The Holocaust Thread - The Great Debate Between Affirmers, Revisionists and Deniers

[mgc]

Cool, no one said this though. Quit straw manning.

You literally said that dopey here "present[ed] evidence that conflicts with the official narrative." So you were saying this one fraud is evidence that conflicts with the Holocaust, which is absurd.

 

[m1ddl3m4rch]

The existence of frauds who falsely pretend they suffered in event x do not prove event x did not happen. If you apply this logic consistently, then instances of stolen valor would disprove the Iraq War, the Vietnam War, World War II, etc happened.

It is, as I said, genuinely impressive how stupid you are.

You'd never talk to Muslims this way. You won't even talk about them at all. We all know what would happen if you started treating them with even five percent of the disrespect you treat white people. Coward. Turncoat. The nations which fought the war don't need lecturing about Nazi Germany, retard. You're a race-grifting parasite setting up your career in the laptop class.

 

[Chugger]

No one milks the Iraq War

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VSJuyIbumqQ

people also milk 9/11 https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UYmv7kWo2zI

>present evidence that conflicts with the official narrative

what evidence conflicts lol?

 

[Bonesjones]

Mrolonzo says that the Jews actually “scattered to the winds” so even he disagrees that the Jews were sent mostly to the East. Secondly, we have records of many Soviet massacres and deportations of much smaller scales. You can look up Chechen deportations in Soviet Union. Why not Jewish deportations or massacres?

The Soviet Union made up the holocaust and the proof for the Holocaust, why would they also tell how they faked the whole thing?

I know Jews escaped from Nazi Germany, I am specifically referring to Jews who were supposedly “evacuated” to the east that I cannot find.

You all keep insisting that the Germans set up some towns or cities that they deported these people to. Instead of putting them on trains going to Soviet territory and forgetting about them after they left. There would be little trace of them since they would mix in with all the other war refugees that existed at the time.

incriminate? why?

Yes why would the Soviets invent the holocaust wholesale and then also expose they invented it. It makes total sense that they would do that because you are all fucking retarded.

The existence of frauds who falsely pretend they suffered in event x do not prove event x did not happen. If you apply this logic consistently, then instances of stolen valor would disprove the Iraq War, the Vietnam War, World War II, etc happened.

It is, as I said, genuinely impressive how stupid you are.

This isn't someone saying they falsely served in the military before being caught. This is someone who existed in the public eye with zero scrutiny for many many years. Weird how no one ever does zero due diligence when it comes to jews and the Holocaust.

 

[Kermit Jizz]

You literally said that dopey here "present[ed] evidence that conflicts with the official narrative." So you were saying this one fraud is evidence that conflicts with the Holocaust, which is absurd.

Holy shit and you have the balls to talk down other people's intelligence.

So you're saying that alleged historical accounts turning out to be fraudulent does not change anything, not even just a little? That's retarded. You're retarded.

what evidence conflicts lol?

The twisting and turning you lot do to not concede a nanometer is astounding. An alleged eye witness turned out to be a lying grifter. If this was any other topic you'd easily concede that it's a mark against their argument, if for no other reason than they have one less eye witness.

 

[Chugger]

An alleged eye witness turned out to be a lying grifter. If this was any other topic you'd easily concede that it's a mark against their argument,

no I wouldn't lol. it's not evidence of anything other than that people will lie for profit or clout, even if that means lying about a horrible historical event, like the holocaust or 9/11

You all keep insisting that the Germans set up some towns or cities that they deported these people to. Instead of putting them on trains going to Soviet territory and forgetting about them after they left.

this is dumb because even assuming the Germans did this (a complete 180 from their previous policy of sequestering all Jews) you still have the problem of millions of witnesses who have not spoken about any of this. This would include millions of Jews and Russians/Ukranians, not to mention the 15 million axis forces serving there, most of whom returned to the west

the only way the Soviets could silence these witnesses was by nuking their own country and western europe, or by employing some hitherto unknown (perhaps alien) memory wipe technology

 

[Bonesjones]

no I wouldn't lol. it's not evidence of anything other than that people will lie for profit or clout, even if that means lying about a horrible historical event, like the holocaust or 9/11

So you admit people lie about the holocaust for profit?

this is dumb because even assuming the Germans did this (a complete 180 from their previous policy of sequestering all Jews) you still have the problem of millions of witnesses who have not spoken about any of this. This would include millions of Jews and Russians/Ukranians, not to mention the 15 million axis forces serving there, most of whom returned to the west

the only way the Soviets could silence these witnesses was by nuking their own country and western europe, or by employing some hitherto unknown (perhaps alien) technology

The Germans had a policy of expulsion, which is what they did. They had plans for internment at Madagascar except the whole war thing got in the way. The fact they try to twist the Wannsee conference to mean murder instead of its clearly stated motivation of expulsion is further proof of this.

 

[Kermit Jizz]

no I wouldn't lol. it's not evidence of anything other than that people will lie for profit or clout, even if that means lying about a horrible historical event, like the holocaust or 9/11

Sure on it's own it doesn't prove a lot, but it's still worth considering. If one person is found to be a liar it's an anomaly, if a lot of people are lying it's evidence something is wrong. There's no reason for anyone to sperg out over the mere posting of this occurrence.

 

[mgc]

Sure on it's own it doesn't prove a lot, but it's still worth considering. If one person is found to be a liar it's an anomaly, if a lot of people are lying it's evidence something is wrong. There's no reason for anyone to sperg out over the mere posting of this occurrence.

There are a lot of people who have lied about serving in the military, including in the Iraq or Afghanistan War, for clout. There are entire YouTube compilations of these people being doxxed. See, e.g., https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iXtEm8S-EgI

Do the existence of these people make you skeptical that the Iraq or Afghanistan War "really happened" or that US soldiers actually saw combat in those wars?

 

[Chugger]

So you admit people lie about the holocaust for profit?

duh

The Germans had a policy of expulsion, which is what they did. They had plans for internment at Madagascar except the whole war thing got in the way. The fact they try to twist the Wannsee conference to mean murder instead of its clearly stated motivation of expulsion is further proof of this.

Wannsee is very vague, speaking of "an evacuation to the East" which clearly does not preclude death camps https://www.yadvashem.org/docs/wannsee-conference-protocol.html

also discussion of some nebulous "preparatory work for the final solution" that should be carried out with causing alarm among the local population

in any case, you ignored my above point about the apparent 'silenced witnesses'

 

[Linako 2.0]

You literally said that dopey here "present[ed] evidence that conflicts with the official narrative." So you were saying this one fraud is evidence that conflicts with the Holocaust, which is absurd.

It is, as I said, genuinely impressive how stupid you are.

Insulting people here won't gain you any favours, let alone people willing to listen to your side.

 

[Aves]

The Soviet Union made up the holocaust and the proof for the Holocaust, why would they also tell how they faked the whole thing?

It’s not about “telling” anyone. It’s about historians and researchers finding out the information. The Chechen deportations and famines in the Soviet Union were silenced, yet we know a lot about how the Soviets had starved people and deported them. Why is this not true for the Jews, a group mrolonzo says is “nearly impossible to silence”?

You all keep insisting that the Germans set up some towns or cities that they deported these people to. Instead of putting them on trains going to Soviet territory and forgetting about them after they left. There would be little trace of them since they would mix in with all the other war refugees that existed at the time.

Your problem is that these other war refugees do tell their story. Here are some polish refugees leaving to Iran. Here are more polish refugees deported by the Soviets to Siberia. Here are Soviet citizens themselves being sent back (not forcibly) to the east.

It took me literally 3 minutes to find these sources. Imagine what a thousand holocaust historians (both affirmers and deniers) could find for these supposed Jews evacuated east. Yet we have nothing.

 

[JohnDoe]

an evacuation to the East" which clearly does not preclude death camps

"Everyone remain calm, but please pay attention. There is an active fire alarm, so please evacuate through the East doors."
"EvAcUaTe?!? I don't want to go to a death camp!"

 

[Chugger]

"Everyone remain calm, but please pay attention. There is an active fire alarm, so please evacuate through the East doors."
"EvAcUaTe?!? I don't want to go to a death camp!"

you should send your stand up comedy routine to Mattogno, the most prestigious and well studied of all holocaust deniers, and see what he thinks of it

 

[mgc]

The Wannsee Protocols are far from the most explicit Holocaust-related document. But they do prove German genocidal intent towards the Jews, insofar as they show that the Germans intended to enslave and work to death able-bodied Jews.

Attached is a relevant page of the Protocols, the last paragraph of which I have transcribed and translated.

Unter entsprechender Leitung sollen nun im Zuge der Endlösung die Juden in geeigneter Weise im Osten zum Arbeitseinsatz kommen. In großen Arbeitskolonnen, unter Trennung der Geschlechter, werden die arbeitsfähigen Juden straßenbauend in diese Gebiete geführt, wobei zweifellos ein Großteil durch natürliche Verminderung ausfallen wird.

In the course of the final solution, the Jews are to be put to work in the East in an appropriate fashion under appropriate leadership. In large work gangs, separated by sex, the Jews fit for work will be taken to these areas to build roads, through which the bulk will doubless be lost due to natural dimunition.

 

[Stan]

The twisting and turning you lot do to not concede a nanometer is astounding. An alleged eye witness turned out to be a lying grifter. If this was any other topic you'd easily concede that it's a mark against their argument, if for no other reason than they have one less eye witness.

Unfortunately, C. Mattogno and other denialist authors can and will use single instances of stolen valor to suggest the whole enchilada is a sham, and that *every* witness can be suspected of lying because of the behavior of one. I think you lot would call that "guilt by association" when you find that behavior coming from the left,, but when it's expedient, you'll do it too, to Holocaust victims, in order to keep a fantasy alive.

But if I was talking to reasonable people I wouldn't be having this discussion on Kiwi Farms now would I...?

 

[JohnDoe]

*every* witness can be suspected of lying

Are all humans capable of deception or mistake? Or are certain humans and their assertions above skepticism or examination? Is it a factor of the person, or the narrative they espouse that determines if they are immune to question?

 

[Kermit Jizz]

Unfortunately, C. Mattogno and other denialist authors can and will use single instances of stolen valor to suggest the whole enchilada is a sham, and that *every* witness can be suspected of lying because of the behavior of one.

I don't know or care who that is and he has nothing to do with me. Why are you pinning what other people do to me?

I think you lot would call that "guilt by association" when you find that behavior coming from the left,, but when it's expedient, you'll do it too, to Holocaust victims, in order to keep a fantasy alive.

Holy shit you are so fucking neurotic. What "lot" am I part of? Do you even know my beliefs, because I didn't bring them up. I haven't even said anything outside of this specific fraudster. You're reaching so fucking hard you are trying to blame me for things I haven't done just because I'm not 100% on your side.

But if I was talking to reasonable people I wouldn't be having this discussion on Kiwi Farms now would I...?

If you were reasonable you wouldn't be so assmad because someone posted a tweet that was relevant to the discussion, without even adding commentary.

I stopped responding because this discussion was getting retarded and cyclical. If you're going to resort to gay shit like guilt by association just don't respond to me. I'm not interested in watching you beat up a straw man.

 

[Stan]

I don't know or care who that is and he has nothing to do with me. Why are you pinning what other people do to me?

He's a denier author whose name frequently comes up because he's more incrementalist/"respectable". The gist of his work is to poke holes in what *did* happen during the Holocaust to cast doubt that the Holocaust ever happened. The journals and publishing houses he writes for are dressed up like academic imprints but they are not.

Holy shit you are so fucking neurotic. What "lot" am I part of? Do you even know my beliefs, because I didn't bring them up. I haven't even said anything outside of this specific fraudster. You're reaching so fucking hard you are trying to blame me for things I haven't done just because I'm not 100% on your side.

Hmm I wonder how the non-lying Jews in Holocaust would feel when you bring up 1 lying Jew to suggest the whole thing's a sham. Maybe a bit like you do now?

If you were reasonable you wouldn't be so assmad because someone posted a tweet that was relevant to the discussion, without even adding commentary.

Not mad but trying to level with you why affirmationists would not want to concede things like Jews lying about camp experiences; deniers use it to imply the entire Holocaust was a sham instead of just 1 person being a liar.

I stopped responding because this discussion was getting retarded and cyclical. If you're going to resort to gay shit like guilt by association just don't respond to me. I'm not interested in watching you beat up a straw man.

lmao k

This content may grind your gears.
Are all humans capable of deception or mistake? Or are certain humans and their assertions above skepticism or examination? Is it a factor of the person, or the narrative they espouse that determines if they are immune to question?

To err and decieve is human; but it's really fucking hard to get tens of thousands of people who don't even know one another conspire to lie about one specific event and have all their stories more-or-less corroborate each other. Watergate was a conspiracy with like a dozen people involved and the whole thing came unglued when Nixon was still in office and had executive privilege helping him.

It's hard enough to keep up a conspiracy among even a few people, so imagine trying to do it with every camp survivor. Who would have pulled them all aside and told them what to say? Where would that have happened, given that some camp survivors were in American zones and others in Soviet ones? What incentive would the survivors themselves have to be given to go along with the plot? How would all of them been stopped from coming clean about the coinspiracy for decades? What's the benefit of orchestrating such a plot when the libel victims (Nazis) are already defeated?

Are you able to answer those questions without sounding like a tinfoil hat imbecile? I'm skeptical.

 

[Bonesjones]

The journals and publishing houses he writes for are dressed up like academic imprints but they are not.

Actual academic imprints are heavily politicized and often promote outright lies for money. So caring about respectability when you post on kiwi farms is hypocritical and shows your own lack of character.

Hmm I wonder how the non-lying Jews in Holocaust would feel when you bring up 1 lying Jew to suggest the whole thing's a sham. Maybe a bit like you do now?

Who cares? Maybe they should have policed the liars instead of using them for personal gain. Since the holocaust narrative exists for power and money.

Not mad but trying to level with you why affirmationists would not want to concede things like "stolen valor"; deniers use it to imply the entire Holocaust was a sham.

If you promote obvious lies to push your narrative you can't be mad that people see you for what you are doing.

To err and decieve is human; but it's really fucking hard to get tens of thousands of people who don't even know one another conspire to lie about one specific event and have all their stories more-or-less corroborate each other. Watergate was a conspiracy with like a dozen people involved and the whole thing came unglued when Nixon was still in office and had executive privilege helping him.

Hey look more inability to stop protecting your own inability to tell the truth on other people, how Jewish of you. We live in a time when outright lies and fabrications have been pushed on the world by a handful of people. Covid, the summer of love, Jan 6th. All obvious fabrications done in full view and significant portions of the world population buy into it. So yes coordinated media campaigns do work. Which is all the holocaust consists of.

It's hard enough to keep up a conspiracy among even a few people, so imagine trying to do it with every camp survivor. Who would have pulled them all aside and told them what to say?

Well jews are known for their extreme ingroup preference and behind the scenes coordination. So they'd just trust other jews to tell the truth and when they get paid for their cooperation using holocaust funds, they have no reason to expose anything.

What incentive would the survivors themselves have to be given to go along with the plot?

Billions of dollars in cash? A belief of revenge?

How would all of them been stopped from coming clean about the coinspiracy for decades? What's the benefit of orchestrating such a plot when the libel victims (Nazis) are already defeated?

You don't have to stop everyone from coming forward just minimize them. Hundreds of millions to billions of dollars?

Are you able to answer those questions without sounding like a tinfoil hat imbecile? I'm skeptical.

You don't believe anything anyone says so who cares?