Western Animation - Discuss American, Canadian, and European cartoons here (or just bitch about wokeshit, I guess)

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Purple fur Pomeranian said:
I've kept seeing this post about Scarlett Johansson standing against LGBTQ themes in children's shows, and I did a Grok review and got this result.
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To be fair it explains why a lot of cartoon characters nowadays are ugly. I feel like once we hit the 2010's the character designs in cartoons just got lazy and slop.

Like go from Looney Toons and early Disney up to Daria and Drawn Together, KotH, etc. Now after that everything is ugly. Has to be that Cal Arts shit. Rebecca Sugar is to blame.
 
Scarlett Johansson said:
To be fair it explains why a lot of cartoon characters nowadays are ugly. I feel like once we hit the 2010's the character designs in cartoons just got lazy and slop.

Like go from Looney Toons and early Disney up to Daria and Drawn Together, KotH, etc. Now after that everything is ugly. Has to be that Cal Arts shit. Rebecca Sugar is to blame.
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It's probably to do with cost cutting. Simpler shapes = less money that the studio has to pay their artists.
 
starborn427614 said:
It's probably to do with cost cutting. Simpler shapes = less money that the studio has to pay their artists.
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Even if that's the answer, it's so fucking stupid. They budget a show, right, so if they cut corners by having simple designs and cut corners by having everything barely move and cut corners by using puppet rigs or whatever, what the fuck do they spend the extra money on? In anime, they barely move the characters except for the mouths and use all that extra money on fight scenes or musical numbers or whatever. Where the hell does the money go in western cartoons? Are we just that bad at budgeting???
 
Chromeo said:
Even if that's the answer, it's so fucking stupid. They budget a show, right, so if they cut corners by having simple designs and cut corners by having everything barely move and cut corners by using puppet rigs or whatever, what the fuck do they spend the extra money on? In anime, they barely move the characters except for the mouths and use all that extra money on fight scenes or musical numbers or whatever. Where the hell does the money go in western cartoons? Are we just that bad at budgeting???
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It's probably on the bureaucracy shit that has nothing to do with the actual production, i.e. the various diversity and other "managerial" roles that could easily be cut, but they don't. The whole union vs. non-union workers would also add to the costs too, but doesn't Japan also have a union for their VA workers, or are their VAs usually work under one group umbrella?

starborn427614 said:
It's probably to do with cost cutting. Simpler shapes = less money that the studio has to pay their artists.
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Would the use of Flash Animation also be a cost-cutting tool? FreshTV is most (?) notable for this with 6Teen and Total Drama, but at least they have distinct artstyles compared to the CalArts crap being spewed out today.
 
Thiletonomics said:
Would the use of Flash Animation also be a cost-cutting tool? FreshTV is most (?) notable for this with 6Teen and Total Drama, but at least they have distinct artstyles compared to the CalArts crap being spewed out today.
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Yes and yes. Lest we remember, MLP was one of the best-looking shows of the early 10s while being made in Flash.
 
Thiletonomics said:
Would the use of Flash Animation also be a cost-cutting tool? FreshTV is most (?) notable for this with 6Teen and Total Drama, but at least they have distinct artstyles compared to the CalArts crap being spewed out today.
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It absolutely was, I remember that being the big complaint before calarts style really took off.
 
Chromeo said:
Where the hell does the money go in western cartoons? Are we just that bad at budgeting???
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The entire industry is simply not interested in providing quality in the same way as anime. It's easy to blame indivuduals, but typically they're trying the best with what little they have even if the results are far from satisfactory. You would need a complete culture shift to even begin to come close imo.
 
Not sure where to talk about it, but here seems right. Sorry for changing the topic so dramatically! Is anyone else getting real tired of Chikn Nuggit? I've been watching it for a few years and I can deal with the random lesbians and gender bullshit, but the pacing is starting to really piss me off. It was bad enough when the Demigod arc felt rushed and out of order and really poorly written, but now it's like Chikn and Onyn have been traveling to Onyn's hometown for SO LONG!!! I'm sitting here like
 
starborn427614 said:
It's probably to do with cost cutting. Simpler shapes = less money that the studio has to pay their artists.
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It's also easier to animate especially with the miserable little no talents that inhabit the animation space these days.
starborn427614 said:
The entire industry is simply not interested in providing quality in the same way as anime. It's easy to blame indivuduals, but typically they're trying the best with what little they have even if the results are far from satisfactory. You would need a complete culture shift to even begin to come close imo.
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Western animators aren't as willing to literally work themselves to death for poverty wages like nips are. The unions compound these problems by making frankly unreasonable demands on studios.
 
Trollblade69 said:
I never watched it. Sell it to me, @Chromeo
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Chikn Nuggit is a series of shorts published on both YouTube and TikTok about cute animals named after fast food going through relatable moments, things like being excited when you get an extra onion ring in your french fries, or wishing Twitter didn't suck so much. There's a big-ass cast of characters who all have little things that make them stand out:
  • Chikn Nuggit is a long-eared puppy who breaks the fourth wall and is very cutesy.
  • Cheezborger (also called Chee) is a cat in a cheeseburger hat who is Chikn's best friend. She's also easily scared.
  • Slushi is a blue fox who loves anime, makes art, and babysits Sody Pop.
  • Sody Pop is a red panda and a literal 8-year-old who likes to explode. I'm not being metaphorical, he literally explodes.
  • Iscream is a demon disguised as a rabbit who likes doing safe-edgy evil shit like unspecified satanic blood rituals and drawing summoning circles.
  • Fwench Fwy is an angelic wish dragon who grants wishes and thwarts Iscream (and they end up dating almost immediately.)
  • Bezel is a tumblr sexyman clock guy who gets under everyone's skin.
  • Hawt Saus is a red squirrel who's ACTUALLY edgy/mean, which of course means all the other cast hate him (but he's my favorite.)
  • Cofi is a sheep dressed as a wolf who intimidates Iscream and ends up dating Chee.
  • Onyn Ring is an anxious bat who wants to worship the demigod he read so much about.
There was a big arc where Chikn Nuggit was revealed to secretly be a demigod who was prophesied to warp reality beyond recognition, and that's why Iscream, Fwench Fwy, and Bezel showed up: Iscream to make him evil, Fwench Fwy to make him good, and Bezel because he's the living embodiment of the Doomsday Clock and just wants things to happen. The pacing was garbage because it's a shorts series with some slightly longer videos and Buzzfeed apparently did some meddling. Chee started dating Cofi, which made Chikn feel lonely, so Bezel got to him while he was vulnerable and unleashed the demigod. Chikn did some reality warping, but Chee got through to him and got him to stop, so now everyone knows Chikn is a demigod but he only uses his powers for fun once in a blue moon. Onyn Ring showed up hoping the demigod had destroyed the world already, only to find a reluctant puppy, and the current arc is Onyn and Chikn traveling to Onyn's hometown so Onyn can show Chikn how much the world sucks and why it'd be better if Chikn went full demigod again and destroyed everything.

It's cute, and even with some of the woke bullshit episodes those are easily ignored (Iscream and Fwench Fwy are agender, Chee and Cofi are obviously gay, there are modern woke humor things especially during pride month, etc,) my only problem is the pacing is so dogshit. Puppyshit? It's frustrating. Episodes come out once in a whenever they feel like it and so far Onyn and Chikn have been traveling at a SNAIL'S PACE. Like imagine getting a story one minute at a time, and it's a 5 minute story they're stretching out to be an hour long, that's what it feels like right now. I usually like Chikn Nuggit but it's bugging me lately.
 
Here's why Ren & Stimpy: Adult Party Cartoon is subpar to the original. Actually, here's a detailed synopsis on how and why many "adult" cartoons fail to be funny.


Shock humor does not work if that's ALL you're providing to the audience as "jokes." The gags, like Family Guy, drag on with no delivery. Jokes need a set up, a twist and proper delivery for them to hit. Just showing gross out humor, swearing endlessly, vividly displaying sex on screen are not "jokes."
 
Sleazy Car Salesman said:
Western animators aren't as willing to literally work themselves to death for poverty wages like nips are. The unions compound these problems by making frankly unreasonable demands on studios.
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And if those Western animations thought that Nips work for pennies, then they should see what the Chinks (I don't know if Gooks get paid more now compared to in the past) get paid in comparison, since the Chinese and Koreans are also jumping in on the animation bandwagon too. They get paid in literal dirt, and have zero worker protection and are even more expendable.
 
I've been rewatching the 90s Scooby-Doo movies, and hot damn, I miss this type of animation so much.
You just don't get this kind of color contrast anymore. You can tell they used black paper as a base and drew the colors onto it.
You can't get that with digital.
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Thiletonomics said:
And if those Western animations thought that Nips work for pennies, then they should see what the Chinks (I don't know if Gooks get paid more now compared to in the past) get paid in comparison, since the Chinese and Koreans are also jumping in on the animation bandwagon too. They get paid in literal dirt, and have zero worker protection and are even more expendable.
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I think it's a good thing to not want to work yourself to death for slave wages. But a little perspective would be nice.
ThisIsGonnaBeGood said:
I've been rewatching the 90s Scooby-Doo movies, and hot damn, I miss this type of animation so much.
You just don't get this kind of color contrast anymore. You can tell they used black paper as a base and drew the colors onto it.
You can't get that with digital.
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The Hex Girls from Witch's Ghost were my first childhood crush. That probably says nothing good about me tbh.
 
ThisIsGonnaBeGood said:
I've been rewatching the 90s Scooby-Doo movies, and hot damn, I miss this type of animation so much.
You just don't get this kind of color contrast anymore. You can tell they used black paper as a base and drew the colors onto it.
You can't get that with digital.
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Fans: Thorne now would be a hot goth milf.


The Velma show:
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And yes I don't apologize for reminding anyone of that garbage, never forget what that show stole from you.
 
A Grey Cat said:
Fans: Thorne now would be a hot goth milf.


The Velma show:
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And yes I don't apologize for reminding anyone of that garbage, never forget what that show stole from you.
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Velma was always hilarious to me because people were acting like it was the worst thing ever and it just...isn't. There's nothing about that show which is uniquely bad, it's the same college campus liberal shit as everything else from the past 15 years has been.
 
Sleazy Car Salesman said:
Velma was always hilarious to me because people were acting like it was the worst thing ever and it just...isn't. There's nothing about that show which is uniquely bad, it's the same college campus liberal shit as everything else from the past 15 years has been.
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That's somehow even more depressing.
 
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