Naruto/Boruto Griefing Thread

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Koji propably makes estimates based on what he knows. Educated guesses at best.
I don't know about that. There's a lot of hints of future sight or something here. It's just in the way they all talk. What we can imply is that Boruto shows up to face Code specifically to get Code to tell him where the Ten Tails is. He seems to know... something. I'm not going to pretend this answer will be satisfying though. It may just be "Koji overheard Jigen say something once".

If you're in a bad place, or if your dad uses you as a human ash tray, suck it up long enough until you're of legal age to finally kill yourself.

Masashi Kishimoto: "I'm so deep ha ha"
Remember, Hinata was always there for Naruto. You know, like when he's on the swing. Or having birthdays alone. Or coming home to no one.
 
"A shinobi must endure."

If you're in a bad place, or if your dad uses you as a human ash tray, suck it up long enough until you're of legal age to finally kill yourself.

Masashi Kishimoto: "I'm so deep ha ha"
I read the TV Tropes page on Broken Aesops the other day. They have a section dedicated to Naruto. https://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pmwiki.php/BrokenAesop/Naruto

I don't know about that. There's a lot of hints of future sight or something here. It's just in the way they all talk. What we can imply is that Boruto shows up to face Code specifically to get Code to tell him where the Ten Tails is. He seems to know... something. I'm not going to pretend this answer will be satisfying though. It may just be "Koji overheard Jigen say something once".
I am of the opinion that they are not paying attention at what they imply with the dialogue anymore. They did not pay attention to how they wrote the catalyst of the story (Omnipotense) so assuming we can use logic to predict this makes no sense. Still, if I am wrong, I will eat crow.

Remember, Hinata was always there for Naruto. You know, like when he's on the swing. Or having birthdays alone. Or coming home to no one.
Naruto 's retcons break the characterisation. He had no one, but he did, but he did not. Naruto is cursed with a demon and that means he is shunned. But no, he is not. He is the village superweapon that helps keep everyone safe and the village would be screwed without him. Hiruzen is a wise and strong leader. Nope, he plays favourites, lets Danzo and Orochimaru get away with murder and is propably the weakest Kage in the series. The Uchiha are misguided fools. Except they are not as their grudges against the village are sound. Konoha abuses Naruto (their hero 's son), kets Danzo and Orochimaru do whatever they want, they blamed them for things they did not do, Itachi is a wise man as long you are willing to ignore the fact that he brainwashed his brother into being a barking mad, revenge-obsessed monster and expected him to just go back to a peaceful life afterwards.

Do you see why I always go on about retcons and bad characterisation? How these characters are portrayed and how we see them is vastly different. Like the before-retcons and after-retcons versions were written by a seperate writer.
 
It's incredibly terrible advice to give in general. "Just smile through the pain."

Like that won't mess someone up even more that they can't react with the appropriate emotion naturally. If they happen to be made of sterner stuff, then sure, more power to them. But to expect people to act like nothing is wrong is nothing short of psychopathic.
 
It's incredibly terrible advice to give in general. "Just smile through the pain."

Like that won't mess someone up even more that they can't react with the appropriate emotion naturally. If they happen to be made of sterner stuff, then sure, more power to them. But to expect people to act like nothing is wrong is nothing short of psychopathic.
Kishimoto was trying to be deeper/smarter than he was. At least he was trying back then...
 
Minato is overrated. There I said it. I just find his character to be really bland. He feels like one of those "tumblr bait" humble soft spoken bishounen archetype. And his prodigy status makes him a borderline Gary stu.
 
Minato is overrated. There I said it. I just find his character to be really bland. He feels like one of those "tumblr bait" humble soft spoken bishounen archetype. And his prodigy status makes him a borderline Gary stu.
There's just not much interesting about him. The only bit that I really like or remember about Minato is his how he has that long named attack he never gets to use. Which is a funny joke but it's still a joke. Something I always found jarring too was how different Minato is from Naruto. He's kind of just generic good guy Dad but he's not like Naruto at all. He doesn't even look like him that much.
 
Minato is overrated. There I said it. I just find his character to be really bland. He feels like one of those "tumblr bait" humble soft spoken bishounen archetype. And his prodigy status makes him a borderline Gary stu.
There's just not much interesting about him. The only bit that I really like or remember about Minato is his how he has that long named attack he never gets to use. Which is a funny joke but it's still a joke. Something I always found jarring too was how different Minato is from Naruto. He's kind of just generic good guy Dad but he's not like Naruto at all. He doesn't even look like him that much.
Minato was supposed to be the strongest ninja in history. It was part of "each generation is stronger than the last" theme that went out of the window when legendary warriors of the past were liched into our time and were proven to be unsurpassed in power or when the strongest characters were shown to be the superancient aliens. Minato 's character traits are that he is good at making new jutsu and bad at naming them. That and that he is a good guy. He is not a particularly deep character but his characterisation is consistent for the most part but apart from his cool moves, he has little to write home about.

He does not break the thematic narative like Hashirama and Tobirama do by being retconed into demigod status (Minato 's speed makes him a threat no matter the opponent in a realistic manner) nor is he a mess of a character like Hiruzen.
 
He does not break the thematic narative like Hashirama and Tobirama do by being retconed into demigod status (Minato 's speed makes him a threat no matter the opponent in a realistic manner) nor is he a mess of a character like Hiruzen.
I just wish Minato was somewhat like Naruto. But he's a completely different person in every way.
 
I just wish Minato was somewhat like Naruto. But he's a completely different person in every way.
He looks like his dad but he is hothead like his mom. Personally, I think he is a good combination of his parents. They have little characterisation though.
 
Naruto 's retcons break the characterisation.
What I pretty much despise in the end is that they made Naruto into this quintessential messiah that all is forgiven after the war. You'd almost be mistaken that the end chapters were ghostwritten by a cult (Fun fact: Japan has a ton of cults, and the government has been cracking down on them for a while).

Try to imagine Naruto being in this manga: https://ww1.mangafreak.me/Read1_Shuujin_Riku_14

The full synopsis is that a kid was falsely accused of killing his surrogate father. It's set in a dystopia where a meteor struck Japan, and the perimeter of ground zero has been reduced to a slum where the unwanted and undesirables have been cordoned off from normal society. The protagonist, Riku, is your typical Shonen protagonist at first glance, but you'd almost be mistaken again that he's a carbon copy of Naruto. Here is where the difference seems to lie.

I find it telling that in the chapter I posted, the first antagonist that had been bullying and harassing Riku tells his backstory to him.

This is how he reacts afterwards.

1722217462585.png

The thing that bothers me the most is this. I will bet every ounce of blood in my body that Naruto, in typical Kishimoto dipshit fashion, will tell the guy that he should forgive the man that almost sold him for his organs and remember the good times they had. That would be a case study of someone so desperate for companionship and affection that even some malignant pig that sells children to be slaves or organ cattle is someone that he could forgive because the guy "actually had someone".

That is not a healthy or sane mindset at all.

EDIT: It's also telling that Riku actually lives in squalor. His entire home is pretty much a landfill of garbage, and that he takes refuge in a car trunk. His "Iruka" is murdered and he finds himself in a situation that would break any one. Reminder that this is the characterization that Naruto has in the manga, which you so succinctly pointed out.
He had no one, but he did, but he did not. Naruto is cursed with a demon and that means he is shunned. But no, he is not.
 
The thing that bothers me the most is this. I will bet every ounce of blood in my body that Naruto, in typical Kishimoto dipshit fashion, will tell the guy that he should forgive the man that almost sold him for his organs and remember the good times they had. That would be a case study of someone so desperate for companionship and affection that even some malignant pig that sells children to be slaves or organ cattle is someone that he could forgive because the guy "actually had someone".

That is not a healthy or sane mindset at all.

EDIT: It's also telling that Riku actually lives in squalor. His entire home is pretty much a landfill of garbage, and that he takes refuge in a car trunk. His "Iruka" is murdered and he finds himself in a situation that would break any one. Reminder that this is the characterization that Naruto has in the manga, which you so succinctly pointed out.
Indeed. And that makes watching the early parts of Naruto jarring. He is cursed, but he is not, but let 's pretend that we do not know that the only reason the other villages do not attack Konoha is because of the fox-shaped nuke we have. What is this? Neji says Kages are born not made and uses that belief to justify his elitism and grudge? He is RIGHT! His only misconception was to think he was an elite and Naruto was not. Apart from that, he was right on the money. The only Hokage who had neither supergenes and/or was a super-genius was Hiruzen and he sucks. He allowed the biggest conspiracies against Konoha to take root (pun shrugged) simply because he did not have the heart to act against his corrupt friends. Or how the Uchiha were mistreated for the action of two bad apples and somehow they were seen as the bad guys when they could not take the injustice anymore. No wonder the Uchiha saw themselves in Naruto. Both they and him were mistreated for things that were not their fault by the people they wanted to protect and they were told to suck it up and endure.

Also, did anyone else notice that there were no Uchiha summoned by the Endo Tensei apart from Madara and Itachi? What? Did Orochimaru and Kabuto not pay a doctor, a mortician or a gravekeeper some money to look the other way while they got DNA from the dead Uchiha? Or even outright disguise themselves those guys? Maybe they were afraid of Danzo but he did not have his Wood-style or the endless supply of Sharingan then. Of course, you could argue that Danzo was a later addition to the story but then the problem that Kishimoto adds characters and lore without regard as to how they fit in remains and is worsening.

Inconsistent characterisation, broken thematic narrative and reckless retcons would have ruined the perception of any other series. People remember how good things made them feel but they do not check to see if the things that happened in part 1 are just as good retroactively now that part 2 is finished.
 
What business did Naruto have being there anyways? If I recall correctly, the whole point of the mission was for team Asuma to avenge their master. Naruto's entrance felt out of nowhere and the only justification being that he's the main character. It would be like if Shikamaru dropped in near the end of Naruto vs Pain and then took out the Yahiko body all by himself.
I heard the reason behind that sudden Naruto entrance at the end of the arc was that Naruto hadn't been getting much focus for quite a while. It might not be obvious if you're a binge watcher who finishes multiple episodes in a day, but back when they aired for the first time, these episodes were a weekly thing. Which meant that around the time of this arc, the anime had already gone months where all they focused on was Sasuke forming Hebi, Sasuke vs Deidara, Hidan and Kakuzu vs Shikamaru and Asuma, Hidan and Kakuzu vs Kakashi and Team 8. Obviously people were gonna start wondering why the show called Naruto has the red eyed emo getting more attention than the actual main character and the editors probably wanted to avoid that by shining the spotlight on Naruto for a moment where it wasn't just him and his clones punching the Niagra before getting right back to Sasuke Shippuden.
 
Naruto 's retcons break the characterisation. He had no one, but he did, but he did not. Naruto is cursed with a demon and that means he is shunned. But no, he is not.
The weird thing is that I feel like they sorta downplayed this aspect after the first episode before bringing it back in Shippuden. In the pilot, it was established that the village hated Naruto and preferred to pretend that he didn't exist. In the subsequent episodes though, Naruto's interactions with the other villagers made it seem as though they just thought of an annoying brat loser rather than a target of hate. Their attitude seemed to lean more towards "Jeez that kid is such a pain." than "That boy is a monster! Stay away from him!" You'd think they would add some scenes where Naruto is being treated like a bad omen by the villagers to drive in the tragic backstory and to add further depth to the character and his motivation to become a powerful ninja so that everyone else will finally acknowledge him.

They did bring it back in Shippuden, maybe retconned it be a little more depressing than it was supposed to be, but then added these weird fillers where he had SOME friends, and SOME people acknowledged him yada yada that seem to go against the point they tryna make. The canon material wasn't much better in that they kept reusing that same "him sitting on a swing scene" over and over. Yeah there were some flashbacks that showed us Naruto's life before the pilot, but their goto recipe for showing Naruto's "sad childhood" was that same swing set scene played ad infinitum.
 
The weird thing is that I feel like they sorta downplayed this aspect after the first episode before bringing it back in Shippuden. In the pilot, it was established that the village hated Naruto and preferred to pretend that he didn't exist. In the subsequent episodes though, Naruto's interactions with the other villagers made it seem as though they just thought of an annoying brat loser rather than a target of hate. Their attitude seemed to lean more towards "Jeez that kid is such a pain." than "That boy is a monster! Stay away from him!" You'd think they would add some scenes where Naruto is being treated like a bad omen by the villagers to drive in the tragic backstory and to add further depth to the character and his motivation to become a powerful ninja so that everyone else will finally acknowledge him.
He was seen as a monster because of Kurama but he was seen as annoying due to his pranks. I suppose that some villagers saw him more as monster while others saw him as more of an annoying kid.
 
Also, did anyone else notice that there were no Uchiha summoned by the Endo Tensei apart from Madara and Itachi? What? Did Orochimaru and Kabuto not pay a doctor, a mortician or a gravekeeper some money to look the other way while they got DNA from the dead Uchiha? Or even outright disguise themselves those guys? Maybe they were afraid of Danzo but he did not have his Wood-style or the endless supply of Sharingan then. Of course, you could argue that Danzo was a later addition to the story but then the problem that Kishimoto adds characters and lore without regard as to how they fit in remains and is worsening.
I can let this go because of some things we see in the story. Uchiha remnants are split between Danzo and Tobi. I wouldn't be surprised if Kabuto did attempt to dig up Uchiha and saw all their eyes were missing and figured it wasn't worth it over reviving some other people. Or Maybe Danzo had his Anbu hide the corpses to avoid conspiracy in the future. I'm just speculating but it's not an impossibility. After all, he had to make special accomodations for Madara and Nagato and maybe doing that for all the Uchiha is too much problem.

I heard the reason behind that sudden Naruto entrance at the end of the arc was that Naruto hadn't been getting much focus for quite a while. It might not be obvious if you're a binge watcher who finishes multiple episodes in a day, but back when they aired for the first time, these episodes were a weekly thing. Which meant that around the time of this arc
I think Kishimoto was sick around the time of the end of this arc so his editors were filling in. I'm not sure if he actually had much involvement in this ending and everyone just wanted to get the arc over and done with.


The canon material wasn't much better in that they kept reusing that same "him sitting on a swing scene" over and over. Yeah there were some flashbacks that showed us Naruto's life before the pilot, but their goto recipe for showing Naruto's "sad childhood" was that same swing set scene played ad infinitum
That swing set got more screen time than most characters.
 
I can let this go because of some things we see in the story. Uchiha remnants are split between Danzo and Tobi. I wouldn't be surprised if Kabuto did attempt to dig up Uchiha and saw all their eyes were missing and figured it wasn't worth it over reviving some other people. Or Maybe Danzo had his Anbu hide the corpses to avoid conspiracy in the future. I'm just speculating but it's not an impossibility. After all, he had to make special accomodations for Madara and Nagato and maybe doing that for all the Uchiha is too much problem.
I cannot let this go. The Endo Tensei was in development since the Second Hokage (who invented it) and was completed by Orochimaru and Kabuto. They knew that it existed and could use it to an extend. Are you telling me that, between the time after Orochimaru began his unethical experiments to the day the Uchiha were massacred, there was not a single amongst them that died without Danzo getting to the corpses first? Not a single one dying in a mission away from Danzo and Root? Not a single one whose corpse was recovered by Orochimaru because the Root Anbu that trailed them were weaker than the Legendary Ninja Sage and his goons? Are you telling me that Danzo had enough Anbu to guard all those Uchiha from Orochimaru over the years (including the earlier years when he was presumably weaker and less infuencial) AND STILL had enough men to run his agenda into both Konoha AND the other villages? Are you telling me that he managed to recover the bodies and every hair, skin and drop of blood? If so, then Danzo was written like a caricature of an evil mastermind. As having both infinite resources/manpower/influence/means and yet being incapable of using them effectively worth a damn while picking the most puppy-kicking option possible (even when other options are better) and going "All according to plan" in the end.
 
I cannot let this go. The Endo Tensei was in development since the Second Hokage (who invented it) and was completed by Orochimaru and Kabuto. They knew that it existed and could use it to an extend. Are you telling me that, between the time after Orochimaru began his unethical experiments to the day the Uchiha were massacred, there was not a single amongst them that died without Danzo getting to the corpses first? Not a single one dying in a mission away from Danzo and Root? Not a single one whose corpse was recovered by Orochimaru because the Root Anbu that trailed them were weaker than the Legendary Ninja Sage and his goons? Are you telling me that Danzo had enough Anbu to guard all those Uchiha from Orochimaru over the years (including the earlier years when he was presumably weaker and less infuencial) AND STILL had enough men to run his agenda into both Konoha AND the other villages? Are you telling me that he managed to recover the bodies and every hair, skin and drop of blood? If so, then Danzo was written like a caricature of an evil mastermind. As having both infinite resources/manpower/influence/means and yet being incapable of using them effectively worth a damn while picking the most puppy-kicking option possible (even when other options are better) and going "All according to plan" in the end.
Kishimoto needed a scapegoat.
 
[*]And finally and most importantly, have him bang that hot blonde chick from the lightining country.
[/LIST]
I always thought it was weird that a white blonde baddie was from the Lightning nation. I thought the Cloud village was full of niggers? Or at least just dark skined ppl. Naruto's world building is not very good. The entire ninja world needs to be fleshed out more. Thats why I thought having a mobster villian with closed toe shoes in the Zabuza and Haku arc was really out of place. Each 5 great nations needs its own culture or type of ppl. I think Kishimoto said that Naruto is caucasian, Sakura is European and Sasuke is asian. But I just dont see it.
 
I always thought it was weird that a white blonde baddie was from the Lightning nation. I thought the Cloud village was full of niggers? Or at least just dark skined ppl. Naruto's world building is not very good. The entire ninja world needs to be fleshed out more. Thats why I thought having a mobster villian with closed toe shoes in the Zabuza and Haku arc was really out of place. Each 5 great nations needs its own culture or type of ppl. I think Kishimoto said that Naruto is caucasian, Sakura is European and Sasuke is asian. But I just dont see it.
There's quite a lot of white people in Lightning, they're just not featured in prominent positions as much. Of all the 5 great nations, Lightning feels like one with the most obvious real world counterpart - MURICA. Different mix of people, but it's clearly based on that great land of wrasslin.
 
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