The Final Fantasy Thread

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LoverofPi said:
Also WOTL content as DLC. Bet on it.
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Would be funny if that were to happen. Sad, but funny.

But really, I doubt WOTL will ever be added besides Steam mods. Reading the interview, it clearly shows how Matsuno and the rest of the team REALLY hates what the PSP remaster brought besides the updated English script. Maybe they felt offended for another dev team daring to add extra goodies in their "complete package".

Honka Honka Burning Love said:
How much are you willing to spend to get another chance to beat the shit out of that little faggot Algus?
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If you are fighting Algus again but not using:
Throw Stone
Throw Stone
Throw Stone

Are you really playing the game?
 
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Reading the ffx conversation really makes me wish that ff14 was just set in a pre existing singular final fantasy setting rather than the weird bastard mix of all the games that it is. Sad that some of the games have so much deep worldbuilding lore that they could’ve expanded on. Then again given how shitty any long running anime gets maybe the Japanese simply aren’t good at extrapolating deeper plot points past what they can fit into one game
 
One Winged Pear Farmer said:
Then again given how shitty any long running anime gets maybe the Japanese simply aren’t good at extrapolating deeper plot points past what they can fit into one game
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I think it's more that Japanese writers usually write the setting to fit the plot rather than the other way around. A lot of the time the worlds they create are very vaguely defined outside whatever places or aspects of it are directly necessary for the plot to happen. That can make it difficult to write sequels or spin-offs because the original plot is done and complete, the cool aspects of the setting made to facilitate that plot are already fully explored, and the setting doesn't really have anything outside the scope of that plot that feels like easy fuel for a new story; it's why so often when Japanese companies try to make sequels to old finished stories they end up just repeating the same story again but with different characters.
 
Retarded Weeb said:
The gameplay does eventually get stale when going for 100% completion because of how every character becomes the exact same except for Overdrives once you've maxed everyone out, and how superbosses end up boiling down to a rather specific set of strategies at that point, but that doesn't mean the main story or even much of the optional content until you get really far into the weeds aren't still fun and mostly pretty balanced for much of it.
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Nemesis is pretty fun since it really makes you think about turn order and plan out your moves, so it took maximum advantage of the combat system. It's a shame that it's an optional superboss locked behind 100+ hrs of grinding.

e: oh whoops I meant Penance. Nemesis is kinda boring.
 
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One Winged Pear Farmer said:
Reading the ffx conversation really makes me wish that ff14 was just set in a pre existing singular final fantasy setting rather than the weird bastard mix of all the games that it is. Sad that some of the games have so much deep worldbuilding lore that they could’ve expanded on. Then again given how shitty any long running anime gets maybe the Japanese simply aren’t good at extrapolating deeper plot points past what they can fit into one game
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The thing is it actually is pre-existing. It's set in the world of ff12 and FF tactics. Now they set it in an alt version so it doesn't contradict the lore but it fits as a distant future. Fran shows up in one of the massive boza raids after shadowbringers.

Everything else is just alt universe cross contamination portal shenanigans.
 
Michael Wade said:
The thing is it actually is pre-existing. It's set in the world of ff12 and FF tactics. Now they set it in an alt version so it doesn't contradict the lore but it fits as a distant future. Fran shows up in one of the massive boza raids after shadowbringers.
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Ivallice? Wtf. That can't be.
Michael Wade said:
Everything else is just alt universe cross contamination portal shenanigans.
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Basically Square forced the inclusion ala-FF World but worse.
 
One Winged Pear Farmer said:
Even without acknowledging how crap the multiverse trope is that would still be basing it on one of the weakest entries. Seemed interesting in tactics but just bland in 12
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I blame Square meddling around with FF12 for why FF12's story and setting are just meh.

Matsuno likes to set up three conflicts in his games. You've got something highly personal (Denam/Catiua, Ramza/Delita) and then a regional conflict and then some kind of deeper secret conflict in the background (ghost king, Zenobia, Lucavi,, etc.) Tactics Ogre and FFT both follow this and it works out well.

Square decides to make Vaan the main character and shit starts falling apart because he has no ties to these conflicts except for his dead brother that you've almost certainly forgotten about by the time his ghost shows up. FF12's plot ends up feeling odd and disjointed because there's very little tying all the conflicts together.
 
FF12 had a lot of neat political drama but the stakes were rather low when you get into It. There's no world ending super weapon at the end or one winged angel stuff. It's kinda refreshing in how low key it is.
 
Froggy Fresh Sextape said:
I blame Square meddling around with FF12 for why FF12's story and setting are just meh.

Matsuno likes to set up three conflicts in his games. You've got something highly personal (Denam/Catiua, Ramza/Delita) and then a regional conflict and then some kind of deeper secret conflict in the background (ghost king, Zenobia, Lucavi,, etc.) Tactics Ogre and FFT both follow this and it works out well.

Square decides to make Vaan the main character and shit starts falling apart because he has no ties to these conflicts except for his dead brother that you've almost certainly forgotten about by the time his ghost shows up. FF12's plot ends up feeling odd and disjointed because there's very little tying all the conflicts together.
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It's been a long time since I looked into it, but IIRC the original idea was for Basch to be the protagonist, and it would've gone more in depth into the relationship between him and Gabranth (which would line up with the first "personal conflict" you mentioned) and Basch's own personal motivations to fight Archadia and protect Ashe/Dalmasca. But Square came in and said that the game:
1. needed a younger protagonist, since apparently Basch being a 36-year-old grown man wouldn't sell well, and
2. needed a less-knowledgeable protagonist that the player can slowly learn about the world alongside.

Which is a shame tbh, since the Basch-Gabranth stuff was always my favorite part, and it definitely felt like there was supposed to be more development there that got removed.
 
People are being too pissy about the FFT remaster not including fanfiction classes that weren't in the original game. They weren't in the PS1 original, they weren't on the downloadable port for PS3; they only existed on the far-less-accessible port for PSP, which then became slightly more accessible by eventually getting clunkily ported to mobile phones. I understand being a little bummed about taking non-original content for granted and then not seeing it included, but the visceral reaction I am seeing on Twitter and GameFAQs seems extreme. I think people have learned some misleading "Non-Buynary" lessons from Gamergate 2 (and tangental battlefields such as the review bombing of Helldivers 2), and now more people feel empowered to boycott if they feel the product is only 95% great.

And boycotting is well within their rights to do, but it just feels like a completely silly hill to die on. The outrage feels manufactured, but that's probably because it's not my nostalgia being fucked with.
 
The Morning Visitor said:
I understand being a little bummed about taking non-original content for granted and then not seeing it included, but the visceral reaction I am seeing on Twitter and GameFAQs seems extreme
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WotL was more bad than good since it locked some stuff (the Genji equipment most notably) behind multiplayer. The additional Beowulf content was okay. The truth is that people wanted more effort put into a product that Square will charge $59.99 for (if not more.) Shouldn't be that hard to put the WotL additions in and then let you toggle them on or off when starting a new game.

Charging full price for FFT with AI-upscaled sprites, voice acting, turbo mode, easy mode and additional story hints on the world map is just not really that appealing for people who have beaten the game 20 times, but then we're not the target audience here.
 
The Morning Visitor said:
People are being too pissy about the FFT remaster not including fanfiction classes that weren't in the original game. They weren't in the PS1 original, they weren't on the downloadable port for PS3; they only existed on the far-less-accessible port for PSP, which then became slightly more accessible by eventually getting clunkily ported to mobile phones. I understand being a little bummed about taking non-original content for granted and then not seeing it included, but the visceral reaction I am seeing on Twitter and GameFAQs seems extreme. I think people have learned some misleading "Non-Buynary" lessons from Gamergate 2 (and tangental battlefields such as the review bombing of Helldivers 2), and now more people feel empowered to boycott if they feel the product is only 95% great.

And boycotting is well within their rights to do, but it just feels like a completely silly hill to die on. The outrage feels manufactured, but that's probably because it's not my nostalgia being fucked with.
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I think gamers just got fed up with sequels/remakes that don't add a whole lot to the experience but they still charge the same price for it AND take things that were well beloved. I got so mad when I heard that WoTL crap was removed, you call it fanfiction, but you can't deny how they were fanfavorite additions, and the excuse of "this is not what the original dev team thought" just come out as narcisstic, ya feel me?

I say this while giving the impression that I'm still pissy about it, but really, I kinda just... accepted it. Day 1 Denuvo, Worthless Deluxe Edition, no toggle for the 1998 US English Translation in the Classic Version... just sucks man.

Not to say that the announced remaster additions are great, 50 party limit and voice acting are amazing, but one is a QoL change and the other isn't as impactful if the characters sprites will act the same just how they were silent. I really hope the the other new content they seem to tease will be worth, because I'm only buying it if it's somehow better than the WoTL additions.

Froggy Fresh Sextape said:
WotL was more bad than good since it locked some stuff (the Genji equipment most notably) behind multiplayer.
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You couldn't get the Genji set in the JPN version of the original anyways, and it won't even surprise me if they keep that in the remake (even if you're playing the classic version). Better yet, I bet you my imaginary quarter that they will release a DLC like "Deep Dungeon 2" for 20 bucks just to make the Genji armor a hidden treasure there.
 
The Morning Visitor said:
People are being too pissy about the FFT remaster not including fanfiction classes that weren't in the original game. They weren't in the PS1 original, they weren't on the downloadable port for PS3; they only existed on the far-less-accessible port for PSP, which then became slightly more accessible by eventually getting clunkily ported to mobile phones. I understand being a little bummed about taking non-original content for granted and then not seeing it included, but the visceral reaction I am seeing on Twitter and GameFAQs seems extreme. I think people have learned some misleading "Non-Buynary" lessons from Gamergate 2 (and tangental battlefields such as the review bombing of Helldivers 2), and now more people feel empowered to boycott if they feel the product is only 95% great.

And boycotting is well within their rights to do, but it just feels like a completely silly hill to die on. The outrage feels manufactured, but that's probably because it's not my nostalgia being fucked with.
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I'm waiting to see what happens, but personally I don't really see a reason to remove extra content and it does sour me on it. Especially as far as non-story changes. Dropping any story and side stuff they feel doesn't fit I can understand. Balthier and Luso are whatever. Although Cloud already exists so I mean.. are promo characters really that out of place? Balthier is at least Ivalice related.

Something like removing Dark Knight is silly since it does more or less exist in the original. Yes, it was Gaffgarion only outside of Cids moveset, yet all it would truly require is sprites and a couple moves. It would already have the stats and growths for it. Even if you had to give it unique ones you can still just copy WotLs. Hell it would be cool if they did that with a few other NPC jobs or whatever as consolation instead of just removing stuff. It's PVE with the WotL cuts so you don't have to care about balance as much and people can just.. not use them if they prefer that. There's how many special NPC classes that exist for one fight in the entire game as is despite having their stat and growth %s calculated.
Let people play around with a few of them or weaker/altered versions. Unless you grind hard early on you probably aren't going to have access until a good halfway through the game anyway if you make the requirements something like WotL did for Dark Knight.

Yeah the original is a great game, but if you can give people some other extras and such why not? Gives an incentive to people not playing emulated/modded versions to pop in and goof around for some replays, and you still can do whatever to try and draw in some newbies. Otherwise though I already own the first two versions. Realistically I'm just throwing away money if I do buy this version seeing as I have the og disc and psp umd. (Not accounting the hacked vita that can play both anyway. Disregarding that emulating is easy.) But I would probably still give them money to support something I like if it was going to offer something interesting and different as far as ways to play it without needing mods.

Admittedly we don't know exactly what's planned, but as of currently there isn't much draw having played the other two numerous times over the years.
 
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