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"but it's hard to find a hard pedo scandel"
"Salem and the rest are brawl/ultimate players."
These are all players that have a history competing in Melee. Some even 2v2 with the 5gods as partners. Unless you win a tournament does it not count? These are people involved in the scene and meet/coerce with fans.
If you want to limit it to only the past few years and not just competing in Melee tournaments:
Dj Nintendo, KPAN, La Luna, LSDX, MacD, Mafia, Nightmare, Overtriforce, RockCrock, SleepyK, Uncle mojo, and Xzax. These players are all active (some still competing) Melee players.

You're scene has pedos playing, definitely some are amongst the fans as well.

"but it's hard to find a hard pedo scandel"
"Salem and the rest are brawl/ultimate players."
These are all players that have a history competing in Melee. Some even 2v2 with the 5gods as partners. Unless you win a tournament does it not count? These are people involved in the scene and meet/coerce with fans.
If you want to limit it to only the past few years and not just competing in Melee tournaments:
Dj Nintendo, KPAN, La Luna, LSDX, MacD, Mafia, Nightmare, Overtriforce, RockCrock, SleepyK, Uncle mojo, and Xzax. These players are all active (some still competing) Melee players.

You're scene has pedos playing, definitely some are amongst the fans as well.
Salem had a meltdown and disavowed melee as a smash game. It was a really funny few days of tweets. Definitely people on that list who just play the newer games though.

Yeah, I guess you're right. Haven't exactly seen any of the people on that list for the last 3 years, but absolutely fair. I guess everyone has their pedophiles.
 
D1 was a big one, but it's revealed that the accusation is a lie. So the court's out whether it's all true or not. He's also more known for commentating all the smash games, not just melee.
Even if the accusation is a lie this response is retarded as it's a "B-but, He's not just a melee commentator you guys! please stop comparing me to ultimate players"

Mafia, la luna and MacD are all fair. Though those players are hard to see as pedophilia. Just shitty behavior. DJ Nintendo is a sex pest, but Eikelmann was already a meme and a pariah before he got the boot.
"Sure, they sexually assaulted several people and did shitty things, b-but it's not pedophillia!"

A rookie's case is pretty weak, but it stuck. Far as public opinion is concerned, he's off the hook.
Why does it matter what his public perception is, he still did the shitty fucking thing? So far all of this has just been deflections, but this is especially amplified with your next point.

Salem and the rest are brawl/ultimate players..
They have a history of competing in melee tournaments, but gotta take the heat off melee!

Also worth mentioning most if not all of the melee instances have been dealt with immediately, and without the clownshow on twitter.
Based on #FreeMelee, I doubt the ability of melee players to not air all their problems on twitter.

How does every single point of yours get fucked by one sentence replies?
Like, this is the same with every smash player I have seen, whenever confronted about anything all of their arguments are shit points structured in a way that they can just be deconstructed sentence by literal sentence.

Not to mention one of the biggest Melee communities is on reddit, and redditors are pedophiles. Why are you so adamant that Melee is so much better than Ultimate? They're both fucking communities built on playing a party game "well" by turning off all the fun elements. They have massive hygiene problems and need to take showers, they constantly complain about the company that made Melee because they won't give them free money? Why should anyone want to join a community of sweaty, (actually) toxic nerds who are also pedophiles?
 
CaptainZack - Forcefully perfomed oral sex against another player. CZ was 15, while the person he performed it on was 20. He also tried to seduce multiple adult men at Smash Tourneys.
CaptainZack isn't a pedo, he's a reverse-pedo
 
Even if the accusation is a lie this response is retarded as it's a "B-but, He's not just a melee commentator you guys! please stop comparing me to ultimate players"


"Sure, they sexually assaulted several people and did shitty things, b-but it's not pedophillia!"


Why does it matter what his public perception is, he still did the shitty fucking thing? So far all of this has just been deflections, but this is especially amplified with your next point.


They have a history of competing in melee tournaments, but gotta take the heat off melee!


Based on #FreeMelee, I doubt the ability of melee players to not air all their problems on twitter.

How does every single point of yours get fucked by one sentence replies?
Like, this is the same with every smash player I have seen, whenever confronted about anything all of their arguments are shit points structured in a way that they can just be deconstructed sentence by literal sentence.

Not to mention one of the biggest Melee communities is on reddit, and redditors are pedophiles. Why are you so adamant that Melee is so much better than Ultimate? They're both fucking communities built on playing a party game "well" by turning off all the fun elements. They have massive hygiene problems and need to take showers, they constantly complain about the company that made Melee because they won't give them free money? Why should anyone want to join a community of sweaty, (actually) toxic nerds who are also pedophiles?

You're right. I won't die on this hill to defend Melee and all of its baggage, especially when I'm just on a phone.

Truth is, I'm pretty bitter about Ultimate in general. I despise the gatekeeping, the ryugacord illuminati, the constant whining online, the virtue signaling, the lack of creativity, the hypocrisy. The pedophilia is just icing on top of it.

Melee is a sweaty game, especially in the years when Hungrybox was on top of the world. Im sure there are many here who are turned off by the culture. At a local level, the games a complete sausage-fest. Yes to all of that. I guess I ended up white knighting melee a bit, huh?

I will say as someone who did travel to melee tournaments all over, the smell level is 100% lower. That's the one thing I'll argue vehemently for.

Shit, drop by in chat or pm me, and we can talk about it some more. I do think Melee has a lot of great moments I just can't find in the newer games.
 
Also can't forget CinnPie, an adult female who raped a 12 year old. Should rename herself SinPie for sinning with her pie ba-dum-tiss
 
Also can't forget CinnPie, an adult female who raped a 12 year old. Should rename herself SinPie for sinning with her pie bu-dum-tiss
Not to downplay it, but she raped a 14 year old. Puppeh was fucking traumatized over it afterwards.

Kind of glad her gender and looks didn't factor into her punishment. But totally could see it being much worse if she was a dude.
 
Not to downplay it, but she raped a 14 year old. Puppeh was fucking traumatized over it afterwards.

Kind of glad her gender and looks didn't factor into her punishment. But totally could see it being much worse if she was a dude.
Oh, my bad. Not that it makes it much better. You're not wrong tho, she wasn't bad looking for a pedophile:
EXSOkiJWoAIZywf.jpg EYBOLtlXQAAbdWU.jpg
Although any woman who looks like this and is spending her spare time attending smash tourneys obviously has more than a fair few screws loose.
 
Nods. Knew you were going to the big ban list.

D1 was a big one, but it's revealed that the accusation is a lie. So the court's out whether it's all true or not. He's also more known for commentating all the smash games, not just melee.

Mafia, la luna and MacD are all fair. Though those players are hard to see as pedophilia. Just shitty behavior. DJ Nintendo is a sex pest, but Eikelmann was already a meme and a pariah before he got the boot.

A rookie's case is pretty weak, but it stuck. Far as public opinion is concerned, he's off the hook.

Salem and the rest are brawl/ultimate players.

Also worth mentioning most if not all of the melee instances have been dealt with immediately, and without the clownshow on twitter.

Edit: Im sure I missed a few, and the list definitely left out one who's actually a felon.

Might have suggested melee is without culpability before, but the controversies aren't as egregious as any other fighting game. We can talk for hours about the Street Fighter and Tekken stories that led to fights and arrests.
Wow dude.

You got three stocked so bad that you're still sitting there pressing buttons after they shut the lights off at the convention center.
 
Granted, if the argument is that all smash bros is autistic and dumb, and fighting games will never be the same level as pro wrestling, fine. But Melee is that one game with new players and old talent proving they can still compete in 2021 and still improve after over a decade. It's hard to say that for any standalone game.
+R? Melty Blood? King of Fighters 98/2002? Street Fighter 3? Marvel? Heritage for the Future? Samsho?

All older titles that have thriving communities and have tournaments incredibly actively. Games with high skill ceilings.

The difference between Smash autism and Fighting game autism are two different things. There's a huge difference between playing an old, unsupported game on a dead console using your controller that's broken in just the right way that's considered complex because of unintended bugs using a hacked together emulator using a ROM you had to pirate, and a fighting game player spending hours in training mode learning a combo using intended mechanics. One makes you a manchild, the other makes you a person with a hobby.
 
The FGC is most definitely not blameless with its own problems (looking at you, Mr. Wizard) and I'm certain most of its members also reek, but very rarely have I ever watched high level game play of an actual fighting game and felt bored like I have with competitive Smash.

- "Alright, here's yet another match between Fox and Marth. Get hyped, ya'll!"

- EVO 2018 when the two literal faggots stood in place with Bayonetta and got booed for it.

- Watching Hungrybox show what a pro he is by hanging off a ledge. "B-but it's great because he uses Jigglypuff!" No one cares.

- The Smash Invitational they held at E3 2014; partially the reason anyone gives a shit about ZERO. What a fun final match, with Hungrybox flying around in the air repeatedly as Kirby with ZERO as ZSS attempting to kick him. What a great way to advertise the new game. The only highlight was Reggie coming onstage and challenging ZERO to a match and saying, "I'LL KICK YOUR ASS!" If only he did that in real life.

-Armada refusing to participate in some tournament because they wouldn't use a specific controller and TV set up. Say what you want about Two Best Friends Play, but them ripping this to shreds was hilarious.

-Smash YouTubers are awful. Anyone that unironically praises AlphaRad needs to reevaluate their life.

I don't want to shit on Smash completely, as I still have fun playing it, especially with friends, but it's like the "pros" do everything they can to make it look like the lamest fucking game in the world. This is even comparing it to old school fighting games that don't have items or wacky stage hazards. At least those guys have actual skill.
 
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-Armada refusing to participate in some tournament because they wouldn't use a specific controller and TV set up. Say what you want about Two Best Friends Play, but them ripping this to shreds was hilarious.
I want to clarify how stupid this in particular is.

It was more specifically Armada dropped out of a tournament, when he was one of the big names they used to push viewship and participation, because his controller was working properly. More specifically, some Gamecube controllers have a hardware issue where the control stick snaps back on releasing it, giving a brief input in the opposite direction which is nearly impossible to humanly do otherwise. The rate of controllers with this defect is around one in thirty, but could be as low as one in a hundred. Apparently this issue can also self-correct, probably due to wear on the controller or even the environmental temperature. This is partially the reason why you see some Smash players carry around five controllers and do minutes-long button checks.

So Armada refused to play with any of his controllers because he couldn't access an exceedingly rare manufacturing error. As one would assume, the technique this enables must be very important. As it turns out, all it lets you do is turn around without doing a 5-frame animation. And no, there's not many instances where this would make a difference. And yes, you need to heavily adjust your playstyle in other regards to compensate for the fact your controller has snap-back. To top this all off, a "tournament-approved" hack of Melee changes the game's code to make it so this technique is possible without malfunctioning controllers, and for no reason there's a controversy as to whether or not the use of these malfunctioning controllers should be banned for tournaments which do not use this hack.

As Two Best Friends Play pointed out, a controller that lets you do techniques which are otherwise impossible would be banned in any tournament. The example they used was an actual instance where a controller allowed both left and right inputs, which broke the game's mechanics in the user's favor, hence causing this controller to be universally banned as cheating. A good analogy in layman's terms would be a controller for Smash which, when pushed, would input the most optimal commands for breaking out of a grab. While the instances where this is useful is limited, it is still an unfair advantage which would enforce all players to use this controller just to compete on equal footing.

I don't feel too strongly about people complaining "you need to break Melee to make it competitive to begin with." There's been instances of that in countless video games, like bunnyhopping in an FPS. But I am bothered when Melee players insist their game is not being broken in half to be competitively viable, because that's an outright lie. Just own up to it. You can like your ancient, rushed game held together by duct tape and gluesticks. But don't act ashamed to the point you need to deny reality.
 
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I want to clarify how stupid this in particular is.

It was more specifically Armada dropped out of a tournament, when he was one of the big names they used to push viewship and participation, because his controller was working properly. More specifically, some Gamecube controllers have a hardware issue where the control stick snaps back on releasing it, giving a brief input in the opposite direction which is nearly impossible to humanly do otherwise. The rate of controllers with this defect is around one in thirty, but could be as low as one in a hundred. Apparently this issue can also self-correct, probably due to wear on the controller or even the environmental temperature. This is partially the reason why you see some Smash players carry around five controllers and do minutes-long button checks.

So Armada refused to play with any of his controllers because he couldn't access an exceedingly rare manufacturing error. As one would assume, the technique this enables must be very important. As it turns out, all it lets you do is turn around without doing a 5-frame animation. And no, there's not many instances where this would make a difference. And yes, you need to heavily adjust your playstyle in other regards to compensate for the fact your controller has snap-back. To top this all off, a "tournament-approved" hack of Melee changes the game's code to make it so this technique is possible without malfunctioning controllers, and for no reason there's a controversy as to whether or not the use of these malfunctioning controllers should be banned for tournaments which do not use this hack.

As Two Best Friends Play pointed out, a controller that lets you do techniques which are otherwise impossible would be banned in any tournament. The example they used was an actual instance where a controller allowed both left and right inputs, which broke the game's mechanics in the user's favor, hence causing this controller to be universally banned as cheating. A good analogy in layman's terms would be a controller for Smash which, when pushed, would input the most optimal commands for breaking out of a grab. While the instances where this is useful is limited, it is still an unfair advantage which would enforce all players to use this controller just to compete on equal footing.

I don't feel too strongly about people complaining "you need to break Melee to make it competitive to begin with." There's been instances of that in countless video games, like bunnyhopping in an FPS. But I am bothered when Melee players insist their game is not being broken in half to be competitively viable, because that's an outright lie. Just own up to it. You can like your ancient, rushed game held together by duct tape and gluesticks. But don't act ashamed to the point you need to deny reality.
This is in direct contrast to Mario Kart Wii community, which will happily admit that the game is broken as fuck and will accept mods. The only thing that the Melee community has over the other is that they have access to rollback netcode.
 
This is in direct contrast to Mario Kart Wii community, which will happily admit that the game is broken as fuck and will accept mods. The only thing that the Melee community has over the other is that they have access to rollback netcode.
There is no more debate. I've portrayed the Mario Kart community as chads and smashfags as virgins. It's fucking over for Smashcels.

smashvsmariokart.png
 
I feel like people are kicking a dead horse here. When's the last time Smash Ultimate got together for a major since the pandemic?

There's loads of online tournaments, sure, but the game's definitely lost a lot of momentum since the loss of EVO and Nintendo's support.

+R? Melty Blood? King of Fighters 98/2002? Street Fighter 3? Marvel? Heritage for the Future? Samsho?

All older titles that have thriving communities and have tournaments incredibly actively. Games with high skill ceilings.

The difference between Smash autism and Fighting game autism are two different things. There's a huge difference between playing an old, unsupported game on a dead console using your controller that's broken in just the right way that's considered complex because of unintended bugs using a hacked together emulator using a ROM you had to pirate, and a fighting game player spending hours in training mode learning a combo using intended mechanics. One makes you a manchild, the other makes you a person with a hobby.

People still play melty blood and heritage in torunaments? Fightcade is cool and all, but you might as well add Street Fighter 3 to that list
 
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