Metal Gear

[HeyYou]

I've said since release that Venom Snake has been the absolute dumbest Kojima twist ever, and the fact more of his fanboys don't see all of the obvious flaws present in the game and their own reasoning for it being necessary makes them all look dumb.

First, they tend to say it was necessary to explain how Big Boss survived Metal Gear. This is a question that I had never seen anyone ask or care about in all my years of being in the Metal Gear fandom. This is just a bullshit fanboy justification because nobody ever questions how Gray Fox survives Metal Gear 2, how Liquid survives at least 3 separate death scenarios in Metal Gear Solid, etc. etc.

Second, they say that it was necessary in order to make Big Boss "evil again." Once again, this is a stupid because Venom Snake witnesses Big Boss go into a coma before (presumably) passing out. So basically...Big Boss wasn't involved in the plan at all. It was a Zero plot. "Oh, but Big Boss still took part when he woke up!" you say. Well...I mean, the brainwashing had already been done at that point. If you go by the truth tapes, the plastic surgery had already been done as well. It's more a matter of him taking advantage of something he couldn't stop than anything else which really doesn't make him out to be that evil just dealing with a situation he was handed.

Then you get into all of the inconsistencies that are presented in the narrative itself

First, Big Boss despite being shielded from the bomb blast and coming out almost completely unscathed mysteriously goes into a coma while the medic who took the full force of the bomb blast and all that shrapnel is conscious up to the point that Big Boss slips into the coma so he can witness it. Am I to assume then as part of Zeros plan he was put into a coma?

Miller is fully awake when Big Boss goes into a coma, and specifically asks about and looks at the medic and is told he took some shrapnel to the head. So he witnesses a perfectly normal looking big boss go into a coma, then see's the medic with a big ass fucking horn in his head. 9 years later, Big Boss with a big ass horn in his head rescues him...and he doesn't suspect anything at all? Doesn't ask where the horn came from? Is shocked and upset when Ocelot reveals what should be an OBVIOUS truth to him?

The truth tapes establish that Zero could not tell the two apart, meaning that the plastic surgery must have happened while they were both under and not weeks after Venom wakes up like is shown in the actual mission.

Also in the truth tapes, it's established that they "wake up" Venom. If this is the case, it makes it sound like he was put into a coma. Doesn't it stand to reason then that he could have possibly AGREED to this "horrible" plan due to his loyalty to Big Boss? (negating the "it was needed to make Big Boss evil" excuse) It also makes me wonder why the hell they needed a code for Venom Snakes awakening (V has come to) if they were able to control it the whole time. You can SAY they used it when Big Boss woke up, but the game presents it as being done when VENOM woke up.

Then you have the entire timeline of events as shown in the truth mission. Venom and Ishmael escape a pursuing Man on Fire only to have an attack chopper start to pursue them. They go into a tunnel and then crash at the end of it. We are then shown that while Venom was knocked out Ocelot came by at 2:32 AM, picked up Big Boss, took him safety, then came back for Venom at 3:07 AM only to suddenly have the attack chopper that was at the other end of the tunnel show up and get attacked by the man on fire. So basically, this attack chopper and the man on fire just...fucked off for over a half hour?

Also, what good was it giving Big Boss a motorcycle to escape the ISLAND of Cyprus? (this has nothing to do with the twist, it's just dumb)

This isn't even getting into how the twist is supposedly clever because "oh it makes the player Big Boss" but it isn't really clever because this was pretty much the whole fucking point of Raiden in MGS2 already.

Honestly, there are so many inconsistencies and holes in the Venom Snake twist I prefer to just think it really is Big Boss suffering from DID over the guilt of getting the medic killed as well as the events of Shining Lights. That'd somehow make more sense given the Paz side story.

Also, there's the question of why Venom needed to exist at all. What exactly was he a smokescreen for? Because he set up a bigger and better PMC than MSF, defeated the strongest Metal Gear up to that point and killed Skull Face without much issue. It's not like Cipher was constantly on his ass and making life hell. Big Boss could have done the exact same thing, easy. The only major problem was the vocal chord parasites, and that's not something anyone could have predicted.

It also makes me wonder how Big Boss got away with rejoining the US Military, considering it wasn't exactly secret that "Big Boss" (Venom) was back and heading a PMC.

 

[Milwaukee Macho Man]

Also, there's the question of why Venom needed to exist at all. What exactly was he a smokescreen for? Because he set up a bigger and better PMC than MSF, defeated the strongest Metal Gear up to that point and killed Skull Face without much issue. It's not like Cipher was constantly on his ass and making life hell. Big Boss could have done the exact same thing, easy. The only major problem was the vocal chord parasites, and that's not something anyone could have predicted.

It also makes me wonder how Big Boss got away with rejoining the US Military, considering it wasn't exactly secret that "Big Boss" (Venom) was back and heading a PMC.

The funniest thing is that it felt like Kojima was clearly setting something up in Peace Walker, a rather simple and easy way to explain away a lot of the shit that didn't make sense, but then he threw it all away for the Venom Snake twist that makes everything way more complicated and make even less sense.

Peace Walkers ending establishes that Zero wanted Big Boss back in the fold and he wanted his army to be the army of the patriots. It seemed logical to me that Big Boss would eventually realize that you keep your friends close but your enemies closer and would agree to the terms with the intent of betraying Zero when he consolidates enough strength with Outer Heaven.

This would explain how Big Boss could establish Outer Heaven as well as how he would be welcomed back into Fox Hound so easily. Because the Patriots think he is with them and they are allowing it all to happen. Then in 1995 Big Boss makes his move. His soldiers are loyal to him, not the Patriots. And with Metal Gear in hand he goes to war with "the world"(The Patriots).

Instead Kojima kind of invalidates the idea that Zero needs a private army by creating XOF, a private army that Cipher already controls. He creates a goofy "phantom" to take the attention away from Big Boss while he establishes Outer Heaven. But Big Boss still does all the shit he did while establishing Outer Heaven in lore. All the fighting and mercenary work that made him so damn renowned. There's no real explanation as to why he is able to rejoin Fox Hound while being at war with The Patriots. In fact now there is some weird war between him and Miller within Fox Hound...

Like it just added way more problems than anything else. All to supposedly answer the question of "well how DID Big Boss survive a missile in Metal Gear?" (a question that was actually answered WITHIN Metal Gear 2, funny enough)

 

[Burned Man]

Miller is fully awake when Big Boss goes into a coma, and specifically asks about and looks at the medic and is told he took some shrapnel to the head. So he witnesses a perfectly normal looking big boss go into a coma, then see's the medic with a big ass fucking horn in his head. 9 years later, Big Boss with a big ass horn in his head rescues him...and he doesn't suspect anything at all? Doesn't ask where the horn came from? Is shocked and upset when Ocelot reveals what should be an OBVIOUS truth to him?

I want the justification to be something as stupid as Miller couldn't actually see shit in that operating room because he kept his sunglasses on and they got cracked in the crash. I want that to be the justification for basically anything Miller does. He is just pretending he can actually see and is more like the Mr Magoo of mercenaries.

 

[Snekposter]

That would actually make sense in the Kojimaverse, given how weird and coincidental things are there.

 

[Grandpa Simpson]

It's 2020, someone playing had their FOB attacked by another player.

 

[Ruin]

The weirdest thing to me is that Kingdom of the Flies aka MGSV chapter 3 was reportedly about 85% complete when it was just canned. It would have been extremely easy to finish it up and sell it as DLC.

 

[Milwaukee Macho Man]

The weirdest thing to me is that Kingdom of the Flies aka MGSV chapter 3 was reportedly about 85% complete when it was just canned. It would have been extremely easy to finish it up and sell it as DLC.

I don't think that's true at all. Kojimapro staff have allegedly made statements that Kojima cut it years before the game released due to storyline reasons. Even if that wasn't true, I don't think it was anywhere near 85% finished since there is nothing to show for it besides concept art and cutscenes.

Even taking all that away, it was obvious Konami wanted to be done with MGS V to the point that even if it was 85% done they weren't going to put any more resources into the games development.

 

[Smaug's Smokey Hole]

You know, I looked back on a few MGS games and scenes and here is something I felt off about them

MGS 4 - Am I the only one disappointed we never had the Patriots' AIs talking like in 2? They did show to be frighteningly smart and very controlling. You would think that a scene or two with an "avatar" of the AIs appearing to talk with some of the characters, maybe Snake or Liquid Ocelot, perhaps to try to convince them why its preservation is the most beneficial outcome for humanity and that humanity CANNOT exist without them long term...that all the tech, nano machines and etc will not simply balance itself out. Without their control, they will only get more and more powerful until humanity figures a way to eliminate itself.

That's a great idea, The Patriots 'possessing' a gekko here and there could have been cool. The gekko might not have good speakers and the sound chip was designed by ViA (the horrors of war) so they sound all fucked up and weird when talking. Better yet, if the gekko shrieking is the sound of rapidly ventilating heat and gases that could have been used as primitive robot vocal cords for a Patriot instance. It could have been played like a Cyber Psycho Mantis of sorts. Could have been used as a couple of miniboss fights as well with a possessed gekko that do not behave or fight like they usually do.

 

[MrJokerRager]

Ground Zeros > Phantom Pain.

I liked the atmosphere more as well as room for expansion and seeing the dark side of Gitmo.

Better off combining the games or just send all development to Ground Zeros. They kep none of the good stuff from Peace Walker either.

Yeah a lot of potential is lacking and we saw the same with death stranding.

 

[Duncan Hills Coffee]

In other news, Metal Gear, Metal Gear Solid, and Metal Gear Solid 2: Substance were just released on GOG. Apparently they're the base PC ports as they were released, but even so it's interesting to see them revived at all.

I don't know if I'd get it, but a lot of people seem to care about those PC ports.

 

[c-no]

In other news, Metal Gear, Metal Gear Solid, and Metal Gear Solid 2: Substance were just released on GOG. Apparently they're the base PC ports as they were released, but even so it's interesting to see them revived at all.

I don't know if I'd get it, but a lot of people seem to care about those PC ports.

From what I heard about the MGS 2 port, it may of had some problems when it was released but I'm not too familiar with it. Other than that, I'm surprised the games managed to get a release on GOG. Gave MGS 1 a try for its PC port and so far, it's pretty decent. The ability to save without using Mei Ling kinda makes her redundant but then again, loading those saves brought me back to the beginning of an area as though I just entered it and any thing I gotten was not in my inventory. Aside from that, it makes me wish Metal Gear 2 Solid Snake also got a port and MGS 3 had its own PC port. That was one of the better games in the series.

 

[Duncan Hills Coffee]

From what I heard about the MGS 2 port, it may of had some problems when it was released but I'm not too familiar with it. Other than that, I'm surprised the games managed to get a release on GOG. Gave MGS 1 a try for its PC port and so far, it's pretty decent. The ability to save without using Mei Ling kinda makes her redundant but then again, loading those saves brought me back to the beginning of an area as though I just entered it and any thing I gotten was not in my inventory. Aside from that, it makes me wish Metal Gear 2 Solid Snake also got a port and MGS 3 had its own PC port. That was one of the better games in the series.

I am a little surprised they didn't bring Metal Gear 2 to GOG. They did the PC release for Metal Gear 1, which was Japan-only for decades, why not Metal Gear 2? It's not like there's a localization issue or anything considering it was packaged with MGS3: Subsistence. Part of me thinks they might release that at some point down the road.

 

[Marissa Moira]

From what I heard about the MGS 2 port, it may of had some problems when it was released but I'm not too familiar with it. Other than that, I'm surprised the games managed to get a release on GOG. Gave MGS 1 a try for its PC port and so far, it's pretty decent. The ability to save without using Mei Ling kinda makes her redundant but then again, loading those saves brought me back to the beginning of an area as though I just entered it and any thing I gotten was not in my inventory. Aside from that, it makes me wish Metal Gear 2 Solid Snake also got a port and MGS 3 had its own PC port. That was one of the better games in the series.

Konami got a large infusion of cash from a few sources recently. The Turbo Grafix 16/PC Engine being an amazon exclusive was a hit and Sony has apparently given them a few million to either co develop a Metal Gear Trilogy remaster or outright buy the IP from them instead.

So it makes sense that the old shit has started to turn up. Konami also didn't like the spiritual successor kickstarter to suikoden got as much money as it did, so I'm hoping those 5 games(7 counting tactics and the DS game) are the next to be brought back.

They're starting to get back into games again little by little.

 

[Snekposter]

I would love MGS3: Subsistence and an MGS4 release for PC. Only MGS game I ever really played was 2, since I was too young to get into the MGS games when I had a PSx, so missed out on the first one and only did the second. I'll look into the port of MGS1 though. Shame about the old graphics, but here's hoping someone releases an HD pack at some point.

 

[Marissa Moira]

I would love MGS3: Subsistence and an MGS4 release for PC. Only MGS game I ever really played was 2, since I was too young to get into the MGS games when I had a PSx, so missed out on the first one and only did the second. I'll look into the port of MGS1 though. Shame about the old graphics, but here's hoping someone releases an HD pack at some point.

I think 4 is FUBAR'd because it was the only one that's a PS3 exclusive and it still doesn't run right on non-native hardware last I checked.

The PS3 cell shit was and still is a nightmare to get working properly.

 

[Totally Awesome]

I think 4 is FUBAR'd because it was the only one that's a PS3 exclusive and it still doesn't run right on non-native hardware last I checked.

The PS3 cell shit was and still is a nightmare to get working properly.

Even people working on RPCS3 are having a hard time getting this game to run properly. All the Metal Gear games beside MGS V need to be remade with better graphics and controls anyway.

 

[Milwaukee Macho Man]

Anyone hear the rumors of MGS1 remake and MGS2 3 and 4 re remasters being made for PS5 (and maybe PC)?

I'm not holding my breath.

Edit: I'm kind of convinced most people who like MGS now started the series late. It's really jarring to me seeing so many people on various forums creaming their pants over the crappy GOG PC ports talking about how they can "finally" play MGS.

 

[Becomemysoulreaver]

The pc versions of mgs 1 and 2 bring me a lot of nostalgia as thy were my first experiemce with the series, boh are ok but the fan fix for mgs2 makes it one of the best ports of the game

 

[The handsome tard]

Am I the only one that feels like Metal Gear Revengence falls into the "Great Game but bad *insert brand* game" ?
Im obviously not saying that people who disagree with me are wrong to do. Its ultimately my opinion as it is theirs.
I still hold the opinion that, despite its flaws, MGS 4's ending was very powerful, fulfilling and touching. It left no gaps for sequels (with them outright making Snake pass away from accelerated aging after the game). All the snakes are now resting in peace (except Liquid, fuck him)

but then platinum games went and did a game set AFTER 4. I was really not a fan of that. Now, before someone simps for Platinum Games and say it was ultimately Kojima's decision, yes, Im very aware of this and attritube some of the fault to the K-Man as well.
I really feel like Raiden's arc was concluded by time 4 ended, he started as a tool, then became a weapon but finally became the family man he wanted to become. Unlike Snake, Raiden could reproduce (when he was still fully human that is), so he could have a happy ending with wife and kid. Its clear that Raiden wanted to lay down the sword and move on to raise his family.
Now yes, you can say that Raiden coming back into the mercenary game was inevitable because he just couldnt "adapt" back into society and how that fits with big Boss's philosophy even after his death and yada yada. I dont exactly care, it still should have ended there.
I remember watching Mutahar's video on MGS4 and I agree with him almost everywhere but Im with him especially on his thoughts on revengence, that game shouldnt have been set after 4. It ultimately weakened Raiden's ending in 4.

Besides, Im not a fan on just how cartoonish the game is. Now yes, my friends, Im not gonna act like MGS wasnt ever cartoonishly stupid sometimes but I think Revengence really goes overboard with it. It really feels like an anime now, especially with the giant robot slashing and jumping on rockets at the speed of sound. I honestly think that made raiden too OP in this game, but only on cutscenes (unless the game decides otherwise and now he gets his ass kicked), Raiden can still get killed by regular mooks because gameplay. This game truly accepted that nanomachines are basically magic in MGS and now does whatever it wants under the guise that "nanomachines can do it...somehow." Maybe it was inevitable given how they can do whatever they plot needed more and more with each entry. The dialogue also feels like something out of an anime. I really feels like this game follows the Rule of Cool far too much, while MGS always was able to keep a healthy balance between ROC and our suspense of disbelief.

I could go on and on but I just want to conclude that with 4, Raiden got the ending he deserved. His story was concluded.
With revengence, we got a sequel hook that will never be concluded and thus, Raiden's character never truly got the closure he needed. He remains a weapon, just like Solidus wanted. He simply decided to finally embrace it and use it against the system (even tho the whole MGS series was about the fight against the "system")
It feels redundant and inconclusive.

Welp, here comes the negative raitings....

 

[Blimp]

Even people working on RPCS3 are having a hard time getting this game to run properly. All the Metal Gear games beside MGS V need to be remade with better graphics and controls anyway.

MGS4 is playable on RPCS3, "playable" meaning that you need a special build for it and need to deal with the random softlock, but a lot of MGS4's hardware fuckery stems from the fact that a huge bombastic game needed to be designed around what's essentially more coprocessor than processor, with Rambus taking a steaming shit on top of the bus. Seeing as how Konami has a dogshit record of holding-onto old source and assets (Silent Hill HD anyone?), the chances of fixing MGS4 up for a modern architecture/OS are pretty bad, so the best we can hope for are MGS4 RPCS3 builds slowly-revealing the secrets of Japanese crunch code

After playing it again a few years ago, it became clearer that the biggest thing killing MGS4's chances of a re-release is all the licensed shit in it, some of which being high-value even for an MGS game. The Altair April Fools costume Kojima riked is in it, you carry an iPod as your own personal sound test, Playboy mags are a dual healing/trapping item, and a lot of random story gags call Sony hardware by their names. Considering their apathy towards MGS, I doubt Konami is gonna hit Ubisoft, Apple, and Playboy up to reneg a licensing deal that probably explicitly forbade renaming/replacing, and if they do indeed lack the source and assets, there is no simple way to work with that shit. Randolph and co. would also have to re-record a lot of lines mentioning said licensed things and redo a couple console-specific jokes in convos/codecs, and there's no way Hayter's getting close to MGS again without acting like a huge bitch baby. Also: the B&B's, they'd be current-year'd like you wouldn't believe in re-evaluating reviews, and I can just imagine passages akin to "YOU CAN SERIOUSLY TAKE EROTIC PICTURES OF DAMAGED AND ABUSED WOMEN YOU JUST FINISHED SHOOTING AT??? AND YOU CAN READ PLAYBOY??? SCEA??????" Octopus is bae

I'm sure Bluepoint could do something, but all of their non-Western PS4 remasters (and coming soon to PS5 - Demon's Souls) have had to be remade from the ground-up entirely ALSO due to source/asset issues, alongside dealing with one of the weirdest goddamn console architectures released, so that's completely remaking a crazy Cell-tied game engine and all associated assets from scratch and a dumped disc, there's demand for an MGS4 re-release, but it probaly isn't in the numbers that'd justify Konami trying anything/spending effort money. Best case scenario is that they could just aggressively decompile like they usually do, helped by Sony still having a lot of design shit somewhere, and considering that MGS4 was their weeb ace in the hole, I'm sure they were monitoring MGS4's development like a hawk

MGS4 should be experienced just so you can witness Naomi going from lady Mengele who supplies the deus ex machina, to completely, totally, 100%-irredeemable emotionally-blackmailing nanomachine cunt. Autism warning, but that scene where she berates Otacon for keeping Sunny in the plane is pretty much everything I hate about her MGS4 character in a nutshell. Like BITCH stop with the fucking uwu I know everything and you'll never understand and examine this situation: there is a society that will stop at nothing to fuck with Snake and friends, and also stopped at nothing to fuck with Olga by USING SUNNY prior, the ordeal in getting her back resulted in Raiden being mutilated into a cyborg, does THAT sound fucking familiar to you? You were certainly willing to murder people over this happening to you personally, so maybe shut the fuck up about sheltering a girl that the Patriots would absolutely lobotomize to learn everything we know. In-game, the way Otacon takes this hammers it out that he's some toxic hikki making innocent Sunny just as much of a computer toucher as him, but in taking it, he doesn't even attempt to argue about what her alternative is. Naomi has a few of scenes like this, and not once, but TWICE does she pop-up uninvited for another story dump, then letting us know about the correct way to feel about a preceding scene - HER way. I didn't give a shit about her sad; emotional ending where she muses over helping Sunny cross the "die" out of Foxdie and helping her write the opposite, all I wanted was some epic goddamn confrontation after crawling around as popcorn, not a quick MOV you made using the Nomad's unlicensed version of Quicktime where you essentially wag your fingers at all of us

The part that follows after the first instance is like a refreshing swig of Listerine that was poured down the breasts of a thousand idols (after throwing up for what feels like 10 minutes too long of exposition), I think even the devs knew people would wanna blow some steam off after THAT resolution

No, the only lady Mengele for me is the one that'll let me rest my head on her tits as we marathon Cronenberg movies while chatting about "if she could do that at the office" once in a while