Wuhan Coronavirus: Lockdowns, Quarantines, Cancellations

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Save the Loli said:
And plenty are perfectly fine with taking the risk of getting sick or even dying just as plenty are fine with that risk as they go out and want to buy things. Now neither group can take advantage of this because the government decided to listen to doctors (and not economists or anyone else on this) and completely close society in a failed attempt to stop the spread of disease which isn't too lethal anyway.

The fact anyone but a communist or some other authoritarian say things like this with a straight face (especially on a site like this which allegedly values freedoms and is full of people who dislike collectivism) continues to astound me. Society is so scared of death we'd rather burn it down than face the reality that a relatively small number of people will die a few years sooner than they were going to die.
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It is honestly fascinating to see the libertarian section does have it in them to create mass death in the same way communism does when their value of absolute Freedom is challenged.
 
ConfederateIrishman said:
It is honestly fascinating to see the libertarian section does have it in them to create mass death in the same way communism does when their value of absolute Freedom is challenged.
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Lol, I was reading a Reddit thread where people were debating Libertarians on the coronavirus crisis (it was on the app on my phone so unfortunately I can't go through my history to find it again). One of the Libertarians, when questioned about his view on how a small, decentralized government can handle a pandemic, responded that he thinks there needs to be "robust," large, centralized government actions and responses during a pandemic. But the government can only be large and powerful and able to mobilize like that during national emergencies.

People pointed out that it's fucking impossible to have the large, effective government response he wants if the government is crippled 99% of the time. Kind of like how it was a bad idea for Trump's administration to disband the pandemic response team in 2018 because we didn't need it at the time.
 
moocow said:
Yeah I get pretty upset when my neighbors play with live hand grenades in their front yard, too. Guess I'm just too "scared of death" to allow them to explore their freedoms without gov't interference. I'm such an authoritarian bastard.
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Bad example. Someone playing with hand grenades in their own yard doesn't hurt you or anyone but themselves. It's the same as someone shooting an AR-15 in their own yard which scares to death many Californians.
ConfederateIrishman said:
It is honestly fascinating to see the libertarian section does have it in them to create mass death in the same way communism does when their value of absolute Freedom is challenged.
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I'm not even a libertarian. I'm just a firm believer in proportionate response to a proportionate disaster. This is not a disaster to shut down the world over, it's a disaster to order more limited measures against (like some countries have done to no less success than the US). Something like the Spanish flu in terms of lethality (especially among younger people) might be. Something much more deadly would be.

And remember, the US already is doing this to an extant because domestic air travel is not suspended anywhere in the country. People are still flying and do it at their own risk. Thank god we put the interests of American Airlines over the interest of Small Town Joe and his shop.
 
UK qualification and exam regulator Ofqual has issued the following information this morning on how GCSE and A-level grades would be awarded following exam cancellation and school closures.

www.gov.uk

How GCSEs, AS & A levels will be awarded in summer 2020

Ofqual sets out details for schools, colleges, students, parents & carers on how GCSEs and A levels will be awarded following the cancellation of this year's exams.
www.gov.uk www.gov.uk

TL;DR exam boards will be contacting individual schools and colleges to submit students' predicted grades based on what they've gotten across mock exams and other in-school work.
 
Save the Loli said:
Something like the Spanish flu in terms of lethality (especially among younger people) might be. Something much more deadly would be.
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It's been explained literally fucking everywhere, for months, that the fatality rate is not the primary concern. The rate of infection spread is. If you're still thinking shutdowns are about keeping Bubble Boy and someone's great grandmother alive you're being willfully ignorant at this point and are deserving of mockery. If you think imposed, unenforced stay-at-home orders are disastrous I would love to hear what your idea of what an infection level of just 10% of the US population would be like. What happens when a major US city doesn't have garbage removal for a month because the entire driver team is sick? Or a plant that makes insulin, causing a nationwide shortage?

Your (continued) inability to look beyond a single number illustrates that you don't have even a grade schooler's grasp on the situation.
 
Let's just stop having a society altogether.

It will be rough for me and mine, but the urban bugmen will die like flies. That's a burden I'm willing to accept.
 
Cosmos said:
People pointed out that it's fucking impossible to have the large, effective government response he wants if the government is crippled 99% of the time. Kind of like how it was a bad idea for Trump's administration to disband the pandemic response team in 2018 because we didn't need it at the time.
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Anyone who pointed this out is a dunce, because it isn't true in the slightest. The idea that CDC pandemic response was disbanded was a complete fabrication. NSC staff was cut because it had ballooned four times in size in the past twenty years, but biodefense was untouched. You can read about that from Tim Morrison, the former biodefense directer at the NSC.

http://archive.vn/ydeE8

It is true that the Trump administration has seen fit to shrink the NSC staff. But the bloat that occurred under the previous administration clearly needed a correction. Defense Secretary Robert Gates, congressional oversight committees and members of the Obama administration itself all agreed the NSC was too large and too operationally focused (a departure from its traditional role coordinating executive branch activity). As The Post reported in 2015, from the Clinton administration to the Obama administration’s second term, the NSC’s staff “had quadrupled in size, to nearly 400 people.” That is why Trump began streamlining the NSC staff in 2017.
One such move at the NSC was to create the counterproliferation and biodefense directorate, which was the result of consolidating three directorates into one, given the obvious overlap between arms control and nonproliferation, weapons of mass destruction terrorism, and global health and biodefense. It is this reorganization that critics have misconstrued or intentionally misrepresented. If anything, the combined directorate was stronger because related expertise could be commingled.
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The CDC has actually expanded anti-pandemic operations under Trump, and their budget has been massively increased year by year under him. You can read about that from Maureen Bartee, the current associate director for Global Health Security at the CDC.

http://archive.vn/tZhcT

“CDC did not have to cut back its work from 49 to 10 countries,” said Maureen Bartee, CDC’s associate director for Global Health Security, in a statement to FactCheck.org. “In the FY18-FY20 annual appropriations, CDC received base appropriations for global health security from Congress. This was used to continue the essential public health capacity development in the four core areas that was started in 2014 with the one-time supplemental funds.”

Those four core areas, Bartee said, are surveillance, laboratory systems, workforce development and emergency management and response. “Focusing on potential weak links in these core areas ensures that partner countries are better prepared to respond to disease threats, wherever they might begin,” she explained.

CDC operating budget plans show that its funding for global public health protection — which includes global disease detection and emergency response and global public health capacity — increased from $58 million in fiscal year 2017 to around $108 million in fiscal years 2018 and 2019. (And that does not include any remaining supplemental funds available for use.) The increases included nearly $50 million more each year for CDC’s global health security initiatives.
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Dog-O-Tron 5000v5.0 said:
This is beyond exceptional. Right now Walmart is a fucking lifeline. It is the ONLY place you can buy clothing and household goods besides Amazon, which isn't prioritizing your orders. It's not easy to shop via phone for some of this stuff; you need to see it and see what's available. Also just stopping people from wandering the toy aisles or garden isn't doing jack shit to stop people from shopping in the store if you are still letting them in to buy food and pharma.

It's just Vermont getting pissy at big boxes cause they fucking hate them. I wonder if this applies to Joe's General Store? Can i still buy a belt and maple syrup candy there when I go for bread and cheese? The net result is it just makes the average person's life harder. If they shut down these kind of sales and Amazon dies, we're pretty much fucked besides being able to buy food.
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"Shop online" isn't even possible anymore. I ordered some stuff from walmart.com 10 days ago, and most of my order hasn't even shipped yet. I don't know WTF people are ordering from there to create such a backlog, all the food, TP, and usual hoard sundries have been sold out over half a month now.
 
IMG_20200403_193513.jpg
Based. Personally think shooting people who are confirmed positive and willfully violate quarantine to mix with the general public should be A-OK.
 
Michigan, USA

(also in the Megathread)

Governor Gretchen Whitmer (D) orders all persons with symptoms of Coronavirus to stay home until 3 days after symptoms disappear, or 7 days after they first appear.
The order requires people — regardless of whether they are deemed essential — to stay home for three days after their symptoms end or seven days after their symptoms appear or they were swabbed for a positive case.
The edict also requires close contacts of a symptomatic individual to remain in their homes for 14 days or until they test negative for the virus.
The 14-day provision does not apply to health care workers, first responders, child care providers or correction officers.
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Also, the fine for violations has been increased to $1,500. $500 in criminal penalties and $1,000 in civil.
www.detroitnews.com

Whitmer order tightens stay-home edict, restricts those who have been exposed

Whitmer strengthened the stay-at-home order she issued two weeks ago, ordering anyone with COVID-19 symptoms or a positive coronavirus test to stay home
www.detroitnews.com www.detroitnews.com
(archive) (Newest executive order on state website - archive)
 
Pargon said:
It's been explained literally fucking everywhere, for months, that the fatality rate is not the primary concern. The rate of infection spread is. If you're still thinking shutdowns are about keeping Bubble Boy and someone's great grandmother alive you're being willfully ignorant at this point and are deserving of mockery. If you think imposed, unenforced stay-at-home orders are disastrous I would love to hear what your idea of what an infection level of just 10% of the US population would be like. What happens when a major US city doesn't have garbage removal for a month because the entire driver team is sick? Or a plant that makes insulin, causing a nationwide shortage?

Your (continued) inability to look beyond a single number illustrates that you don't have even a grade schooler's grasp on the situation.
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Except nuclear power plants and other important pieces of infrastructure have their crews working in shifts to ensure there's enough healthy people to keep working. Many businesses should be doing that. We can take a 10% infection rate (they say it's just two weeks!) assuming we order essential businesses to prepare for it and mobilize the National Guard to step in. That's what the government should be doing instead of forbidding people everywhere to work.

So how does that justify closing down every single "non-essential" (whatever that means, politicians everywhere seem to have different definitions) business? It's collectivism akin to that seen in the USSR (especially during WWII) and China. Let's ignore that many major Chinese cities right now have more lenient policies toward business and freedom of movement than much of Europe and the US. If we listened to some climatologists like we're listening to some doctors we'd have the Green New Deal passed unanimously.
Male Idiot said:
In Italy it is outperforming the Spanish flu by a good margin.
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Of course it would considering they have been very short on tests (and mostly test people who get hospitalized) and the Italian population is much, much older as a whole compared to 1919 (not to mention tobacco use and AIDS rates).
 
The way we've lost freedom of movement just like that is really disturbing. Even scarier is how most Americattle don't seem to question it that much
 
Freya said:
The way we've lost freedom of movement just like that is really disturbing. Even scarier is how most Americattle don't seem to question it that much
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Please show me one state which is enforcing their stay-at-home order under force of law.
 
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