Sperg about comic books here

[kaien]

They've got Midnighter in this mess, so I'm watching to see how they ruin this opportunity. Remember Ladytron? Why not bring her back? Is a sociopathic Juliette Lewis in chrome blasting toasters for Gort woke enough for these cuttlefish?

I get why they're bringing back Grifter yet again for a key supporting role in Batman, because Jim Lee still runs the shop and you never forget your first Mary Sue, but Ladytron in that same slot would ruuuuuuuuule.

 

[Cyber Bowling]

I tried to avoid spoiling it. But yeah. I'd call Superman bad from what I saw. Batman, Harley, and Swamp Thing were undercooked and nothing really stood out as good though. You have, what? Six or seven books and none of them are good?

I completely forgot I even read Swamp Thing, and for the life of me, I don't think I could say what happened without having to re-read it. I personally thought Superman was bad, but I can't tell if it was just not liking the heavy sci-fi style story they were telling, or if it was actually just badly written. Possibly a bit of both. To me, it felt like they were trying to throw way too much plot at the reader. It also felt like Jon could have just as easily been replaced with Clark, with the exception of a few lines of dialogue implying that he wasn't as good as his dad. Felt like another example of DC not recognizing that people (at least from what I've seen) like Jon as a character. I feel like there has to be some writer that's genuinely interested in writing him.

 

[Alexander Thaut]

Forgot Giganta as well.

I mean sure, that's a big one.

She was tailor made for Amanda Conners. Did you read a collection? Because if so you may have missed the Terra mini, Supergirl #12, and the first PG mini that ties into it. All drawn by Amanda.

Speaking off. If you are an Amanda fanatic, you have to read her run and Vampirella. Woof. Sexy, funny, and gore.

Oh, I wouldn't want you to do that. Judd is.... He's difficult. He's from the edgy era that gave us Identity Crisis and he liked to shove gay shit into things. His run suffers because its both more serious and it ties into JLI Lost, which as a Bwahahha fan I loathe with the fury of a billion suns.

Matt Sturges did issue 26-27 and those are more in line with what Amanda did.


Yeah, she was born in the feminist 70s. Back when feminism was body positive and a little more self aware.



There are others, Silver Swan, Dark Angel something or another, but top talent creators avoided Diana like the plague before George Perez came in. Even then, usually they came to the title with baggage.

Greg Rucka was a cuck fetishist who wanted her to be something she wasn't. Gail Simone wrote her like fanfiction. JMS, Grant Morrison, and Brian Azzerallo had interesting alternate takes. But that's the thing. No one just wanted a good, straightforward Wondy. None of the big name artists since the 90s have committed to just giving us Lynda Carter Wonder Woman straight.

honestly the entire problem is that I think you could do some amazing Wonder Woman stories with a Thor-esque focus on myth, monsters, and whatnot.

The problem is that we just don't see that, but we get weird shit like the current Wonder Woman run, which looked like it was going to turn Maxwell Lord into an anti-hero and closer to redemption, but introduces his daughter or some shit?

Granted she's a villain, which makes it interesting.

It's a lesser version of the same problem Carol Danvers has. The characters are associated with an ideology and the solo books have shifted towards that instead of telling good stories. At least they try to keep Diana consistent with her warrior mindset and pursuit of truth, unlike Carol's weirdly increasing arrogance.

IMO, Future State ranges from fine to meh. I think the only one that I legitimately felt strongly enough to call bad is the Flash. It finally gives us the Speedsters back together again! Except they're all angsty and depressed because Wally went evil/is possessed by some four horseman shit and killed Wallace. Oh, and they all lost their speed somehow. And Bart dies. And Jay dies because his old heart can't handle all the stress he's been going through. Future State!

It also just further emphasis how this whole thing is really more of a "what if" 2-3 issue miniseries and not anything with much substance or weight. I have a feeling if anything is popular enough to stick around, it'll be rebooted to fit in with the general DC universe. I think that's another reason why the Flash comic stands out as being lackluster. I guess they could potentially focus on a new villain to introduce to the mainline, but most of the focus was on Barry.

I thought Batman was fairly bland and boring. We've seen the whole "police state cracks down on vigilantes" storyline so many times now. Including in previous Batman comics. Including the current batman comic, now that I think about it. I guess you could at least argue they're building off the existing story stuff, if you wanted to be generous.

police chasing vigilante has been done to death in Gotham and I'm 90% sure it's been handled better before.

also having the focus of the Flash books on Barry was a mistake. He should have been a short time revival for Final Crisis and maybe sacrificed himself for another event or sth. I like Barry, but man they revived the man who'd been dead since 86 just to feed silver age fanboys.

I completely forgot I even read Swamp Thing, and for the life of me, I don't think I could say what happened without having to re-read it. I personally thought Superman was bad, but I can't tell if it was just not liking the heavy sci-fi style story they were telling, or if it was actually just badly written. Possibly a bit of both. To me, it felt like they were trying to throw way too much plot at the reader. It also felt like Jon could have just as easily been replaced with Clark, with the exception of a few lines of dialogue implying that he wasn't as good as his dad. Felt like another example of DC not recognizing that people (at least from what I've seen) like Jon as a character. I feel like there has to be some writer that's genuinely interested in writing him.

I feel like Jon's going to get aged and de-aged down the line and whatnot.

He's a good character but the problem is that I think we need another few years of Jon and build him up like we did to Damian.

what the fuck happened to Damien after all the bullshit they pulled? i feel like making him a morally grey character isn't a bad move but needs to be handled with quality.

 

[Cyber Bowling]

Also having the focus of the Flash books on Barry was a mistake. He should have been a short time revival for Final Crisis and maybe sacrificed himself for another event or sth. I like Barry, but man they revived the man who'd been dead since 86 just to feed silver age fanboys.

I agree. Barry was fine as a hero back in the day, but it feels like Flash didn't become a notable character until Wally took over the mantle. Wally also had the superior supporting cast, something that I feel like Barry, both in the past and present, never really got. It also feels like in team books or non Flash specific crossovers, if someone is writing Barry, they write him more like Wally.

What the fuck happened to Damien after all the bullshit they pulled? i feel like making him a morally grey character isn't a bad move but needs to be handled with quality.

I gave up on Teen Titans awhile ago, so I was only vaguely aware of what he was doing from a few comments other people made or the odd reference to him in the comics. It made it rather jarring when he suddenly showed up in the bat titles again. And it also highlights how King didn't seem to want to do anything with him, which is why he just sort of vanished until the end of his run.

It's unfortunately one of those fairly common Robin issues, where a lot of writers just have no ideas/interest in the character, then they try something big to reinvent them. Tim Drake becoming Red Robin, that time Damien died and then got brought back with powers. Whatever happened in Robin War. Really, the best case scenario is they get a decent run on Teen Titans or Super Sons or whatever else.

 

[Alexander Thaut]

I agree. Barry was fine as a hero back in the day, but it feels like Flash didn't become a notable character until Wally took over the mantle. Wally also had the superior supporting cast, something that I feel like Barry, both in the past and present, never really got. It also feels like in team books or non Flash specific crossovers, if someone is writing Barry, they write him more like Wally.

I gave up on Teen Titans awhile ago, so I was only vaguely aware of what he was doing from a few comments other people made or the odd reference to him in the comics. It made it rather jarring when he suddenly showed up in the bat titles again. And it also highlights how King didn't seem to want to do anything with him, which is why he just sort of vanished until the end of his run.

It's unfortunately one of those fairly common Robin issues, where a lot of writers just have no ideas/interest in the character, then they try something big to reinvent them. Tim Drake becoming Red Robin, that time Damien died and then got brought back with powers. Whatever happened in Robin War. Really, the best case scenario is they get a decent run on Teen Titans or Super Sons or whatever else.

Barry was amazing but he didn't really do a ton aside from be a vehicle for the Silver Age of comics, the multiverse, and whatnot. The one time he gets an interesting concept in The Trial of the Flash, it was right before the OG Crisis.

Wally defined the notion of the legacy hero and was the first non-Dick Greyson hero to grow up into an adult mantle.

I feel like they failed at getting the rest of the OG titans into being adult heroes on their own since Roy wound up with a drug problem and then being a secret agent or sth starting in the 90s. Donna is whatever the fuck they want her to be. Garth gets shafted 99% of the time and noone really cares about him anymore.

But hey I guess Cyborg's lucky he made it to being a major hero outside of the titans even if it was a sort of artificial push?

 

[Fromtheblackdepths]

Real quick, I really did enjoy the JSA Post-Crisis series with all of the characters coming from a dynasty. There's just something hypnotically comfy about watching these old-timer supers and their children.

Shame that DC had to erase these people from existence.

 

[Water-T]

Real quick, I really did enjoy the JSA Post-Crisis series with all of the characters coming from a dynasty. There's just something hypnotically comfy about watching these old-timer supers and their children.

Shame that DC had to erase these people from existence.

Doomsday Clock brought the Legion of Super Heroes and the JSA back into the post Nu52 canon.

Unfortunately, the new LOSH series SUCKS FLOPPY DONKEY DICK and nothing's been done with the JSA since (unless you count Injustice Year Zero, which is great but not the same continuity)

 

[Fromtheblackdepths]

Doomsday Clock brought the Legion of Super Heroes and the JSA back into the post Nu52 canon.

Unfortunately, the new LOSH series SUCKS FLOPPY DONKEY DICK and nothing's been done with the JSA since (unless you count Injustice Year Zero, which is great but not the same continuity)

So are they keeping Alan Scott gay?

 

[sKr0n]

Real quick, I really did enjoy the JSA Post-Crisis series with all of the characters coming from a dynasty. There's just something hypnotically comfy about watching these old-timer supers and their children.

Shame that DC had to erase these people from existence.

A lot of what DC did with the JSA characters just before and Post-Crisis was pretty fun and a great love letter to Earth-Two.

So are they keeping Alan Scott gay?

That was New 52 Earth-2 Alan not the JSA one that came back, but with the new TV show who knows?

 

[Fromtheblackdepths]

A lot of what DC did with the JSA characters just before with and Post-Crisis was pretty fun and a great love letter to Earth-Two.

Especially with Alex Ross as an advisor (I think) to the series. The team may have also needed to cut down the roster by a smidge.

 

[jspit2.0]

I get why they're bringing back Grifter yet again for a key supporting role in Batman, because Jim Lee still runs the shop and you never forget your first Mary Sue, but Ladytron in that same slot would ruuuuuuuuule.

I actually love Grifter. He's a good foil and I hate Joe Casey gave us him and Ladytron as duo then immediately axed it. Nobody ever really got Maxine...

I completely forgot I even read Swamp Thing, and for the life of me, I don't think I could say what happened without having to re-read it.

If that doesn't describe Future State in a Nut Shell.

I mean sure, that's a big one.

I see what you did there...

honestly the entire problem is that I think you could do some amazing Wonder Woman stories with a Thor-esque focus on myth, monsters, and whatnot.

That's what Azzerallo did and JMS was starting to do.

The problem is that we just don't see that, but we get weird shit like the current Wonder Woman run, which looked like it was going to turn Maxwell Lord into an anti-hero and closer to redemption, but introduces his daughter or some shit?

Granted she's a villain, which makes it interesting.

Meh. Max isn't a villain. We've erased so much good stuff, why can't we erase Infinite Crisis!

I agree. Barry was fine as a hero back in the day, but it feels like Flash didn't become a notable character until Wally took over the mantle.

He had great villains. But think about it. Barry lived a full life. He got the girl, had kids, retired, and died saving everyone. His story ran its course. Where do you go after all of that?

Wally also had the superior supporting cast, something that I feel like Barry, both in the past and present, never really got. It also feels like in team books or non Flash specific crossovers, if someone is writing Barry, they write him more like Wally.

Because Barry's a straight up adult who started as a hero. Wally had to grow to reach him. So instead of continuing Wally's journey or moving forward with a new Kid Flash, Iris?, they bring Barry back and have to gut him. Make him less of a hero, pretend he's selfish. Then, when that's pointed out, they butcher Wally's characters to try to make Barry look less of a tool.

Barry breaks reality because he's selfish and unheroic? Well, Wally tries to do that too!

I feel like they failed at getting the rest of the OG titans into being adult heroes on their own since Roy wound up with a drug problem and then being a secret agent or sth starting in the 90s. Donna is whatever the fuck they want her to be. Garth gets shafted 99% of the time and noone really cares about him anymore.

But hey I guess Cyborg's lucky he made it to being a major hero outside of the titans even if it was a sort of artificial push?

Denny O'Neil and relevant comics.

Real quick, I really did enjoy the JSA Post-Crisis series with all of the characters coming from a dynasty. There's just something hypnotically comfy about watching these old-timer supers and their children.

Shame that DC had to erase these people from existence.

That was actually true for the pre-crisis JSA too. It was introduced first by Paul Levitz in Adventure Comics and then Roy Thomas wrote a whole series about it in All Stars and Infinity Inc where most of those characters were created.

Infinity Inc, by the way, had some great artwork. If you liked JSA you'd probably like it too. Jerry Ordway for the first year then Todd McFarlane for two years.

Doomsday Clock brought the Legion of Super Heroes and the JSA back into the post Nu52 canon.

Did it though? I felt like Doomsday Clock was pissing in the wind and everyone would ignore it.

Unfortunately, the new LOSH series SUCKS FLOPPY DONKEY DICK and nothing's been done with the JSA since (unless you count Injustice Year Zero, which is great but not the same continuity)

Scott Snyder had something. Whether he does it or not, I'm giving it a pass. It'll involve some new ultimate entity and a super secret cabal stretching back to the beginning of everything or whatever.

So are they keeping Alan Scott gay?

I don't know. It's so ridiculous. He's got a son and daughter. Before any of you start...he's from the '40s.

Especially with Alex Ross as an advisor (I think) to the series. The team may have also needed to cut down the roster by a smidge.

He teamed for Thy Kingdom. It was an attempt to do the real sequel that Mark Waid killed.

 

[Water-T]

So are they keeping Alan Scott gay?

He was gay in Injustice Year Zero but it was in the canon on the Injustice game, not the comics.

 

[jspit2.0]

He was gay in Injustice Year Zero but it was in the caon on the Injustice game, not the comics.

Of course he was. God forfend there is something with a gay whatever in it. Everything must hammer home that shit.

Granted, this is Tom Taylor. Mr. Mustard bigotry and Japanese war criminals being heroes.

 

[Fromtheblackdepths]

Of course he was. God forfend there is something with a gay whatever in it. Everything must hammer home that shit.

Granted, this is Tom Taylor. Mr. Mustard bigotry and Japanese war criminals being heroes.

Obsidian was gay, why couldn't they (DC) use him?

 

[Prehistoric Jazz]

For everything Doomsday Clock got right and wrong, I learned something I hadn't been aware of: I'm more comfortable with DC characters using grawlixes instead of direct language. To me, it doesn't feel right. I normally couldn't give a flying fuck at a donut about that. Seeing Guy Gardner mention making Darkseid lick shit off their boots was totally in character for him, but felt off. Strange.

 

[jspit2.0]

Obsidian was gay, why couldn't they (DC) use him?

Three reasons.

First, using a gay character that exists doesn't earn you applause anymore. They get credit for making a straight character gay. Second, Green Lantern is a name 'people' recognize. When James Robinson took a character he didn't create and disrespected seventy plus years of history, he got tons of puff pieces praising him for 'making green lantern gay'. Third, it's about taking something away. You liked straight Green Lantern. You bad person you. Well, he's gay now. How do you like that?

For everything Doomsday Clock got right and wrong, I learned something I hadn't been aware of: I'm more comfortable with DC characters using grawlixes instead of direct language. To me, it doesn't feel right. I normally couldn't give a flying fuck at a donut about that. Seeing Guy Gardner mention making Darkseid lick shit off their boots was totally in character for him, but felt off. Strange.

DC characters should be heroes. I absolutely agree with you.

 

[Cyber Bowling]

First, using a gay character that exists doesn't earn you applause anymore. They get credit for making a straight character gay. Second, Green Lantern is a name 'people' recognize. When James Robinson took a character he didn't create and disrespected seventy plus years of history, he got tons of puff pieces praising him for 'making green lantern gay'. Third, it's about taking something away. You liked straight Green Lantern. You bad person you. Well, he's gay now. How do you like that?

I think the name was the big one. It feels like they deliberately chose a hero a lot of non-comic readers would recognize as being one of the "big" ones, but probably don't realize references multiple people. Or, as was the case at the time, characters in a completely separate universe. The average audience wouldn't care if they said they were bringing Obsidian back.

 

[Fromtheblackdepths]

I think the name was the big one. It feels like they deliberately chose a hero a lot of non-comic readers would recognize as being one of the "big" ones, but probably don't realize references multiple people. Or, as was the case at the time, characters in a completely separate universe. The average audience wouldn't care if they said they were bringing Obsidian back.

 

[Bungus Scrungus]

Since people mentioned Ennis, the one thing I find hilarious that the irish bastard gets all hung up on and upset about is Captain America. An American super hero. If he's going to complain about "durr it's offensive to ww2 veterans" maybe he should complain about Captain Britain instead? Funny enough, those claims of him being offensive fell flat because, you know; actual US Army members read that shit. Jack Kirby, who was one of the two men who created him and drew him, actually served in WWII. Yeah, "well researched in military history" my ass. What a dumb Mick.

 

[Water-T]

Obsidian was gay, why couldn't they (DC) use him?

In the Nu52, the JSA were on Earth 2, and much, much younger. So Alan was not old enough to be the father of Jade and Obsidian, two kids in their twenties.

So making Alan gay was a substitute for his gay son Obsidian not existing in canon anymore.