongst a Japanese committee?
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And where is the new Sony base located in? California.
And what does California host the most?
 
Kari Kamiya said:
Real question: What's the last American (animesque or otherwise) cartoon not based on an existing decades-long property to have been successful in Japan? What makes them think a Japanese audience will flock to their American cartoons even if it's adapting a manga? When was the last time an American committee even had an inkling of power amongst a Japanese committee?
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SpongeBob was pretty popular, but American cartoons are generally only on Japanese cable these days.
 
Kari Kamiya said:
Real question: What's the last American (animesque or otherwise) cartoon not based on an existing decades-long property to have been successful in Japan?
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Does Frozen count? It topped Spirited Away's Japanese box office record for an animated film and was only surpassed by Your Name a couple of years later if I remember correctly.
 
sasazuka said:
Does Frozen count? It topped Spirited Away's Japanese box office record for an animated film and was only surpassed by Your Name a couple of years later if I remember correctly.
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I'm not really counting anything Disney.
 
Kari Kamiya said:
Oh yeah, that's right it's based off an actual manga. I thought this was an actual original concept by Masaaki. That makes it even worse, then, having to squish all that information into 12 episodes. They should've just gone the creative liberty route to make it work better.



Damn. The idea isn't bad at all, too, and I guess that's why it's so frustrating to me that it feels like they're skipping things. I get it if they expect their audience to actually look into the process themselves, but the average viewer rarely ever does that unless they were already interested in animation themselves. I have learned about animation and its history since high school, the same age as these girls, I never once felt like my instructor had skipped around to get to such-and-such project or to such-and-such point.



I need to get around to Shirobako, but my understanding was it was more about the industry itself than the art/science (as someone once described it) of animation.



I checked because it was possible Crunchyroll of course fucked it up, but it actually IS: "マルチプレーン・カメラ" (muruchipureen kamera), which they didn't say at all in the episode. These aspiring animators didn't even know it's called a multiplane camera.



It's not unrealistic at all since you're your own worst critic, but there's no fucking way amateur animators can make an animation that's on the same level as a first-year CalArt student's animation project--were those same issues they pointed out even in the actual short itself as literal Easter eggs for the viewer to get on the same page as them, or is that still a negative because of fucking course this short wasn't animated IRL by high school students? I get it, they didn't have the time to look at it all the way through which they mentioned in passing, but they still act like they're actual fucking professionals when they were whining about shit/getting in an argument with Kanamori earlier despite having never touched an algorithm program in their lives. It's not like they're prodigies, nothing was ever established that was ever the case for them. Self-taught animators still take years/hundreds of hours if they're animating every day to be able to properly animate something coherent.
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Maybe you should just drop the show if you're going to get all worked up over it like this.
 
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