Tabletop Roleplaying Games (D&D, Pathfinder, CoC, ETC.)

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The lesson here is to never play RPGs with strangers online and never try to play anything except 5e.
Why would that be the takeaway? It successfully filtered out a group of retards, congrats.
The big city described in detail, Cahokia, is located where the largest city of the Mound Builders culture once existed.
I don't get the obsession with Cahokia, anyone that knows anything about it, knows that it collapsed long before Europeans arrived in the New World of their own causes.
There are very little interesting plot hooks or conflicts to explore. The game designer stated that the lack of detail was by design. He wanted to have gaming groups create their own stories and have Native players develop how their cultures would look like in this setting. Coyote & Crow made such a dull indigenous-futurist setting that one of the only unique things that we found was the inclusion of tribes of sentient wooly mammoths.
Hence why Shadowrun reigns, whole damn countries with the governments detailed, politicians and whatnot.
 
Hence why Shadowrun reigns, whole damn countries with the governments detailed, politicians and whatnot.
One of the fun and understated things in Shadowrun's NAN (Native American Nations) when you wonder how you can end up with a resurgence of the tribes is that there's likely huge numbers of LARPer types with just a drop of ancestry or none at all making up their numbers. Every Caucasian with a tan declaring their name to now be "John Smoking Bear" and driving their RV over to the reservation. It's really quite hilarious to imagine it. Though it's not that hard to justify the level of success their leaders had when they are (nearly) the only people in the world with magic at that point. It's one thing for the US political elites to send others to their deaths in a war and scurry to their bomb shelters. Quite another to find a malevolent spirit waiting for you in that bomb shelter that none of your bodyguards or doors can stop. Or to play hardball with an enemy that you literally cannot find. Like, at all.

One of the great things about pre-5th edition Shadowrun was that for the most part, no matter how nuts the idea, they actually did a pretty good job of making it plausible.
 
Every Caucasian with a tan declaring their name to now be "John Smoking Bear" and driving their RV over to the reservation. It's really quite hilarious to imagine it.
It's even mentioned in the OG novels:
The slender woman at Jason’s side nodded in agreement. She wore gray leathers decorated with short fringe and panels of exquisite beadwork. The leathers were real, unlike her Amerindian features and skin color. Those were the result of cosmetic surgery and melanin chemoadjustment. Once, when very, very wasted, she had shown Sam the minute scars, claiming they were the marks of a ritual Sun Dance. Sam knew the signs for what they were, having once prepped information for a brief on radical cosmetic surgeries back when he’d been a researcher for the corp.
This character isn't even doing it to live in the NAN either, although she is in an Amerind only street gang in Seattle.

It's not just indian larpers either:

"Te Purewa's not his real name, is it?" I guessed. Scott gave a bark of laughter. "You got that," he agreed. "Mark Harrop, that's his real name, can you beat that? Mark fragging Harrop. Couple years back he decided he had Maori blood in his veins—like, a couple drops, maybe—and picked the name out of some book."
 
It's even mentioned in the OG novels:

This character isn't even doing it to live in the NAN either, although she is in an Amerind only street gang in Seattle.

It's not just indian larpers either:
I'd forgotten that. Was that first example from the original novel trilogy? It sounds familiar. From memory, the book order was "Never Deal with a Dragon", "Choose Your Enemies Carefully" and... blast. What was the third one called? They were good novels and a good intro to the setting and I recall being annoyed by the goofy line art inserts that would have been way more appropriate to a younger person's novel. Gah, they were good books at the time. The creepy doppleganger thing really stayed with me.
 
What was the third one called?
Find Your Own Truth (that's the name of the novel, not a passive aggressive way to tell you to go google it :p ) Second quote is from House of the Sun, the second of the Dirk Montgomery novels, which were both awesome as well.

They were good novels and a good intro to the setting
I originally found SR through a ROM of the Megadrive game, but it was the novels that really got me into it. I spent years scouring ebay trying to collect the full set of the FASA. Eventually I gave in and got electronic versions instead, and then during coof i came across someone selling an absolute shitton of SR stuff that included all of the novels, so now they're on a shelf in my new gaming room.
 
Find Your Own Truth (that's the name of the novel, not a passive aggressive way to tell you to go google it :p ) Second quote is from House of the Sun, the second of the Dirk Montgomery novels, which were both awesome as well.
Ah, yes: "Find Your Own Truth". I remember it being the odd one out because the other two titles are from the three rules of Shadowrunning way back in 1st edition era:
  1. Conserve Ammo
  2. Choose your enemies carefully.
  3. Never, ever, cut a deal with a dragon.
But I agree that "Conserve Ammo" wouldn't make a good title for a novel. Sometimes you have to know when not to force something.

I remember House of the Sun, but not as well.


Alas, I sold my copies of the books long, long ago. Shame - would be nice to have them now. I didn't have or read all of them. I recall for example there was one about a were-tiger which I don't think I read. I may be getting them confused though - long time ago. I remember them being good books though. And the setting was lightning in a bottle.
 
One of the fun and understated things in Shadowrun's NAN (Native American Nations) when you wonder how you can end up with a resurgence of the tribes is that there's likely huge numbers of LARPer types with just a drop of ancestry or none at all making up their numbers. Every Caucasian with a tan declaring their name to now be "John Smoking Bear" and driving their RV over to the reservation.
This character isn't even doing it to live in the NAN either, although she is in an Amerind only street gang in Seattle.
Yeah, having read through the 1st and 2nd edition region source books lately, they are very explicit that outside of the really racialist nations like Ute and Tsimishan (who don't like other natives anyway), they ahem "manufactured" some natives, or absorbed those living in the remaining UCAS. The Salish Shidhe Council being the most prominent as two of their big 5 tribes, Sinsearach and Cascade Ork, are made up of metas that hold to the culture and not natives necessarily. I do appreciate that they bothered to make all the nations very distinct in government and outlook, the two NAN sourcebooks are great for that.
 
Isn't rule 4 geek the mage first?
It was. But that brings up one of the things I liked especially about the game system. It had some of the finest game balancing I've ever seen before or since, all the way up to and including 4th edition which was the pinnacle in my opinion.

Here's the thing of it - D&D 4e had superb balancing (at the start) but it did it by grinding everything down to working more or less the same way with different flavour. Magic and tech in Shadowrun did play substantially differently but each had its positives and negatives nicely set against each other. Tech, on the whole, was very reliable steady output. Magic could be more powerful but had comparative risk. It had spells but they weren't Vancian magic where you used them up. Instead you decided how hard you wanted to cast them with an eternal temptation to get carried away, and could injure yourself in doing so. The element that I think made Shadowrun balancing possible is a subtle one but I think it was critical. In the Shadowrun system, offence nearly always outpaced defence. Yes, you could sustain some Armour spell or layer yourself up with dermal plating and hard armour but nuyen for nuyen or karma point for karma point, what you mostly found was you could hit harder than you could take. And that was true for both tech and magic. And because you had that underlying truism, it mitigated any imbalances between Magic and Tech because Magic v. Tech was now a less significant axis than Offence v. Defence. You could argue over whether a Manaball or a Frag Grenade were best but in both cases, the key was to get the drop on the enemy and hit them with it first.

I'd often see people claim that magic was over-powered and every time it turned out that the GM was ignoring some rule or consequence. Or that the party was just enabling it like everybody pooling their nuyen to bind some high-force spirit. I mean - don't complain that the mage player is better than your samurai character when you're willingly giving half your earnings from the run to the mage player to enable him to be so!

I found this sort of thinking a problem with many groups where the players veered younger, including non-Shadowrun crime campaigns I ran. Player: "We don't have any money!". Me: "The job paid 10,000 and you spent 8,000 on gear and bribes and other things to complete it."

They just can't get their head around resource management. In my last campaign I actually had the team come out in debt from completing the mission because they spent more during the mission than it actually paid.
 
4th edition which was the pinnacle in my opinion.
I disagree, I think limits are actually good and prevent insane success bloat, but it is more of a personal preference of mine, since getting infinite dice on anything remains very possible regardless of edition.
 
The peoples of the Americas survived, tapping into a purple substance that gave them super abilities which also led to improved technological development
So it literately is just a we have Wakanda at home Marvel rip of, I did not expect the "inspiration" to be this blatant and that bit about leaving things vague so players could fill in their own blank what a lazy cop-out.

"The peoples of the Americas lacked the ability to develop technology" is not what I expected the woke take to be
This is like the least surprising thing, remember these are the same people that believe the giant green skinned monsters roaming the country side raping, murdering, and pillaging are a reasonable representation of black people.
 
I'd often see people claim that magic was over-powered and every time it turned out that the GM was ignoring some rule or consequence. Or that the party was just enabling it like everybody pooling their nuyen to bind some high-force spirit. I mean - don't complain that the mage player is better than your samurai character when you're willingly giving half your earnings from the run to the mage player to enable him to be so!
A lot of it can also just be poor speccing. I had a 4e/20th game where the Force 8 water spirit our Shaman lucked out on summoning simply couldn't do jack shit in a combat because the two combat characters moved faster and hit just as hard.

Granted, we were both pretty heavily min-maxed since I had like 1.8 essence left at chargen plus a gyrostabilized Ingram White Knight so I pretty much ignored all but the worst penalties to my shots and the other guy was a Phys Adept with a maxed out Gremlins flaw, and the GM had no experience whatsoever to the point they had been completely unaware of the Japanese takeover of San Fran, but you know... I think I did okay. Especially since nobody expects an elf to be chucking 7 dice at a Damage Resistance Test on top of a lined coat and a form-fitting full body suit. Had a grenade go off three feet ahead of him with no cover in the way and near as we could determine all it did was make his coat billow awesomely.

My biggest complaint about magic in SR is that its effectively uncapped in power thanks to Initiation, whereas people who use ware run into hard limits fast thanks to Essence.
 
My biggest complaint about magic in SR is that its effectively uncapped in power thanks to Initiation, whereas people who use ware run into hard limits fast thanks to Essence.
Well the trade-off is that magic characters have spend weeks then months initiating, which means they need more time, which means more money, and they are absolute Karma hogs, and unless your GM allows you to trade money for karma, you are drek out of luck in that regard, do more runs retard. I think that the real terrifying potential is on non-combat applications, especially because I am playing an illusionist right now, take the right mentor spirits and a specialization to start and you are throwing out tons of dice on game start with far greater utility than your common combat street mage, especially if you invest in a rating 6 Health spell sustain foci to always have +6 reaction and +3d6 initiative dice, and then maintain a force 6 improved invisibility spell on yourself with the Illusionist quality.
 
This might not be the forum to ask, but I have a few things to ask.

1. Anyone know a good simplified character creation system for Savage Worlds?
Character creation is always the weakness of Savage Worlds. It's point buy, but people struggle to understand it, or spend a couple hours min-maxing their build. This doesn't really work for a 3 hour one shot. I tried having a standard array ready, with the players assigning it as they see fit, but it didn't work. On Reddit, the option is choose a main attribute and 5 skills. This basically works the same as my array, but presented differently.

2. What's a good alternate magic system for 5e or OSR games?
I don't want to go with spell slots. The internet says "just use the mana system from the DMG", but I've skimmed the DMG and can't find anything about it.

3. Not really a question, but I'm putting thought into running a short Men In Black/Xcom style game. Is there anything I should look into? I know of Delta Green and Spycraft, anything else I should look in to?
 
1. Anyone know a good simplified character creation system for Savage Worlds?
Character creation is always the weakness of Savage Worlds. It's point buy, but people struggle to understand it, or spend a couple hours min-maxing their build. This doesn't really work for a 3 hour one shot. I tried having a standard array ready, with the players assigning it as they see fit, but it didn't work. On Reddit, the option is choose a main attribute and 5 skills. This basically works the same as my array, but presented differently.
If players can't even figure out such a simple point buy system, just give them a set of premade characters to pick from and fill in the customization blanks.

2. What's a good alternate magic system for 5e or OSR games?

I don't want to go with spell slots. The internet says "just use the mana system from the DMG", but I've skimmed the DMG and can't find anything about it.
Page 288, "Variant Spell Points", under "Creating New Character Options".
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Probably requires some additional work, but it's a start.
 
3. Not really a question, but I'm putting thought into running a short Men In Black/Xcom style game. Is there anything I should look into? I know of Delta Green and Spycraft, anything else I should look in to?
Well how do you want the game to feel because I can see four systems that could easily support it:
1. Delta Green: literally made for it, but clearly for investigation, but not great combat if you want it to serve as a key portion (since you mentioned X-Com).
2. Call of Cthulhu: same but with a d100 system.
3. Shadowrun (any edition): systems for magic (supernatural/alien psychics), systems for high-tech, d6 dicepools are fun to roll, very good combat especially if you go hard into Run and Gun for 5th edition and the 10 billion called shots and moves you can get out of it and the martial arts system.
4. Storyteller: To get the whole thing you'd have to have PCs as Hunters basically and use Technocracy stuff from Mage to get the MIB and Aliens stuff. This naturally would be your story and character focused game. Probably the easiest to pick up? Need a ton of d10s (I recommend a chessex set you can get off their website).
 
Speaking of CoC (fuck you I double post all I want) I have been thinking over the possibility of running a one-shot (maybe PbP) game for some kiwis here, I was thinking of Call of Cthulhu since it is an easy sell and I have done tons of one-shots for it. Would anyone be interested? Also any suggested platforms?
 
3. Not really a question, but I'm putting thought into running a short Men In Black/Xcom style game. Is there anything I should look into? I know of Delta Green and Spycraft, anything else I should look in to?

With a little reskinning, Maybe the Star Wars tactical RPG? Or the recent Alien RPG that got some good buzz before fizzling.

Hell, you could practically just reskin D&D 4e since that's heavy on tactical placement and gear powers.
 
Speaking of CoC (fuck you I double post all I want) I have been thinking over the possibility of running a one-shot (maybe PbP) game for some kiwis here, I was thinking of Call of Cthulhu since it is an easy sell and I have done tons of one-shots for it. Would anyone be interested? Also any suggested platforms?
Absolutely if it happens at a time i can join I would, as far as platforms is concerned unfortunately the only one I know is Roll 20 but I kind of hate the kind of people that run it
 
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