Red Dead 3/Red Dead Redemption 2 - IT'S HAPPENING.gif

[Snekposter]

You can't have both. Either Dutch was always a bad man manipulating everyone and Arthur redeemed himself by seeing through it and saving John and his family, or there was nothing to actually redeem.

To me what happens after the return from Guarma was all about a high honor Arthur looking back on his life of evil and deciding to do some good with what little time he had left. Certainly not any sort of grand redemption arc considering one of those missions is explicitly named Do Not Seek Absolution and he straight up tells Edith Downes he isn't looking for forgiveness.

I ain't looking for forgiveness... it ain't about that. Don't forgive me... just take the money and get outta here, please. I know I ruined your life. I suffer for it every day, but... don't let yourself get killed for... for pride. I seen it kill too many folk.

He's well aware he's paying the price for his sins, and he knows he has it coming, especially when you talk with the nun later at the train station and he tells her how he got TB by beating Thomas Downes half to death. Its past time for him, and he knows it. He's just being loyal to the end with John and Abigail, to maybe give them and Jack a way out and a new chance at life so they don't end up like him, Jack especially.

Which of course is ironic considering what happens at the end of RDR. All Jack had to do was walk away.

 

[Bunny Tracks]

Like, a lot of RDR2 fans are kind of retarded. Or maybe it's just the ones who talk on reddit.

The ones on reddit are retarded.

When they're not sucking Arthur's dick, and getting into stupid slapfights over horses, they're posting the same shit that's been posted, and asked a million times before, and complaining about how they won't play the first game because it's not on PC.

 

[William Murderface]

To me what happens after the return from Guarma was all about a high honor Arthur looking back on his life of evil and deciding to do some good with what little time he had left. Certainly not any sort of grand redemption arc considering one of those missions is explicitly named Do Not Seek Absolution and he straight up tells Edith Downes he isn't looking for forgiveness.

He's well aware he's paying the price for his sins, and he knows he has it coming, especially when you talk with the nun later at the train station and he tells her how he got TB by beating Thomas Downes half to death. Its past time for him, and he knows it. He's just being loyal to the end with John and Abigail, to maybe give them and Jack a way out and a new chance at life so they don't end up like him, Jack especially.

Which of course is ironic considering what happens at the end of RDR. All Jack had to do was walk away.

I agree. Arthur's redemption came because he stayed loyal to the gang long after the gang stop being loyal to each other. Not to Dutch's plans of grandeur, but he kept trying to get everyone, including Dutch, see what was happening around them. After the last train robbery when the they're riding back to camp and Tilly tells them Milton has Abigail and Dutch cuts her loose, all of them are there, even Javier and Bill, and only Arthur argues to even try to save her. That gang that was so tight-knit at the beginning is well and truly dead right then and there. But Dutch, Bill, and Javier (forget about Micah, who was always about himself) ride off without her simply because they had the money. So it's up to Sadie and Arthur to save her. Then with the high honor ending where you choose to save John and he tells Micah, "despite my best efforts, it's turned out I've won." He saved John, Abigail, and Jack and gave them a shot at a normal life. He even tells Dutch as much when he's at the very end and says, "No. John made it. He's the only one. The others? No. I tried. In the end, I did." He tried to get the rest of the gang to see Dutch's plan was going to end up getting them all killed and only John took the opportunity to leave for something else.

I think Arthur's biggest problem was his sense of loyalty to Dutch. He wanted to do the right things, and he does when Dutch isn't around (all the side missions plus the Wapiti missions until Dutch gets involved and uses Eagle Flies), and even Sister Calderone mentions to him how he likes helping people, but he felt that Dutch saved him and he needed to stick with Dutch no matter what. Not to mention that he genuinely loved Hosea like the father he didn't have. You see it in his interactions with Mary, who basically told him he couldn't have both that normal life we wanted with her and Dutch and that was why she walked.* She tells him again when they go on their "date" after getting her brooch back and in that letter that he is "wrestling a giant and the giant wins time and again." He even recognizes it when he meets Sister Calderon at the train station and tells her he "had a girl who loved me and I threw that away." It isn't until he is told he has TB and time is short, that he gets that he has to do something. Like he said "we can't change what's done, we can only move forward," but he can do what he can to save those he loves at that point. He isn't going to atone for killing Mr. Downes and sending Mrs. Downes to work on her back and Archie to labor to death in a mine, but he can make sure that stops and gives them the money to start a new live.

I guess Arthur's redemption comes when he finally accepts that Dutch isn't worth fighting for but John and his family are.

* He must have learned his lesson because he tells John the same thing in regards to Jack when they're stealing sheep. He can be a criminal or a father, but not both, but he needs to choose one or the other for the boy's sake.

 

[Agarathium1066]

The ones on reddit are retarded.

When they're not sucking Arthur's dick, and getting into stupid slapfights over horses

Alright that sounds hilarious. Please do elaborate.

 

[xXx: State of the Union]

To me what happens after the return from Guarma was all about a high honor Arthur looking back on his life of evil and deciding to do some good with what little time he had left. Certainly not any sort of grand redemption arc considering one of those missions is explicitly named Do Not Seek Absolution and he straight up tells Edith Downes he isn't looking for forgiveness.

I mean, I think a low honor until Guarma playthrough works well too. I just wish Micah would still shoot you in the head with that because it feels so dumb for him to not shoot Arthur at the end.

It's just the weird idea that Arthur is this high honor dude from the start that feels wrong. Especially when in the final act Arthur comes to his sense and see's that it was always an act and they were never really doing any good. It just makes him look like an even bigger retard for not seeing through it and leaving earlier.

 

[William Murderface]

The counterpoint is there are missions right from the start, like any of Strauss' loansharking beatings, that he despises. He does them out of guilt (Strauss says something about that being how they get money to feed the children of the camp). Low Honor Arthur wouldn't even care that he beat a lunger like Downes and threatened his wife and son.

I think Arthur knew the robbing and killing the gang engaged in was wrong, but still went along with it because Dutch said to and he was loyal to Dutch, and like the saying goes, "after the first felony, the rest are free."

It's funny that of all the characters in the gang, none of them were there because they were willingly rejecting society and wanted that freer life he kept talking about. They were all there either out of desperation or because they chose to be criminals. Hosea was a conman, Mary Beth an orphan and her prospects were become a thief or a whore, Javier was hungry, etc. Dutch knew to find desperate people and convince them he had a better way. Even Arthur and John were both recruited as children who had terrible lives before Dutch and Hosea showed up.

 

[Bunny Tracks]

Alright that sounds hilarious. Please do elaborate.

Basically, the fans on reddit really hate Arabians, and if anyone says they use them or even just says they like them, dozens of retards will suddenly act personally offended, and start bitching about them being small, and scared of everything even though horse bravery is fucking randomized in this game.

When asked why they care so much about what horses other people use in their own damn game, they make up some bullshit about so-called "Arabian fanboys" constantly harassing them, or say they just want to "help people explore their options" even though that makes no fucking sense because it's extremely unlikely the players wouldn't have tried out all the different horses on their own.

 

[HeyYou]

Another story complaint that American Krogan also makes:
It genuinely bothers me how many people played RDR2 and walked away thinking there was any redemption (which clearly was the intention) or that Arthur became a good man. He dies in a shootout with lawmen going about their rightful business trying to stop a band of murderers and thieves from continuing their murdering and thieving, so he can help his fellow murderer and thief get off scot free. But Arthur is a good man because he's learned to be friends with that particular murderer and thief (over some other murderers and thieves). Similarly, Arthur directly caused the death of a man and the ruin of his family through his thuggery, but because he feels really sorry about it (facing imminent Hell) and makes a half-assed attempt at fixing it (that never can), he gets the approval of the man's widow-turned-prostitute.

I don't mind playing as a criminal, but I like it when the story is aware that the criminal is a bad guy. GTA: San Andreas has things in it to make the Grove Street Families (to borrow some faggy TV Tropes talk) "neighborhood friendly gangsters" like going up against corrupt cops and not selling hard drugs, but I don't feel like the game actually makes them out to be good people as such. Mafia 3 similarly has you on the "right side" of evil vs evil but is explicit about the fact that you're still wrong, as evidenced by, say, the Catholic priest character acting as the conscience and the final conversation between the don and the gangbanger fighting him.

Redemption in Red Dead Redemption's world is cheap, it doesn't require mending the wounds you caused or making sacrifices, doesn't require a change of life. And as an amoral story about one man's troubles - pure adventure - that's fine. But when I see people talking up Arthur Morgan like a great hero, it makes me question how strong of a sense of morality those people have in real life.

I'm reminded of a book I read, The Shootist. I can't actually remember if the main character was an outlaw in that or just a gunslinger, but either way the man lead a dissolute and violent life and ends up facing a slow and painful death by prostate cancer. He holes himself up in a hotel to wait out his end, and along the way is hounded by people trying to turn a buck off his death, ghosts of his past just there to remind him how unwanted he is by the world, opportunists looking to shoot a sick man to claim some glory, and lawmen who want to pressure him out of town just to get rid of the headache. It's a bleak, depressing story, and is painful in how you see him degenerate physically until just living is a pain, and finally he goes out one day, knowing he can't carry on anymore, and shoots three of the bad hombres in a duel - a good deed to the town - and leaves his money to the respectable lady who's been taking care of him. The gunslinger lead a life not worth living and he, in the end, gets a little bit of redemption by sacrificing his life in a way that helps a few people, normal people.

The difference between John and the other murderers and thieves is that John is, like Arthur, slowly waking up to the reality of what the gang actually is behind Dutch's platitudes, and that is a bunch of murderers and thieves. John escaping and starting a new life for himself isn't justice after what the gang has done, sure, but he realizes how destructive and wasteful their life is and at least wants to do start anew, go legit, and raise his son to be better than him. Arthur respects that and at the very least trying to get a child and his mother away from a bunch of outlaws is definitely a good deed.

 

[William Murderface]

The difference between John and the other murderers and thieves is that John is, like Arthur, slowly waking up to the reality of what the gang actually is behind Dutch's platitudes, and that is a bunch of murderers and thieves. John escaping and starting a new life for himself isn't justice after what the gang has done, sure, but he realizes how destructive and wasteful their life is and at least wants to do start anew, go legit, and raise his son to be better than him. Arthur respects that and at the very least trying to get a child and his mother away from a bunch of outlaws is definitely a good deed.

And those same outlaws who talked a big deal about they were a family were going to leave John to die in prison instead of demanding Dutch break him out, were going to let Abigail be tried for murder because they had the money instead, and watched Micah murder Mrs. Grimshaw and sided with Dutch when he made it about him "Which of you is with me and who is betraying me?" (although Javier wasn't there for that and only came a few seconds later to tell everyone the Pinkertons were on their way but Bill was).

Of all the victims in those games, it's Jack that is truly heartbreaking, Every time the kid has any stability in his life it is ripped away. Blackwater goes bad, they have to move. Every camp they go to, they have to leave in a hurry. All those gang members keep dying or running away. He's kidnapped and used as a pawn, there's a massive gunfight right outside his walls (when the O'Driscolls attack Shady Belle and Kieran gets his head cut off), he's told his mother is captured and Dutch isn't going to do anything about it, his family wanders for years while they are on the run, he gets to watch his father gun down three men right in front of him, his parents fight all the time, his mother finally leaves his father, and then when they do finally have a few years of peace, the government rolls up and he's kidnapped again to be a pawn. Uncle dies right in front of him, he hears his father die, his mother dies young, and all that pain and anger in him finally comes out when he hunts down Ross.

And that was the very last thing Abigail, John, or Arthur would have wanted for Jack.

 

[Bunny Tracks]

Of all the victims in those games, it's Jack that is truly heartbreaking, Every time the kid has any stability in his life it is ripped away. Blackwater goes bad, they have to move. Every camp they go to, they have to leave in a hurry. All those gang members keep dying or running away. He's kidnapped and used as a pawn, there's a massive gunfight right outside his walls (when the O'Driscolls attack Shady Belle and Kieran gets his head cut off), he's told his mother is captured and Dutch isn't going to do anything about it, his family wanders for years while they are on the run, he gets to watch his father gun down three men right in front of him, his parents fight all the time, his mother finally leaves his father, and then when they do finally have a few years of peace, the government rolls up and he's kidnapped again to be a pawn. Uncle dies right in front of him, he hears his father die, his mother dies young, and all that pain and anger in him finally comes out when he hunts down Ross.

And that was the very last thing Abigail, John, or Arthur would have wanted for Jack.

This is why I want RDR3, if they ever make it, to be about Jack.

I don't care if it's not a pure western anymore. I don't care if it's some kind of Mafia-esque game. I wanna see what happens to him because they've set up his backstory for two games, and to just ignore that, and focus on some other rando, or go even further back in time, and play as a young Dutch, or Arthur, or something is so fucking dumb imo.

We already know how their stories end. We don't know how Jack's does, and that's what I want to see.

Yes, I know you can find a book written by him in GTA V. I still wanna game.

 

[Snekposter]

The difference between John and the other murderers and thieves is that John is, like Arthur, slowly waking up to the reality of what the gang actually is behind Dutch's platitudes, and that is a bunch of murderers and thieves. John escaping and starting a new life for himself isn't justice after what the gang has done, sure, but he realizes how destructive and wasteful their life is and at least wants to do start anew, go legit, and raise his son to be better than him. Arthur respects that and at the very least trying to get a child and his mother away from a bunch of outlaws is definitely a good deed.

Na, Hosea actually wakes up and realizes what's going on. Down at Clemens Point you can hear him talk about how the gang are nothing more than murderers and they don't even bother to pretend otherwise, and later at Shady Belle he talks to Lenny to try and get him into legal thieving, like banking or practicing law. He's still trying to keep it together though despite Dutch, probably because he doesn't have anywhere else to go or anything to do. His wife is dead, and John and Arthur are the children he never had.

This is why I want RDR3, if they ever make it, to be about Jack.

I don't care if it's not a pure western anymore. I don't care if it's some kind of Mafia-esque game. I wanna see what happens to him because they've set up his backstory for two games, and to just ignore that, and focus on some other rando, or go even further back in time, and play as a young Dutch, or Arthur, or something is so fucking dumb imo.

We already know how their stories end. We don't know how Jack's does, and that's what I want to see.

Yes, I know you can find a book written by him in GTA V. I still wanna game.

They could set it in the Roaring Twenties, him in his late twenties. He's 19 in 1914, which would make him 22 when the USA joines WW1 in 1917, or a suitable age to volunteer to get away from something (like say dealings with Mexican banditos), so could start it a couple years after he comes back trying to live a normal life like his father wanted for him, and then something from his past shows up and he has to join or start up a gang of auto bandits to survive. Hell, could set the prologue during the Punitive Expedition where he decides to tag along as a local scout and winds up joining the military afterwards because he views it as a way out of his life on the run and looking over his shoulder. Could start off the game proper with him writing a book about some of his experiences in the Army before, during. and after WW1 as a way to fill in the missing blanks, and then history comes calling.

"Things aren't too different now than they were back then. Everyone's still got Colts on their hips and Winchesters on their shoulders, and the horseless carriage is close enough to a horse when it comes right down to it." Could even set it in the same place as the earlier RDRs. That whole stretch along the border is still wild even today after all, never mind the 1920's, and like I said above, you've got the historical Punitive Expedition in 1916, two years after the epilogue of RDR1.

Frankly it would be more like Mad Max than Mafia as you buy and upgrade cars, but that's not exactly a bad thing.

EDIT: Keep in mind The Last Enemy That Shall Be Destroyed has a 16 year old Jack showing talent with a lathe even if he's a poor shot (at least by his father's reckoning), so there's plenty of room for tinkering and craftsmanship to separate him from John or Arthur in terms of gameplay and gameplay features. He'd definitely be more like Hosea than either of them, preferring to have something up his sleeve when things hit the fan instead of just raw gunslinging.

"No. John made it. He's the only one. The others? No. I tried. In the end, I did."

There are few lines in RDR2 more impactful than that. Arthur knew everyone's only shot, even his, was to give up this life. Its the whole reason Dutch has convinced everyone to stick with him: one big score and everyone is off to Tahiti or Australia or somewhere far away from here. Honestly the lines from the blind totally-not-seer are pretty interesting.

I see the morrows and see them clearly, sir. Even when all reason is lost, and all truth has become lie, you will stand firm. For loyalty is both your saving and your curse.

Loyalty cursed him to stand with Dutch to the end... and loyalty had him make one final stand to save that which was not yet lost. And yes, there's a reason the final mission is called Red Dead Redemption. IMO it isn't because its Arthur's redemption, but because its John's redemption and chance to start over. Its the end of Arthur's story, and the start of his.


Jack really needs a fucking shave and a haircut though for RDR3. That greaser look works on Javier, not a kid who preferred to read books instead of doing anything outdoors.

 

[William Murderface]

This is why I want RDR3, if they ever make it, to be about Jack.

I don't. I know he's a fictional character, but he has suffered enough. Arthur died to give John a chance, John and Uncle died to give Jack a chance, and I want Jack to finally have peace now that he's gotten revenge on Ross. None of the adults in his life who cared for him wanted him to end up as an outlaw and I just don't want to see him go down that path. I want to see Jack have the happiness those adults fought and died for.

I know, it's irrational to care that much about a fictional character, but after those two games, it's like I know the members of the Van Der Lind Gang better than I know some real life people.

 

[Bunny Tracks]

I don't. I know he's a fictional character, but he has suffered enough. Arthur died to give John a chance, John and Uncle died to give Jack a chance, and I want Jack to finally have peace now that he's gotten revenge on Ross. None of the adults in his life who cared for him wanted him to end up as an outlaw and I just don't want to see him go down that path. I want to see Jack have the happiness those adults fought and died for.

I know, it's irrational to care that much about a fictional character, but after those two games, it's like I know the members of the Van Der Lind Gang better than I know some real life people.

It's okay, dude. I know just how you feel.

I'm the same way with Charles. He's just such a bro that I don't want anything to happen to him, and it's why I'm mad that he goes to Canada at the end of the game because if the RDR world is anything like ours, he, and his descendants are going to be treated like absolute shit for basically the entire next century.

 

[Agarathium1066]

Basically, the fans on reddit really hate Arabians, and if anyone says they use them or even just says they like them, dozens of retards will suddenly act personally offended, and start bitching about them being small, and scared of everything even though horse bravery is fucking randomized in this game.

When asked why they care so much about what horses other people use in their own damn game, they make up some bullshit about so-called "Arabian fanboys" constantly harassing them, or say they just want to "help people explore their options" even though that makes no fucking sense because it's extremely unlikely the players wouldn't have tried out all the different horses on their own.

IS bravery totally randomized? I never knew that since its a hidden stat. I personally don't think Arabians are my favorite but they're still really good. Its just that an unbonded one will shit itself and run if its near a predator so you should dismount or be mindful of it. Its really not all that difficult to get used to. Hell from what I've seen in videos and my own play experience the largest difference is the handling trait and you can get around just fine on whatever horse you happen to fancy. High end saddles do half the work.

I am not shocked to find out that there's high caliber horse autism in the reddit community.

It's okay, dude. I know just how you feel.

I'm the same way with Charles. He's just such a bro that I don't want anything to happen to him, and it's why I'm mad that he goes to Canada at the end of the game because if the RDR world is anything like ours, he, and his descendants are going to be treated like absolute shit for basically the entire next century.

He's half black and half native there's no getting away from being treated like dogshit for him. I think the character was well aware of it and just wanted to get a lot of distance away from his criminal past.

Should they ever make an RDR3 (and its not dogshit) I hope they set it earlier in the timeline and not really touch the Van Derlinde gang much if at all. I think that ground has been trodden enough.

Maybe actually follow Red Harlowe or Uncle before all of it. At least the latter lives long enough that there's no 'died horribly and early' curse to know about like John.

 

[Hard Toothbrush]

If I may interrupt the story and character talk: anyone tried installing the Lenny Mod Loader on the most recent cracked version (1436.28 )?
Can't get it to work as the game keeps crashing on startup. Tried using version 10 and 9 of LML and version 9 does get into the pre-main menu videos but crashes there.

 

[Bunny Tracks]

IS bravery totally randomized? I never knew that since its a hidden stat. I personally don't think Arabians are my favorite but they're still really good. Its just that an unbonded one will shit itself and run if its near a predator so you should dismount or be mindful of it. Its really not all that difficult to get used to. Hell from what I've seen in videos and my own play experience the largest difference is the handling trait and you can get around just fine on whatever horse you happen to fancy. High end saddles do half the work.

I am not shocked to find out that there's high caliber horse autism in the reddit community.

It's looking like it is. Horse bravery, and whether, or not it's an actual predetermined stat has been a source of major debate since the game came out.

To cut a long story short, horse bravery was supposed to be its own stat in the game, but it was taken out. It was thought to be still active in the game, but just hidden, but when people looked into the code nothing was found. Multiple people have done tests to see whether, or not it exists, and they all come back as being either inconclusive, or they just end up contradicting each other.

The main consensus now is that there most likely is something in the game involving horse bravery, but that it probably is just random, and if anything, has more to do with how well your horse is doing at the time, how much you've bonded with it, and how much you've actually used it than its actual breed.

However, there appear to be at least two horses in the game that according to most players' accounts, are always brave, or at least, have the highest chance of being brave, and that's the Black Shire, and Buell.

Again, nothing has been found in the code, but players have reported that these horses consistently don't end up being as nearly skittish as other ones, and further evidence within the game's own dialogue, and in-story details imply that are in fact supposed to be brave as Hosea mentioned the Shire is "tough, and mean", and Buell's previous owner, Hamish, often used him to hunt dangerous animals, and also said he had a "strong, and stubborn personality".

To put it simply, considering how much of stickler for details this game is, having these lines mean nothing would be really weird.

Tl;dr: Probably, but if there's some horses where that isn't the case, the strongest candidates are the Black Shire, and Buell.

 

[Agarathium1066]

<excellent horse autism snip>

Again, nothing has been found in the code, but players have reported that these horses consistently don't end up being as nearly skittish as other ones, and further evidence within the game's own dialogue, and in-story details imply that are in fact supposed to be brave as Hosea mentioned the Shire is "tough, and mean", and Buell's previous owner, Hamish, often used him to hunt dangerous animals, and also said he had a "strong, and stubborn personality".

To put it simply, considering how much of stickler for details this game is, having these lines mean nothing would be really weird.

Tl;dr: Probably, but if there's some horses where that isn't the case, the strongest candidates are the Black Shire, and Buell.

I'd always presumed Buell was braver, I remember reading people working under the same assumption. He never dumped me off his back even while hunting but it could be confirmation bias. I kept the Shire from Hosea simply because I thought it was a charming animal despite being as clumsy as any other draft horse.

It's funny to hear that there's so much in the air about the game's horses. Even its wiki(s?) tend to be vague about some stats. At times I really do think there was meant to be so much more. Same deal with Online though that's because they realized it wasn't raking in the cash as much as GTA so they shoved it into the closet.

I've always presumed certain animals scare horses more than others but I don't know how to see if there's any actual truth behind it or if its just making assumptions.

 

[Bunny Tracks]

I'd always presumed Buell was braver, I remember reading people working under the same assumption. He never dumped me off his back even while hunting but it could be confirmation bias. I kept the Shire from Hosea simply because I thought it was a charming animal despite being as clumsy as any other draft horse.

It's funny to hear that there's so much in the air about the game's horses. Even its wiki(s?) tend to be vague about some stats. At times I really do think there was meant to be so much more. Same deal with Online though that's because they realized it wasn't raking in the cash as much as GTA so they shoved it into the closet.

I've always presumed certain animals scare horses more than others but I don't know how to see if there's any actual truth behind it or if its just making assumptions.

Buell, and the Black Shire have always been brave for me. I can really only remember one of them bucking me off once, and that was the Shire when I was hunting panthers, and one suddenly darted out of nowhere right in front of it.

Up until recently, the wikia wasn't very good when it came to information on the horses. Stats were often missing, or incorrect, and some specific details about certain horses were straight-up wrong like the claim that Baylock's condition worsened when Micah was freed from jail. It's gotten better, but for a long time you could just make up whatever you wanted, and post it as fact, and no one cared.

That last part has been theorized too, and if you really wanna go deep into the horse bravery stat autism, it's thought that maybe the horse's class (War/Work/Race/etc) affects what it's specifically brave to like war horses being specifically brave in battles, and shit.

 

[Agarathium1066]

Buell, and the Black Shire have always been brave for me. I can really only remember one of them bucking me off once, and that was the Shire when I was hunting panthers, and one suddenly darted out of nowhere right in front of it.

Up until recently, the wikia wasn't very good when it came to information on the horses. Stats were often missing, or incorrect, and some specific details about certain horses were straight-up wrong like the claim that Baylock's condition worsened when Micah was freed from jail. It's gotten better, but for a long time you could just make up whatever you wanted, and post it as fact, and no one cared.

That last part has been theorized too, and if you really wanna go deep into the horse bravery stat autism, it's thought that maybe the horse's class (War/Work/Race/etc) affects what it's specifically brave to like war horses being specifically brave in battles, and shit.

I'd actually noticed that some War horses seemed to get very easily scared by wild animals whereas they'd be far less spooked by being shot at. I just shrugged off inconsistencies because I assume the game was either lying to you, was coded poorly, or people were stupid. In Online as well I swear the horses lose their shit at completely different things when they feel like it.

I still don't get why they didn't bother making more clear stat layouts for the horses or allow you to simply customize them as you liked. Having very specific coats of the horses be stronger was arbitrary as hell. Like Thoroughbreds but don't like the Brindle? Eat shit!

 

[Bunny Tracks]

I'd actually noticed that some War horses seemed to get very easily scared by wild animals whereas they'd be far less spooked by being shot at. I just shrugged off inconsistencies because I assume the game was either lying to you, was coded poorly, or people were stupid. In Online as well I swear the horses lose their shit at completely different things when they feel like it.

I still don't get why they didn't bother making more clear stat layouts for the horses or allow you to simply customize them as you liked. Having very specific coats of the horses be stronger was arbitrary as hell. Like Thoroughbreds but don't like the Brindle? Eat shit!

I've noticed that too, but I've noticed some that are the exact opposite, and I'm honestly not sure what to make of it outside of the fact that it does point to bravery most likely being random.

Me too. You'd think considering how big of role horses play in this game, and for how detailed it is, they would have made things very obvious, but they didn't, and I have no idea why. I do agree that the lack of being able to make your own horse is also a huge missed opportunity because it seems like it would be an obvious thing to include, even if it was just a new game+ feature.