Tabletop Roleplaying Games (D&D, Pathfinder, CoC, ETC.)

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Speaking of entirely evil races, how do people feel about "mostly entirely evil race, some neutral and/or good exceptions exists though."? I do see that sort of plot tossed about a couple times.
Depends on your worldbuilding, and the creature in question. Generally, if you want to run a plot with that angle, go with a mortal creature, typically humanoid or monstrous humanoid.

Things like aberrations or outsiders are... well, that's a lot more of a problem.

Aberrations are just wired differently; you might even go with them having a morality that doesn't mesh with anything normal or sane, if you can come up with something that works. Don't be afraid to play with things, though. Stupider aberrations might be more willing to negotiate since their motivations are a lot more tangible (think of them as operating pretty low on Maslow's hierarchy of needs).

Outsiders -- especially things like angels, devils, and other outer-planes inhabitants -- are even more of an issue. Now, this is my personal worldbuilding bit of autism so discard it if you want; but creatures like angels or demons can't change, because they are literally built of concentrated good and evil. If they start to change, it begins to change their very nature. In mechanics terms, if an outer-planes outsider slips far enough out of their alignment, they will stop being what they were. Maybe they become something new; or maybe they just implode messily.

That being said, WotC and D&D are being run by absolute retards and you should not borrow any plot points from them.
 
They expect them to be some big red guys laughing like cartoon villains. I like using them as Villans but using them as manipulative, to where they act like your best friend offering you everything while having that fake nice in that it feels off, while getting the dagger ready to place in your back as they take everything. I view them as wanting you to give your soul willingly to them. I have them never lie but use half truths, selective truths, metaphores,etc. Liking violence when it is useful and time.
In the dungeon my party is going through an abandoned dwarven vault. There's a cacodemon spawn in the form of a small 2'9 dwarf girl crying asking for help. She has a poison aura 1d8 and a poison breath weapon 3/day 1d8. I hope they end up finding her.
 
In the dungeon my party is going through an abandoned dwarven vault. There's a cacodemon spawn in the form of a small 2'9 dwarf girl crying asking for help. She has a poison aura 1d8 and a poison breath weapon 3/day 1d8. I hope they end up finding her.
Any other tells that give an indication that something is wrong with the child?
 
The best thing about playing tabletop is that it literally does not matter what Wizards of the coast says. The game straight up doesn't belong to them, and it never will. It doesn't matter if they own the copyright, the trademark, whatever. It doesn't matter what they do do their gay fucking app or their gay fucking books. They can not stop you from sitting down with your friends, rolling characters on paper, using 20 year old books, and running a campaign where you genocide goblins and orcs with your based friends. DND was a gift given to humanity and it can never be taken away no matter how hard the retards try. Get fucked.

Gary Gygax was sperging out at TSR's customers for tampering with "his" game by using critical hits in their home games 50 years ago, and it got him nowhere.
 
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Speaking of entirely evil races, how do people feel about "mostly entirely evil race, some neutral and/or good exceptions exists though."? I do see that sort of plot tossed about a couple times.
I play with it on a gradient. In my Mars game, the giant primitive apes are prone to being evil... well more savage really, since barely sapient race with low cunning that likes to eat sapients. But due to their rapidly becoming more sapient and entering a full stone age, it can be directed. The party I have is working on that. They'll likely remain CN to true neutral even with their efforts since they're just well, basically a perfect race for barbarians and druids to pop from, but for the apes in their area, that's better than CN to CE they WERE.

Synthetic Men tend to be firmly evil due to being made in their master's mental image, which was an amoral hubristic bastard. There are rare exceptions but even those struggle with their mindset and do it more out of spite or because of a code. They are hard to shift if even possible.

The divine or infernal is a pretty firm line. Due to how I play with theology, it is possible to force an alignment shift in an entity like that. It takes a lot of fucking effort though, and it's more due to how the deity pivots more than its devotees. The god almost always wins, but on a few rare occasions the devotees might be able to shift it due to worship being a force of power for them.

It's how a war god one of my party worships shifted from Neutral to Evil ages back for example, though that was more due to an effort by the god to remain relevant due to a new popular war god supplanting him in the pantheon centuries ago.

However even there you know that a Demon's word is never to be trusted, and Devils may play unfair with the wording, but follow the oath. Divine messengers act in their accord or fall/break apart. They are what they are.
 
Any other tells that give an indication that something is wrong with the child?
Green mist follows her. She also lives in a pile of corpses. Dwarves dig underground and fight demons. That's the center of their culture in lore. If a dwarven mine is abandoned then usually it means the demons started attacking upper floors until the lower sections are magically sealed and they move on.
 
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I think it's become a trend to say Demons are actually Good or as morally varied as Humans to lighten up races that would traditionally be seen as pure evil. I've heard people are less interested in Drizzt clones these days trying to play "Most of my races are evil but I'm one of the good ones."
Yeah I had a new player try freakshitting in a 3.5 Dragonlance game and decided to roll up a Chromatic Draconian. While inherently good they were A - A Draconian and B - A fucking Red one. 99% of the population have no idea that they even exist. But what they do know is that first off Draconians were murder machines throughout their entire existences. Also Red Dragons tend to burn the women, eat the bushes and rape the horses. I got to use the peasant mob statblock though!!!!! That character lasted all of an hour and some change.
What is the most evil thing you ever did as a DM? The most cruel thing I can remember was having a player encounter one of his most beloved characters, one who had been captured by mind flayers, and encountering his own character, years later, both irl and in game, who had been enslaved for years, and reduced to the level of a retard, but very, very slowly, and begged his own player to kill him.

The character had started out as a genius and the mind flayers loved tormenting him by turning him into a retard.

This player decided his goal was to eliminate mind flayers from existence and he achieved this. By the time he was done, not only did illithids no longer exist (pure genocide achieved), but psionic abilities were entirelely outlawed and there was basically a Butlerian jihad.
Your entire post is absolute freaking gold. I've never ran mindflayers as an antagonist to that extent. Only the feral ones from Taladas + had some characters tasked with hunting them down in Mystara when they hopped the border. Those sessions were wrapped around players running mostly Shadowelves still in their Underground Kingdom that the mind flayers were trying to set up shop like the Underdark in Toril.
The 3.5 Book of Abominations has a very good write up on Mind Flayers if you haven't read through it. Along with every other type of Aberrant.
Gary Gygax was sperging out at TSR's customers for tampering with "his" game by using critical hits in their home games 50 years ago, and it got him nowhere.
Oddly enough I've killed more players in 3.5 than I have any other edition and it was my least played edition. I can say that most of those deaths were due to nasty critical hits and the RNG gods doing what RNG does. I'm pretty sure Gygax did some writing on that very topic and how it's more detrimental to the players due to the fact that the players are being whittled down. While the monsters generally start out in tip top shape. Plus there's the part where the monsters damage dice and capabilities far exceed those of the player characters a majority of the time. The nastiest example of that I can recall was when I hit/critted on 3 attack rolls in a row with a Skeletal Dragon (Dragonomicon). It was a bite and 2 claw attacks on a character charging it. I rolled damn near close to max on all 3 and it shredded the character down to like -30HPs.
Have you ever seen the .gif of the pet snapping turtle tearing a mouse in half and the top half swimming away? That's pretty much how I described it minus the swimming away part and being alive part.
 
Speaking of entirely evil races, how do people feel about "mostly entirely evil race, some neutral and/or good exceptions exists though."? I do see that sort of plot tossed about a couple times.
I don't think feel about it.

Disclaimers that like that are usually one of two things. Pandering to wokescolds, or pandering to grognards.

Wokescolds because they identify with evil and want orcs to be the misunderstood good guys and a mass immigration allegory.
Grognards because they want to run the tired "ow so edgy" plot where a lawful good paladin is the bad guy.
 
Run a campaign where they're peasants who have to overthrow the insane absolute monarch and institute Real Communism™️
Even in a game of pure unfettered imagination with magic, travelling to the realms of gods, and remaking reality....
There is no way communism works.

The best thing about playing tabletop is that it literally does not matter what Wizards of the coast says.
That's the thing I keep telling you faggots. It DOES because eventually you will need to find new player or a new group. And when you do, what faggotry WotC & Critical Role has been pushing absolutely, 100% very much matter.

Speaking of entirely evil races, how do people feel about "mostly entirely evil race, some neutral and/or good exceptions exists though."? I do see that sort of plot tossed about a couple times.
In general that's how I run things.

But the other thing is I always tell my players "Alignment isn't fixed, its the consequences of your actions".

For example, you might have some goblins living in a city. They follow rules, but only when they think they're being watched and can't get away with taking what they want. But they also aren't entirely stupid. If an orc warband rolls up, depending on how they're treated, they would likely take up arms against the Orcs because they prefer their current station in life. But if there is a mind-control shaman, it wouldn''t take much to turn them into a 5th collumn.

You can have a gnoll, or group of gnolls, who turned away from Yeenoghu and the constant cycle of decay. But they would very rare and very likely hunted by Yeenoghu.

My usual though is something like a Red Dragon merchant or the Beholder who runs the market in Sigil; They are rarities, and still evil, just smart enough to keep their evil natures in check for gain.

Because demons and devils and shit are seen as persecuted minorities, and since WotC hasn't released anything with any actual world building in over a decade no one who has gotten into D&D since 5th edition knows who the hell Drizzt even is.

In my setting beastmen are generally either chaotic or neutral. Humans generally lawful or neutral. Demons are always chaotic. If they gave up on their evil ways (killing everything they see, doing necromancy, tricking people to be evil, etc.) they would no longer have their powers which are ultimately bestowed upon them by a Goddess of demons and hell.
[ ... ]
For beastmen it's ultimately because they are stupid. Stupid people do more crime or immoral things for power because they can't reason why they shouldn't.
I agree with this too. If they turn good, their patron deity is going to abandon them.

And stupid things/stupid people are less likely to vary alignment.

They expect them to be some big red guys laughing like cartoon villains. I like using them as Villans but using them as manipulative, to where they act like your best friend offering you everything while having that fake nice in that it feels off, while getting the dagger ready to place in your back as they take everything. I view them as wanting you to give your soul willingly to them. I have them never lie but use half truths, selective truths, metaphores,etc. Liking violence when it is useful and time.
Yup. If you are dealing with a demon, it is to their benefit and not yours.

Things like aberrations or outsiders are... well, that's a lot more of a problem.
Yup. Abberations just have different minds and I'm less likely to have them vary alignment. I know I gave a Beholder Merchant example before, but in my worlds Beholders are always evil and view mortals as at best slaves.
The BEST you are going to get from a beholder is aligned interests and it deciding you are more useful alive and un-enslaved than the alternative. (Actually the best you are going to get from a beholder is being too unimportant to be noticed or bothered with. But providing its interacting with you, that's the best you can hope for)
Its not like a Dragon you can try to grovel and prostrate and maybe bribe your way out of.

If you have something a beholder wants its going to disintegrate first and ask questions never.

I play with it on a gradient. In my Mars game, the giant primitive apes are prone to being evil... well more savage really, since barely sapient race with low cunning that likes to eat sapients. But due to their rapidly becoming more sapient and entering a full stone age, it can be directed. The party I have is working on that. They'll likely remain CN to true neutral even with their efforts since they're just well, basically a perfect race for barbarians and druids to pop from, but for the apes in their area, that's better than CN to CE they WERE.

Synthetic Men tend to be firmly evil due to being made in their master's mental image, which was an amoral hubristic bastard. There are rare exceptions but even those struggle with their mindset and do it more out of spite or because of a code. They are hard to shift if even possible.

The divine or infernal is a pretty firm line. Due to how I play with theology, it is possible to force an alignment shift in an entity like that. It takes a lot of fucking effort though, and it's more due to how the deity pivots more than its devotees. The god almost always wins, but on a few rare occasions the devotees might be able to shift it due to worship being a force of power for them.
This another good breakdown.
Dumb things are not even evil, just more prone to evil actions.
Alien minds may have less flexibility, but there might be a couple exceptions.
But the gods & their servants won't shift - or if they do, it is a huge deal.

Found on reddit but it is the best broken pathfinder 1e build.
A perfectly balanced game with no flaws.
 
What is the most evil thing you ever did as a DM? The most cruel thing I can remember was having a player encounter one of his most beloved characters, one who had been captured by mind flayers, and encountering his own character, years later, both irl and in game, who had been enslaved for years, and reduced to the level of a retard, but very, very slowly, and begged his own player to kill him.

The character had started out as a genius and the mind flayers loved tormenting him by turning him into a retard.

This player decided his goal was to eliminate mind flayers from existence and he achieved this. By the time he was done, not only did illithids no longer exist (pure genocide achieved), but psionic abilities were entirelely outlawed and there was basically a Butlerian jihad.
This is great. In general I find players really get a kick out of seeing call-backs to previous PCs/NPCs they played as or encountered especially former characters that met some unfortunate fate that as long as it makes a bit of sense if you squint, that they would end up somewhere along the way that they can be run into again.

It's the little things.
 
This is great. In general I find players really get a kick out of seeing call-backs to previous PCs/NPCs they played as or encountered especially former characters that met some unfortunate fate that as long as it makes a bit of sense if you squint, that they would end up somewhere along the way that they can be run into again.

It's the little things.
This happened a lot in my Call of Cthulhu campaigns, because the most knowledgeable characters had read most of the books you should never read, and had all of the knowledge that you shouldn't know, and had Sanity in the single digits.

That's because once your Sanity hit that level, you probably had spells in your mind like Call Azathoth that could literally just instantly end the world. And then the party would have to put this guy in a mental ward. Because some previous character had done exactly that.

So the PCs would eventually turn into NPCs in mental institutions to protect them from doing that, so you often had to interact with barely sane single digit Sanity characters who used to be your characters, or even outright lunatics with 0 SAN. Who also used to be your characters.
 
I'd rather commit ritual suicide than play 5e with my friends.
Why would you play 5e at all? 3.5 with home rules is more than enough for any setting or campaign, if you want to play a warlock simply write up the stats for one and play it. You don't need a book to tell you what to do. You can make your own classes, races, whatever. This mentality is exactly why people think what WOTC does matters. You have more than what you need with 3.5. Just play the game and ignore all updates and discussion.
 
Outsiders -- especially things like angels, devils, and other outer-planes inhabitants -- are even more of an issue. Now, this is my personal worldbuilding bit of autism so discard it if you want; but creatures like angels or demons can't change, because they are literally built of concentrated good and evil. If they start to change, it begins to change their very nature. In mechanics terms, if an outer-planes outsider slips far enough out of their alignment, they will stop being what they were. Maybe they become something new; or maybe they just implode messily.
Even int christianity and other monotheistic religions this was up to debate. Christian fathers like Origenes always assumed demons can repent and become good and angels can still fall etc.
 
I mean all the devils are literal fallen angels.
Yes. It is a very different setting than what is assumed in a regular D&D setting (with alignments and planes etc.) But still
-the assumtion on how the angels were created
-how many times did the angels fall (which fall was the Lucifers)
- Does Jesus saves them as well
-What is the source of Original Sin (and if it exists)etc. etc.
We have meny flexibility even in theology and philosophycally in Christianity, Islam and other Religions. this is why you can all be content with how you are dealing with this issue. I prefer mortal races to be redeemable, but evils of outerplanes to be irredeemable.
 
Yes. It is a very different setting than what is assumed in a regular D&D setting (with alignments and planes etc.) But still
-the assumtion on how the angels were created
-how many times did the angels fall (which fall was the Lucifers)
- Does Jesus saves them as well
-What is the source of Original Sin (and if it exists)etc. etc.
We have meny flexibility even in theology and philosophycally in Christianity, Islam and other Religions. this is why you can all be content with how you are dealing with this issue. I prefer mortal races to be redeemable, but evils of outerplanes to be irredeemable.
Usually in my worlds, D20 Satan is far from antagonistic to the good side of the pantheon; on the contrary, he's such a huge believer in Good that he is willing to wade into a realm of eternal fire and pain to make sure the the sinners are being tortured sufficiently and correctly, becasue he can't trust anyone except himself, The Force of Good's #1 superfan, to do it right.
Of course he tempts sinners, and works with other forces to try to ensure their damnation. If he didn't do that, bad, underserving people might get into D20 Heaven and we can't have that.

So its possible for Angels to fall/Devils to be redeemed/Gods to change allignment but such things are of (sometimes quite literally) earth-shattering importance.
 
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