Weightlifting for Kiwis - Discussion and support regarding the art of swole

[sodaboard]

death to the barbell squat

you best have a damn good reason for making this post

 

[24nagging]

you best have a damn good reason for making this post

1) they are not the most effective movement to hit the muscles it involves (quads, glutes, calfs)
2) the first muscle to give out is the lower back, and your quads can take way more than your low back
3) all of this is because it is not a stable movement, which means energy goes to stabilizing yourself instead of generating stress to the muscle
4) it is a massive risk the closer you get to failure (which is the hole point of hypertrophy training)
5) it stresses your joints to a massive degree, because of the instability. Hip pain is the most common injury from squads
honestly, if you are not powerlifting or you just really really really like it, why bother? do literally any other squad movement if you want bigger/stronger legs

 

[sodaboard]

1) they are not the most effective movement to hit the muscles it involves (quads, glutes, calfs)

as opposed to what else? whenever i do squats i always feel the burn in my thighs and glutes. calves not so much but calf extensions make up for this.

2) the first muscle to give out is the lower back, and your quads can take way more than your low back

you might want to check your form, usually it's my thighs that give out first. if the bar is parallel with the middle of your feet at all times, you keep your back straight and you're not leaning to either side on the way up this shouldn't be a problem.

3) all of this is because it is not a stable movement, which means energy goes to stabilizing yourself instead of generating stress to the muscle

that's part of lifting heavy things, you build up the endurance to remain stable while doing so.

4) it is a massive risk the closer you get to failure (which is the hole point of hypertrophy training)

this is when you need to understand your personal limits and know when to drop the bar, although ideally you should rerack if you know for certain you cannot complete the next rep rather than bailing out of the squat and crashing out. it's happened to me a few times and i feel like shit for it, so it comes down to knowing what your personal limit is.

5) it stresses your joints to a massive degree, because of the instability. Hip pain is the most common injury from squads

again, if you have proper form and know when to stop this shouldn't be an issue. joint pain should only be an issue if you're an old man AND training on the level of ronnie coleman (who has lifted so much and so hard over the course of his life that he has worn away all the cartilage between his joints. not fun).

honestly, if you are not powerlifting or you just really really really like it, why bother? do literally any other squad movement if you want bigger/stronger legs

when done properly squats hit every muscle group from your legs to your core and are an excellent compound lift. if you're really struggling with them or deathly afraid you might want to look into mark rippetoe's chapter on it in Starting Strength (which I believe is the first chapter because of how important it is) and commit it to memory. unless you have some other physical disability that prevents you from doing it i really can't see why you'd avoid it. do a light squat and just focus on maintaining proper form the whole time, then work your way up to heavier weights.

 

[24nagging]

as opposed to what else?

leg extensions, leg presses, hack squats, pendulum squats, etc

you might want to check your form, usually it's my thighs that give out first

well, you are built to do squats, am not, many people are not. Squats are not a universal movement for efective leg growth

that's part of lifting heavy things, you build up the endurance to remain stable while doing so.

maybe, but that's not the point of hypertrophy training

this is when you need to understand your personal limits and know when to drop the bar, although ideally you should rerack if you know for certain you cannot complete the next rep rather than bailing out of the squat and crashing out. it's happened to me a few times and i feel like shit for it, so it comes down to knowing what your personal limit is.

still. The point was that it is a massive risk for too little reward. Plus when things go bad on a squat, they go terminal sometimes. You can not say the same thing for a leg extension

joint pain should only be an issue

well, many young people feel joint pain and have good form. Training is not a yes or no thing. There are multiple reasons for one issue that has many different factors involved on one person, and so is everybody else.

Starting Strength

nah, I'll do what the chinese olympic team does when they wanna grow their muscles: MACHINES. Or hell, I'll do what Dorian did: MACHINES

Squats are not bad, they are just not a universal good movement for everybody that everybody must do otherwise... you will not get injured?

 

[Ted's Cabin]

I’d really speak to your consultant or surgeon about this as we are just a bunch of retards on the internet.

Look after your hands, bro.

Agreed. If you fuck up your hands because you listened to retards online, your surgeon is going to hate you.

4) it is a massive risk the closer you get to failure (which is the hole point of hypertrophy training)

this is when you need to understand your personal limits and know when to drop the bar, although ideally you should rerack if you know for certain you cannot complete the next rep rather than bailing out of the squat and crashing out. it's happened to me a few times and i feel like shit for it, so it comes down to knowing what your personal limit is.

Am I the only person here who doesn't have to worry about dying under a barbell because I use a power cage with a safety bar?

 

[The I Scream Man]

I got a question for the kool kids krew: what is the best/most effective preworkout?

“Fuck preworkout” is an acceptable answer, I just wanna try geeking out while puttin up plates

 

[Rimanah]

I got a question for the kool kids krew: what is the best/most effective preworkout?

“Fuck preworkout” is an acceptable answer, I just wanna try geeking out while puttin up plates

Depends on exactly what you’re looking for. The actual best is understanding what the individual ingredients do and what their most effective doses are for you, then buying them from a wholesaler like bulksupplements and making your own. Can even add more “esoteric” substances like DMAA if you want, not that hard to find them if you have even decent Google skills. Usually ends up cheaper too, but it takes a fair bit of time to learn what the stuff does and experiment with doses.

If you don’t want to LARP as a Witcher before each workout, I personally just like an energy drink or two (or five). I think gorillamind’s stuff is supposed to be hyper optimized but I haven’t tried it in years and didn’t feel that different when I did.

 

[dick brain]

death to the barbell squat

I fucking hate them but I do them anyway because I'd rather have suboptimal glutes/quads and rock solid stabilizers in the real world than a fat ass on instagram.

I got a question for the kool kids krew: what is the best/most effective preworkout?

“Fuck preworkout” is an acceptable answer, I just wanna try geeking out while puttin up plates

Glucose, water, electrolytes, creatine and a good night's sleep.

 

[Blue Flying Leaf]

What is purpose of taking creatine instead of regular protein ? Body breaks it down to make what it needs no ?

 

[dick brain]

What is purpose of taking creatine instead of regular protein ? Body breaks it down to make what it needs no ?

From what I remember, creatine essentially converts ADP to ATP in muscle cells which translates to more energy/less fatigue. The body doesn't break creatine down into its component amino acids before that; rather, without supplementing creatine your body has to work to make it out of protein, which is energy and protein that could be going to anabolism. Basically supplementing creatine is like... I don't know, buying a premade Magic deck instead of buying booster packs. Maybe. I don't know, I don't play Magic.

I may be wrong about any or all of that, I wrote a paper on it like fifteen years ago.

 

[Legalize Asbestos]

What is purpose of taking creatine instead of regular protein ? Body breaks it down to make what it needs no ?

Basically it's a step in metabolism that you can shortcut by having it already available in the body instead of your body manufacturing it as needed. Unlike a lot of other stuff you can pre-load it doesn't cause some obscure biological mechanism to go haywire from slight excess.

 

[grasshoppermustard]

Creatine also (allegedly) has some benefits for the brain.

 

[souschef]

what is the best/most effective preworkout?

self loathing

 

[CrunkLord420]

I got a question for the kool kids krew: what is the best/most effective preworkout?

“Fuck preworkout” is an acceptable answer, I just wanna try geeking out while puttin up plates

a few mg of mixed amphetamine salts, probably.

What is purpose of taking creatine instead of regular protein ? Body breaks it down to make what it needs no ?

Protein is food, EAAs, your body needs them. Your body will produce ~1g of creatine from the protein if you're not getting it from food. Your body can hold ~5g (depends on muscle mass) of creatine. You are unlikely to max your creatine stores just from eating food, maybe, I guess.

Perhaps overlooked bro-science: More creatine in muscles = more water in muscles = less injury prone muscles.

 

[SOLDIER OF WALES]

At the point in the cut where I'm on the verge of losing weight on my lifts. Fuck my stupid chud life.

 

[HowlingChasm]

As for the squat debate, I’m a minimalist lifter for the sake of time efficiency so I’ll always go for compounds as opposed to high volume isolations that make the workout twice as long. Like if I’m doing back/biceps and only have 20 minutes, I can be satisfied that the goal was met by simply doing weighted chins and killing two birds with one stone.

 

[24nagging]

At the point in the cut where I'm on the verge of losing weight on my lifts. Fuck my stupid chud life.

that's normal (and good) lol

rock solid stabilizers in the real world

why? Squats are not even the best way to train the "stabilizers", and glutes (and all muscle to different degrees for that matter) stabilize the pelvis and trunk. If you wanna trian abs, do crunches; if spinal erectors, back extensions; but squats is (supposed) to be for quads and glutes, not abs and erectos. The squat is a terrible ab exercise
Honestly just do leg presses and rows and you'll be just as strong "in the real world" and you'll probably like leg day a lot more. Maybe add an ab movement if you want to

 

[dick brain]

why?

Because I don't live in the gym. When I pick shit up in real life I don't typically have access to a smith machine or a leg press or an esoteric system of cables and pullies to do it, I typically perform a movement most similar to a squat or a deadlift. I could make a spreadsheet of every muscle involved in those movements and attempt to train them optimally in isolation, or I can guarantee that I train all of the muscles involved in those movements by just doing them. I don't want to have any uncertainty when I'm six miles into the mountains packing my campsite out.

 

[DSP's Tax Lawyer]

Oh boy, only a few more days before you see the worst form and new workouts from newbies. Remember, don't judge or correct. No free advice

 

[Pentex]

death to the barbell squat

Back squats are for dumb kids and juice monkeys.

Zercher squats are the true and only king.