Metal Gear

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I don't think it's unpopular to say that MGS4 played great.

The problem was there wasn't *enough* to be played IMO. It's why I get pissed at both MGS 4 and MGS V. There's something *there*, but its true potential isn't realized.
Between the two, I think MGSV is the worst offender. MGS4's gameplay is so much better and 'complex' compared to V. MGSV has great cinematography but the missions and gameplay loop is a remnant of Peace Walker that I wish they dropped altogether.
 
That's concerning too that Snake is gonna be so OP for the level design. They would need to make the enemy AI way more observant to balance it. No more quick shooting bullshit from MGSV.

It appears beyond the map, and cutscenes, it's a brand new game. So I'm sure the enemy patrols will have new gimmicks.
As long as you can still move silently while holding a primed grenade to fuck with guards. There's nothing more nostalgic to me than booting up MGS3 and playing those guards like a damned fiddle.
 
God I love that art.
ALL of Ohrai's stuff was great. R.I.P
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Even for lil' old Portable Ops!
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Between the two, I think MGSV is the worst offender. MGS4's gameplay is so much better and 'complex' compared to V. MGSV has great cinematography but the missions and gameplay loop is a remnant of Peace Walker that I wish they dropped altogether.
Exactly. The PW gameplay only works on a handheld. Why it transferred into console is so fucking idiotic and tone deaf. Why gut all the cool gimmicks 3 and 4 had?

I completely cannot understand why it's looked at as some gameplay marvel and no one can ever make an argument to me that's even remotely compelling. I can give dozens of reasons why MGS3 and 4 play infinitely better.
 
I completely cannot understand why it's looked at as some gameplay marvel and no one can ever make an argument to me that's even remotely compelling.
I remember thinking the movement control was good at the time, but that might be because the most recent game I played was Peace Walker.

Thinking back, I don't think it controlled any better than MGS4, but I haven't played either recent enough to really compared.
 
Say what you want about MGS4 but that game certainly had the most fleshed out, in-depth and intuitive combat system in the series, I was still discovering new things I could do on my second and even third playthroughs.
The moment I played it and discovered crouch-walking, I couldn't go back to the old "stop and prone". If Snake got laid out onto his back by an enemy, he could immediately return fire while prone, and he could continue to move. You could effortlessly transition to his stomach while prone, and continue to move or shoot or throw grenades depending on the situation. All of this was done with just a couple button presses. You could choose your default aiming method between 1st and 3rd person, and whilst in 3rd person you could also change the camera to see behind his left or right shoulder depending on what was comfortable. That's not even getting into all the weapons, fire selects, and attachments you could use on the fly. Or the meme weapons like the race gun which could be banked off of walls or the ground like young Ocelot did.

Edit: Watched the trailer, and I see Snake can move while prone and on his back, which is a bright spot along with the original VAs.
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The Japanese still like putting sexy women in their games, seducing Snake is a large part of EVA's relevance in the story, and if there's any series that gets away with chesty female characters quite often (even when the reason is bullshit *cough*Quiet) it's MGS. Don't worry.
It's a shame Eva was a liar right down to her implanted funbags.
 
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mgs4 had the same problem dmc4 had: it's combat and movement are peak, but the actual game is not packed enough to actualy use all of it.
 
According to Hayter in a video talking about the gameplay, it's going to have both camera styles the HD version had.

Fuck yeah.

This really looks promising. I haven't been excited about a game in about 5 fucking years.
Yeah apparently they're keeping every control system except the one with trigger sensitive like the PS2, which is kinda weird considering that PS5 controllers have haptics so it wouldn't be an issue to replicate that as well.
 
Yeah apparently they're keeping every control system except the one with trigger sensitive like the PS2, which is kinda weird considering that PS5 controllers have haptics so it wouldn't be an issue to replicate that as well.
I mean given it's going to have the OTS shooting I sorta understand it since it's the norm. But I liked the bird's eye view while holding soldiers up. Unless it's gonna have both of those.
 
Exactly. The PW gameplay only works on a handheld. Why it transferred into console is so fucking idiotic and tone deaf. Why gut all the cool gimmicks 3 and 4 had?

I completely cannot understand why it's looked at as some gameplay marvel and no one can ever make an argument to me that's even remotely compelling. I can give dozens of reasons why MGS3 and 4 play infinitely better.
PW is doing its own thing, its more arcadey. Rooms are smaller so guards have shorter view range. The big strength of PW is the bosses heavily inspired by monster hunter. Sure it doesn't have the intricacies of an MGS3 boss but it works well with the power scaling system of developing new weapons. Personally I don't compare it to 3 or 4 as much as I do V because V is more or less just a bad version of PW.
 
PW introduced the unnecessary in a stealth game but still awesome to see cqc slam chain. It feels real good to do to a group.
 
I don't feel like it is fair to compare V with the other games in the franchise, it feels like Kojima wanted to do something else and slapped the Metal Gear logo on it. It just that, the game requires you to make your own fun, there is a reason why you can disable reflex. The whole point of chapter 2 is to encourage the player to play differently so they don't have to make a difficulty selection screen that increases some sliders for the enemies, which is just lame in my opinion.

There is also a lot of mechanics that you only start to notice in FOB, like soldiers entering the anti-sniper alert if you are abusing it, using grenades to diverge their attention, destroying lights to make it harder for the enemy to see you, or, I kid you not, staying on shadows during day mission in FOB to increase your camo. They really made it hard for you to notice those things in the base game, which is just bad design in my opinion, but they probably did that as to not have a difficulty spike early on.
 
V is more or less just a bad version of PW.
That's an apt way of putting it. PW on it's own is fine since it's designed to be picked up and put down on the go. That doesn't work in a console experience. Especially taking the PW gimmicks and sticking it in an open world, and a bad open world at that.
 
Recently purchased the Metal Gear Master Collection... on Switch of all things.

That may sound batshit, but let me justify my decision: First, it was on sale. Second, I saw the Switch release as basically a "secondary" play option, most notably being able to do a VR mission when I'm away from home. I've long wanted something that scratches the stealth itch on the go and nothing does it quite like Metal Gear.

A neat little surprise is that a lot of the performance issues I've heard about seem to have been patched. I've been comparing MGS2 to the original Playstation 2 game and honestly I don't notice a whole lot of difference (outside of not having the Skateboarding mini game).

Anyway, this has awakened.... feelings in me. But I'll put my thoughts behind a spoilermarking:

Bit of background: I was actually late to the MGS party. I didn't actually get into the series until around 2010. Before then, I had tried MGS1 on a demo disc and not liked it, and a lot of what I heard secondhand was that the series sharply declined after the second game.

Then one day I happened to find MGS1 and 2 at a goodwill. At this time I had just gotten a working PS2 so I was inspired to try out new things for it.

If you're wondering how I didn't have a working PS2 in 2010... the keyword is "working." PS2's are notoriously fragile pieces of shit and after having had two go bad on me near the beginning of the system's life, I just avoided it and in fact dropped out of gaming for a bit. The one I have now is actually one of the last production models and surprisingly seems to be a durable little guy. Or maybe it just loves me.

Anyway, for a combined ten bucks, I was willing to give Metal Gear Solid 1 and 2 a try and see if they were as bad as I'd heard.

... They... weren't. Okay with MGS1 that wasn't much of a surprise, I don't think anyone in their right mind could hate that game.

MGS2 was the real shocker. I went in already having heard for years how it was such a letdown and Raiden was such a bad character, the Scrappy Doo of the MGS series... and just, none of that was true.

Metal Gear Solid 2 is my favorite game in the series, and I unironically like Raiden. At the very least, the one thing nobody can disparage is that the gameplay is solid (I will not make the pun).

Around now I was hearing people say that MGS3 was the actual best game in the series. This one I had to order online since I specifically wanted the two-disc edition that included the MSX games (and the Ape Escape crossover, but that was a bonus more than anything).

.... MGS3 is where I start to fall off the truck a little. The story was still great, but I always hated the gameplay, and playing it again now, I still do. Even having beaten the game several times I never got used to the controls and still often have times where I feel like I'm fighting with them, and I feel like the game does not give you enough to properly stealth--I find no matter how much watching and waiting I do, I always get blindsided by an enemy I didn't know was there.

I think a big problem was MGS3 had no training mode. This was the purpose VR missions served in the first two games. Fans will say "well they can't have VR because its the 1960s." I never quite bought that excuse--you could just rebrand it as "boot camp" or "war games" or something and get the same idea across. But the bigger problem is it means MGS3 essentially throws you into the deep end of the pool without a life jacket, and you just have to adapt to its gameplay on the fly.

I still liked it enough to continue the series at least.

So at the time, I had to make a choice: get a PS3 for Metal Gear Solid 4, or get a PSP for the whole four Metal Gear games that system has.

I chose the PSP, which turned out to be worthwhile in the long run--I honestly don't think there's any PS3 game I want to play besides MGS4.

And again, I unironically liked Portable Ops. It's far from perfect, and the storyline felt like fanfiction at times... but I felt it basically improved on MGS3's gameplay. Most notably adding this sort-of radar that represents your character's hearing. And this was supposedly one of the "low points" of the series, and Peace Walker was better in every way

You know where this is going, don't you? Skykiii got excited for Peace Walker, finally got Peace Walker.... and hated it. I hated it so much that in fact, I never finished it, and its one of the few MGS games I just don't see any redeeming value in.

This is both when I dropped off the boat entirely, but also started having some thoughts. I low-key have a theory that Hideo Kojima was intentionally trying to sink the franchise by making the gameplay unbearable. Part of my rationale for this is I notice that in games where he's not involved, they tend to actually think of things like player convenience, but then when its an entry Kojima is heavily involved in, he tends to intentionally fuck with these things.

Most notably, Portable Ops had a lot of anti-grinding features. If you needed big rations but didn't have the tech level to make them yourself, there's a map you can raid for them. Peace Walker... makes it so this won't work. You have to do the grind. Also it turns that radar into an equippable item you have to build. Lots of little things like that just add up and make me wonder about Kojima's intentions.

Also, can I say that the prequel era of MGS is kinda dumb anyway? Seriously every single game has been obstensibly about how Big Boss became the ruler of Outer Heaven, but the story amounts to "oh several times he had to start over from scratch" and that happening three times in a row gets a little bit silly.

I never did get to play MGS4 or 5. MGS4 I might at least want to play at some point, but V... I dunno. It basically sounds like "open world Peace Walker" and that's already a choice of words that makes me not wanna bother.

Personally, if the series had ended with MGS3, I might've been fine with that. MGS is a good example of how dragging a thing out forever can ultimately ruin it. Especially when even the series creator clearly wants the series to just end already.

Here's hoping they include the Gameboy Color game in the next Master Collection, at least.
 
Also, can I say that the prequel era of MGS is kinda dumb anyway? Seriously every single game has been obstensibly about how Big Boss became the ruler of Outer Heaven, but the story amounts to "oh several times he had to start over from scratch" and that happening three times in a row gets a little bit silly.
Adding to this that Big Boss never got the "proper" idea for Outer Heaven until he met Gene in MGS Portable Ops.

You should definitely play MGS4, even if emulated.
 
Also, can I say that the prequel era of MGS is kinda dumb anyway? Seriously every single game has been obstensibly about how Big Boss became the ruler of Outer Heaven, but the story amounts to "oh several times he had to start over from scratch" and that happening three times in a row gets a little bit silly.
MGS3 was the only prequel that was needed, and I'll die on that mountain.

Each prequel just made Big Boss seem dumber and dumber. There was no need for more, there was nothing that needed to be "explained" that wasn't explained in MGS3 if you weren't a fucking retard that needs everything spoonfed to you.
 
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