Red Letter Media

[Honka Honka Burning Love]

I adore the Star Wars prequels as comedies so my definition of "bad" may vary. But as with such a huge series I think I'll hazard watching it with a friend who's already a big fan, since they've been trying to convert me for years.

There is shit worse than the prequels, I shit you not.

I will watch the Prequels over movie 1 or 5 (at least the Prequels are over in 2 hours unlike The Motion Picture.)

 

[Doctor of Autism]

I think this review plays better for people who have seen Picard. I haven't watched any nuTrek since the JJ Abrams abortions, so I'm out of the loop. Trek has been on a downhill slide since best of both worlds. There were gems afterwards, but nothing ever got better than that two-parter.

And that was a really long time ago. It's time to let go.

Honestly I never watched any NuTrek stuff so I think this review is pretty good, I think it’s best if you watched the Picard reviews that Mike and Rich did

 

[RomanesEuntDomus]

I think this review plays better for people who have seen Picard. I haven't watched any nuTrek since the JJ Abrams abortions, so I'm out of the loop. Trek has been on a downhill slide since best of both worlds. There were gems afterwards, but nothing ever got better than that two-parter.

And that was a really long time ago. It's time to let go.

Yeah, I felt the same way, the start was a bit slow and having not seen anything from the new shows aside Rich and Mike talking about it and particularly not having seen anything regarding the end of Picard, I didn't really get much out of a few of the comments about the show, since it seemed to assume that I already am familiar with the plot and the ending to a farther degree than "Picard dies and turns into a robot". Which is sort of a shame, but it picked up later on, thankfully, and still was a pretty entertaining ride.

Still, not a substitute for Rich and Mike disecting the Finale point by point like they did with the previous shows. Was there a public comment that I missed by Rich or RLM in general? I assume the finale was just such a shitshow that Rich refused to talk about it, since everything has been said: It's bad writing, bad characters, bad pacing, bad consistency, bad logic and it shits on everything that made old Trek so good.

We've reached a point where I would give my left hand to have a wholesome space opera with smart characters and a cozy atmosphere, resolving conflicts without violence as far as they can, preferably a show that doesn't try to be a comedy.
But we can't have nice things.

I adore the Star Wars prequels as comedies so my definition of "bad" may vary. But as with such a huge series I think I'll hazard watching it with a friend who's already a big fan, since they've been trying to convert me for years.

Something a lot of people say is, that it picks up in Season 2.

 

[A Ghost]

Still, not a substitute for Rich and Mike disecting the Finale point by point like they did with the previous shows. Was there a public comment that I missed by Rich or RLM in general? I assume the finale was just such a shitshow that Rich refused to talk about it, since everything has been said

rich is in a bunker somewhere just in case we need to repopulate after this coronavirus outbreak

 

[Twinkletard]

Yeah, I felt the same way, the start was a bit slow and having not seen anything from the new shows aside Rich and Mike talking about it and particularly not having seen anything regarding the end of Picard, I didn't really get much out of a few of the comments about the show, since it seemed to assume that I already am familiar with the plot and the ending to a farther degree than "Picard dies and turns into a robot". Which is sort of a shame, but it picked up later on, thankfully, and still was a pretty entertaining ride.

Still, not a substitute for Rich and Mike disecting the Finale point by point like they did with the previous shows. Was there a public comment that I missed by Rich or RLM in general? I assume the finale was just such a shitshow that Rich refused to talk about it, since everything has been said: It's bad writing, bad characters, bad pacing, bad consistency, bad logic and it shits on everything that made old Trek so good.

We've reached a point where I would give my left hand to have a wholesome space opera with smart characters and a cozy atmosphere, resolving conflicts without violence as far as they can, preferably a show that doesn't try to be a comedy.
But we can't have nice things.

The problem with Star Trek is that hollywood types just don't get why the original series was so popular. It was optimistic humanism and every episode was self contained. You could literally sit down for the evening, not see a single episode from a season and still enjoy an episode. Every episode was about people working together to overcome a problem and they did it without fighting with each other, being pessimistic, or cursing. My family would watch Star Trek together when I was a kid; I couldn't imagine letting my kids watch these new shows. I'd feel like I was showing them porn.

Hollywood Jews, man. Just the fucking worst.

 

[Honka Honka Burning Love]

Was there a public comment that I missed by Rich or RLM in general? I assume the finale was just such a shitshow that Rich refused to talk about it,

I think it just hurt them enough that they couldn't just sit there and talk about it. In the last RE:View they did Rich had already said the only thing he really needed to say about Picard, that last bit with the direct comparison is basically how Rich summed up his feelings about Nu-trek.

I don't think we are gonna see more RE:Views on star trek discovery or Picard, Much like Star Wars..there is nothing left o Star Trek to care about.

It's dead Jim.

 

[RomanesEuntDomus]

The problem with Star Trek is that hollywood types just don't get why the original series was so popular. It was optimistic humanism and every episode was self contained. You could literally sit down for the evening, not see a single episode from a season and still enjoy an episode. Every episode was about people working together to overcome a problem and they did it without fighting with each other, being pessimistic, or cursing. My family would watch Star Trek together when I was a kid; I couldn't imagine letting my kids watch these new shows. I'd feel like I was showing them porn.

Hollywood Trump's Chosen People, man. Just the fucking worst.

Yeah. Like everything nowadays, we need every show to be political, or should I say POLITICAL? It's so in-your-face, it deserves allcaps. It must be FUCK DRUMPF at all corners, it needs to be abou refugees and strong women and lesbians and space islam and FUCK DRUMPF FUCK DRUMPF FUCK DRUCMPFAD FAK DRAMBRLUMP and I just can't take this shit anymore. It ruins everything.

You could get pretty neat political messages in old Star Trek and I would say that the old Star Trek was more bold in what it did. TOS had the first interracial kiss and an ethnically mixed crew, containing a black woman during a time when Jim Crow Laws were still a big issue, it contained a Russian guy during the peak years of the Cold War, it contained a Japanese guy 2 decades after WW2... TOS took risks. TNG had a strong humanitarian tilt, where issues would be resolved with kindness, understanding, diplomacy... and it would only use violence when everything else failed and it would still ask the question of "Could we have done better?". Hell, even Voyager had a decent episode, featuring Neelix of all people, that dealt with the remorse of a scientist that invented a WMD that obliterated an entire planet. It deals with Neelix' PTSD and the Scientists guilt and how he wants to put things right and seems like a rather obvious stab at the nuclear bomb and their use in WW2.
What does STD or STP offer? "FUCK DRUMPPPPPPPPPPF" being screamed at the top of its lungs into a void of identical screams. It has the boldness to say what everybody else is already saying. It has the boldness to agree with what everybody else is already agreeing. It is bold enough to take no risks. It is despicable and smug.
TOS has a strong message of intercultural understanding in every scene with the main cast, far stronger than any message in STD or STP combined.
TNG, Voyager and DS9, even ENT, show the ideals of a future without hate... or at least they try to. DS9 shows the ideals of Star Fleet and the Federation at odds with an overwhelming enemy. Voyager is a hodgepodge of badly written nonsense at times, that celebrates the importance of the prime directive one episode and flings it into the trash the next. But Voyager still has a recurring theme of the Crew prefering to stick to their ideals rather than using a shortcut to get home quicker.

And now we have filthy shows like STD and STP, you can't even imagine how sad I am at scenes like that cunt of an admiral using the word "Fuck".

I want my optimistic humanism back. I want a fun show with fun characters, not miserable people being accused of their "fucking hubris" for trying to help people.

 

[Flexo]

I assumed the analysis was hard to follow cause the show was so nonsensical

Halfway through the video myself and I think what's confusing some folks (and it could have been explained a bit clearer) is that Plinkett is doing what a lot of authors (especially of mysteries) SHOULD do: A back and forth check. Do the questions & answers at the start of the story, make sense when you look at it with knowledge from the end of the story. A proper mystery will flow smoothly if you look at it either way - backwards or forwards.

I was having some fun with this in the Star Wars thread as the prequels are a pretty good example of this. Just ask yourself: "What if the heroes failed here and the villains plans proceeded as they intended?" and you'll realize they don't make any sense.

Likewise with Picard. If you rewatch the beginning with knowledge of where it's going, a lot of it makes no sense.

 

[Miller]

The montage at the end with Sisko's speech was well done. It's the end of an era. Now it's all about the power of math and fucking hubris.
I wonder how Ketwolski will bend over backwards to defend KurtzmanTrek from RLM/Plinkett.

Galactic Treaty

I can't believe I've missed that when I saw the episode.
KurtzmanTrek is made by and for the jocks/fake geeks.

We did it, Reddit!
View attachment 1304997

Not a surprise, they went full damage control and banned RLM videos after their review of the second season of STD. Like I said in the Star Trek thread, there are very few places where you can criticize KurtzmanTrek.

 

[mandatorylurk]

I was expecting a stronger callout about the wannabe Reapers from Mass Effect about how the 4 Horsemen poorly ripped off a game that got lots of inspiration from Star Trek in the first place. "Being gay is now a choice," it's a very solid point that Mike makes that won't get traction and dismissed because it's from Mike, and the breadtube media critics would get their ideological wires mixed up to justify it.

 

[Mola Ram]

I was expecting a stronger callout about the wannabe Reapers from Mass Effect about how the 4 Horsemen poorly ripped off a game that got lots of inspiration from Star Trek in the first place.

If Mike is the driving creative force behind the Plinkett reviews, and that does seem to be the case, you'll never see something like this. Mike is not a gamer, and had to have the Mass Effect, uh, "similarities" pointed out to him by Rich Evans. It is shockingly obvious, though. This was the first time I'd seen any footage from the final episodes, and the space octopus is such a brazen ripoff of the Reapers that I couldn't believe they got away with it. (Then again, the Reapers are kind of a mechanized ripoff of the Assassins from Frederik Pohl's Gateway series, so who knows where it all started. The visuals were straight from Mass Effect, though.)

 

[RomanesEuntDomus]

I can't believe I've missed that when I saw the episode.
KurtzmanTrek is made by and for the jocks/fake geeks.

Rich observed that in one of their STD Episodes (also holy fuck, how can they make a show that is literally abbreviated STD without realizing how fucking stupid that is?), mainstream Sci-Fi is no longer made for the nerds, it's made for jocks that want to see AWSUM EXPLOSHUNS IN SPEHS. STD didn't even understand the basic concept of the speed of light being finite, and it clearly didn't expect the audience to know or care. If that basic idea can't make it into their scripts, what storytelling can we expect.

I am so unbelievably happy we got The Expanse. It doesn't hit my "HUMANITY FUCK YEAH" spots for Sci-Fi, where humans are noble, benevolent, understanding and respectful towards each other and especially to others, but it gives me smart Sci-Fi with a great plot and characters.

I was expecting a stronger callout about the wannabe Reapers from Mass Effect about how the 4 Horsemen poorly ripped off a game that got lots of inspiration from Star Trek in the first place. "Being gay is now a choice," it's a very solid point that Mike makes that won't get traction and dismissed because it's from Mike, and the breadtube media critics would get their ideological wires mixed up to justify it.

That and "mistrust people that are different", both appear to be very valid points in relation to nuTrek, so of course it's gonna be the last we ever heard of it...

 

[stuffandthings]

I adore the Star Wars prequels as comedies so my definition of "bad" may vary. But as with such a huge series I think I'll hazard watching it with a friend who's already a big fan, since they've been trying to convert me for years.

The TOS is best if you watch it by liking the main cast, and laughing at the plots. It's basically Bonanza in space.

 

[Flexo]

If Mike is the driving creative force behind the Plinkett reviews, and that does seem to be the case, you'll never see something like this. Mike is not a gamer, and had to have the Mass Effect, uh, "similarities" pointed out to him by Rich Evans. It is shockingly obvious, though. This was the first time I'd seen any footage from the final episodes, and the space octopus is such a brazen ripoff of the Reapers that I couldn't believe they got away with it. (Then again, the Reapers are kind of a mechanized ripoff of the Assassins from Frederik Pohl's Gateway series, so who knows where it all started. The visuals were straight from Mass Effect, though.)

I've been disappointed major grin's videos have barely scratched the surface of the mass effect/Picard similarities. I keep hoping to find someone doing an in depth side by side of both but only find snippets.

(I'd do it myself but i don't have access to either source.)

 

[Mola Ram]

I've been disappointed major grin's videos have barely scratched the surface of the mass effect/Picard similarities. I keep hoping to find someone doing an in depth side by side of both but only find snippets.

(I'd do it myself but i don't have access to either source.)

I think the reason it sticks out like a sore thumb and makes it feel so very un-Star Trek is because the conflict between man and artificial life was never a defining element of the series. You had Data, obviously, but that was framed more as a philosophical issue. You had the Borg, but that was more about the implacable, all-consuming nature of the Borg itself, and the horrors of collectivism more than the trouble with AI. You had "The Ultimate Computer," but there was a lot more going on there, especially considering the problems all seemed to stem from the AI's creator's neuroses than the machine itself. (You see, Flexo? Robots really are superior.) Man/machine conflicts were incidental, not a fundamental part of the fictional world.

 

[Reverend]

Watched the review and this was the same type of Plinket review from his early days of bagging on the phantom menace. It had depth, it had points it wanted to make, and it showed you the audience why his points were accurate. Picard is a hot mess of ideas and ranks up there with shows that let the main actors write their own parts but are horrible at it while the producers are babbling "OH SO STRONK! SO BRAV! SO TRU!" and clapping at the idiocy. Fart sniffing is appropo symbolism for this entire show.

Now with Season 2 they want to do firefly remake with a crew of AA rejects and killers that no one likes, that has no backstory or history, and then have ZombieStew lead them? But why? Why is that interesting? Why is this world interesting? This whole universe is flooded with sensory overload going at Mach 69 that you'd need an entire crew of android just to keep up with what's going on. That's not even to say if the writers know what goes on with Ep 1 will pay off in later episodes or be forgotten about. We've seen that with Discovery which RLM has dissected into gory detail.

Give Kurtzman his Section 31 show and tell him to go fuck off into oblivion. Let someone who knows about the franchise write about the world in a timeline that isn't full of hopelessness, fast and furious dopamine rushes, and where you don't swear at everything and drown yourself into a barrel of bloodwine because that's what winemoms do.

Early Trek was dark, dreary, and depressing, but there was hope and optimism in the darkness, it was there and it shone in the writing and the sets that weren't made by OMGCGILENSFLARE creations. The writers and directors had to try as they didn't have TEHSHINY to cover up their sloppy hot mess of nonsensical show.

This is why I won't watch any of the Nu-Trek and prefer RLM reviews as I can waste my life watching anything else other than shit that is designed to make me go "WHY ARE YOU DOING THAT!??!" at the TV screen.

PS. Go watch Ozark, great show. Jason Bateman should get Star Trek next.

 

[trekkor]

I don't have much to add to what has already been said ITT, but damn good review. Even with Mike doing his Plinkett voice you could hear how disappointed he was with the direction Trek has taken in recent years. This was personal to him, moreso than SW, which, let's be completely honest, has more overall shit entries to its canon than Trek. Also appreciated Mike adding clips from ENT. I am a big fan of it and its cheesy, yet catchy opening song, and I like when people actually look back on it and admit it still had the heart of Trek, despite its faults.

I also can't believe I missed so many stupid things from Picard that Mike brought up. Like, I didn't even realise Oh revealing herself in the final "battle" was retarded (I think I was completely zoned out at that point). I guess even with writing all my thoughts down while watching the episodes, there was just too much obvious bad writing a single person could take in.

 

[Starscreams Cape]

I have never felt better about my decision to eject after E2 of Picard than after seeing this. It just seemed so incomprehensible and dumb. Really, really dumb.

Bonus points for the swipes at Wil Wheaton. Low hanging fruit but it must be done so long as he is getting even this pathetic amount of work.

 

[Y2K Baby]

Star Trek has always been libtard.

 

[Secret Asshole]

The sad thing is that Seth McFarlane does Trek better with the Orville, but he clearly wants Trek for real. I say give Trek to McFarlane wholesale. Fuck Patrick Stewart. Giving an egotistical actor access to a shit-tier writer's room is the worst fucking thing to do.

I've not given a shit since Abrams trek and just want Bad Robot out of business in general as I think they are part of the problem with modern television and movies (they undercut other production companies and generally have trash talent under them).

But Picard was obviously going to be this waste of time. There is no point to it.