Pokémon (Not-So) Griefing Thread - Scarlet and Violet Released with 10 Million Copies in First 3 Days in Buggy States

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zyclonPD said:
Pokemon's biggest hurdle that they have with this game is unmet expectations. Most everything released on the switch so far has brought something new to the table. Mario advanced in some ways, Zelda advanced in some ways, even the new animal crossing game is going to have placeable furniture anywhere in the world not just the sandbox of your home.

every game has advanced to new hardware in some way shape or form even a shity game like animal crossing but the sore thumb sticking out for everybody to see is Game freak and their Pokemon game which is basically just port of a 3DS game. why is it that every development team that makes games for Nintendo felt the need to advance in some way except one of the biggest things that's been with them since the Game boy?
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To fully understand this as well, you need some Pokemon fanbase knowledge. As the Sword and Shield reception has shown, there's two kinds of Pokemon fans. There's the fans who will happily buy anything Game Freak puts out on store shelves, and then there's the picky fans who grew up with the franchise but want something a bit more in their Pokemon games.

Yet as the fake Sonic rumor experiment proved, fans of franchises like Pokemon are less divided than one might think. For years as seen by which fan games got popular and which Pokemon rumors became memes, there have been some things Western Pokemon fans have been wanting for years. Pokemon Colosseum and XD have always had a cult following because until the Switch came out they were the only console Pokemon RPGs. Battle Revolution was praised for its graphics but gameplay wise it was only a "battle simulator" like the Stadium titles were. Comparing them to Sword and Shield, they're more polished both gameplay wise and graphically.

The only thing they don't have is the traditional gyms and elite 4 story format, being replaced with the shadow Pokemon story arc. In fact Pokemon Colosseum and XD had stories closer to those of spin off titles (aside from the evil team making a return) and they broke a lot of conventions for a main series Pokemon game. Only XD had Wild Pokemon, and both titles featured a "steal specific Pokemon" mechanic. The setting featured no routes instead taking place in a deserty region. Colosseum pushed extremely hard on the double battle mechanic to the point where just about every battle in the game was a double battle (and giving you two starters to adapt to this).

PMD Rescue Team and Explorers also had a following because both games had perhaps the deepest and most interesting story in any Pokemon game. While the self insert nature of the writing naturally drew some lolcows to the games, it's clear the original intent was to feature you as yourself in the game to an even greater extent than the main series.

Fangame wise, there have been countless attempts at making a Pokemon MMO style game since at least the mid 2000s. Fanmade battle simulators for computers also have been huge ever since Pokemon NetBattle was a thing, and Pokemon Showdown has quite a few people using it. The main thing these battle simulators offer is the ability to create specific Pokemon with perfect stats without hacking. Removing Pokemon from the Pokedex clearly pissed off this crowd.

Then there's Sword and Shield...and they're generic cookie cutter Pokemon games. They're on the Switch, but they're not well optimized at all. The gameplay follows a even more streamlined version of the handheld Pokemon game formula. The story is generic, the single player holds your hand, and you can't even catch them all. The more picky Pokemon fans are angry for this reason. Pokemon is finally on the consoles and instead of getting Colosseum or XD they got a DS game upscaled.
 
Perspicacity said:
So everyone keeps touting this shit as a big deal, but I gotta break down the math for the less informed.

UK Let's Go first week 116k + 53%= 177k
Sword & Shield first week sales in UK 177k
Pokemon Sun & Moon first week 368k.

Another article says that it's 39% less than Sun and Moon
368 - 39%= 224.5k

That doesn't look like a victory at all to me. They way they put out this figures is kind of bizarre though so I won't know until I see the actual copies sold. Interestingly on the UK eShop chart Sword is 19 and Shield is 23.

www.gamespot.com

Pokemon Sword & Shield Had A Massive Launch And Spiked Switch Sales In The UK

Pokemon Sword & Shield is a sales juggernaut in the country it's based on, driving Switch sales and scoring Nintendo its third-best launch ever.
www.gamespot.com www.gamespot.com
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While the backlash has no doubt played into this, a bigger factor is there simply aren't as many Switches out there as there are 3DSes. When SuMo came out in 2016 the 3DS had been around for five years and had four different versions. We've had the Switch for three years, and a cheaper version only just came out.
 
nonnewtonian said:
While the backlash has no doubt played into this, a bigger factor is there simply aren't as many Switches out there as there are 3DSes. When SuMo came out in 2016 the 3DS had been around for five years and had four different versions. We've had the Switch for three years, and a cheaper version only just came out.
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That's why Game Freak is usually "late to the party" when it comes to putting their games on subsequent systems. Which just makes it all the more stranger how SWSH was rushed out the door relatively early in the life cycle of a system, especially with all the evidence pointing to it being a ported 3DS game. I couldn't guess exactly why though. It could be anything from Nintendo wanting a mainline Pokemon game for this holiday on their new system that badly, to a panic scenario when they saw how the M&L remake utterly tanked on the dying 3DS and rushed everything to the Switch last minute. Who knows.
 
UntimelyDhelmise said:
That's why Game Freak is usually "late to the party" when it comes to putting their games on subsequent systems. Which just makes it all the more stranger how SWSH was rushed out the door relatively early in the life cycle of a system, especially with all the evidence pointing to it being a ported 3DS game. I couldn't guess exactly why though. It could be anything from Nintendo wanting a mainline Pokemon game for this holiday on their new system that badly, to a panic scenario when they saw how the M&L remake utterly tanked on the dying 3DS and rushed everything to the Switch last minute. Who knows.
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They're paving the way for an second release or their trying to advertise the anime.

Come to think of it, wasn't Diamond released early on in the DS's lifespan?
 
Kari Kamiya said:
turn your happy-go-lucky rival into your worst nightmare over time because they were always petty little shits who used to get their way
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I'd love the shit out of that. Your rival starts out as happy and peppy and gradually gets more and more bitter the more they lose to you. Hell, maybe they even team up with the baddies just out of spite for you.
 
Ya girl got blessed by the RNG again, this time in Glimwood Tangle.

IMG_7718.jpg

I've caught lots of shinies in previous games due to obsessive shiny hunting, but the only one I ever caught during story mode without trying was my very first one, a Meowth in LeafGreen. Every other time I've been actively looking for one. So to have it happen twice in the span of a few days is just crazy!
 
So I take it at this point, the chances of getting a Pokémon Snap 2 or even returning to Orre is the equivalent of zero and has always been a pipe dream. Spin-offs will work just fine, but the only one coming down the pipeline is Detective Pikachu 2, and I don't think that's going to sell any better than the first game.
 
NerdShamer said:
They're paving the way for an second release or their trying to advertise the anime.

Come to think of it, wasn't Diamond released early on in the DS's lifespan?
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The DS and 3ds had two generations of Pokemon released on them. One earlier in the system's lifespan and one later on. While Sun and Moon weren't really technically advanced compared to X and Y, Black and White were pretty amazing graphically compared to Diamond and Pearl. Suddenly Pokemon ran at 60 frames per second again with some sprite zooming effects, and there were even early attempts at 3d environments as well.

DP were pretty much seen as the closest thing to Sword and Shield by the fanbase, at least at the time. They introduced Wi-Fi battling, but the games became notorious for being far slower than Generation III while not being any better graphically. Platinum was the "fixed" version, and HGSS ran on the same improved engine Platinum used.
 
Kari Kamiya said:
So I take it at this point, the chances of getting a Pokémon Snap 2 or even returning to Orre is the equivalent of zero and has always been a pipe dream. Spin-offs will work just fine, but the only one coming down the pipeline is Detective Pikachu 2, and I don't think that's going to sell any better than the first game.
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Oh we got a Pokemon Snap 2 alright, just not the one we were expecting.
1560315054965.jpg
 
CIA Nigger said:
The DS and 3ds had two generations of Pokemon released on them. One earlier in the system's lifespan and one later on. While Sun and Moon weren't really technically advanced compared to X and Y, Black and White were pretty amazing graphically compared to Diamond and Pearl. Suddenly Pokemon ran at 60 frames per second again with some sprite zooming effects, and there were even early attempts at 3d environments as well.

DP were pretty much seen as the closest thing to Sword and Shield by the fanbase, at least at the time. They introduced Wi-Fi battling, but the games became notorious for being far slower than Generation III while not being any better graphically. Platinum was the "fixed" version, and HGSS ran on the same improved engine Platinum used.
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It's kind of interesting how Gen 4 started out as the red-headed stepchild generation, but has since come to be known as part of the Second Golden Age (in particular, Platinum and HGSS pretty commonly being called some of the best in the series).

I wonder how the rest of Gen 8 will go. How will it be remembered a decade from now?
 
Kari Kamiya said:
So I take it at this point, the chances of getting a Pokémon Snap 2 or even returning to Orre is the equivalent of zero and has always been a pipe dream. Spin-offs will work just fine, but the only one coming down the pipeline is Detective Pikachu 2, and I don't think that's going to sell any better than the first game.
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I remember somewhere that Masuda mentioned that Pokemon Snap was made over how innovated cameras were at the time (correct me on this, my memory is fuzzy) and because the hottest thing now is phones/social media that a Snap 2 wouldn't be as impressive or whatever.
We're never gonna get another Orre game since Genius Sonority had the majority of its members absorbed by GF and the last Pokemon games they made was Shuffle. I also like to imagine that GF must have some serious beef with GS and the Orre games and likes to pretend they don't exist.

And because of the success of mobile games we'll probably see less spin-offs of stuff like Mystery Dungeon, along with the complete extinction of the Ranger games.
 
While asshole rivals are good they shouldn’t be the only type of rival. There should be a diversity.
Ido said:
All I get out of this is that Game Freak's most fatal flaw is they doesn't know how to human. They can make pokedex entries/animations for a fantastic magical beasts to give them personality, it works because pokemon that look like thugs (krookodile, Pangoro, and Scrafty) don't need more personality than to just look/act devious. They're animals (well... most of them are), they don't need intricate back stories, they don't need family or friends, all they need to do is look the part. That's the most important part about Pokemon is the Pokemon. This worked until they jumped to 3D.

Way back before 3ds the characters other than the bad guys were never important, Red didn't say anything, Blue was just kind of an asshole but didn't really have any personality, the Gym leaders entire personality was their team and design and you didn't really see them much after their gym. They were never good with character development in the first place, and all the personality came from the writers in the anime/manga fleshing them out. My fondness for Brock and Misty is solely due to the anime as a kid, I don't think I ever would've thought twice about them without it. I understand this continues to be true, the anime/manga has much more freedom to work with, but their current writing team for the game tries really hard to add this aspect but they SUCK at it.

I guess Diamond and Pearl was the first to technically do the friend as your rival with Berry, I never really cared all that much about him and I memory holed him being the rival and thought it was the other MC until I was writing this. I can't remember a whole lot about him so I have no beef with him. I did think it was annoying in the beginning to go with him to the lake, though. However, since Black and White came right after I feel they were going in the right direction. They were believable, Cheren becoming a gym leader and Bianca the professors assistant was great. It was still 2d and the only face to face interaction you had with them was through the Xtransceiver. Then X and Y happened, Shauna, Tierno, Trevor, along with Calem or Serene, despite being in 3d these character's were so god damn one dimensional. The jump to 3D left them with those blank empty faces, and they didn't really seem like friends. bare minimum personalities thrown together. Sure it was cute that we all went through the forest together but they just aren't interesting, the single character trait they were each given doesn't make for a very well rounded group of friends. This worsened in Sun and Moon, Hau and Lillie were terrible, they were everywhere, I couldn't escape them. I couldn't enjoy Gladion as the rival because Hau and Lillie kept butting in to my business. They really tried to make Lillie this pure innocent little character who works through it to become stronger but her and Hau were just obnoxious. This is where I think everything else fell apart, they tried to give the trial leaders have personality but it just doesn't work, they have the same depth as Shauna, Tierno and Trevor do but there's more of them, they also seem more like "friends" than anything. Then I hear that Hop is Hau but worse and apparently everywhere. As I haven't played the game, I hear Bede and Marnie are ok but I can't verify.

Like, they really lost the understanding of how people, kids especially, make friends and talk to each other or act. It's like having to hang out with the autistic kid down the street because your parents are friends, he is socially inept and doesn't understand personal space. I don't expect to get a good story or characters from a Pokemon game, the MC has always been just an empty husk, but they're really REALLY botching the human aspect up to the point it's inexcusable and hindering the game. I don't need good well rounded characters, I just need them to not be annoying and GF is failing even that.
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The problem is that GF went way too long coasting by with the basic formula that when they did decide to go all out with stories they had no experience. That sad part is that when they decided to break the mold they made genuinely good first steps. Platinum did a good job and HGSS took it further by taking a decade old game and fleshing out the characters. It was so much fun watching gym leaders interact and have lives outside of their gyms. The best part was that it wasn’t intrusive at all, it was bonus content that enriched the gameplay experience and felt like a huge love letter to Gen II fans.

Gen V took it further and GF actually improved. Sure Unova was more linear and railroaded than previous games but I didn’t care. It was the first time I actually gave a shit about the world and its characters in a Pokemon game. It struck a (mostly) perfect balance between story and gameplay. What worked was that compared to later games interactions between the plot and characters were far more organic. I loved having nothing but new Pokemon until post game. Unova was the first mainline generation not based on a real life Japanese location and it gave the impression that the region was more foreign and far away from the rest. I was a bit disappointed when BW2 decided to add older Pokemon to the region dex but it wasn’t a deal breaker.

When the 3DS games came out GF suddenly decided to throw all that progress out the window. As I said earlier on in this thread they couldn’t decide if they wanted to go back to the basics or continue on with a deeper plot. The result was a mess of ideas and games that had no direction or an identity of their own. Gen V may not have been perfect but the direction and vision of a more plot focused game was far more clear.

The biggest thing that bothers me the most about the 3DS games was that it was obvious GF wanted to please everyone. Between catering to older fans with nostalgia pandering to making the games more basic for newcomers they just were clueless. I wonder if they got backlash for Gen V exclusively focusing on new Pokemon. Nostalgia pandering was so intrusive that it cost Kalos having its own identity. They didn’t even bother with giving the new Pokemon mega forms despite the mechanic debuting there. They could have at least given the starters one.

I don’t care about what direction GF wants to take with a generation as long as it is clear. Want to make a story focused game? That is fine. Want to make a game using the basic classic formula? That is fine too. Just pick one and stick with it. Of course GF is too far gone right now so I have no faith in them doing that.
 
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CIA Nigger said:
To fully understand this as well, you need some Pokemon fanbase knowledge. As the Sword and Shield reception has shown, there's two kinds of Pokemon fans. There's the fans who will happily buy anything Game Freak puts out on store shelves, and then there's the picky fans who grew up with the franchise but want something a bit more in their Pokemon games.

Yet as the fake Sonic rumor experiment proved, fans of franchises like Pokemon are less divided than one might think. For years as seen by which fan games got popular and which Pokemon rumors became memes, there have been some things Western Pokemon fans have been wanting for years. Pokemon Colosseum and XD have always had a cult following because until the Switch came out they were the only console Pokemon RPGs. Battle Revolution was praised for its graphics but gameplay wise it was only a "battle simulator" like the Stadium titles were. Comparing them to Sword and Shield, they're more polished both gameplay wise and graphically.
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I figured at some point they would tweak the formula some. They did double battles, mega evolutions, weather, battlefield conditions, and Z Moves that altered the core battling mechanic.

I was curious if they would push it forward by trying something like Mario RPG did. Timing button presses in battle to partially or fully block attacks. Something that could have you be more involved in the blow by blow of the battle because your timed "B" press might could save your Pokemon by getting him to defend himself at the right time. You could make super effective move types negate the defense etc.

Or something like Square Enix has done with passive attacks gilling the space in between special attacks in the battle. Have there be a low powered tackle type of attack that is happening between you using moves so battles aren't the akward stilted experience of time stopping as it waits for an untold amount of time for you to select a move

There is also Pokken Tournament to consider. Came out on the WiiU and was redone for the switch. A fighting game of Pokemon
 
Kaede Akamatsu said:
How long until DK gets his own thread? It'd be hilarious if he finds it and his drones lose their shit about it.
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As entertaining as that would be, there probably won't be a thread.

Let's face it, guy's as interesting as soggy toast, with a personality to match. He's way too boring to make a thread about, and the only thing that's even close to thread worthy is him sperging out, constantly rehashing his points, and comparing pokemon to the Hong Kong protests.

Other than that, the guy's just boring and it's only a matter of time before he falls into obscurity... Especially if his content gets marked with 'made for kids' that youtube's slapping on everyone.
 
For all the shit this game is deservedly getting I'm going to give them a solid thumbs up for adding probably the funniest thing in any pokemon game and going out of their way to make sure you don't miss it (the full animation plays even if skip animations is on):

pika.jpg


That pikachu is visibly struggling the whole time it's onscreen and eventually the bird will lean back and whipcrack projectile it at you, which causes paralyze.
goodluck.jpg
 
I finished the main game of Sw/Sh and now in the """post game""" section.

Initial thoughts:
I thought GF could have done more work with Bede's characterization. Literally missed potential for a really good rival. His encounter theme was pretty much the only good song out of the few songs I liked in Sw/Sh.



Also, the final city's theme is hilarious. Okay, so you're climbing up this mountain, and after all of your "hard work", you are greeted to hearing the epitome of "you are the circus for playing this game":
 
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